I'm jumping in late and have read through most of the responses. I understand where you are coming from as I went through something similiar a couple years ago when I wanted to have carpet replaced in 4 bedrooms and tile put down in all the other rooms except our baths. I thought I would get a better price overall if I used the same flooring place who could order the tile and carpet and have them do all the work. I got what I thought was a reasonable price from a place that came highly recommended but the man I was dealing with would not break down the labor costs for the tile and the carpet. His rationale was that it depended on who he actually got to do the two jobs since it would not be the same crew laying the tile and doing the carpet. No matter how I asked, he just wanted to give me a total price and wouldn't tell me the labor costs. I ended up feeling like I was actually paying more for the tile and carpet than he actually quoted me when he said I was getting it at a discounted price because of the size of the job. So I started back at square one and got another quote that was broken down by a company that would do both the tile and carpet. It was lower - more for the tile and less for the carpet. Then I found a guy that would lay the tile and he helped me get an even better price for the tile and a great price for laying it. I then went to the second bidder and got the carpet at his price and his company installed it with a better warranty than the first company. The total amount I spent was about $1,700.00 less than the original guys quote. One thing I found out was that the guy that did my tile only added 3% waste. The other two added 5%. My guy did such a great job of laying it out that we ended up with 11 boxes (4 pieces each) left over. (This job was over 1,400 sq. ft of tile in 5 rooms that all feed into each other with walls between and he matched it so that we have no pieces less than 12" wide around the walls, we used 20x20 tile). We ended up ordering more of the tile this summer and had the same guy tile our back porch leading to our pool area, of course we used our left over and it did match well. I hope you find someone who can give you the breakdown you need. You should be able to know what the materials cost and the labor costs.

fac3, Maybe you should try thinking of it a different way. And I apologize in advance if anything that follows offends you, but you asked for everything, and and if this is the same woman he cheated with when you were 2... From what you've described it sounds possible your mom may have a mental disorder that she kept hidden until after they were married, and the woman he thought he married never actually existed. This generally holds true for narcissist, borderline, bipolar and other similar personality disorders. Do you "walk on eggshells" around your mother? If so, that's a strong indication and you may want to read up on these. Then met TOW, and maybe to them, it wasn't JUST an affair, but when he asked for a divorce, your mother refused maybe even threatening what she would do to him and how she would punish his children--and he believed her too! So for the sake of his children, he put aside his own personal desires and chose you over her, to protect and keep his children from harm. So he bore the brunt of your mom's fury himself, mostly in silence, but that would explain also why he confided in you with some of those inappropriate adult conversations--because he needed someone, and never really had a wife or anyone else and he felt very alone. His only joy in life for 20 years was YOU. When his loneliness became too great to bear, he also sought comfort in the arms of another woman, but that was just "comfort sex," shallow and unfulfilling. It's no excuse but it is THE REASON. After the rest of his children moved on and you were ready as well, absent any further need of protection, he felt that after 20 years of abuse, he could not see himself living that way, all alone with his tormenter for the rest of his life. He fulfilled his obligations, and after all that, didn't he deserve some happiness by finally being with someone he loved, and returned his love? This is no justification for cheating, but there is also a reason it is called FALLING in love, because that's what happens. We fall, and there's no way to stop ourselves. That's why it's better not to place yourself in the path of temptation. Maybe your dad and TOW fell in love those many long years ago, madly, desperately and hopelessly. When your dad chose you over her, she made some very bad choices as broken-hearted people tend to do. For all you know, at one time she may have had high standards and morals which your dad convinced her to set aside for him, promising he would take protect and care for her, and when he didn't she fell by the wayside, and went into a downward spiral. If your dad loved her, he should have protected her too! Instead now, he feels guilty for having abandoned her, the woman he never stopped loving, and is now extremely protective because he feels responsible--and that's because he IS responsible. His entire life has been one of obligations and responsibilities, and she is the one obligation he made that he didn't fulfill. Instead he left her out in the cold, all alone, to be made the subject of ridicule and abuse, he's regretted it ever since. He's not about to make that same mistake, ever again! And now the daughter who he loved deeply that he made this sacrifice for is the very one he must protect her from. Every single day, he is probably regretting he didn't leave your mom long ago--and maybe he should have! If he didn't love her, he should freed her to find love with someone else. We each only have 1 life, and none of us should live it trapped in a loveless marriage. He has obligated himself to her now voluntarily, and dedicated himself to sheilding and protecting her, just like he with you--only you have your own husband and in no further need of your dad's protection--she is now his primary responsibility. If you can't see how you are putting him in a very bad position by attempting to convince him to exclude his wife, then it might help to consider that even the most dispicable amount us, those who embody the very essence of evil, namely "sociopaths" and "psychopaths," are nice and even kind to those who care about and treat them well--and that doesn't take any effort whatsoever because that's in their own best interest. What separates them from the rest of us is that they lack the ability to EMPATHIZE--to truely place oneself in another's shoes to gain an awareness of their thoughts, emotions and behavior, even those you don't agree with and even those you find distressing until you find some way to relate and care about them, at least enough to be compassionate and considerate. It's what gives us the ability to "treat others as we wish to be treated ourselves" even people we don't like, even people who do things we feel are wrong. You are only seeing him as your father, and not the entire man as an individual human being, with all the same flaws and human weaknesses, along with the same emotions to be happy with a mate who is his alone to love and cherish, with whom he can enjoy the passions of intimate love, and find the place where he belongs and can call home. Even from what you've said, he never had that with your mom. But hey! I could be wrong, maybe your dad's a good person who made some mistakes and poor choices, or he's a dog! You can decide that for yourself, but if he's not going to change his mind, and you can't find some way to empathize and compromise to include her in some way, then the only resolution I can see is for you and your dad to go your separate ways. But I hope that's not going to happen.

