Extreemly intemidated by my stepson

pinkbunny

I am 26 years old, my stepson is 25. I have been with his dad for almost 3 years now and just had a child. The first year was really awful. My husband's son HATED me with a passion and I could'nt understand why. I am really freindly and likeable and never had openly been so rejected and had never felt such hostility from someone I barley knew. I tried to talk to him about it - ONCE, and was met with angry questions such as "how old is your dad?" and "do you know how old MY dad is?" and "you are just temporary, how many stupid little girls like you have come and gone with my dad!" and "girls like you are a dime a dozen." It was all really hurtful, but very insiteful. I set forth from then on taking his hostility with grace because I realized the anger was stemming from issues he had with me and his father's age difference and possibly attachment issues because of the girls his dad had been with in the past.

So that was the first year- the second was much better- he realised that I wasnt going anywhere, and I think he saw how happy I made his dad and how much I loved his dad. Also I always cook for them both, do laudry and clean and work hard to be the perfect little housewife- which he benifits from even though its his dad who is married to me.

BUT here is the delemma I am faced with now. I am all of a sudden a stay at home mom and since I am in the house day in and day out - I would like to get things better organized and to feel a little more like this is MY home too - right now I feel like I am living in my husband and stepson's house.

BUT whatever I do- whatever furniture I move or pictures I take down/put up, closets I clear out or whatever it is I work on to improve around the house- this wicked stepson undoes right after I do it! It is so annoying and we have started having all out screaming and yelling and name-calling verbal brawles over it. He has a horrible temper and it really scares me. He is so careless and leaves lights on and doors open all the time too. I came home the other day to find the front door wide open and no one home- he had left the house and thoughtlessly left the door open. I was afraid the whole rest of the day that some stranger could be hiding inside the house somewhere. Also he leaves his shoes all over along with clothes and just tons of "stuff." I am fed up with picking up after him - and then having everything spread out all over the house again. Its like an endless cycle and I have started feeling such hate towards him. His dad does nothing about any of this. He tells me to not pick up after his son- saying Im "not his maid" but I cant stand clutter and messes! About the fighting, he just tells us both not to talk to eachother - which is hard when you LIVE with someone.

If anyone has any advice- please give it to me!!! Im dyeing for answers. I start getting anxiety whenever I hear him coming into the room Im in and I get shakey everytime he talks to me (which is jsut to yell at me)I have started staying locked in our bedroom with my baby whenever I know my stepson is home just to avoid seeing him. His dad WONT tell him to move out either. I dont know what to do!!!

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sunnygardenerme

I am sorry to hear of your situation. I have experienced the same with my 22 year old adult SS. He no longer lives with us but when he did it was pretty much the same senario. However, he never yelled at me, he often ignored me or said rude disrespectful comments to me. There is no age difference between me and DH. It was hurtful, stressful, like walking on egg shells in my own home, which DH and I purchased together (I paid 1/2 and DH paid 1/2). SS never paid a dime for the home. It often felt like I had no say in my own home. DH could see NO fault with his son. I would never allow SS to live with us again, it cause to much stress on our marriage. At 25 years old why is he living with you? Give some details.

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angelz921

Oh my goodness, I can find so many things that are so wrong with this picture. First off why exactly is a 25 year old adult living at home with his daddy? Does he pay rent? Utilities? If not he'd better start, my mother use to yell at me and my brother for leaving lights on or doors open, things like we are not air conditioning all of Cocoa (where we use to live).

I would talk to DH, tell him that if SS doesn't straighten up he can be charged for all of the things you do for him. You pick up his clothes and shoes drop them off in his room on the floor, if there is laundry in the wash or dryer that is his dump it on the floor in his bedroom. My mom does it with my brother who is also 25 who moved back home a few months ago. Don't do his laundry he is old enough, don't cook for him he is also old enough. If you are cooking dinner and he is home, let him eat but insure you DH tell him that he can do all the dishes and clean the kitchen since you were nice enough to cook for him. It is not a you give and he takes situation, you are not his door mat, you are an equal part in a not so equal household. Your DH needs to step up and take your side, if your SS yells at you you DH needs to step up and be a dad and a man. It's not appropriate for a man to yell and scream at a women, threaten or anything of a violent nature. He needs to teach his son some manures, you might not be an adult to your SS but you are his father wife and that deserves some respect. He doesn't have to like you but does have to respect you.

As for the moving things around in the house, again speak to DH. Tell him what it is exactly that you want done, let him do it. When SS opens his mouth about the change or he goes to move it back, let your DH say that he had moved it for a reason. Your SS needs to see that your DH excepts the changes being made in the home and is even wanting to support you by doing them himself. There for SS can't outright blame you for the changes.

Anyways, the point your DH just needs to back you up more. You should not have to live like a prisoner in your room just because you SS is acting like a 16 year old child.

Just my opinion.

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sweeby

What struck me most about your post is that your husband's son is treating you like a step-sister, not a step-mother, and your husband is treating the discord between the two of you the same way he would treat it if his two children couldn't get along. You do not have the 'upper hand' parental role over SS -- you're both 'equals', because your youth, SS's attitude, and Dad's lack of respect all work to keep things that way. The family dynamic is one adult and two children, not two adults and one child, and certainly not three adults.

Sounds like your DH needs a major and fundamental attitude change -- and you probably do too.

There's no way you should get 'parental' about your SS. I'd even lose that term entirely from your vocabulary! This young man is IN NO WAY your son, and you are IN NO WAY his mother. That's a totally unrealistic expectation. You simply can't expect his to treat you with any sort of 'position authority'... But what you can demand is common courtesy.

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sweeby

More precisely, when you first cam onto the picture, SS treated you like crap and told you why -- It was because he considered you "Chippie of the Month". I'm guessing he started treating you better because he realized that as 'Chippies' go, you were a pretty decent one. But now that you've had a baby and are starting to get territorial (ie, 'Your' house, not his) -- he's angry that you're overstepping your boundaries -- the ones he's given you in his own mind, not the ones you're entitled to as 'wife'.

So in SS's mind, you're STILL 'Chippie of the Month' -- but no longer a good one. (Marriage, baby, telling him what to do, etc.) Seems SS still thinks of it as "Dad and his' house" and "Dad and him" as the primary relationship. And Dad's letting him get away with it. Meanwhile, you're trying to complete the transition to "Hubby and Me" and "Our house - SS lives here too" --
And Dad's just trying to keep the peace and not acknowledge the problem.

Just curious -- How many wives has your husband had?
Do you think this accurately reflects SS's current mindset?
And if so, how much truth is there to his perception?

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pinkbunny

WOW - what a wonderful surprise to see all the good advice and input from everyone! You all have such great things to say and I appreciate it so so much. And you are ALL right about each thing you said...
"Sweeby" you are so right about me not being his step-mom and him not being my SS. I have never though of him that way- I used to term simply to help illustrate my situation and technically since I am married to his dad, thats what I now am, but in no way feel like. I don't try to tell him what to do either- that is one thing I am really uncomfortable doing. After all, I am not his elder and even though he should respect me - I also need to respect him, and I feel that by telling him what to do I would make matters worse. If the trash needs to be taken from the back step to the garbage cans because it has piled up for two weeks - I tell his dad to ask SS to do it (It is SS ONLY responsibility around the house. Taking out the trash- thats IT.)
Our big fight last week came about when SS ripped out the baby's car seat, case and toys and stuffed it all in the trunk because he didn't want it to look like he was driving a family car. Thats fine, but I think that the right thing to do- is when you get back home, put everything back like it was. When I went out to the car the next day holding my sleeping baby- I was planning to put her into her seat and buckle her in without waking her and take her to her Dr.s appt. Which I couldn't do because everything was in the trunk. I asked SS to please put it back like it was (and I ASK- I don't TELL- the tones used in doing those two are very different from each other) he blew up at me screaming that if it was a problem for me then to do it myself. Which I responded that I shouldn't have to because I didn't take it all out. His reply to that was "you are lucky you have my dad and you better hope he lives a long time because when he dies you are F@#$%&." Which of course had nothing to do with our problem at hand- don't know why he blurted that out. To make a long story short, his screaming woke the baby and I ended up putting the seat and everything back in the car myself.
His dad is from Italy (Speaks Italian better than English) and says that in his culture the parents don't make their kids move out because they are a certain age. He says his son can live with us as long as he wants. His son doesn't go to school, and he works at a surf shop making min. wage. His dad pays for everything- and even gives him cash when he comes asking for it - which is often. His dad even pays for his cell phone, truck, truck insurance, utilities, food and no he does not charge him rent.
I like what "angelz921" said about putting his laundry on the floor in his room along with his shoes and things he leaves lying around. I will do that - but I will be terrified of being around when he comes home and discovers what I have done! But you are right- I need to be that way with him.
In answer to the last post- My husband has had 2 wives before me. He is 27 yrs. older than me and this is my first marrage. SS's real mom and dad hated eachother and didn't get along at all. They were "promised" to eachother in Italy when they were young and got married because of that- not for love. His second wife he supposedly loved alot- and she had probs. with SS as well- but he eventually came around and liked her. She said he was her "SON" and made him believe she cared for and loved him like one. Then after the divorce- SS never heard from her again.
I am madly in love with his dad and want to be with him for the rest of my life- but I shudder at the thought of having to always live with this unhealthy presence in the home. I don't know what to do to change things though- besides make him hate me so much that he wants to move out! But by doing that I am going to be miserable :(

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theotherside

I think you need another car. Of course the son wouldn't want to drive a car with a carseat in it - any potential girlfriends would probably jump to the conclusion that he was married or at least a father. It is also far safer to keep the carseat base buckled in the car, since it is not always easy to buckle it in tightly enough.

I have to wonder if the father (and the son's potential girlfriends) are worried about the potential for a sexual relationship between his son and his wife. If I were in my twenties and my boyfriend were living with a woman of the same age, I would be suspicious.

All I can say is what were they thinking, to get themselves into such a mess. How could either the father or the wife expect the son not to be furious when his father marries someone his own age? I am having trouble imagining someone marrying a man more than twice her age.

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sylviatexas1

This is both abuse & abuse by proxy.

Your husband's son is not "just" jealous, or "just" having trouble adjusting, he's screaming, he's intimidating, he's "ripping" your belongings out of your car, he's storming around in a rage, & you're the focus of his rage.

People who act like that do not "get better".

They like being like that.

They feed off rage, they enjoy screaming at their scapegoat/victim, & the next step may very well be a punch or a beating.

& your husband is not just tolerating it, he's enabling it;
he finds excuses, he ignores your position.

& he claims people in Italy put up with this kind of nonsense because that's the way it's done.

My guess is that he enjoys seeing his son terrorize you.

It's like the son is a tool;
the son does horrible things & the father is "innocent", (that's how passive-aggressive people inflict a lot of misery).

I was in what I thought was a relationship years ago, had a great deal of uneasiness with boyfriend's son, finally fled when the son (he was 32!) was invited to move back into his father's home.

I knew that not only would I never be safe spending any time there, but that my very existence in his father's life would enrage the son, & that it would eventually build to a crisis & explode, & I'd be the one to pay the price.

As it turned out, I wasn't safe anyway:
the son knew where I lived, knew my dogs (they wouldn't bark if he appeared)...
& one night my car was spray painted.
It was a white car, & every square inch of it, every separate part, had black paint sprayed on it.

The police agreed that the paint color had been chosen for my car, that the purpose was to cost as much money as possible (even the windshield, license plates, & wheel covers had black paint on them), & that it likely was ex bf's son...

but nobody saw him, & ex bf said I had undoubtedly angered some kids in my neighborhood (damage was victim's fault), was incensed that I would think that his precious child would do something like that, even threatened to take me to court for defamation of character.

Knowing that his father's staunch defense of him would encourage the son to do more bad things, I dropped the matter & kept a low profile.

Get your baby & get out of there.

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sylviatexas1

tos, what the h### is the matter with you?

This woman writes that she's intimidated by a bully & that her husband (no matter how old he is or how long they have or haven't been married) stands by & does nothing & indeed enables it, & your response is that they should buy another car for the bully???

& that it's the married couple's fault for getting married?

&, although *nobody* mentioned a girlfriend until you did, even if this grown man (who was already grown when his father married) has a jealous girlfriend, it does not entitle him to bully anybody.

One thing I did forget to say is that viewing his father's women friends or significant others or Saturday night dates as "chippies" is *not* normal, & that calling any of them names is not decent behavior.

If his father were a decent man, he wouldn't have stood for that nonsense & would have put a stop to it long before OP came on the scene.

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june0000

Well put, Sylvia.

Why is a 25 year-old man still living at home? And why is it expected that you cook and clean for him?

SS needs to grow up, get his own place, pay his own bills and start acting like the adult he is supposed to be. This is a ridiculous living situation and unless there is some sort of developmental disorder or mental problem going on with him, there isn't any excuse for his behavior - or his Dad's for that matter. It is abuse.

I'd tell DH to make the necessary changes in your household or as Sylvia suggested, take your baby and get the H--- out of there.

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theotherside

It doesn't work to move into someone else's house and make changes without their enthusiastic agreement - whether that is the husband, the husband's children, or a roommate.

It rarely works to marry someone old enough to be your father.

It rarely works to marry someone with children your own age.

Is there ANYONE here who would be ok with their 23 year old daughter dating any 50 year old guy, much less a 50 year old guy with a 22 year old son? Is there anyone who would not discourage their daughter from doing so?

