What a sweetie lol

Bet BioMom's having an absolute picnic with this!

Actually I bet bm loved it! It will probably bring her and sd closer as they chant it together LOL!

After we watched the documentary the boys (SS10 and SS13) went out to the shed saying "just in case she decides to kill ya we hid the axe and hatchet".

Isn't it lovely that my potential death gives my SC such joy!

I was just thinking....how did bm get custody of sd? Were you and dh ready to let her go there since bm instigated all her crazy behviors?

I have sort of filled it in since all this began...

SD9 was having mental health issues so mom kept stressing to SD that she was the only one who could understand her ... I know this because SD told me so ... my mom says she is the only one who understands me... etc etc.

So she starting in April she was refusing to come home and hubby not wanting to put anymore stress on SD just let her stay with mom when she wanted to each week is was less and less and SD was medicated more and more.... So in July mom called DSS because we were neglecting SD's mental health status because when she was here we wouldn't let her talk to her mother on the phone because only her mother understands her so the whole time she was here she needed to be on the phone with her mother.

She would be on the phone from the time she woke up till she passed out at night .... she and I were almost in an accident because she was digging through my purse to get my cellphone to call her mother.... was the last time I had her in the car with me.

I also stopped being "alone" with her the end of June so if hubby wasn't here SD couldn't be here

So they go to court in Aug. Hubby tells the judge if I take her away from her mother her mental health status will be more affected than if I leave her with her mom ...

So the judge granted mom sole custody of SD hubby gets visitation with SD as recommended by her therapist and granted hubby sole custody of the boys with mom having same visitation as previously ordered (weekends and weds).

Sept. SD only wanted to come on sunday and monday nights (mom's pool nights) but SD would be on the phone with Mom til midnight last time she was to sleep over I went in her room at 11:30PM to shut her tv off (not my choice they wouldn't have TV's in their rooms) I hear a males voice I look at SD she is still awake and on the phone .... the male voice is saying "I miss you so much when you are not here I hate Sundays" I said hang up the phone she said I am talking to my mom I said thats not your mom now hang up the phone .... half hour later BM is picking up SD.

That monday hubby called counselor to ask her what when she thinks SD should come here ... took ten days to get an answer couldn't understand why it was up to her .... hubby told her because mom told the judge you were the authority on SD's mental health issues so you should decide and no one else.

Now SD comes every other day from 4 to 8pm and sundays 10am to 5pm. as recommended by the counselor. :)

Hubby is going back to court in Feb. with the recommendations from 6 mental health clinicians backing that hubby should have sole custody of all 3 children and mom having limited visitation.

She is not cooperating with DSS recommendations or the childrens counselors .... SD's counselor and psychiartrist want to have her mental health status re-evaluated mom is refusing ... psychiatrist is refusing to prescribe anymore medication for SD until she is re-evaluated there is also a flag on our insurance that she cannot be treated by any other psychiatrist until she completes the evaluation process. But because mom and SD are on welfare now she has her own insurance so she took SD to a new psychiartrist to get meds who called first one and refused to give any med till she is evaluated.

Mom is in the process of looking for a new counselor for SD. SD's counselor is now saying SD shows more manipulation than anxiety. School pysh team agrees more manipulation than anxiety. Mom is also trying to get SS10 medicated she is saying he is bi-polar.

Its just a looooooooooong drawn out process.

Pseudo, just to clarify I'm understanding this:

SD is 9 years old.
She is awake at 11:30pm.
She is on the phone with a man at 11:30pm.
BM is picking her up at your house at 12:00am.

Please tell me if I misunderstood.

same question as silverswood, i was just going to type same thing when i saw her questions. SD is on the phone wiht a man at 11:30PM? and then mom picks her up right away? is there a stepfather or a boyfriend in the picture? who is the man?

The male voice was mom's BF.

Mom explains being on the phone as a "comforting technique" with SD's anxiety.

After she was told at 11:30PM that she could not be on the phone with her mother anymore she began to have in her words "anxiety" so hubby told her mother to come get her since we did not have any medication for her here.... it was either bring her a pill or pick her up.

So she picked her up....

SD is given no boundaries she is allowed to do whatever she likes wouldn't want to be the "cause" of her anxiety. After all thats why DSS is keeping the case open ... we failed to recognize SD's mental health issues.

Although SD now says ...she "doesn't have anxiety anymore" She doesn't miss her mom anymore and even though she misses her dad and being home she doesn't get anxiety over it anymore she thinks she would be ok sleeping over with out calling her mom and misses taking the bus to school and all her friends.... "if daddy didn't give me away to mommy I could still be going to school with my friends" "I think daddy was right about me not having anxiety that bad"

Hubby's house rules ... SD and hubby shook hands and agreed on in front of SD's counselor.

SD is only 15 minutes on the phone with mom one time per visit.

Mom cannot call SD while she is here. And can only call if there is a problem with drop off time...other than that no communication.

SD is to only be here when hubby is here. (I will not be with her alone so if he gets called into work on an emergency mom has to be available for him to drop her off)

SD cannot remove anymore of her belongings from our home to bring to her mothers. (She was packing a bag every time she came here with her "stuff" to take to mom's since she "doesn't live here anymore".)

