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Electrical Wiring

wiring help - bathroom fan

14 years ago

Hey there, new poster with a wiring question. I'm replacing the old exhaust fan in the upstairs bathroom with a new Panasonic fan. I've got a Marktime fan/light time switch. The hot wire is in the ceiling where the fan will go. There are two romex wires that go from the fan to the wall switch. We have had the attic insulated with dense pack cellulose so adding more wires would be very difficult. I had no problem wiring the old fan but this new timed switch is different than wiring to two separate switches. Here is the diagram from the switch:

http://www.mhrhodes.com/images/42_Series_11-05-07.jpg

Can anyone help here?

Thanks,

Steven

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Comments (6)

joed
14 years ago
If you only had a fan before you probably don't enough wires to also wire a light.
Tell us all the wires going from the fan to the switch box. Is the a receptacle in the switch box?
steveninmaine
Original Author
14 years ago
The live line goes to the fan in the ceiling. Then there are two pieces of romex going from the fan to the switch.
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"You mentioned Panasonic fan with occupancy sensor. Does the fan turn off automatically when persons leaves the bathroom?" Some of the fans have sensors; motion and/or humidity. Motion will turn the fan on when you step into the shower. When you step out they will continue to run for a specified period of time set by the user, to 60 minutes, then they turn off automatically. The humidity sensors, they can go off any time. You can set them to a certain level...but they can be a little wishy-washy. The sensors sound good, but I'm wary of how they perform. Humidistats can activate at any time (3:00 in the morning) and run for how ever long. It's really all about sensor sensitivity and calibration. Motion sensors could be activated by simply walking through the bathroom. I'm not aware of how well (or poorly) Panasonic's automation performs. Automation can be advantageous - as long as it works how you expect it to, at least within reasonable boundaries.
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(1) is the source of power, as you surmised and determined empirically. One of the cables goes to another room and the switch does not affect it. The black from that cable is paired with the black of the cable from the power source and a pigtail from that junction goes to the switch to power it. The other two blacks are one for the fan and one for the light. Since there is just one circuit, the whites can be left spliced together. The blacks for the light and fan each need to be controlled by separate switches. A 2-gang box must be installed instead of the single gang you now have. The existing single gang must be really crowded. It probably exceeds box fill specifications.
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There should be a ground terminal (possibly just a screw or bare or green wire) that you connect the ground wire to. It's really hard to be sure, you should have noticed how things were connected before you removed the old unit. I'm presuming there are two switches in your previous installation (one for fan and one for light)? In that case one probably feeds the black and the other the white. If that is the case then the beige (probably just a discolored white) gets connected to both fan white wires. The blue wire goes to either the red or black and the black wire to the other one.
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From the load side of the GFCI to the switch - hot (black) wire to the common. From the switch, the three 12/2 cables going out. Black wire connected to each of the three screws. Connect the white (neutral) coming in from the GFCI to the three neutrals going up to the fixture. Label everything so you don't get confused up at the fixture. Make up your connections at the fixture. Ground wires need to be connected in each box and to the devices/fixtures. You need to consider box fill with that many cables you'll need somewhere around a 23 sq. in. box. That rules out any kind of rectangular "switch" box. You'll need to use a deep 4" square box and a mud ring.
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joe_cnc
14 years ago
I couldn't pull up your wiring diagram.I replaced my bathroom exaust fan some years back.I had a GFCI that fed a double-single pole switch which powered my fan and a 5 bank of vanity lights.The new exaust fan had 1-60watt light and a 25-watt night light.To run it I had to add another double-single pole switch.In order to wire it to the switch I had to wire a WHITE(NEUTRAL)as a HOT BLACK WIRE. It's very rare to have to do this but in my situation the CODE allowed it.That means connecting a black(hot) to a (nuetral) white.The original fan was fed from a GFCI.So in order to connect my 2 double-single pole switch's I had to use a WHITE (NEUTRAL) AS A HOT WIRE.I also marked it with a marker and coiled some electrical tape around it to have no doubt that was a live hot wire.I would suggest you contact an electrician if you don't understand the wiring diagram or are unsure how to make the connections.Its always worth the extra money to keep your family safe.When in doubt call an electrician.
steveninmaine
Original Author
14 years ago
I understand the diagram but it only shows how to wire the switch when the supply is at the switch, not when the supply is at the fan. There are enough wires, I just want to get it right.

Steven
joe_cnc
14 years ago
If you understand the diagram and how to connect the switch or switch's?#1 disconnect the breaker that is feeding that line.#2 get the correct length and gauge of wire to (fish) down to the switch.#3 get a UL approved connection box with the correct box connector's. You will need 2.#4 make sure ALL circuits are disconnected that feed that area-bathroom.#5 fish down your wire to the switch allowing 3" extra for connections.#6 fasten connection box to joist.#7 run the feed and the extension feed through the box connectors.#8 run both the feed and extension feed wires into the connection box.#9 connect both wire feeds and box connectors opposite to each other in the connection box .#10 use the correct wire nuts for the ga wire being used and make the connections.#11 Wire according to your diagram.
hendricus
14 years ago
I'm making the assumption that the two romex are cables with two wires plus ground in each cable. Also assuming that you had two switches and both these lines are switch loops. If so, I'll continue.

One cable must be converted to carry the power to the switch along with a neutral. Connect this cable to the power and neutral line at the fixture and to the black and white at the switch/timer.

The second cable, for ease of identification, remark both ends with one wire being red and one being blue. Connect to the blue and red on the switch/timer. Refer to the diagram and connect the other ends to the brass of the fan and light. Connect the neutral to the silver of the fan and light.

Stand back and trace the path that the power will take coming from the main circuit box, thru the fixture, to the switch/timer and then to the fan/light. There should be a continuos path from the main panel and back to the main panel.

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