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sylviatexas1

It isn't the "child's" house, it's the father's house.
The "child" is a grown man.

If a child or roommate has a problem, even if it's only lack of "enthusiastic agreement", with a homeowner marrying & moving the new spouse into the home, the child or roommate isn't entitled to abuse the new spouse; the child or roommate needs to move.

OP didn't ask for opinions on the age difference between her & her husband.

& OP isn't the parent of a 23-year-old daughter whose choice of partner the parent disagrees with;
OP *is* a now-25-year-old wife & mother who is being tormented in her own home (yes, it's her home; she lives there, she's married to the person who bought it-although, if we're dishing out unsolicited advice, I hereby advise her to see an attorney to find out what property rights she has, if any.)

I also hereby advise her to check out the stories on the 1st & 2nd wives;
I don't think arranged marriages were common in Italy in the 1970's;
her husband's first wife may very well have other reasons to "hate" him.

OP, I wish you the best.

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theotherside

It is the son's house as well as the father's - I wouldn't repaint my 11 year old's room without her agreement, I don't throw anything out (except for things that are obviously trash, of course) or give anything away without consulting with all my children, and I certainly wouldn't make any major changes to the house without consulting EVERYONE who lives here - whether they contribute to the mortgage or not.

Let's say there were two adult roommates, and one of them wanted to ask a third to live there, as a SO/spouse. If the new occupant started making changes to the house without consulting the existing occupants, and otherwise not getting along with one of them, are you saying the ROOMMATE would have to move?

It makes no difference how much the roommate/son is contributing to the mortgage - he is there because his father wants him to be. In my state, his father would have to go through a rather lengthy legal process to evict him, even if he wanted to, especially if he has promised him that he can live there indefinitely. For all we know, he is on the deed - I kind of got that impression from what he said to the OP about what would happen in the event of the father's death. At a minimum, it appeared from that comment that HE will inherit the house.

What I don't understand is why the OP moved in/married the father in the first place, knowing that his son lived there and that he couldn't stand her.

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sylviatexas1

'It is the son's house as well as the father's'

What?

Are you getting that idea from here?

'right now I feel like I am living in my husband and stepson's house.'

Do you think that that means that she said she's living in a house that her husband's hostile son actually owns?

I think OP is saying that she feels disenfranchised, like a third wheel.

in which case, her husband needs to correct his attitude & correct his son's attitude & make sure that everybody knows that he & OP are partners & that son will respect OP as his dad's partner.

which he isn't doing.

or from here?

'you are lucky you have my dad and you better hope he lives a long time because when he dies you are F@#$%&.' '

Here I see 2 possibilities:

#1. This abusive *man* is intimidating her by issuing groundless threats, a common tactic of bullies.

in which case, the husband needs to kick his son's backside.

Since he refuses to do that, I'm very suspicious that it might be

#2. The abusive man knows his father has no respect for any woman (OP might get a whole new story from first 2 wives) & thinks that his father has tied up the property so that no woman can get it, even if she's the mother of the guy's child.

in which case OP needs an attorney yesterday.

& I didn't say that if *2 roommates* shared a house blah blah blah.

I said that if a roommate shared a house with the *homeowner* & didn't like what was going on, the roommate would have to move.

He's there because his father wants him to be?

Well, yes, I think that's the problem, isn't it?

His father wants him to be there, threatening & intimidating & verbally abusing OP.

& yes, you can evict someone from your home if you don't have the fortitude to put your obnoxious adult son's stuff in storage & change the locks on your home.

If the son sues, it may cost you some money, you might have to pay a couple of months rent for the brat, but I've never heard of the court making a parent let an abusive "child" live in the house where someone else is vulnerable to mistreatment at the hands of the "child".

You say, 'For all we know', 'I get the impression','It appeared', but your replies sound as though there's no doubt, even though OP never said any of the things you're assuming.

Even if the house is husband's separate property & he has left it to his son, or he has put his son's name on the deed, a wife, especially a wife who has a child with the homeowner, has certain rights, & the belligerant brat might have a hard time throwing his stepmother & half-sibling out on the streets.

If he's deeded the house to his son, #1 he's an idiot, & #2 OP needs to get out of there.

Every time I return to this, I notice more & more alarming things.

'Kids', normal ones anyway, or even grown-ups or other people of legal age, don't get so enraged & out-of-control all by themselves, & they don't stay in a rage.

I'd bet the husband is pushing his son's buttons, keeping him on edge, badmouthing OP, telling the son that OP is a gold-digger who has wormed her way into his life, that she just wants his money, that she got pregnant on purpose even though he didn't want her to, etc, & I'd bet this isn't the first time he's done it.

There's a reason the first wife 'hated' her husband, there's a reason the second wife hasn't been heard from since the divorce, there's a reason the son views all his father's women friends as 'a dime a dozen' chippies, etc.

I'd really really like to hear their stories direct from the first 2 wives.

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sylviatexas1

...that I'm sorry that this has deteriorated into an argument.

tos always opposes 2nd wives, I don't know if it's on principle or if it's something else, but please don't be disenheartened.

Take care of yourself, take care of your baby, & let the rest of the world, husband & his son included, sort itself out.

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pinkbunny

Thank you to the ones who actually had usefull advice. I have to say that my postings birthed some very misconstrued conceptions- but that is ok...
I must respond to several of them though- one being what "silviatexas" said ("I'd bet the husband is pushing his son's buttons, keeping him on edge, badmouthing OP, telling the son that OP is a gold-digger who has wormed her way into his life, that she just wants his money, that she got pregnant on purpose even though he didn't want her to, etc, & I'd bet this isn't the first time he's done it.") That could not be further from the truth. His father does nothing of the sort and hates discord in the home.
I know clearly what happened between both of his ex wives and him. The first one he did not love and married her to keep the promised word, as I said before. Because he didn't love her and wasn't attracted to her or happy, he cheated alot. Eventually enough was enough and they went their separate ways. She left taking nearly everything he worked his entire life for... and he is still struggling to recover financially from that divorce.
The second wife he was with for 12 years and he has nothing bad to say about her. He just didn't feel that she was the one for him and she hat a hot temper and he does too (I am more passive and level-headed) and so they fought alot. After fights many times they would split up for short times but kept getting back together later and trying to make things work. Finally though there wasn't anything left in their relationship to salvage and he was going through a very painful time in his life- his daughter of 16 years old died of cancer. He didn't feel that his wife was supportive or compassionate towards him as he thought she should have been and their relationship was on the rocks at that time anyways - and they broke it off and only reunited for a brief time about 6 months before I came into the picture.
I have read plenty of letters she wrote to him during their marriage and I think I get a pretty clear picture from them how things were. I don't think that I want or need to speak with her directly about their relationship. I have seen her twice when I have been out doing shopping and although she doesn't know who I am I have recognized her because of pictures I have seen of her. She is really beautiful - much more than I am and so Id rather not think about her let alone talk TO her!
I am not mistreated by my husband. He is good and so loving and sweet to me and our child- it is his evil SON who is my problem here. I just wish I could find a solution to this problem - and I don't think that ME leaving is the solution.
Oh and one more reason that I think my man is so easy on his son and indulges him is because of the loss of his daughter. I think that because he knows how it feels to loose a child - he clings even more tightly to the one (now ONES) he has still.
So I did what one of you suggested and I went around gathering all SS stuff up and piled it all in his room. You couldn't even see his bed when I was through!!!! I was so proud of myself for taking that kind of action. I will let you all know what his reaction to that will be... if I live to tell of it!

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plasticgarden

You wont care for my response.Your stepson does not respect you because of your age.You are on the same level as him maturity-wise,and he proably feels you are by no means a "parental" authority figure.Pointing out the obvious probably doesnt help,but unless your husband is willing to toss him out~there isnt much you can do.

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plasticgarden

"Is there ANYONE here who would be ok with their 23 year old daughter dating any 50 year old guy, much less a 50 year old guy with a 22 year old son? Is there anyone who would not discourage their daughter from doing so?"

I wouldnt be ok with it,you can bet on that.I'm sorry if it seems judgemental~but I agree with TheOtherside.And I agree with Sweeby.It's kinda ridiculous to expect much else from a situation like this.

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Vivian Kaufman

I am having a hard time getting my head around the fact that pinkbunny's husband would ALLOW his son to verbally abuse her in this manner. Based on that fact alone it is obvious that he is a lousy husband and possibly has been a lousy father in the past. Culturally-bound or not, abuse is abuse and the person who tolerates it is JUST AS responisible for it as the abuser. What kind of husband doesn't take up for his wife if she is being mistreated?

A "loving, sweet, good" man would NOT stand by and let his wife be tormented by ANYONE.

The most valuable lesson I have learned in the past two years is that "actions speak louder than words." Seems to me that what you're being told isn't actually matching up with how he conducts himself. I know that you DON'T WANT to believe that your husband is hanging you out to dry, but by not protecting you from an abuser he is doing just that. I don't know a MAN who would allow his wife to be tormented in this manner by ANYONE.

I say take your baby, get the hell out, and get an attorney NOW. You and your baby need to be protected from these miserable people.

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theotherside

"Because he didn't love her and wasn't attracted to her or happy, he cheated alot."

There is no justification for cheating, and this says quite a lot about his character.

"she hat a hot temper and he does too" yet "hates discord in the home?"

"I think that because he knows how it feels to loose a child - he clings even more tightly to the one (now ONES) he has still."

I think that may well be true, and makes marrying into this situation even more difficult. I have to wonder whether, just as people who marry much older men are often looking for father figures, this man was, in some weird way, not looking for a trophy wife but for a daughter figure. And/or, perhaps, someone who was willing and able to give him another child.

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angelz921

pinkbunny - Good job hunny! He can get mad at you all he wants for throwing his stuff in his room and on his bed. When he has a problem and starts yelling simply put it "As you have clearly put in I am not your mom I am also NOT your maid, treat me with some respect and I will do the same but until then I will continue with this." It's that easy, if he gets mad and yells walk away, don't encourage him by yelling and screaming back, you're just stooping to his level which is what he wants. My grandmother has a saying I rather like it and try to use it in my own life. If you yell at someone they can and will ignore you but if you whisper they are forced to listen real hard to hear what you are saying.

You don't demand respect you earn it, but in a situation like yours I think you will have to go about it in a different way. I hope some of the stuff I have said will help in a little bit. I do agree your husband should step up and not allow his son to treat you this way, but that really isn't up to us how to tell you to live your life or what to do we can only advice you. If you are willing to live with your SS you will need to get wise on how to deal with him and his attitude and anger. Be SMART and get CREATIVE! BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY DON'T GET ANGRY!

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pinkbunny

Thank you to the ones who actually had usefull advice. I have to say that my postings birthed some very misconstrued conceptions- but that is ok...
I must respond to several of them though- one being what "silviatexas" said ("I'd bet the husband is pushing his son's buttons, keeping him on edge, badmouthing OP, telling the son that OP is a gold-digger who has wormed her way into his life, that she just wants his money, that she got pregnant on purpose even though he didn't want her to, etc, & I'd bet this isn't the first time he's done it.") That could not be further from the truth. His father does nothing of the sort and hates discord in the home.
I know clearly what happened between both of his ex wives and him. The first one he did not love and married her to keep the promised word, as I said before. Because he didn't love her and wasn't attracted to her or happy, he cheated alot. Eventually enough was enough and they went their separate ways. She left taking nearly everything he worked his entire life for... and he is still struggling to recover financially from that divorce.
The second wife he was with for 12 years and he has nothing bad to say about her. He just didn't feel that she was the one for him and she hat a hot temper and he does too (I am more passive and level-headed) and so they fought alot. After fights many times they would split up for short times but kept getting back together later and trying to make things work. Finally though there wasn't anything left in their relationship to salvage and he was going through a very painful time in his life- his daughter of 16 years old died of cancer. He didn't feel that his wife was supportive or compassionate towards him as he thought she should have been and their relationship was on the rocks at that time anyways - and they broke it off and only reunited for a brief time about 6 months before I came into the picture.
I have read plenty of letters she wrote to him during their marriage and I think I get a pretty clear picture from them how things were. I don't think that I want or need to speak with her directly about their relationship. I have seen her twice when I have been out doing shopping and although she doesn't know who I am I have recognized her because of pictures I have seen of her. She is really beautiful - much more than I am and so Id rather not think about her let alone talk TO her!
I am not mistreated by my husband. He is good and so loving and sweet to me and our child- it is his evil SON who is my problem here. I just wish I could find a solution to this problem - and I don't think that ME leaving is the solution.
Oh and one more reason that I think my man is so easy on his son and indulges him is because of the loss of his daughter. I think that because he knows how it feels to loose a child - he clings even more tightly to the one (now ONES) he has still.
So I did what one of you suggested and I went around gathering all SS stuff up and piled it all in his room. You couldn't even see his bed when I was through!!!! I was so proud of myself for taking that kind of action. I will let you all know what his reaction to that will be... if I live to tell of it!

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kkny

PB,

Obviously your DH views his house as that of his son also. Whether it is old country, loss of his daughter (which we all agree has to be devasting) or just the way he is, so be it. I think putting the stuff on his bed was just rude, territorial and immature.

Yes, if my DD told me she was a dating a man twice her age with children her own age, I would try my best to dissuade her.