"the male voice is saying "I miss you so much when you are not here I hate Sundays" I said hang up the phone she said I am talking to my mom"

The male voice was mom's BF.

I feel nauseated. I may be WAY off base with this, but does anyone else get the creeps when they read this?

Silver creeped me out too .... had she been on with mom I would not have said a thing ... let her deal with a grumpy kid in the morning who hasn't had any sleep let the school call her because she was on the phone with her daughter until _________... not our issue ....

But when I heard the male voice I stopped in my tracks to make sure I was hearing it right maybe mom had a cold who knows .... she had the phone on speakerphone by the way .... I didn't have to strain to hear the voice.

I told DSS what I heard I told SD's counselor what I heard. I told the boys counselors what I heard.

No one seemed to bat an eyelash. Hubby called mom she denied he was on the phone it was her ... blah blah blah and I was just making up stuff .... hubby then said well don't let me find out anyone has touched my little girl while in your care or it will be the last time you ever see her.

How long have bio and bf been dating? Could this "anxiety" have stemmed from something else?

I'm not glad you have a reason to be creeped out, but I'm really glad you're creeped out too, if you know what I mean.

And, thinking about it, that was completely innappropriate IMO, for any adult to say at that late of a time on a school night to a young girl. Even if it was her mother. She's going to see her the next day for goodness sake, and she probably just saw her two days earlier. It's not like they've been parted for weeks/months/years. And they wonder why she's anxious? What a selfish mother. Again, IMO!

On another note, and not that you probably have much control over this, or condone this, but why is she getting medication at midnight? Couldn't this be over-stimulation? Is this what we are teaching our children? If you get stressed, take a pill rather than a walk, or a relaxation technique, or anything! I would try something, anything, first, before medicating for anxiety.

Glad you told everyone what you heard. I'm sure you know what the mom sounds like and it's not even close to the bf's voice. Watch that situation like a hawk. Something is not right.

Going back to your original post. You live in Mass and the Lizzie Borden thing happened in Fall River..........Mass!

Yes that is correct. Are you from the area? or just heard the rhyme elsewhere growing up?

I have always heard the ryhme. I am not from the area. I did see a halloween special about it though. I was merely playing on the similarity of the situation and the location.

That explains that ... I am from the area and in elementary school we would go feild trips to the house where it happend and the historical society to see the axe and other artifacts from the murder scene.

Its a big tadoo around here even 100+ years later.....

I didn't think they were still "teaching" it in school as it has to do with a murder .... apparently I was wrong.

What I was thinking .... who would teach a kid who has severe SM issues about a woman who killed her SM.

Ditz of a teacher. Should update their cirriculum. :)

Pseudo - I had the same sort of experience with FSD and the movie The Parent Trap. She really thought thought that if she could get me out of the way, she could get her mom and dad back together, just like the girls on that movie. When I first met her, she watched that movie like 3 times a week. She never played tricks on me, but she started treating me with the same disrespectful attitude that the girls treated the dad's fiancee with. I told FDH I wanted that movie out of the house, and from now on only Brady Bunch was to be shown! LOL!

Sounds to me like BM is trying to get SD's mental health issues diagnosed so that she can use it to get gov't assistance and as a weapon against DH. I fell that your DH needs to put his foot down with BM about SD, and taking it back to court sounds like the right place to start. Sounds like BM has been playing DH when it comes to SD, and it appears that he has let it happen, perhaps not even realizing he's doing it.

No clue what BM is up to don't care what she wants to get out of it ....

My opinion of mom is..... she is not happy unless her children are tormented, fulfills her need to be needed.

If her children are happy they don't need her. And they have learned to complain to get her attention if they are not complaining she is not happy. (if that makes sense)

When they complain she gives them attention she writes down their complaints and tape records them ... then will tell them how she is going to tell the judge how badly they are mistreated....

Examples of mistreatment...
No dessert
Being called last to dinner
No snacks afterschool
Being sent to their rooms
No TV
Not being able to play video games
Not being able to go and play until homework is done
Shouldn't have to fold their own clothes (13, 10 ,9)
Taking out the trash
Gathering clothes to be washed
Cleaning their rooms

Her moral compass is off kilter ... whatever thought she has come out of her mouth into her children's ears.

Hubby has taken her to court every 6 months for the "petty" stuff but the petty stuff adds up over time.

Mom called DSS on us thinking god knows what .... but they have been our best ally in all of this ... They have her jumping through hoops and she is refusing .... but thats on her.

I would file a written report with DSS(not just saying it verbally) that SD is on the phone wiht mom's BF at night and he says he misses her so much etc. Just to be on a safe side I woudl document it.

Pseudo, are you serious? You actually mistreat your children that badly??????????? I cannot believe anyone would send a child to their room or not let them watch tv, let alone get not dessert. It's horrifying abuse!

(and on that note, here come the police to take me away, for I'm as guilty as you are)

Finedreams, excellent idea. There is no such thing as too much documentation in cases like this.

