Let me preface my comments by stating that I have 3 children, ages 8, 5, 2 (and one on the way). So I am not new to this, but it's all still fresh enough in my memory that I remember it realistically. That's just so you know where I am coming from. And I ask your patience now for what I expect will be a long answer. The answer to your question is yes and no. If you think of discipline in terms of teaching and guiding, yes, you can begin to discipline a 9 mos old in terms of protecting them from danger. If they pull hair, you can distract them and say "no." You can say "no" and remove them from a situation like pulling an electic cord. But they aren't likely to learn any lesson from it. I know people say their babies understand "no" but I do not buy that. A baby might respond temporarily to the tone of the voice, but at that age, I don't believe, from my experience, they understand "no" in any disciplinary terms. In other words, you could substitute any word used in exactly the same tone and context and get the same reaction from the baby. At that age it is about protecting them. Even if you do get a response to no in a physically harmful situation, you still aren't going to get one over manners, i.e. crying and screaming in temper. If you think of discipline in terms of more concrete action=consequence the answer is no. If you think of discipline in terms of knowing what behavior is expected, the answer is no. That is the beginning of self-discipline and that is a couple years off. There are a million reasons why this baby would behave that way. First off, she is a baby. She has no understanding of socially acceptable behavior and won't for a long time. She could be coming down with something, maybe she's teething, or tired. Maybe her nap/sleep schedule is in a period of change making her more tired and cranky that usual. It is also common for babies that age to begin to feel frustration over their lack of mobility or autonomy. She knows what she wants to do, but she is not yet physically capable of doing it. That makes her frustrated and the only means she has to express it is to cry and scream. Some babies express that frustration more intensely than others, kind of like adults. Sometimes there just isn't anything you can do about it short of making life go their way all the time (and we all know how well that would go). We will all have days like that, some of us will have weeks like that. And it has nothing to do with our parenting skills. It's real life. What you do about it has more to do with you than with the baby. If a parent responds to a baby's cries of frustration with a raised, loud voice and frustration of their own, the baby's will only intensify. As a parent, you just have to stay calm. Rule out any cause you can resolve, fix it if you can, and ride it out if you can't. If baby cries because he doesn't really want to be in his car seat right now he'd much rather crawl on the floor, there just isn't anything you can do about it. You gotta do what you gotta do. You can't reason with him. You cannot impose a consequence for the crying. You really only can carry on with what you gotta do, try to offer a distraction, but if that doesn't work, ride it out. They are not old enough for the type of discipline that makes them understand you can't always have your way. They are still of the mentality "I am the center of the universe and as my mother it is your job to make me happy." The scream says "Why aren't you doing your job!" So when that age hits, try to see life through your baby's eyes, try to understand what their cry says to you, it helps keep your expectations within reason. If you can see the baby's view of life, it helps you determine if the fit is over a need or a want, thus the best way to resolve it. And remember that when you have days like that, you are not alone, we all have them, it doesn't make you a bad mother. Not to scare you, but the temper of a 9 mos old doesn't begin to compare to the temper of a 2 yr old. And most professionals do in fact say that the best way to deal with that is to ignore it. On the up side, you will have far more good days than bad. And when it is your child, you move into those temper cries gradually and 1)get used to them and learn to block them out and 2)have time to work into dealing with it slowly and not BAM there it is. When you find yourself having to deal with it, you watch your baby's needs. If you know your baby gets cranky being out of routine, try to avoid that. If you know strange places make him cranky, invite people to your house instead. You can try to make some compromised in your daily life to avoid things that will aggrevate the crankies. But life happens, you can't avoid it all the time and probably really shouldn't. I feel from the way you posted you are seeking information for your own use, not judging your friend. But I still want to say don't judge her parenting by this bad day, or even a rough few weeks. Instead, and I'm sure you're already doing this, be supportive and understanding of this normal phase. I hope from all that rambling you got something helpful. :o)

Boy...this was a posting and a half to read but definitely shows some different ideas on what parents and teachers think about discipline in a class. All I can add is that each group of children and for that matter each child will react differently to different ways of handling a situations. I think group punishment is needed as a foregound to control an entire class who is out of control but not as a continual way of controling certain disruptive students. Once a teacher has the feel for who is causing the problem then that individual needs to be dealt with just as a parent when discovering which child broke the house rules or made the mistake. When in doubt everyone gets punished and it has to be explained that this is being done to avoid favorism. The child causing the problem should also be given a chance to come forward and appologize without punishment if they choose to with in a certain time frame after which a punish applies. If you gain the trust of a child and treat them like a real person 9 out of 10 children will respond. They want exactly what we want to be respected and noticed for our good acts. Children who act out have found it the only way to get attention and don't care anymore that it's negative attention just as long as someone is seeing them. I have four children with very different personalities. Each has their own way of getting attention when they feel they are not getting any...multiply that by how ever many and you have aclass full of children all trying to get one adults attention so they feel SEEN. It must be the hardest thing for a teacher to deal with everyday. It is as a parent to four, and because I have grown to know them so well I know what they are doing. When my 9 year old son who is easily bored starts to act like a clown I know he wants mom to spend sometime with him or he needs something to interesting to do while I am busy. When my 11 year old son talks my ear off I know he has had a day and a half and needs to download his feelings, when my 7 year old daughter gets clingy with me I know it's time to do an activity with just her and I, When my 2 year old is pulling at my shirt for something for the upteenth time I know it's her turn. It's not easy to figure out what each child needs individually but as a parent we have only a few children and need to take the time to know as a teacher wouldn't always have that time and has 30 students or more to get to know in under a year. That's when the group discipline needs to come into play and then be broken down to find out the individual needs within a short time frame. My suggestion is discuss it with the class in an open forum explaining the need for rules and the rewards of following them then stick to them and show your students that you respect them and they will respect you. That makes the difference in whether they will learn from you or ignore you.The best teachers I have meet have been strict with class ediquette but reward their students with respect and privelges of being a helper rather than give them material things as a reward.