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weed30 St. Louis

This will be difficult for you to read, but I will offer my perspective as someone whose father dated girls half his age, many of them not much older than me, and all of them younger than the rest of my siblings.

I hated them too. I couldn't hate my dad, but I could hate those girls. I was never rude or abusive towards them, but I disliked them intensely and thought they were stupid and sleazy. I hated being around them. It was just gross, and also very embarrassing to me. I was mortified to be seen by someone I knew if we all happened to be out together. Heck, I was embarrassed for *anyone* to see us out together.

It was (and is) disgusting to me that a man would date/sleep with/marry someone who is young enough be his daughter or his daughter's best friend. So I should have hated my father too, but it was not emotionally possible for me to do so.

Currently, I am in the process of getting divorced. My 44 year old still not ex husband has a 22 year old girlfriend and a 3 month old baby. This girlfriend was not the cause of our divorce, but I bring it up because my stepdaughter (his daughter from his first marriage) is 18. And guess what, she hates the girlfriend. My SD lives in another state, has never even met the girlfriend, and hates her. I imagine she feels as disgusted and embarrassed as I did many years ago.

I am not saying all of this to be mean or make you feel bad - I am sure you are a nice person, as perhaps some of the girls my dad dated were. But how I felt and how my SD now feels is obviously, from his initial comments, exactly how your SS feels. These very real (and predictable) feelings and emotions are what you are up against.

I in no way excuse your SS's abuse of you, nor your husband's allowing it - that is unacceptable. But even if your husband steps up to the plate, I don't see that you will ever have it easy with your stepson.

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sylviatexas1

"That could not be further from the truth. His father does nothing of the sort and hates discord in the home."

Then why is there such "discord" in the home?

"she hat a hot temper and he does too (I am more passive and level-headed) and so they fought alot."

Where was his hatred of discord when this was going on?

"I am not mistreated by my husband. He is good and so loving and sweet to me and our child- it is his evil SON who is my problem here."

I'd have said the same thing about the situation I described in my past life-
until the light bulb finally lit up in my brain.

People do not let you know that they're sabotaging you, that they're two-faced, that your misery is hilarious fun.

They just keep telling you how sweet they are & how *sensitive* (one of my all-time faves) & how distressed they are at your unhappiness...
& you keep blaming the angry son.

(Magicians do this all the time.
It's called misdirection.

While you're looking at the beautiful assistant, the magician is working his illusions.)

As long as you focus on the son, & the son focuses on you, you're intimidated & the son is enraged.

Everything stays the same.


Best luck.

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pinkbunny

I don't need a father figure- I had a good father my whole life. He did want another child, but wasn't "looking" for someone to have one for him. He had a girlfriend when I met him and she was pregnant and he had her get an abortion and then they broke up and the two of us got together... If he was just looking for a baby then he would have kept hers I'm sure. I don't think his son sees me as a "gold-digger" - his dad doesn't have that much money.
SS does have a girlfriend and has been with her for a little over a year. I like her- although I dont see her very often. She spends the night over alot but slips out without me seeing her most of the time. She has her own house and car, good job and is educated and pretty. I dont know what she sees in him. She DOES NOT see the kind of guy that he is when she is not around though. I am debating on weather or not to talk to her about him and ask her in a subtle way if this does not bother her that he lives at home with his dad and is such a mooch. And also to see if htey are serious and if she thinks they will live together in the near future. My mom thinks this is a very screwed up situation and has asked SS if he can see himself living on his own or when he is going to start a family of his own (which I cant imagine him doing- he is like a CHILD) his reply was that he wants to always live with his dad and when he gets married he will probably live in the same house or one on the same property. I know why he wants to do this- FINICAL SUPPORT! Oh and everything his dad owns is in SS's name because of my husbands nasty first divorce- he doesn't want to appear to have any assets for fear that she will be able to take it all away again...

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pinkbunny

Oh and by the way- to "plasticgarden" what you said about "You are on the same level as him maturity-wise" is sooooo not true! He is VERY immature. I am mature beyond my years which is why I have problems dating someone my own age. I get along much better with people who are significantly older than myself, and always have. Even when I was a teenager my friends were adults. I wanted to be in during conversations the adults were having rather than being out playing with the kids my age.
About SS thinking of me as sleazy- I don't think that is possible. I am a modest person with class and dignity and am not flirty or ditzy in any way.
Thanks "weed30" for what you shared. Im sorry it was so hard for you and I feel bad to make someone else feel the same way you said you did. BUT at the same time you cannot choose who you love. I never expected to fall in love with someone 27 yrs. older than myself, nor did I set out looking for someone who was much older than me. It just happened that way.
I dont think putting all his crap on his bad was rude. Its rude for him to walk into a house that I put effort into keeping clean and toss his coat and shoes and whatever else on the floor and leave it all there for days. Its rude of him to do laundry and leave it all out for days puled up in the laundry room - filling the washing machine and dryer - and then to come home three days later and yell at me for them smelling rotten. I didn't start the washing and then leave it for days on end. And it isn't my responsibility to finish what he started. I don't think I have ever been rude to him in any way.

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Vivian Kaufman

"BUT at the same time you cannot choose who you love."

Oh yes you can... Make no mistake, you DECIDE to whom you hitch your wagon--and you have picked a couple of horses' behinds.

You are in a no-win situation. Sylvia and Weed30 know of what they speak. No husband worth keeping lets his wife be abused by ANYONE.

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weed30 St. Louis

"you cannot choose who you love"

Oh, but you can. You will realize that some day.

I would really advise you to take a step back and look at your husband in the cold light of day - there are some huge red flags waving madly :

>He has been married twice already. And I'm sorry, but you don't know the truth about what really went on.
I can promise you this: you know exactly what he wants you to know.

>He had a pregnant girlfriend when you met, 'he had her get an abortion', then he hooked up with you.

>He allows his son to treat you with disrespect and abuse.

>Everything he owns is in his son's name.
"Because he doesn't want to appear to have any assets for fear that his first wife will be able to take it all away again."
Is that what he told you? That is absolute BS. Unless these assets were things he acquired during their marriage and he hid them from the courts, she has zero claim on them. Anything he earned or bought after the divorce was final is his. He could have won the lottery the next day, and she'd have no claim. The fact that everything is in his son's name will be very bad for you if you split up or if he dies. Very bad.

Back to your SS.

" About SS thinking of me as sleazy- I don't think that is possible. I am a modest person with class and dignity and am not flirty or ditzy in any way."

Believe me, he thinks you are sleazy, or some form of it. It has nothing to do with modesty/class/dignity, and everything to do with the fact that you are his age and you are sleeping with/married to/have a baby with his father.

I would absolutely not talk to his girlfriend, you will make a bad situation worse. "The kind of guy he is when she is not around" ~ do you think she doesn't know how much he dislikes you? Do you think she won't tell him of your conversation? It is even possible that she doesn't think much of you either. As much as you want to think that everyone should accept your relationship, and that anyone who has an issue with the age difference is wrong, well, it doesn't work that way.

So you are stuck making the best of a bad situation. I would start with having a serious talk with your husband and demand that he have a serious talk with his son. His son doesn't have to like you, but he should have to treat you civilly and contribute in some way to the household.

Next, re-read the red flags above. What would you advise a friend who presented these to you?

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weed30 St. Louis

Add to red flag list:

> First wife: "Because he didn't love her and wasn't attracted to her or happy, he cheated alot."

> Second wife: "They broke it off and only reunited for a brief time about 6 months before I came into the picture."

Overview:

Cheated on first wife.

While reunited with second wife, cheated on her with girlfriend that he got pregnant.

Given the short span of time between reunited with second wife/got girlfriend pregnant/you came into picture, can pretty much guarantee that he cheated on pregnant girlfriend with you.

Will cheat on you.

I realize it seems like several of us are ganging up on you and ripping your husband, the man you love, to shreds. But Pinkbunny, please step back and really try to look at your situation. It is not good. Take your focus off your SS, and take a hard look at your husband. (Like the magician/assistant reference, above. )

Some of us have been there, or been in an equally bad situation. We are just trying to open your eyes and hope that you are spared what some of us have gone through. I hope for you and your baby's sake that we are wrong, but I don't think so.

At the very least, take some steps NOW to protect yourself and your baby financially. If you decide you want advice on how to do that, post back.

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sweeby

This is sounding worse and worse Pinkbunny...
Your handsome prince is sounding more and more like Charming from the Shrek movies than the Cinderella ones... He's not the victim of his two previous wives. He's not powerless to straighten out his son -- that is, unless he's allowed himself to become powerless by years and years of poor parenting.

Weed and Sylvia and Vivian have all given you excellent advice.

Please don't let this be true of you:

There are none so blind as those who will not see

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plasticgarden

"Oh and by the way- to "plasticgarden" what you said about "You are on the same level as him maturity-wise" is sooooo not true! He is VERY immature"

I have no doubt that this is true,but you must understand your stepson will NEVER see it this way.I wonder if your husband even sees it that way considering he doesnt stand up for you.No husband worth his salt lets his wife be bullied...even if it is by his own son.
I agree with weed30 and silviatexas advice as well.
I would tell your husband you want his son gone,and if he cant do it,I would leave as well.You dont want your child growing up in this hostile enviroment,do you?

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sylviatexas1

You can't throw someone out of the house they own.

so much for "letting" children stay in the home forever being a fine old-world tradition.

The only wife who could make a claim against his home is his current one, & he's nipped that in the bud by not *having* a home.

You feel like an outsider because you are.

Your stepson knows it, & he knows why;

you're the only one who's been fooled.

I wish you the best.

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theotherside

"He had a girlfriend when I met him and she was pregnant and he had her get an abortion and then they broke up and the two of us got together... If he was just looking for a baby then he would have kept hers I'm sure."

Am I interpreting this correctly - he met you, then talked his girlfriend into an abortion, broke up with her and hooked up with you?

Although I am pro-choice, I find this sickening.

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Vivian Kaufman

I agree, TOS.

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kkny

Pinkbunny, Did you know, at the time you met, that your then boyfriend had a girlfriend? That she was pregnant?

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pinkbunny

I did not know about the pregnant girlfriend.
Thanks for pointing out the obvious (which I feel stupid for not seeing before) about "The only wife who could make a claim against his home is his current one, & he's nipped that in the bud by not *having* a home." I never thought of that before! Now what SS said about "when my dad dies you are F@#$%@" makes sense.
So SS got home and found all his stuff in his room and I guess he spent a good part of the night putting everything back where I have gathered it up from. (He got home after we were in bed.) I haven't seen him yet- but I fully expected him to come and pound on our bed-room door and scream for his dad to come and see what I had done.
Yesterday I had a long talk with my husband about the home situation and how I feel like I live in him and his son's house and that this is not my home. I told him how uncomfortable I am here and how me and the baby hide out in the master suite when SS is home. He said that I need to change the way I feel and that I don't have to hide. I SHOULDN'T have to hide and how the hell am I supposed to change the way I feel? I think the situation needs to change in order for the way I feel to change. He brought up the fact that his last wife had the same probs. with his son for a long time before things got better. He also said his son was a complete ass-hole and that he knew that and cant change that. I told him that I think we need to go to a counselor to work out this major issue, because I don't think he realizes to what extent this is effecting not only me, but also our relationship and Im sure our baby feels the tension in the home too, and that breaks my heart to think of her suffering from this.
He said he had been to marital counselors in the past with both of his ex'es and that both the counselors had bigger issues than they did (he found out one of this was having an affair with the secretary and the other was later under suspicion for poisoning his wife which he almost got charged for.)
It is really important that I find someone who is really good at what they do and can help us sort through this problem. I really appreciate all the input from here- it helped me so much yesterday when we were having our discussion because I pulled from alot of the things I remember you guys saying.
I love my husband so much and wouldn't leave him over this- I would however leave him if he ever cheats on me. I don't feel that he would though, despite his past. He always says that he would never do that and I better not ever either and says "why would I want to hurt you like that?" I feel secure in what he tells me he will and will not do. I DO wish he would take action with is son instead of being so passive with him. Oh one more thing he did say is that he wants to have a talk with SS and I together- (vs. a talk with me and then one with SS) So that will be interesting- and hasn't happened before.
Thanks everyone on here for your support and encouragement.

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kkny

"He said that I need to change the way I feel and that I don't have to hide." You need to change the way you feel???

"He brought up the fact that his last wife had the same probs. with his son for a long time before things got better." -- Last wife had same problems???

"He also said his son was a complete ass-hole and that he knew that and cant change that" -- Was that the language he used? Because if he did, I would have even more questions.

And yes, once he has put house in son's name, it will be difficult to change son.

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pinkbunny

Yes it is the language he used. He talks like that- It is not unusual for me to hear him refer to his son that way.

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sweeby

OK, so YOU have problems. Yeah, it's your fault.
And his Ex's had problems. Must have been their fault too.
And son has problems.
And the therapists both had problems.

Sounds like the only perfect one is -- well, him!

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kkny

PB,

Have you explained to your mother that DH has put house in son's name? So in reality you, DH and your child are living in your stepson's home? I realize you just now understand the significance of this (which is part of the problem when someone young like yourself marries someone who has children, Xs, etc.).

Also, to Angel and the others, now that you understand that stepson owns the house, would you care to revise your advise re dumping stuff in his room, redoing, redecorating, etc.