I wrote a "complaint" filed a 51A basically and a separate two-page report of concerns for SD.

Sent it to DSS worker, her supervisor, the boys counselors, and SD's counselor.

But it just looks like "I am out to get mom" ...

A month ago I gave the DSS worker and SS10's counselor a list of my predictions... So far 2 of them have been completed.

Mom will say SS10 is having mental health issues.
(she is saying she thinks he is bi-polar)

Mom wants to drop either friday or saturday nights.
(mom wants to take one son on friday and the other on saturdays)

Mom will take exception to me picking up SD on Tues with the boys.
(hasn't complained about this one yet)

Mom wants hubby to take SD on sunday and monday nights.
(he called first and said I am going to take her on Tues Thurs and sundays all day.)

pseudo,

What BM is doing to her kids is abuse, in my opinion. But, my opinion means squat.

I'm not sure what your entire situation is, but have you and DH taken a 'defensive' stance? It sounds as if everything you do is defending yourselves and that no matter how ridiculous BM's complaints are, she is being taken seriously.... maybe because you are defending yourselves?

When she says her son is bi polar... I'd respond by asking her why she thinks that. Then, suggest a professional evaluate him. I might even add my opinion to the professional, "he seems like a normal 10 year old to me. I'd hate to think of him being labeled as bi polar if he really isn't. I'd hate to see him on medication if he really doesn't need to be." and let the professional make the determination. It's just my opinion, but it's a bad parent that pushes to get their kid diagnosed and on medication for something, unless there are obvious signs that others besides mom notice. Thinking Munchausen by proxy? (Is mom getting something out of kid having mental health problem?)

When mom wants to split up the kids by taking them on alternate weekends, I might ask if she thinks it's important for her kids to spend time with her together? It might create more rivalry if they alternate weekends. Imagine one kid comes back saying we did ______. and the other kid feels like he missed out on that fun. It can become a competition and about who has more fun with mom or who mom likes better. That rivalry can happen when they are together, but might be worse when they are split up. My SD is constantly worried that her mom is doing things with BF's kids when she's not there, or that she talks to her sister more than her. I'd point out that it's not about mom & her convenience, it's about the kids & what's best for them, even if it means mom is inconvenienced.

If you are not defensive but making it about the kids, not about mom or you/DH, then you might get better results. Mom wants to be seen as the victim and your complaint of her is only going to fuel her image as a victim. But, if you are not complaining about what mom is doing, but complain about things that hurt/affect the kids... how can DSS or mom argue with that. Let me give you an example:

In our situation, BM says she'll call SD back, then doesn't. Instead of DH calling BM (or someone else) and saying how terrible BM is for not calling SD, he would say to BM (or someone else) how upset SD gets when her mom promises to call but doesn't. She looks at the clock (when BM says I'll call you back in 30 minutes) and mopes around. Sometimes she calls BM back & gets her voice mail. If DH were to call BM and be critical of her not calling (or answering her phone), BM would feel attacked (& think DH is telling her what to do) and someone else might see him criticizing mom as him attacking mom. But, when it's presented from how it makes SD feel, it's not attacking mom, it's worrying about SD, which gets a different reaction. (mom still gets defensive & makes excuses but she can't argue that SD isn't sad when SD is sad by it.)

I say nothing to BM absolutely nothing. Except in court last week but once she began threatening me I walked away.

Figured let her look like a fool screaming and hollering in the court house.

My letter to the counselors contained:

What she does to the boys and the reactions it produces in them.

And the things I am concerned about with SD her behaviors.

I agree splitting the boys nights up with mom is a bad idea. Hubby told mom if she wanted to do that it had to be on the wednesdays ... but she cried she couldn't go that long with out seeing one of her babies. So that won't happen.

I believe Mom has some sort of personality disorder ...but again just my opinion.

Mom is not co-operating with DSS. Who knows how long they will put up with it before they do something....

SD's counselor is second guessing herself. (she helped diagnose SD)

We have many (6) people helping us now ... the more people the better... we say nothing to mom about what she does we log it and the DSS worker and counselors read the comments when we meet bi-weekly.

The one question they keep asking us is "what goes on at mom's house?" and we keep telling them we don't know we don't ask ... unless they come through the door battling we do not ask other than "did you have a good weekend?" and even when battling we settle whatever the issue is from the time they walked in the door .... well why don't you ask ... our standard answer is ....they get enough badgering from her that they don't need us to ask them every detail of their weekend. They just tell us eventually.

Wow psuedo mom. Sounds like some of the crap I have had to deal with over the years. Tread carefully. Even if dh gets full custody, your trouble will just begin.
Love the mistreatment too lol...most of those are all on my list too, and a few others, like actually having sd do her own laundry and expect it to be put away (which she never does anyway), and she has one stinking chore (washing dishes) which is apparently torture. Plus her dad won't let her wear certain types of clothing to school (ie spaghetti strap tanks, or low cut tops etc) So obviously we are just big meanies! Those are the things that get us trash talked by her to my family and others, but she makes it sound like we just throw her into the basement and chain her to the wall or something. God forbid she actually do something to turn things around for herself. Better to blame others.