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Electrical Wiring

Generac 14k standby generator test run problem

10 years ago

On two occasions in the last couple of months, my two year old generator has required a second try to start for its weekly exercise run. Before this, it always started on the first try. It has been serviced regularly - the last time in November - a 'soft' service.

Any thoughts on what could be causing this? Should I have a tech over to check it out again? Any help would be appreciated.

This post was edited by sarahlee123 on Sun, Dec 22, 13 at 17:07

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Comments (10)

bus_driver
10 years ago
Sounds as if it is a problem requiring an engine technician rather than an electrician.
What is the fuel for your generator?
sarahlee123
Original Author
10 years ago
Busdriver, thanks for your reply. It uses propane. Can you recommend a forum that would be more appropriate for this problem? As you can tell, I know very little about generators .
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Hi, This I take it is a petrol generator. Looks like you have not run it for a while. My guess is that the petrol has gone bad, and that your carburettor has becomed cloged with old fuel residue. The jets are the things that get clogged. See if you can open up the caburettor and clean the insides. A good organic solvent will do the trick. Try mineral sprits available at Home Depot in the paint department. While you are there swing by the lawn mower section a buy a bottle of Stabil, petrol stabilizer, cost about $US 5. Clean out all the parts of the carburettor then reasemble. Try and remove the old petrol by siphoning it out. Note do this outside because of fire hazzard, and try not to swallow any or even get the stuff in your mouth. Once you have all the old petrol out. Take a clean empty gas petrol can (5 gallons) and pour in some of the Stabil, sufficient to mix with 5 gallons of petrol. Go to your petrol station an buy some fresh petrol. Refill your generator and try to start again. What happens is that petrol decays. In most cars this is not a big issue because you refill the tank every week. Modern petrol is made by distilation, but also from cracking heavier oil fractions. This tends to make the petrol break down faster. For lawn mowers and generators which may sit idle for a while, that petrol breaks down and forms a varnish which tends to gum up carburettors. To avoid this you can use the Stabil. What this is is a bactericide which kills of the bacteria which eats petrol and converts it into varnish. Petrol then stays "fresh" for 1 to 2 years in storage. Hope this helps. best, Mike.
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There's no argument there, brickeyee. In context, the breaker on the OP's generator *IS* likely to trip before undervoltage or oddball waveforms damage MOST consumer electronics. Computer PSUs typically operate *PROPERLY* down to about 90V or so, and shut themselves off (protection circuit) below that. Devices with linear power supplies aren't going to give a darn about undervoltage - and the waveform issue is never going to be seen by the secondary side - the transformer won't be happy, but that usually just blows the input fuse. I AGREE that, if the problem is overcurrent, everything electronic is long gone before the breaker trips. Overcurrent through any one particular electronic device isn't the issue here, it's undervoltage before the generator's breaker trips. Overcurrent through one particular electronic device, I might suggest, probably means that said device is already fried anyway.
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Hello: First let me explain that I am not an electrician, I am a homeowner that purchased and had a Generac Guardian 10K series air cooled generator that was professionally installed with all necessary permits etc by a licensed electrician in late November 2010. I am using the generator to ensure that critical power is uninterrupted to keep and maintain critical temperatures in egg incubators. During the past month and a half I have lost to sets of eggs and I could not figure out what the problem was except the min/max thermometor in the incubator indicated that the temp went dangerously low but it does not indicate the amount of time the temp was at that low level. Also during that time there have been 2 power outages in my area. and I was under the impression that the generator was operating normally? Upon inspection last Friday I found that the Generator was in off line mode with a hard stop diagnostic of a "Undervoltage" (Shutdown Alarm). See page #21 in the Generac Owners Manual. It tells you how to clear the alarm and cites the ranges under which it will occur but it does not provide any information regarding what variables or conditions would cause this type of failure, any ideas? Also, Why would a generator be designed under a "Low Voltage" condition, not to reboot or recycle itself to be ready to re-start in the event of another power failure or when the condition that caused the low voltage condition returned to normal? Any suggestions or guidance would be greatly appreciated. Will
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Ron Natalie
10 years ago
Check the cranking battery. I found mine died after a couple of years and I had to replace it. It's just a car battery with a rather stupid charging device on it.

Doesn't the control panel on yours give you some hint as to why it didn't start?

If it's not the battery check all the other stuff: air filter, radiator fluid level, etc....
bus_driver
10 years ago
While I never serviced the fuel-system on a propane-powered engine, propane vaporizes slowly in the cold and could cause slow starting. An advantage of propane is that it does not age in storage and a tank last filled 10 years ago is as fresh as today's fill.
If all else fails, a forklift mechanic should be able to service the fuel system.
sarahlee123
Original Author
10 years ago
Ronnatalie, since it does start on the second try, the control panel shows that everything is fine. As for the battery, do you think it would have been checked when they did the servicing? I'll call and ask tomorrow.

Busdriver, the first time it took two times to start, it was very cold out - teens. And when it happened today, the weather was ridiculously warm - in the upper fifties. Would that have an effect on the propane flow?
bus_driver
10 years ago
While batteries can fail at any moment without warning, weekly use is, in my opinion, ideal for longest life. I had one last for 13 years-it was original in a new 1998 vehicle. Two aftermarket units lasted 10 years each in off-road equipment. It could be a corroded battery terminal. But a failing battery that does not work the first attempt is highly unlikely to work on the second attempt.
The forklift mechanic is familiar with all this.
Ron Natalie
10 years ago
If his little generic is like mine there's a 2A trickle charger on it and the unit runs about 20 minutes once a week. I hate to disillusion all you battery experts but there is enough time between attempts for the battery to recover a bit and sometimes it can take a bit to crank that generator over. This is NOT the same situation as trying to start your car with a failing battery.

I doubt his propane has gone stale, it's not gasoline. I've been running on the same propane tank for nearly five years now. A low tank however, could cause some problems especially in colder weather.

If the thing isn't reporting low coolant or some other alert the thing most likely timed out because it hadn't started after 30 seconds of cranking (or whatever his timeout is). It can indeed be the battery. It could also be something blocking the air intake (while there's a filter on the engine itself, there's also the air into the cabinet that could be jammed with leaves or grass clippings, though that would be pretty obvious.

This post was edited by ronnatalie on Mon, Dec 23, 13 at 7:41
MongoCT
10 years ago
If it's only been a cold weather issue, a cold weather warming kit might help.

Some kits have one heater, some three. Example, a "three-part kit" has a warming pad for the battery to sit on to keep the battery warm so you'll get a good crank, a block heater to keep the oil warm to it's easier for the engine to turn, and a carb heater to help with the initial light-off.

The kits have a thermostat of sorts so they only heat when the temperature is below a certain set point, usually 40 degrees.

Propane generators may not fire off in cold weather if the tank is lower than half-full. If that is an issue the regulator pressure might need to be checked.
sarahlee123
Original Author
10 years ago
Mongoct, busdrive, and ronnatalie, I spoke to the techs who service the generator. They mentioned that the propane pressure may be an issue. When they finally come, I'll bring up the items that you all have mentioned, and let you know what happens.

Thanks so much for all your thoughts and comments!

.
Betty Hewett
2 years ago
Our Generac generator will not shut off during exercise.

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