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pinkbunny

SS does not own the homes or cars- his father does. It was his father who did the working and sweating and who is faced with so many challenges just to invest in and buy whatever he owns. SS did nothing to "earn" what is simply under his name. All he did was go to the bank with his dad/or home financing company's or wherever it is you go for those things- and he simply signed a paper agreeing that the properties and vehicles were to be in his name. Yes, technically he "owns" them now. But it is his father's things. Now that I have taken the time to explain of of this on here and to read the comments of everyone who replyed to my posts, I think that that is why my husband wont kick him out. He has too much to loose if he makes a wrong move with his son. His son has power over his dad because of all everything his dad owns being in SS name. It all makes much more sense to me now. My husband doesn't want his things in his son's name- but feels that he doesn't have anyone else he can trust as much as his own blood. He owes his first wife alot of money in back child support and somehow if his assets look significant than they can be taken from him and sold to pay what he technically owes (although he shouldn't have to pay anything- he provided for his family when they were together and after they split up.) He even lost his passport in that whole mess and cant have it back till the sum (of about $50,000.00) is payed.
Also KKNY- NOTHING in the house- the decorations, furniture or anything I move around/get rid of or buy is SS. It is his father's. SS did not purchase or decorate the house.

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kkny

PB,

Possibly you meant to say SS did not earn the house. But it certainly appears he now owns the house (and possibly also car). Possibly you do not understand the difference. I suggest you talk to a lawyer. Your SS can evict you and his Dad. Not vice versa. He has already put the house in his sons name.

So on top of Dad having no assets he owes 50K in back CS. What a guy! And he owes it. Dont kid yourself. Whether it was fair or not, it certainly appears he owes it. And just because he said it wasnt fair, that might not be the entire story.

In any event Dad has no assets, 50,000K in back CS. He may even have trouble getting a lease for a decent place.

He lost his passport over this? What about drivers license?

If I were you, I would explain all this to your mother. And I would work on my career.

I hope at least your DH is working on a job covered by social security and not off the books.

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june0000

PB,

On the chance that you are for real, please forgive me, but I hope that you get the help you need so you can remove yourself from this whole crazy scene.

If what you are saying about your husband is true, I don't think there is any purpose in getting him to a counselor because I don't think that what is wrong with him can be fixed. He's probably been told this during a session or two and that is why he doesn't want to go to go.

I've tried to not jump to judgement about your husband and at first felt his son was the problem. But the problem is most definitely your husband. He has no respect for women and he has no respect for his son.

Watch what he does. He will do what suits only him because he is the only one who matters.

Please get some help.

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sweeby

'Earning' and 'owning' are two very different concepts.
He owns them every bit as much as if he DID earn them, and the fact that he didn't earn them is irrelevent.
SS may have done nothing to earn those assets, but if they are held in his name, even "technically", then HE OWNS them.
"Technically" is another word for "legally" -- and when it comes to a legal dispute, "legally" is the only standard that applies.
Besides, even if the assets somehow were given back to your husband, it appears they would instantaneously be attached for back child support, and so not be 'yours' anyway.

So not only did you marry a man who has no house, he has an outstanding $50,000 debt that he is using to prevent him from ever owning anything.
You didn't marry into 'financial security' -- you married a black hole!
You're not "F@#$%@ when Dad dies", you're F@#$%@ now...

An honest man would have told you all of this up front.
No, an honest man would never be in this position.
What kind of man puts all of his assets into his son's name to avoid back child support? NOT a stand-up thing to do.
Clearly unethical, even illegal. Definitely a strong indication of the character of the man you married, and NOT a good one.
Think about what this means for YOUR child! He already broke the law to avoid providing court-ordered financial support for one child.
What on earth makes you think he wouldn't do it again?

Pinkbunny, you are the very definition of naive.

I'm not suggesting you file for divorce, but I am STRONGLY suggesting you retain a family law attorney NOW anyway to find out where you stand, what assets are whose, and to protect your current and future financial interests. A post-nupital agreement spelling out who is to get what in the event of a divorce or your husband's death would be a very, very good idea. (IMO, an annulment and change of address would probably also be a good idea.)

If after all this, you still think you can trust your husband or his words, then all the advice in the world won't help...

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cawfecup

Who cares whose name the house is in..... her husband has basically said to her ... suck it up we have to live here we can't say anything to my son because I was an idiot I made a lot of mistakes my whole life and you have to suffer the consequences. What does she do now?

She didn't come here to be picked apart she can here for some advice on how to deal with the son's attitude toward her ....

I would suggest telling hubby and son ... they need to hire a maid ... you are too "tired" caring for your daughter to clean up after two full grown men and immediately stop doing anything that irritates you. Take care of yourself and your daughter. Whats hubby gonna do throw you out for not doing his son's laundry?

If it is the "son's house" let him do the work leave his laundry on the floor let hubby or son pick it up. Stop doing what is getting to you ... if you don't do anything you have nothing to be resentful for.... who cares if the house is a "mess" ITS NOT YOUR HOUSE....as you have been told.

Start putting away money now..... if something should happen to hubby. You and your daughter will be put out with out hesitation I am guessing. I would talk with hubby about that scenario.... hunny if something happens to you what about me and the baby where will we go? What if any provisions have you made for us?

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kkny

Cawfe,

How is PB supposed to "put money away"? She is stay at home mom. Only money comes from her DH (presumably). Hiding some of grocery money, when X owes 50K in back CS is fraud. Frankly, I think it is dishonest in any event, but in this case is fraud. Any bank accounts are supposed to be reported.

PB can tell her DH she wants a maid, etc. Good luck. It wont happen. Her DH is a user. Time for PB to cut her losses while she is young. And I doubt anyone is going to throw her out, they will just make her life miserable. Oh wait, it already is miserable. That is what it is going to stay.

Why do I suspect the pregnant GF found about this situation wiht house, etc. (maybe the PB's DH telling her his finanical situation was what "talked" her into abortion and going away). I beleive in a woman's right to choose and this GF may have been so depressed with situation she saw abortion as the best for all.

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pinkbunny

Thank you "cawfecup" I like your approach to the situation and will use those words with my husband when addressing the provisions issue.
Gosh, I first came on here cause I thought I had a problem with my SS and I do- but I now realize I have SO MANY MORE problems than that.... Im overwhelmed.

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sylviatexas1

& if OP stops picking up, etc, it not only will not stop her husband's son from screaming at her, intimidating her...abusing her & making her feel threatened, it's likely to aggravate him & make things worse.

She needs to get outta there & make a decent life for herself & her daughter.

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Vivian Kaufman

Cawfe, with all due respect, I think that the OP's problems are far, far bigger than housekeeping. And truthfully, I don't think that she is capable of dealing with the SS's attitude toward her.

What Sylvia said.

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plasticgarden

"He owes his first wife alot of money in back child support and somehow if his assets look significant than they can be taken from him and sold to pay what he technically owes "

If your husband was any kind of a stand up guy,he'd pay the child support. He could set up a payment plan to not have to pay it all at once and in a fair manner.Instead he has given his son full power because he is trying to hide his assets? I'm sorry,but No brain=no headache.

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plasticgarden

My comments were not directed at OP,whom I feel very sorry for. Her husband obviously picked her cuz she is young and nieve and believes him to be so great.
I too am extremely sickened by the abortion factor of the ex girlfriend.Too many things about his guy make him sound like a real creep.
Pinkbunny~I sympathize with you,but not at all with your husband.You deserve better,and I hope you dont waste too much of your youth with this guy.

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sweeby

Ditto Pinkbunny -

I don't mean to be critical of you. It's obvious your husband is much more worldly and is taking advantage of your life inexperience. Between his lack of ethics and your SS's lack of restraint, you're in a terrible position and really need some legal assistance.

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pinkbunny

I think that my husband has had a very bad experience in the past with the ex that nearly put him on the street with the divorce and endured much loss from it. He has covered himself now because of that and I know that many women out there would not be with someone who has made some of the finical/business decisions that he has. But I see that ultimately he is a good person, an AMAZING father to our little girl (he worships her completely) and so I have to think of what is best for not only me but my baby. She needs to be with her daddy and she really loves him so much. I know how important a father is in a little girls life. I would not leave him over his SS. BUT, this forum has really brought up some issues that have got me thinking. I want to talk to an attorney now and find out what I can do to secure my daughters future financially if something were to happen to her dad. I don't want to get him into trouble- some of you have said what he has done is illegal.
Oh and I wanted make it clear that he DOES pay monthly to his first wife. (I think it is around $400.00 a month.)
Also the word "creep" is not one anyone who has met him personally would ever use to describe him. He is the most charming, handsome and charismatic person you could meet.

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theotherside

"charming, handsome and charismatic"

Being charming, handsome and charismatic doesn't keep a man from being a creep.

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weed30 St. Louis

Also the word "creep" is not one anyone who has met him personally would ever use to describe him. He is the most charming, handsome and charismatic person you could meet.

~sigh~

PB, that is a perfect description of my soon to be ex husband. PERFECT. In fact, in a direct challenge on charming, handsome and charismatic, my soon to be ex would win hands down.

However, ask me, ask his first wife, and, once our divorce is final, ask his future third ex wife, (I guarantee she will marry and divorce him), how 'great' of a guy he is.

If you want advice on how to protect yourself and your daughter, email me. I was in a hell of a 'marriage', and THANKFULLY, had read something a long time ago that I remembered when we were splitting. It has made ALL the difference in the world in a fair settlement. And I mean fair in the true sense of the word. I was not looking to 'take him to the cleaners', just wanted the legal 50%. I am not saying you should divorce him, only you can decide that, but in this situation, you DEFINITELY need some "insurance", just in case. Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

I am going to spell out my email to avoid spam bots that would pick up a normally typed email address: kate dot blue at yahoo dot com.

I know all of this is extremely overwhelming to you, but please, *listen* to those who have walked in your shoes.
Shoes you don't even realize you are wearing.

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plasticgarden

People said the same about Scott Peterson~how he was charming,and handsome,and oh so nice.It usually is the ones that come off as all those things who ARE the creeps.They hide it well.

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weed30 St. Louis

I also want to add that I was, like you, (in my opinion), very smart and a little ahead of the curve in maturity all my life. In addition, I didn't marry until I was 32. Yet....this charming, handsome and charismatic man that I chose to love turned out to be a cruel and thoughtless human being. Please add subtle and clever to that description. It took me many years....years wasted....to finally see him for what he really was. And is. I felt and still feel so stupid. For putting up with what I did, and then when the fog cleared, realizing all the lies that were fed to me. I believed him, because not only did I love him, but it was not in my experience that anyone could be so....whatever it is that allows a person to treat another so badly and dishonestly. And for no reason at all.

I honestly feel sorry for his girlfriend and baby, and I await the phone call from her, the same phone call that I finally made to his first wife, to confirm that I was not crazy, that this was not normal, that he was........him.

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june0000

PB,

It may seem as if you are being picked on. You're not. I think the women here are very concerned about some of the things you've posted about your husband. I know that I am.

You stated he is about $50,000 behind in child support. And it appears he has no intention of honoring his financial obligation to help support his child.

This is illegal and the fact that he is manipulating the system by putting things in his son's name to avoid having to pay is also indicative of a very serious character flaw.

If you put yourself aside, what makes you think your child will fare any better than the one he walked away from? He's already shown that he will walk away.

Please get some help and open your eyes.

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pinkbunny

PICKED ON??? No, I dont feel that I am being picked on here "juneoooo". I KNOW what being picked on feels like (read above posts from me about SS) and this does not feel like Im being picked on at all. I am SO thankful I found this forum!!! I feel so validated now in things I knew were issues but were just kind of brushed to the side. Now I see that it is pure stupidity to let such important matters be brushed aside. They need to be addressed.

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plasticgarden

You DO deserve an answer on this Pb.Just the fact your husband is getting testy and refusing to talk to you about it says a lot.
The thing is,about guys who are like this,is they always want everyone to see them as Mr. Nice guy. When their character flaws come into account they get extremely hostile about it and avoid the situation.They dont want to think of themselves as being anything less than the great guy they see themselves as. Which is why,as another poster pointed out, your husband may not have continued therapy and said they were quacks. They pointed out his flaws that he didnt want to hear.

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june0000

I've gone back and read the posts again and it appears SS and the daughter who died at the age of 16 were from DH's marriage to his first wife.

Did SS enter into the house and car arrangement with Dad and in the process, ripped off his own mother, who was cheated out of $50,000 in child support?

Did I read that right?

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pinkbunny

SS couldnt belive what a ride his mom was taking his dad for and thought it so unfair that his dad pay so much money to her when he left her a house in the divorce and provided child support while they were married, seperated and divorced. SS has always lived with his dad since then and doesnt get along with his mom very well. There were several times when his dad had to go to court about the money owed and SS went with and got so upset and even started yelling to the judge that what his mom was doing to his dad was so wrong...

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weed30 St. Louis

No, he did not cheat on me until well after our marriage was "over" for all practical purposes, and at that point I honestly didn't care. (For the record, I moved out in March 2006. Baby was born July 2007. We are still married because he cannot deal with not being in control, thinks he is above the law, and mainly, doesn't understand what 50% means.)