yes, the oldest has add... which I work with to upteenth degree. We actually already have the homework rule... ours is more like even if you dont have homework you have homework... you have to review what you did in school that day to make sure that you understand everything. Which, is why I find it so frustrating that he or rather they lie about having homework. It is not like they get out of doing work, they just end up in trouble for lieing and not doing their homework. It is ridiculous in a lot of ways ... why spend an hour reviewing everything from the day when you could have spent 15 minutes doing the assignment the teacher gave you. They are just playing every angle that they can and unfortunately it's working on a lot of fronts and I am exhausted. For example: the kids were at their moms house this weekend. The oldest had a report to do. I meet BM at 6 monday morning to take kids to school and oldest didnt do his report. I asked if BM knew and he said "well I asked her if I should finish at your house and she said I guess so" Ofcourse I am highly irritated because we had a very specific conversation on satureday about what he needed to do. And, ofcourse, I make him sit there and do his report. But, to top off the entire deal I show DH what he didnt do... he gets onto oldest ss about it makes a big deal. But then I have to go to school that same evening (report did not get finished before school which I made sure DH knew) and I dont get home until after 9 and he didnt do the first thing on the report and DH says that he didnt realize what he needed to do. So, I end up staying up with ss until late late to make sure the report got done. And then, the next morning DH gives the grounded boys doughnuts even though it is his own rule that when grounded you dont get treats. I don't know... I feel like they are doing it to test me sometimes. It's not like anyone else is holding them to right and wrong and doing what they are supposed to do. (well I suppose that is unfair DH does back me up but i feel like if I didn't say this is the problem it wouldnt be brought up) Really, I honestly feel like they are testing how far they can push and I will still stand strong... but then I feel like maybe they are starting to have an attitude of you arent my parent that has never really been an issue before because they weren't teenagers. i tried to disengage tonight and just let DH handle everything but that sooo didnt work... it is not in my nature. I tired to busy myself in my room organizing... I didnt ignore them, I helped them with homework and answered questions but my goal was to make sure that DH made sure they got their homework done and made sure they werent just wandering around doing nothing... but i couldnt help it... I couldnt just watch oldest ss playing with the girls knowing that he had a stack of homework on his bed... ugggghhh it pretty much boils down to I am frustrated!!

To me, discipline goes hand in hand with helping children develop a value system and morals. Every family, heck, every individual, has different ideas of what those are, and that's why *discipline* varies from family to family. I think discipline goes hand in hand with guidance. I suppose there is a measure of control involved, but I don't think that's a bad thing. Children need a certain amount of control in their lives--the goal of raising children is to gradually lesson that control as they get older until, hopefully, they are able to control their own lives in a responsible and mature manner. I think the key, as a parent, is to be reasonable about what you control. Bedtimes need to be controlled for a child. I would never allow my daughter, or STBSS, to stay up until midnight and thus be tired at school the next day. They NEED sleep, but they don't understand that the way we do. So our kids might argue at bedtime and want to stay up late--and, as a parent/step-parent, I have to exercise *control* over them in regards to that issue. Now--other things I don't think need to be so rigid. I would never attempt to *control* a child's hobbies or interests--I give my daughter the freedom to pretty much choose what she wears. I let her do this because I buy all her clothes and they are appropriate choices for her age, I believe. So I don't care if she has the freedom to choose what she wears. I believe kids need to have *control* balanced with freedom and the ability to make their own choices--slowly, and age-appropriately. If you teach and guide them to learn to make responsible choices, then you are preparing them for adulthood. The word punishment is probably the same as correction or discipline. In life, even as adults, we are exposed to punishments. If you drive too fast, you might get a speeding ticket and have to pay a fine--that's a consequence, punishment, correction, whatever you want to call it. Get too many and you might lose your license. Another consequence or punishment. If kids learn at a young age, that there are consequences to their actions (choices), then they hopefully will learn to make the right choice. When I use the word discipline, I am not talking about beating kids or grounding them for months at a time. For my specific situation, I am talking about age-appropriate consequences for young children. In our house, these might include the loss of a video game privilige for a day (or two days, etc.), the loss of allowance for a week, etc. I am not doing my bio-kid or stepkid ANY favors by not having ground rules and consequences for breaking those rules. I also believe that children NEED to learn to listen to and obey the adults in their lives--whether it's a teacher, a parent, a step-parent, coach or friend's parent. I'm not saying there aren't abusive wackjobs out there, but for the most part, I believe most adults have their own rules and expectations for a reason--whether that's the child's safety or something else. And you know what? I don't think kids always have to have an explanation or a reason, either. Sometimes there are rules that we ALL think are stupid--but they are there--and whether you personally agree with them or not, you have to follow them....or face the consequences. Just my two cents.