Our marriage ended because he is an abuser. It would take too much space to try to explain the dynamics of an emotional abuser, so I won't. I am only so insistent that you try to see things as they really are, and to protect yourself financially, because I ignored many, many red flags, just as you are now. Our stories are different, but the framework is the same. Abusers, narcissists, and just plain jerks have extremely similar behavior patterns. Their relationships repeat themselves. That is why more than a few of us here can so easily recognize the issues in your marriage. Because they are the same. The same deceptions, the same deflection of blame, the same shifting of focus, the same patterns.

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weed30 St. Louis

Your SS should NEVER have been privy to the details of his parents divorce. Nothing f*s up a kid quite as well as being put in the middle of a nasty divorce.

And again, you only know what you have been told. As apparently, SS only knew what he had been told by his father about his mother.

Patterns.

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june0000

PB,

Your SS has said that he always intends to live at his father's house. Believe him. He has "earned" that house as far as he is concerned.

He sailed his own mother down the river by agreeing to help his father hide his assets to avoid paying child support. He did so because his father manipulated him, but also because it benefitted him financially.

The court ordered child support and your husband did not pay what he was supposed to pay. Otherwise he wouldn't be $50,000 behind. I'm not a lawyer, but I would guess that they could both get prison terms for what they've done.

I don't know what else I can say other than I don't know how you can possibly survive in this marriage or house for very long. You are swimming with sharks.

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plasticgarden

I dont understand how he could be 50,000 dollars behind in child support and still have a liscense? I'm telling you,social services here will suspend your liscense if your child support payment is even one month late. Is it different because it is through divorce and not through social services? I know men doing jail time for being less behind than her husband is in support.

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theotherside

It is really not likely that the judge would have allowed a minor child to be present in the courtroom during a child support hearing.

As far as I know, every state determines child support based on fairly rigid guidelines, and there is a limit to the percentage of the NCP's income that can be awarded, no matter how many children you have. If the son lived with him, and the daughter died at 16, there would be no more child support to the first wife after that point - unless there are other children who have not been mentioned. Fifty thousand dollars is a lot of money. That must represent years of paying little or nothing.

BTW, if you are married to him, I am surprised you just "think" he pays about $400 a month. Why wouldn't you know for certain? Does he handle all the bills?

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kkny

Plastic Garden, I accepted less than I was entitled to, with agreement that X put house in trust for my DD. Negotiated deal.

PB's husband's first wife may be thinking that as long as her X is supporting the child now, she wont go after back CS. But it doesnt go away. Which could be another reason why PB is in a tough spot -- her DH is runnning out of choices.

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cawfecup

Either way ... she'll need to get a few bucks together to go. One thing to leave by yourself with no money ... but to leave with a baby with no money is not practical.... even $100 is better than nothing.

I understand her issues are bigger than housekeeping ... but what I was trying to say ... was take care of yourself if it irritates you to do something then don't do it.

Can't be angry about doing for others and getting berated if you are not doing anything then you can only be angry for being berated ... that will only last so long before you stand up for yourself ... whatever your "standing up" solution works for you then do it.

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kkny

PB,

Can you move in with your mom? If you had to?

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sylviatexas1

Of course he's charming, handsome, & charismatic.

that's why his MO (modus operandi, mode of operation) works for him & for guys like him.

Other people can't get away with the kind of manipulation & cheating & misdirection he does.

Imagine that the guy at the gas station said:

that he put his home in his son's name to protect it from an ex-wife to whom he owes $50,000 back child support,

that he never loved 1st wife, that it was an arranged marriage

that he cheated on 1st wife "a lot" because he didn't love her,

that the reason he has nothing is because she took him for everything,

that his adult son can live in the house as long as he wants because of cultural values,

that he hates turmoil but that he & 2nd wife had screaming fights,

that 2nd wife just left for some reason, dunno, just seems like she "wasn't the one" for him, shrug,

that he "had" ex-girlfriend get an abortion...

would you believe him?

or would you think:

house may be in son's name to protect it from judgments from ex...or judgments from other entities.

$50,000 is a lot of back child support, & it's a nice round number.
Why not $47,000 or $28,000? how about zero?

Arranged marriages, although rare in the 1970's, are made for family reasons;
the partners don't expect to fall in love:
Partners in an arranged marriage would be *less* likely to divorce over not being "in love".

He cheated because he wanted to...& by the way, what did he tell the "lots" of women with whom he was having sex?

Any guy who's broke or who has hidden his money always blames the ex-wife for "taking it all".

Maybe she did, maybe she didn't, maybe the the money was what she brought to the marriage, maybe he lost it all, maybe he never had any in the first place.

In agricultural societies/cultures, the son is likely to make his home with the parents until he marries, & then build another house on the property, because he will take care of his parents in their old age & inherit the farm.

In such societies, elders are respected, & younger wives are respected as the father's wife/partner/choice.

where's the farm?
where's the respect?

What society has a tradition of adult children staying on forever in a single-family residence designed for a nuclear family?

His son can live in the house because the son owns the house, & dad knows that he has to stay close to son to keep son from realizing how he's being manipulated, conned, & used, to maintain control over son, to keep son from realizing that he actually owns the house & has power over father, to keep up the misdirection, to keep the son believing the illusion that dad is a victim & son is his rock, the only "real" family he has, & his only loyal friend.

Saying that he hates turmoil or discord & then saying that he had screaming fights with an ex because he has a temper means that he lies:
one or the other of those statements can be true, but they can't both be true.

He knows why 2nd marriage ended, but the truth won't make him look good, so he's decided to act clueless.

If he pressured the ex-girlfriend to have an abortion, he's a slimy creep, & if she had one on her own, then
a) she didn't want to have a child with him (hmmm? what did she find out?) &
b) he's telling the story to make you think he's the one who makes all the decisions in everyone's life.

If he were the guy at the gas station, would you believe him, or would you think otherwise?

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pinkbunny

He is not even a month late in child support- that is why he has a license still! I said he pays around $400.00 monthly for the BACK CS. I dont know why this is becoming such an issue here and I really dont care to continue talking about it.
His son was in the court room and was NOT a minor. This was in the past two years that the screaming at the judge happened (I was living here already) My husband went because he was trying again to appeal that the CS was not really owed and BTW the amount is AROUND $50,000. I think now its at about $48,000. But that is not really important to me - I don't think he owes it to her. He is a provider and makes sure the home and family is well taken care of (groceries bought, houscleaners and landscapers employed and the way that he worships his kids leaves me seeing it as impossible for him to have been negligent in the past with providing financially for his family. I simply DO NOT believe he owes it.
About the guy at the gas station.... I don't know him, so no, I don't think he is being 100% honest. I do believe that "things just didn't work out" and that "she isn't the one" because of how easily he can disconnect when the going gets tough and when there is discord between him and me (and past women).
Yes I could move in with my mom- but I am not about to. I have a family here that I am not about to walk away from.
He isn't a creep and a vital little piece of info I left out about the pregnant girlfriend/fling is that she had a drug dependency and got the abortion because he felt that something would have been wrong with the child had it been born because of the health of the girl- who by the way didn't hesitate to abort.

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kkny

PB,

No one is trying to jump on you. I think the consensus of the older and wiser crowd here is that you are naive and dont understand the entire picture.

1. "Appealing" CS after the statute of limitations has passed is virtually impossible. As SS is 25, in any state I can imagine, the statute of limitations has passed for appealing it. What I am trying to say, is that the CS was ordered years ago. If DH didnt like it, he had the right to appeal. The time for that has long come and gone. People get CS adjusted all the time, but that is going forward. If he is paying about 400/month, then that is at least 10 years (if no interest charged) till it is paid off. If the son was in the court, I suggest this is now a civil collection matter. Why do you think he doesn't owe it to her? Becuase he said so?

2. How do you know he was a good provider? Becuase he said so? How do you know what she paid for?

3. Beleive what you want. Hope for the best. Prepare for the worst. I know you dont want move in with your mother, but I am glad you have that option.

Like I said, I doubt he will ever be able to buy a house or even rent one. You are stuck with the SS. Like I said, keep up with your career, or go back to school as soon as the little one is a little older.

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plasticgarden

PB~I dont understand why you are getting defensive. If your husband has an arrearage of 50,000,then at some point he WASNT paying it,which is why I asked how he could have his lisence. I was just curious because my own husband has been late one time and got a notice saying they were going to suspend his liscense.At least in the state where I live,they really dont mess around with child support issues.Some states dont enforce as much as others though.

Also,no one said you HAD to move in with your mom,it is nice to know you DO have that option incase anything bad happens.
As far as your husband not being a creep...That is what most of here observe him to be,sorry but from what you've told us,that's how we see it.

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theotherside

pinkbunny,

What evidence do you have that he doesn't owe the child support? If he paid by check, that would be easy enough to prove. If he paid in cash, he's an idiot.

With every post, he looks worse and worse. Why would a responsible guy date a drug addict, much less impregnate her? It is no surprise that his son doesn't have much regard for his father's choices in girlfriends.

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justnotmartha

PB, I've been reading but not posting . . . until now. I think everyone has made very valid points and given you much to think about, but here is one BIG issue I have not seen addressed you need to consider.

CONCEALING ASSETS IS A CRIME. In knowing that this is happening and not doing anything about it you are an ACCESSORY TO THIS CRIME.

Honey, do not leave your child without a parent. Take responsibility. Take care of you and your child.

My best to you.

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Ashley

Pinkbunny,

If you have any doubt at all as to the details of the divorce and if you suspect at all that he is not giving you the full truth about things...which is what I and most of the other women posting believe...I suggest you go to the courthouse in the county in which he divorced each of his wives and look up the details for yourself. Most of the time divorces are a matter of public record and are very easy to find. You can at least get the jist of what the marital assets were, sometimes the reason for the divorce, as well as what the court orders were in reguard to child support, etc. If I were you, I would not tell him that my plan was to go look it up. Once you know for sure what the details are, then ask him about the details of the divorce and then you can know for sure whether or not he is trustworthy.

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sweeby

"then you can know for sure whether or not he is trustworthy."

You mean you think there's even room for doubt?

Could be that your hubby's a total gem with a woman he loves while he still loves her. Which would explain why he treats you "so well" now. But he does appear to have a relatively short attention span, and you have A LOT of evidence of how he treats women he USED TO love.

On another thread, Lilysuzanne gave some great advice about hiring a lawyer and having that lawyer retain a private investigator.

You're already standing chest-high in some very muddy water. As NotMartha pointed out, you may yourself even be accessory to a crime. And as you already admitted, you feel very intimidated by your stepson and are a virtual prisoner in your own home (oops, his home), with a new baby to care for and protect.

PB - You need legal help now.

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Ashley

Sweeby,

I don't think there is room for doubt, but obviously Pinkbunny believes him, and she is the one that matters. I think it would be a good way for her to find out the truth for herself. It is usually free to look at the divorce file and at that point she wouldn't have to spend any money to have a law office do that for her.

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kkny

Yes, Raek, I think that is a good idea. PB, see if you can leave baby at your moms one afternoon and go to courthouse. Clerks are usually pretty helpful. Also, where I live, you can go online for civil judgemntts, etc.

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pinkbunny

And how would doing all this "invesitagation" actually help me with the problem that I have. Thats his past- they are HIS problems, not mine. He is the one that made the bad decisions of getting involved with someone he was'nt in love with (which I am not doing) and of not having a pre-nup and of not having a better lawyer during the divorce. That is so in the past that I feel that it isnt relavant in my situation with him here now.
My mom lives in another State- I have no friends here whatsoever- and although my grandma lives several miles from me- I cant leave the baby with her because she is in her late 80's and isnt cabable of taking care of a baby at this point in her life. I have never left my child with anyone.
If I went to the courthouse and found out that she left him for abuse or cheating - I would not be surprised. Not that he is abusive, but she is crazy. I dont think he is abusive in any way- HIS SON IS! But my husband is not.
I dont think there is any crime in what he has done- which is protect his assets from someone who basically wants to rob him of everything he has worked hard for because of bitterness she harbors from all the cheating (which by the way she knew about during the whole marrage- therefore she is the stupid one for staying for so long with someone who she obviously knew didnt love her and who cheated on her repeatedly.
He didnt know the ex girlfriend/fling was a drug addict- untill several months into the relationship, at which point he checked her into rehab. She did not get better though and was back to using soon after getting out, so he broke it off with her - and thats when they ound out about the pregnancy, and when I met him.

Ok so here is the news so far on what happened this week so far with my hubby - So I talked to him the other night (or tried to) about what provisions were to be provided to me and that baby if something unexpected to him were to happen. Well, he didnt want to talk about it then and ever since then he hasnt wanted to talk to me about anything OR kiss me hello or goodbye. I guess I did the wrong thing in bringing that up. BUT IM NOT DONE!!! Oh no :) We ARE going to talk about it- when he is ready to talk about anything- it will be that we talk about.
So I went to A T & T yesterday to look into getting a new phone for myself (mine is on the blink) and found out that SS added internet and a texting pkg. to his line (which he isnt supposed to do and I have taken it off more than once and he keeps adding it back) so his line cost $340.00 and some odd cents. I called his dad and told him and he said "either he pays me back for that or we take him off the family plan!" HOW BOUT BOTH??? So I suspended his line untill his contract is up which is at the end of this mo. and hopefully his dad insists that he pay the additional charges he incurred- which I doubt he will do. But I was glad to see my husband make a step in the right direction with his son and making him have to get his own cell phone plan and be responsible for his own monthly bill for that.
Plus there is a pass-word in place now so he cant make changes on the acct. or add features or un-suspend himself. :)

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kkny

PB, please make some local friends. Do you belong to a church (or Temple, etc)? Please join one. Many have mommy and me groups. Go. Local Ys may also have, but they may cost $$. Maybe the phone is small progess. I hope so for your sake. But your DH not be willing to speak to you re what happens if he is gone speaks much louder. Is he currently employed on the books? Paying Social Security. It is not much, but if he dies, then you do get survivor benefit until child is 16. Does he get medical insurance through work. Where I work, we get small life policy also.

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Ashley

PB, You can take your baby to the courthouse. People do it all the time. I know because I work in the courthouse on a regular basis. I suggest the "investigation" because I don't think he is being honest with you about things. How do you end up with $50,000 in back child support if you have been paying what you owe all along? That is what we have all been wondering. He doesn't want to talk about things because he knows that you will find out that he is at the very least withholding information from you. There is more to all of this than you are willing to believe right now, but if you see it in black and white, then there is no denying it. I am less concerned about whether he is lying about the reason for his divorces than the fact that he is probably lying about the reason he owes her the money he is trying to hide from her. On top of that, if he has no intention of selling his house anytime soon, the most she can do is put a $50,000 lien on the property. He could still have it in his name until he is all paid up and the lien is Satisfied. His story is just not adding up. I think his property is in his son's name to protect him from another divorce (from you). If he has no assets, then if you divorce him, you will not be able to take anything from him. Also, I'd want to make sure, if I were you that the $400 per month is actually going where he says it is going.

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sieryn

You need a life insurance policy on your husband at the very least with YOU as the beneficiary, especially because of your age difference, the housing situation and you being a stay at home mom.

I sympathize with your situation, my husband is a bit older than myself. There is only a six year difference between us but it is enough to where I could not have birthed my oldest step son (I would have been 12 when he was born). I am thankful that this has never been an issue for us. I will say that the few times he has made rude comments to me my husband literally leaped to my defense stating as your should 'This woman is my wife and your stepmother and you will show her respect and should at least have the decency to treat her like an equal human being, I will not tolerate any less' If he cannot say that to him, if he cannot defend you on a basic basis against the abusive nature of his son than you need to get your daughter and yourself somewhere safe. Actions speak louder than words to men, it may take you walking out the door for him to realize that this situation will not work for your marriage.

Having read all the posts it really seems like your husband has you in a serious situation. You're isolated, verbally abused by his son, and don't seem to have much of a say on anything in your circumstances. Do not let any man regardless of love control you this way. You are a person not a toy or a servant. Do you have a degree? If not you need to obtain one, take online classes while the baby sleeps if you can't bare to leave her with a sitter. You need to be able to provide for yourself if your husband passes or the SS situation becomes to unbearable or damaging to your daughter.

...just my two cents.

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june0000

Raek:

What you posted makes sense to me. I'd recommend PB go to her county assessor's office and find out "when" the son was put on the deed to the house. It should be public record. Some states even have some of this information online.

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pinkbunny

Good advice and I actually just started looking into getting an online degree. I am filling out my FAFSA today in fact! I'm excited about that and think it is defiantly a step in the right direction. I am a licensed Aesthetician, but I want to own a medi-spa and bakery someday and think a degree in business would be a wise thing to get.

Raek, I do know for a fact it is for back CS- I get the mail and pay the bills. Those CS ones I hand to my husband to take care of himself but there have been quite a few times that he has asked me to go pay them for him.

He is self-employed and has been for over 30 years.
I do agree that he needs a life insurance policy. He keeps saying he is going to do that when things start to "slow down" for him with work. But I don't see that happening, he is always so busy. Can anyone recommend a good company to go through for that?

I know I should make some friends, and I have gone to some mommy and me classes and they were ok, but I didn't connect with any of the moms. I have taken my baby on play-dates too and its ok but I just end up playing with her alone really. She makes me so happy- I feel that I don't need to spend time with other people besides her and my husband. BUT if I did meet a woman who I liked then I would be happy to have a friend who lived nearby.

I know I can take her to the courthouse with me. I have before when running errands for my husband. Also I just filed bankruptcy, and took her with me for that. (that wasn't a real courthouse but it was like one.)

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quirk

I've been biting my tongue, but...

"Thats his past- they are HIS problems, not mine."

It may be his past, but they are certainly your problems.

You are married to this man, and to make matters worse, you are a stay-at-home mom. You AND YOUR CHILD are financially dependant on a man who owes someone else $50,000 and who apparently cannot have any assets in his name or they will be taken away from him. Do you honestly not see how this is your problem? You AND YOUR CHILD are financially dependant on a man who sees nothing wrong with illegally hiding assets to avoid paying his exwife what he legally owes her. You AND YOUR CHILD are financially dependant on a man who, in spite of the fact that he legally owns nothing to pass on to you, is not even willing to have a conversation with you about your AND YOUR CHILD'S financial security if something should happen to him, and punishes you for even bringing up the subject by refusing to talk to you at all or show affection toward you. This is not abusive behavior?

Furthermore, these past problems are affecting your current situation, which you came here to ask advice about. His son OWNS YOUR HOME because of these "past, not my problem" problems. The fact that the son, not you and hubby, owns the house gives son an enormous amount of power over the situation. The son can LEGALLY KICK YOU OUT ANYTIME HE WANTS TO. And there's not one G-D- thing you could do about it. It is his house, after all. And this is how your husband arranged things, because of "his past, not my problems".

I think it bears repeating. This abusive stepson who you are afraid of can legally kick you and your baby out of your home if he wants. I think you realize no one here thinks your husband is the wonderful man you think he is, but even if he is, he's obviously unwilling or unable to protect you from his son. His son owns your house. His son apparently hates you. You are financially dependant on hubby. Hubby can't or won't protect you from son. Add this up; you are at the mercy of **both** your husband and his son, and will continue to be unless and until you get some emotional, social, and financial independance from them. If husband won't or can't protect you from his son, then it's up to you to protect yourself. People are just trying to get you to think about how to do that.

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kkny

PB,

If he is self-employed, you will only recieve social security as a widow if her files tax returns and reports income. Based on everything you have said, I doubt he does that. Has he asked you to sign a joint return? What income did it show? You may be better off not signing return, as that may make you liable for unpaid taxes.

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sweeby

For what it's worth PB, YOU can take out a life insurance policy on your husband without his permission or even knowledge. That is your legal right. (Actually, I could take out an insurance policy on your husband - not that I'd have any reason to.) While your husband would need to take a physical exam for the lowest-cost / highest-benefit policies, there are PLENTY of insurance companies out there that won't require one, and any life insurance salesman will be happy to sell you a policy. Of course, I don't think his death is the biggest concern you need to have.

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kkny

Actually, I think only someone with an "insurable interest" can buy a life insurance policy -- but that would clearly include wife.

The bigger issue, as to insurance, is that if PB's DH dies, Wife number one may claime the insurance policy was bought with funds that belonged to her, so policy belongs to her. That is why I suggested to look to employer (which I now realize is not an option).

But I agree, death of DH is not the only issue, and may not be the most important. I think the sooner that PB realizes that she is living in SSs house (even if he didnt earn it in her mind), the better off she is. I beleive in living in reality, not in teh world as I want it to be.

In short, PB, for the nth time, I do not think you realize that your DH has no assets, everything either belongs to SS, and/or subject to claims by wife #1.

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Ashley

So why wasn't he paying his child support when he owed it back when the kids were still under 18?

Also, PB, Please, Please, Please, for the sake of yourself and your daughter, listen to what quirk is saying. His past choices and unwillingness to pay child support when it was do IS AFFECTING your life now. It IS your problem now, unfortunately. Not to mention the fact that if he did not pay his exwife the Child Support he was supposed to pay her at the time, then what makes you think that he would do anything different for your daughter?

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Ashley

oops, I meant due, not do...

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eandhl

PB, you seem defensive where you DH is concerned. (rightly so, ordinarily one should feel that way). But oridinarily a spouse doesn't sign a house to one child leaving a wife and baby out. Maybe he didn't think, maybe he didn't care. It doesn't matter now. Even if you forget the XW, GF and legal matters, you did ask how to deal with Stepson and how he treats you.
Think about it please - if your DH doesn't speak up in your defense there is nothing you can do about the situation. You, DH and baby are living in SSon legally owned home. You are in a situation where SS could tell all of you to leave. All that would matter is the legal paper signing the house to him. Not who did or didn't pay for it.
Your DH in the process of securing what he felt was his put the house in his sons name that now leaves your DH, you and baby with nothing. Your DH didn't provide 1/2 the home for new baby or any other children that may be born.
That is one of the most important thing people here really want you to see.

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pinkbunny

We are meeting in an hour to "talk". Im so glad he is open to having a conversation with me now- We'll see if he actually delivers when it comes to real info. though...

Oh and to Eandhl, he did not leave us out, (me and the baby) because we were not in his life at the time of all of his assets being put in the name of his son.
I know it seems that his son could evict us and ruin our lives as we know it because of the power he holds by having all that his dad owns in his name, but my husband trusts him blindly because he is his son and I dont think he would imagine in a million years that his son would do that to him. I on the other hand know that were something to happen to my husband- his son would send me and my baby packing and without a dime AND with a huge smile on his face...
These are some things I want to say at lunch with my honey today...

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june0000

I have to disagree on the life insurance subject. You cannot buy an individual life policy on someone (even if you have an insurable interest in their life) without first having the proposed insured complete an application, undergo a paramed exam and take an AIDs test. Trust me, I know.

The only exception would be perhaps a mail order life policy with a face amount of $5,000 or $10,000, which won't do PB any good.

I'd recommend buying a life insurance policy on him (if he is insurable). If he smokes, it will cost at his age.

He needs permanent insurance - not term. This will also be expensive but he has a long-term financial obligation to his child of 20-25 years, so I would recommend a minimum premium universal life policy.

PB should be the owner - that is the most important thing. The owner controls everything on the policy and no one else can cancel it (as long as premiums are paid) and no one can change beneficiaries except for the owner.

PB should be owner and primary beneficiary with daughter as contingent beneficiary.

If he dies and the daughter is the primary beneficiary, PB would have to go through conservatorship and post a bond to be able to get any funds from the policy proceeds to raise her child.

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eandhl

PB, I know he didn't leave you out on purpose because you/baby were not in the picture. What he didn't think is leaving the door open in the event of a remarriage and more children. At least it doesn't sound like he could/would say to his son, now I want you sign 1/2 of house to my wife/baby. Or even if he did, would it happen?

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pinkbunny

Thank you June0000 for all that useful info. I wrote all that down for a reference when I am looking for a life-insurance policy, which I am now convinced I need to have for him. If he leaves us nothing else (property or will) then at least we will have that. I don't plan on him dyeing soon soon or anything, but I would feel more secure knowing that was in place.

Im so fed up with SS. I thought it was all done with - the cell phone situation that is. But him and his dad have the same name, and although I put a password in place and suspended his acct. that was all useless because we are all under HIM on the acct.! I should have checked on the social security number - it being under my husbands name means nothing because his son's name is the same as his. (usually he uses "JR." and the cell phone acct didn't say that so I just assumed that meant it was his dad's). He un-suspened himself and threw a fit with his dad. Tomorrow I am going in to start a new acct. under his dad's name and transfer myself and his dad and his dad's employees onto the new one and let Jr. have his own acct, own bill, own responsibility.

I cant stand him and I have never felt so hateful towards someone! It scares me how he like lights a fire inside of me- I have never been that way. I feel like I need anger management. I don't act out in anger but I get all these ideas of nasty things to do to him and I know that isn't good! (Like donating all his shoes which he has hundreds of pairs of and collects to the salvation army.) I wont do it but gosh I sure wanna do something.

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Ashley

PB,

How did it go at lunch today? Was hubby willing to talk about things?

Also, you never answered my question as to how he owes back child support if he was paying child support all along when the kids were under 18. I know you don't want to talk about these things, but I'm asking you as somebody who is concerned about your future. I would press my friends on the same issues. In fact, I would go down to the courthouse and look up the information for myself if it was a friend of mine in your situation. If I am wrong about your husband than I'm sorry, but I think you should be a little more skeptical about the things he is telling you.

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theotherside

"Also I just filed bankruptcy, and took her with me for that"

This really concerns me. Did both of you file for bankruptcy, or just you? If at some point in the next few years you find yourself on your own, the bankruptcy is going to haunt you, and make it difficult to rent an apartment or find a job. If he filed too, you do realize, I presume, that bankruptcy does not eliminate his child support obligations.

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pinkbunny

I'm sad to report that lunch didn't end up happening. He was running late with appointments and had a meeting. He promised to stay home tomorrow and go with me to deal with the cell phone issue and get my nails done and pedi. and then lunch to "talk". I have so much to say to him (and ask) since reading all the posts from you ladies on here...

I just asked him as he sat watching TV and I am typing away- about the CS issue, and started out by asking if he payed for last month or not and then asking him to tell me again why he owed so much. His reply was that he has so much CS to pay because his attorney wasn't there in court for him when the judgment was passed. If no one is there to object the charges, then the judgment is passed and whatever amount she and her attorney was asking, they get. That is what he just told me. He has said in the past that it was a big f@#% up on his attorneys part- but never explained it in full like he did just now. Makes more sense to me now.

No both of us didn't file. Just me. I had alot of debt from living off of credit cards while putting myself through Beauty school and just being careless with my spending after. I have always had to pay my own way ever since I was 16. My parents provided us with opportunities with which to earn money from home when we were that young and with that money we bough our own clothes and other things we wanted. I was raised in an Amish community - and there wasn't much of a focus of material things. When I was on my own at 18 and bought my first car and could dress how I wanted and do as I liked, I rebelled and went crazy -so to speak -with spending and not realizing what I was doing. So I was in a hole big-time when I met my man, who did not want to pay off my debt. I understood why- it wasn't his responsibility, it was mine and now I am learning the hard way what happens when you spend money you don't have.

I am thinking now about going to the courthouse and just making sure what he said is true about him not being there and the judgment being passed for that amount because no one was there to object. I would feel awful if he found out I did that though. He would think that I really distrust him- which I don't really... and I'm just scared I'm going to run into someone he knows there or something and then it get back to him that I was at the courthouse...

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weed30 St. Louis

Your HUSBAND let you file BANKRUPTCY???!!!! This entire situation is insane!!!

Do you understand the repurcussions of filing bankruptcy?

Why didn't YOUR HUSBAND pay the bills?

His dad even pays for his cell phone, truck, truck insurance, utilities, food and no he does not charge him rent.

What is WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE??!!!!

Please, call TODAY and see if you can withdraw your filing. If you just filed recently, it has most likely not been processed. You DO NOT want a bankruptcy haunting you for the next 7 - 10 years!

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sieryn

"judgment is passed and whatever amount she and her attorney was asking, they get"

Child Support, in my experience, is determined by the judge based on income difference and custody arrangement. Of all the court cases we've been through there was never an amount asked for, that is up to the judge.

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weed30 St. Louis

He is a provider and makes sure the home and family is well taken care of (groceries bought, houscleaners and landscapers employed and the way that he worships his kids leaves me seeing it as impossible for him to have been negligent in the past with providing financially for his family.

He is supporting his 25 year old son with housing, truck, cell phone, and "cash when he asks for it", he is paying housecleaners and landscapers, yet let (talked you into????) filing for BANKRUPTCY.

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theotherside

How much credit card debt could you have acquired by the time you are only 26, especially if you were in school for part of that time, and, one assumes, never had a three figure income?

I am finding this whole thing a bit hard to believe. You said you could, if necessary, go back and live with your mother (she is, I take it, still Amish?), but how could you do that if you ever divorced? I doubt if you would be welcomed back into the community. New Order or Old Order? I assume you didn't get baptized before you left?

No Amish woman I have ever met would have had such a cavalier attitude about infidelity or divorce. Few Amish who leave completely ditch every belief they have grown up with.

sieryn is right about the determination of child support. Every state has guidelines, and even judges can't just award any amount they feel like. They certainly don't award whatever the plaintiff asks for when the defendant doesn't show up. In addition, there are federal laws (maybe case law?) that apply, limiting the maximum percentage of the NCP's income that can be required to be paid.

What exactly is your husband providing for you as you raise his child? He is not even willing to pay (or even loan you money for) the minimum payments on your credit cards in order to keep you from ruining your credit? Do you have a car of your own (I guess not, if you share it with your SS). What would you do if your husband died or kicked you out tomorrow, with no available credit, no money in your own account?, no job, and no nearby family?

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june0000

TOS,

I agree. This story just keeps getting more and more bizarre and unbelievable. I've struggled with the story but but the Amish part has me fairly convinced that someone is playing a big joke on all of us.

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june0000

Practices of the Amish:

"The "rumspringa" is the right and tradition of every Amish teenager. This tradition provides that a teenager may be able to explore the outside world before committing themselves completely, as an adult to the community. And lastly, the topic of this article is what the Amish refer to as meidung banishment, or being shunned by the community to which they belong. Not returning to the Amish culture after a "rumspringa will result in shunning. In the practice designed to help a teenager make a personal, spiritual choice, one of the considerations must be turning permanently away from everything the teenager has ever known.

All communication and contact with anyone in the community is forbidden for someone shunned from the Amish culture. Meidung, by my speculation, has to be the most feared potential aspect of the life of an Amish individual. As a matter of fact, the practice of shunning is a factor in what separated the Amish from the Mennonites in the year 1693. Marrying outside of the faith is one, automatic reason to shun an Amish man or woman. Otherwise, being banished is usually followed by a certain number of serious warnings. Some Amish communities are, of course, more lenient than others in terms of their limits that when breeched by an individual will necessitate his or her meidung."

Can you tell us what happened, PB?

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sylviatexas1

I had that thought, too, but if OP is not real, she's a very good writer, both in terms of plot & in terms of sincerity.

Maybe she's a big furry policeman practicing before posing as a teen-aged girl on a site to catch sexual predators.

*But*:
there are naive, sincere, sweet young girls who venture into the world without the support & protection of their families.
They are ideal targets for people like this husband.
& she really sounds sincere, & the chain of events really sounds genuine, right down to her husband "not being able" to have lunch with her but promising to take her to lunch later & treat her to a manicure.

I'd rather accept someone at face value than blow off a person who may be entangled in the kind of web that guys like this weave:

One of the ways abusers take power is to wreck the credibility of their victims.

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sweeby

If nothing else, an Amish upbringing credibly explains this young woman's heartbreaking niavety.

Sorry PB - But your husband's explanations of his child support situation don't make sense. As other posters already pointed out, the judge doesn't just rule in favor of the only party that shows up. And even if the judge did rule unfairly, the ruling would still be for a MONTHLY payment, and it would take YEARS of non-payment to work up to such a huge arrearage. And child support judgements are contestable, meaning your husband could have gone back to court at any time to have the judgement reduced if it weren't reasonable. He gave you an (unlikely) explanation for why his CS payments are high -- but NO REASON at all for why he didn't pay them. He didn't answer your question, and by not being available for lunch, he evaded your other questions as well. I'll bet anything that Friday doesn't get your questions answered either...

You say you fully understand his reluctance to assume responsibility for your debt. OK - I get that.
But he has saddled you with full responsibility for HIS debt.
Where's the fairness in that?

PB - My parents were the most ethical and upstanding people I have ever met. They were wonderful role models and I strive to live up to their examples. I imagine your upraising was similar in that respect -- that there was a clear code of moral conduct that almost everyone lived up to, and that transgressions were relatively infrequent and relatively minor. That sounds ideal, until you realize how unprepared it leaves us for dealing with people who are skilled at deceiving others. People like you (and formerly me - I'm older and a bit wiser) are easy targets for 'snake oil salesmen' -- people who look good on the surface but operate by a completely different moral code. Your "handsome, charming" husband is one of these, and he's using his good looks and smooth-talking ways to take advantage of you.

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june0000

I agree, and I'd rather error on the side of reaching out to someone and being hoodwinked than not, but:

1. PB doesn't seem to be bothered at all by the moral insufficiencies in her husband's character that she has described in her own words. Even when pointed out to her, she doesn't seem to be bothered by any of it. She doesn't "see" what's wrong with the situation.

2. PB doesn't seem to be bothered by her own personal bankruptcy. She made a choice to be a stay-at-home Mom, rather than to get a job to pay off the debts she incurred. She's indicated she went to beauty school. She's said she has a housekeeper and gardener. But she isn't working. Granted, she has a baby, but most women with debt and babies will work to pay their debts and do what they need to do to avoid bankruptcy.

3. What seems to bother PB the most is what she stated in her initial post - she and SS do not get along. And that is all.

Because of #1 and #2, I'm having difficulty with the Amish part of her life. An Amish woman would know the difference between right and wrong and the things that were wrong would be unbearable for her to live with. There is no indication of that from PB.

That goes beyond being naive and is something entirely quite different in my opinon.

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sylviatexas1

The very fact that her moral compass has gone awry may indicate that she's entirely smitten, entirely under the spell, of an older more savvy male.

A smart friend, male, once asked me,
"Why did you do that incredibly stupid thing?
Wait.
I know.
You were 'in love'."

It's very easy for women/girls to be snowed by a man they (we) 'love'.

Our moral compasses, our sense of self-preservation, our ties to the real world, all go flying out the window;
all we can see is the image of the beloved & all we can hear is the lies he tells us.

& we believe him.

An Amish *woman* *might* know the difference, but if she were bowled over & in love, even a mature Amish woman might lose her bearings.

A very young girl, who is bonded to the guy by having a baby with him, would be easy pickings.

Again, a really good way to take power away from your human prey is to wreck her credibility:

Make her believe such incredible things that no one believes her when she repeats them.

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kkny

I do beleive PB is legitmately reaching out for help. I do think sometime real posters exagerate (maybe they just see things a little differently). Maybe PBs mom lives in a quiet rural community, and to PB, that is the same as Amish. I also was a little perplexed that PB lives near her Grandma, but not near her mom (who is purportedly Amish). All that being said, yes, some men are Svengalis, and take advantage of trusting young women. That is why everyone is begging PB to reach out, make friends, find out the real story, keep up her career, etc.

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sylviatexas1

"If I went to the courthouse and found out that she left him for abuse or cheating - I would not be surprised. Not that he is abusive, but she is crazy."

see how easy it is to wreck someone's credibility?

"I dont think there is any crime in what he has done- which is protect his assets from someone who basically wants to rob him of everything he has worked hard for because of bitterness she harbors from all the cheating (which by the way she knew about during the whole marrage- therefore she is the stupid one for staying for so long with someone who she obviously knew didnt love her and who cheated on her repeatedly."

& see how easy it is to blame a victim for your bad behavior & for her own pain?

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pinkbunny

I am so surprised that so many of you see my story as "unbelievable" - I guess it is a bit uncommon to see someone who was raised in an Amish community in a public forum (I guess I should not be up-to-date enough to know how to use a computer?) and who is with a man twice her age and has problems with his son, but this is my life! It is really real, and if you don't believe it then thats fine. I don't really care. Trying to sound believable isn't a concern of mine- If its real for me in my life and it isn't believable to someone else than whatever... I have bigger issues to concern myself with.
Thanks June0000 for all that info about the Amish. I have to say that I didn't even know in detail how they went about ex-communicating people. As a teen in the community, I didn't really care about all of that. I cared more about catching glimpses of TVs when out of the community with my mom and sisters or of listening to the radio and not being caught- and of course working in the garden and home school and trying to make friends with kids who would rather speak German (or Pennsylvania Dutch) than English - and therefore being left-out most of the time because of that. My parents weren't born Amish and they adopted the lifestyle when I was little. And no my family doesn't live in Tn. anymore and are not part of a menonite OR Amish community anymore.
Anyways- I'm exhausted and don't have the energy for this anymore... I talked to my husband today - he took the morning off. He agreed that there needs to be a will made - and he will do it - he said he just has trouble making the time. But I told him he needs to make it a priority. He refinanced two of the houses and did so under a friend of his's name because he had better credit than his son. So now none of the houses are in SS name. My husband's credit is not good enough to get him an interest rate that he can afford so thats why he has his things in his friend's name now. Not to hide from the ex. I was under the wrong impression I guess and I feel bad for sharing what I thought with all of you when it wasn't the case anymore. I'm glad to be updated on what is going on...
Oh and HE brought up a life insurance policy and said that I need to start checking around for one. With the info shared by June0000 I'm going to search for one.
Sorry for my "unbelievable" life. I also would like to not believe certain parts of it are true too.... but they are.

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pinkbunny

Just saw the new posts from silviatexas, kkny and june0000... I guess I do sound pretty stupid and naive to all of you. Maybe I am. I don't know what to do. I love my husband- (obviously or else I would not be with him) and while I know he is not a perfect person (which no one is) I want to see the good in him and not dwell on his shortcomings- same as I would want him to do with me. I don't want him to dwell on bad choices Ive made in the past and I would hope that he would want to search out the good in me and love me FOR that and love me IN SPITE of what I have done wrong or what character flaws I have. I do believe 100% that I am smitten with him. And your quote silviatexas from your friend about being in love is really funny to me because my husband says something similar to that whenever I mess something up - like dinner for instance- I cooked the chicken for too long a few nights ago and it was dry and he just laughed and said "you must be in love." (Maybe thats why it was overcooked, but I think mostly it ws because I had a crying baby I was trying to attend to at the same time!)
Some of you think my moral compass has gone awry - which I don't understand at all! What have I done that is morally wrong?? I understand that my husband was a TERRIBLE husband to his first wife- (not convinced that he was to the second) and I NEVER in a million years thought I would fall so hard for someone who had been married TWICE and who had a kid MY AGE and who was a big-time CHEATER! Just saying all those things makes my stomach turn. But then I look at him and all my disgust melts away cause I love him so much for what he is TO ME and not what he was to other women in his past.

The amount I owed was alot (nearly $20,000.00) and I was really sick through most of my pregnancy - which resulted in me loosing my job and now I am a full-time mom and don't want to leave my baby with anyone. My husband also wants me to stay at home with our little one which is the only way I would have it. If he would have said he wanted to have a baby with me but he wanted me to keep my job and hire a babysitter- I would not have gotten pregnant.
Some of my interest rates on my CC debts were 50% and I was only paying off the interest monthly on each one and was behind on payments and just really in a bad situation.
I live near my grandma because I moved here (not really to MOVE but to come and stay) with her when she had major heart surgery- then I met my man and stayed. My mom lives states away with my sisters. She does not like where we live and would never move here. She is a country person, as am I actually. But I see where we live a temporary and we talk about him retiring and us moving to someplace with woods and land and long dirt roads...

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pinkbunny

Oh and we were in a REAL Amish community- (hats - bonnets, horse and buggy and all. My family had a car though and we WERE accepted in as one of them inspite of that) My grandma never was and is a stylish and very modern 80+ year old lady. Only my immediate family lived that lifestyle and they gradually began leaving those ways behind the older us girls got and the more we rebelled and then the move that we made took us out of "Amish Country" although one of the Amish families did move with us.

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Ashley

PB,

The reason people are having a hard time believing you is that your story is getting more and more outrageous and you are sounding more and more nieve with every post. Assuming you are for real...you can also find out whose name the property is in if you go to the courthouse. What state do you live in? You could probably get all of that information online, esspecially if you are in a metropolitan area. I still think he isn't being truthful with you. If the friend had the Mortgage in his name, he can still Quitcliam his interest back to your hubby. This story is just not adding up!

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mom_of_4

for the most part I have chosen to stay out of this one but I will say one thing...

No one should be loved IN SPITE of their bad choices or habits but loved because of them; because every bad choice or bad habit (and, obviously, all of the good ones) are what makes them the person they are today. I would loathe to think that someone loved my in spite of something .....instead of just loving me ALL of me no matter what.

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pinkbunny

I see your point "mom of 4" - but doesn't it seem a little weird to love someone for the mistakes they made and to love them for the bad choices they have made? Where is hate the sin but love the sinner? I'm sorry but I don't love him for doing things wrong, I love him for who he is inspite of what he has done wrong.

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pinkbunny

like for example if your husband come to you and said "I lied to you yesterday about something" Would you reply "I love you for lyeing to me" -I wouldn't. I think I would say something more along the lines of "well that was wrong but I love you even though you did that."

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orangetree

pb - some men like young women. They're loving and attentive until that young woman turns into a middle-aged woman. This may not be true of your DH, but you might want to keep an eye out for that.

As for the house -- it's his son's house, not yours or DH's. Your husband has made sure of that.

If DH has the financial means, you might want to think about purchasing another home, just for the two of you. If he does not have the means to purchase another house, you might want to think about getting insurance on DH, because when he dies, you will be left high and dry.

If DH refuses to move into another home or get insured, then I would question just how much this person cares for you and your little one. "Actions speak louder than words."

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theotherside

Now I am really confused. You can't refinance a house that doesn't belong to you. If the house is in his son's name, his father couldn't refinance it in his friend's name.

Were your parents baptized as Amish? If so, they couldn't own a car if the ordnung prohibited it. Where they Beachy Amish , in which case the other church members would be able to own cars as well? Or did you mean your parents lived a mostly plain lifestyle and were just accepted as friends?

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pinkbunny

He can refinance a house - and put it into someone else's name who has better credit than his son- and thats what he did. Thats what I was told. How it all works, I don't know. I'm not in rel-estate nor do I work in the mortgage and financing business.

As for the Amish issue (which isn't really one!) No my parents weren't baptized Amish. In my 12 years living in the Amish community and with an Amish family living IN our home, I never witnessed an Amish baptism. What is Beachy Amish? And "ordnung"? Never mind- I don't care really. I'm not interested in the Amish lifestyle, their practices or beliefs. Ive had my fill of that for one life-time.
As for you not believe that I grew up in an Amish community- thats ok. I see disbelief in peoples eyes whenever my husband brings it up (which he likes very much to do.) I have bleached blond hair and an augmented chest (which is new and I LOVE) and never go without wearing heels. Not exactly the epitome of an Amish girl..

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june0000

Ok - now I am really trying to understand. The husband put two houses in his friend's name so his friend (with a better credit score) could refinance. So his friend is on the deeds and the mortgages.

Why would his friend take on two mortgages? He would undoubtedly know that PB's husband is $50,000 in the hole on back child support, obviously doesn't have a good credit record and also that PB doesn't have a job and recently declared bankrupty.

He would also know that if PB's husband doesn't pay the mortgage(s), he has to pay.

Is the friend "leasing" the houses to you and your husband? A lease would provide you with at least some landlord tenant protection. Without a lease, he could call the sheriff and have everyone thrown out tomorrow.

What an arrangement!

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pinkbunny

Yes June0000, there are tenants in the houses. I am surprised what an interest this subject has sparked. I don't think our friend is aware that my husband has back CS to pay - and no, we don't publicize the fact that I filed bankruptcy (although I just announced it to the world on here- but thankfully you don't know who I am- I would be embarrassed if you did.) Yes of course our friend knows that if my husband doesn't pay, then he would have to - but thankfully we have tenants in the house.
He would never have us "thrown out" as you put it. He is the kindest and most Christ-like human being I have ever met.

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june0000

He'll throw you out if you don't pay the mortgages. I promise.

I'm having a hard time believing that someone who was in dire enough straights to file for banktruptcy recently would go out and pay for a new set of boobs.

PB, if you had to sum it all up, what are your three biggest concerns in life?

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theotherside

Does the friend own the house(s) jointly with your husband, or by himself? If your H's son was on the mortgage and deed, he would have had to sell the house to his father's friend to pay off the mortgage. This whole thing doesn't make any sense.

Of course you wouldn't have witnessed a baptism - not being Amish, you wouldn't have been present. I am getting the impression that you didn't go to an Amish school, speak low German, attend church at the houses of Amish families - in short, you weren't any more Amish than my family was when we lived in an Amish community and had some Amish friends.

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pinkbunny

You guys are turning mean and I feel like I am constantly having to defend myself and explain myself - only to be disbelieved in the end.
Sorry I am not making any sense. I didn't know that I was so ignorant until now.
Thanks for the advice about the SS in the beginning and for the advise about life-insurance.
By the way- I emailed Kate dot blue and got no response.
Goodbye

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weed30 St. Louis

I did respond.

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plasticgarden

"I have bleached blond hair and an augmented chest (which is new and I LOVE) and never go without wearing heels. "

Kinda figured with the name PINKBUNNY.I really dont think anyone is trying to be mean,though.I think you see it that way cuz we have lots of questions that you cant answer.I dont think it's your fault,you probably dont KNOW what is really going on.
Look,the ladies here really do give good advice.Most of them have been through a lot,so they have much exprience.
They are only trying to help you see what you cannot,and learn from it,and know how to protect yourself.
I dont think you are lying about your life.I have had people accuse me of the same before,so I know how you feel.
It's just most people dont hear stuff like this everyday so it's hard for them to beileve.

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theotherside

Actually it is your husband's explanations that aren't making any sense.

It is difficult to understand the situation without having sufficient background information initially, and when additional relevant pieces of information keep popping up.

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sylviatexas1

Do you have a password that no one else knows?

If not, husband or his son may have read & deleted weed's email.

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june0000

PB,

I'm not trying to be mean, and I don't think anyone else is either. We've spent considerable time trying to help you and none of us is getting paid for posting here.

What alarmed me, and most likely others, is that you have told us of your husband's past history of cheating, etc. and I think most of us are fearful that you don't seem to fully realize what you've gotten yourself into.

At the tender age of 26 you have completely put your life under this man's total control. His past is checkered and you have told us this yourself. And we all know that the stripes on a tiger do not change and you are being sailed down the river and you don't even seem to realize it. Look at what is happening to you:

1. You have no assets - your husband signed them over to a friend to play games with refinancing (shady deal at best) and you don't seem to think there is anything wrong with this. You also don't seem overly concerned about how this affects you and your baby.

2. You have recently declared bankruptcy over $20,000 in credit card debt. Your credit is ruined for at least 10 years - don't believe the story about it being erased in 7 years. That's simply not true. And your explanation about wanting to be a stay-at-home Mom (thus the reason for not going back to work to pay off your debts)is not something that most people would consider a compelling reason to declare bankruptcy.

3. It sounds as if after you declared bankruptcy, you had breast augmentation. That is not covered by insurance and the cost usually ranges from $10,000 to $20,000. That money would have made a big dent in the debt you left others to cover. It wasn't just the credit card companies who paid when you declared bankruptcy. We all pay with higher fees. I don't think you seem to realize this.

You seem to be nice person but the things you have told us are beyond bizarre. They are alarming. What I'm trying to figure out is how much your husband had to do with you declaring bankruptcy and then having breast augmentation surgery.

To me, those two things outside of anything else are HUGE character issues. I can understand how an older man can totally manipulate a much younger, naive woman and talk her into things like this.

Is that what happened? Do you see what is wrong with the picture? Do you think if you continue on this path that you will end up with any future happiness and security?

That is why most of us are concerned for you. Most of us are old enough to be your mother. I know that I am. I have a stepdaughter who is your exactly your age that I love dearly and sometimes she still needs to be protected.

What I'm trying to figure out is are you that naive or are you a willing party to what's gone on?

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Ashley

PB,

I am not old enough to be your mother...I'm only 3 years older than you are. But, I do deal with real estate legal issues on a daily basis. I can tell you that it would be very easy to check to see if he is telling you the truth about your home and who owns it. This is very important because if you are having a hard time dealing with the son you need to know where you stand legally as far as ownership of the home. If, as I suspect the home IS actually in the son's name, and not in the friends name, you should know that. I think your hubby is telling you stories about the ownership of the home in order to get you to stop asking questions. Because the behavior of your SS is abusive, you should know where you stand. It is VERY simple to find all of this out if you want to. As far as a will goes...if he has no assets in his name, what good would it do for him to make out a will? He can't will a home to you if it doesn't legally belong to him in the first place.

If one of my friends were in your situation, I would advise her to at least do what it takes to have an understanding of where she stands legally and I would want her to find out what the truth is.

Odds are very slim that you would run into one of your husband's friends at the Courthouse unless he is involved in a business where that would be a regular thing for them. If you do, tell them or him that you were there to tie up some lose ends on the bankruptcy situation. Or at the very least, look it up online. If you tell me what County and State you live in, I could probably direct you to the online information for the County in which you live.

It's important for you to know for sure that he is telling you the truth about his situation. I don't think he is, but if you think he is, what would it hurt to find out?

Let us know how the talk went today!

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sleeperblues

Pinkbunny,

Thank you so much for your story. I was enthralled for the last hour reading, amazed at the twists and turns. I loved how everytime someone made a legitimate point you had a pat answer to fill in the blanks.

There is a lot of good advice in the posts for people who really need it. You, however, are a figment of some clever person's imagination. Perhaps a shut-in with nothing to do and all the time in the world to do it? You really should attempt to write a romance novel.

But I really have been having fun imaging what a bleached blonde, large chested high heel wearing bankrupt 26 year old Amish mother looks like. I know you're reading this, so thanks for the laughs.

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Vivian Kaufman

LOL....

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sylviatexas1

Pinkbunny sounds exactly like a young woman whose parents tried to shelter/protect her from the world & who rebelled & went as far in the other direction as possible, without having the street smarts a more worldly lifestyle requires.

& her husband sounds exactly like the kind of person who would know how to to manipulate such a young woman.

Pinkbunny, it concerns me that you haven't posted since Friday's scheduled talk with your husband.

Please let us know how it went.

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lonepiper

Irrelevant and yet somewhat noteworthy...anyone notice that the "mom camp" and the "stepmom camp" stood shoulder-to-shoulder? Granted, there wasn't much provocative "stepfamily" issues involved so there wasn't much to fight about and yet the concept gave me pause...we can interact quite well with one another apart from our stepfamily issues.

Pinkbunny, please know that it is very difficult to determine if people are who they say they are, however, if you have been truthful and you came here seeking help please know that you are in my thoughts and I'm hoping for the best for you. If you came here for any other reason then thanks for the distraction from our usual problems.

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june0000

I've gone back and forth on the issue of whether PB is for real or if she is the figment of someone's creative imagination.

If PB's for real, perhaps she's thinking about what everyone has posted and letting it digest. I don't think she is gone forever, though. We'll hear from her again, I feel pretty sure of that.

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pinkbunny

Sleeperblues... your post is exactly why I wanted to end my postings here. I dont understand how someone can be so disbelieving. I wish you all knew how real I am.

Silivatexas... your post is the reason I am writing again. Thanks for believing that there is a slight chance that I am in fact a real girl ("Woman" if you want but I dont think that word quite fits me yet).

As far as how the "talk" went... I guess it wasnt clear earlier when I wrote about it saying:

"I talked to my husband today - he took the morning off. He agreed that there needs to be a will made - and he will do it - he said he just has trouble making the time. But I told him he needs to make it a priority. He refinanced two of the houses and did so under a friend of his's name because he had better credit than his son. So now none of the houses are in SS name. My husband's credit is not good enough to get him an interest rate that he can afford so thats why he has his things in his friend's name now. Not to hide from the ex. I was under the wrong impression I guess and I feel bad for sharing what I thought with all of you when it wasn't the case anymore. I'm glad to be updated on what is going on...
Oh and HE brought up a life insurance policy and said that I need to start checking around for one. With the info shared by June0000 I'm going to search for one."

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sylviatexas1

The post on October 8 was the only one sleeperblues made.

Pinkbunny, I wish you the best.

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sleeperblues

Pinkbunny,

If you are really someone that is seeking help, you have received A LOT of great advice from people here. I really do wish you the best. I am still having a hard time believing everything, but I guess that is just my own skepticism.

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