Reading this post just made me text my boyfriend and tell him what a good boyfriend he is and how much I appreciate him. You remind me a lot of me. I'm 31 now, but I dated a slew of guys who were takers while I am a giver. My ex bfs were not as bad as yours, they were actually ok guys who just didn't have it in them to be good boyfriends. I am a social worker and have dated a lot of "fixer uppers", LOL, it's in my nature. I accepted less than I deserved from a relationship hoping they would come around and actually be the kind of boyfriend I really wanted. None of them ever did. Then, I started dating someone completely not "my type". Didn't look the my usual type, didn't act like my usual type, wasn't into the same things as my usualy type, etc. He's the best boyfriend I've ever had, we've been dating a year now. He pays for things when I'm low on cash, he walks my dog so I can sleep in, he made a REAL effort on my birthday and surprised me with something very sweet, he drives over an hour multiple times a week to spend time with me, he tells me all the time how much he appreciates and loves me. I'm not a big Dr. Phil fan, but I've come to rely on something he says all the time: "When someone shows you who they are, believe them!". Your boyfriend is an @ss, pure and simple. He treats you like crap despite all the nice things you do for him. At least if you were his maid and whore you would be getting paid for it! Right now you're doing it for free with no appreciation or reciprocation. Be single and happy and the right guy will come along. It has nothing to do with how attractive or not attractive you are. Actually I've seen a direct correlation with guys who think they are soooo good looking and being shallow pieces of crap. Don't settle for any less than a guy head over heels about you who shows you constantly how much you mean to him. Try dating guys you usually don't, maybe you'll be surprised by what you find!

If only it were that simple. My poor DH took the job in NYC following his divorce because he took a bath. His ex-wife got 65% of their marital assets (including most of the retirement funds), and his obligations included an $8,000/month fixed and guaranteed child support/maintenance payment, as well as 100% of the boys' college tuitions. He also had agreed to pay reduced maintenance upon his ex-wife's remarriage. She had already had her next husband lined up in DC, and she told DH she would need the additional maintenance (in addition to the child support) in order to stay in the Chicago area until the youngest son graduated. She reneged on that and moved to DC when she married last summer, and that's why the boys came to live with us, but she still gets her maintenance checks. The reduced maintenance runs for 3 years of her marriage or until youngest son graduates, so she synched her remarriage to get the maximum maintenance. Anyway, DH took the job before I was in the picture, and I think most divorced dads in that situation would just start a new life in their new city. My husband choose to keep his post-divorce apartment here so that he could come home on the weekends and be with the boys. He had tried to find a similar position in the Chicago area, but there just wasn't anything. So now DH commutes. He's usually home for 3 or 4 days on the weekends (yes, he can take long weekends, the flip is that he works 15 hour days while in NYC), and he does take time off during the school breaks (all winter break, spring break, and several weeks in the summer), so he does spend time with the kids. The irony of all this is that youngest son, during his recent tirade about how he doesn't want to live with us because of all our stupid rules, said he would follow his BM's rules because, as he put it, "No offense, dad, but I respect mom more than I respect you." This would be the mom that took off for DC and dumped him off with us. Go figure. I should also add that my ex-husband (my daughters' bio dad) is a lawyer who returned to Israel. Try collecting child support from that. So my DH supports all of us. I once had a conversation with DH's ex-wife about how we actually have 5 college tuitions to pay for, and she said, "But DH doesn't have to pay for the girls' college!" She was really surprised that he would, and thought that he shouldn't, but that is the kind of dad my DH is. I guess because I was raised by my stepdad, with a totally absent bio dad, I don't think anything unusual about this. Now that youngest son has opted to return to living with mom, our fixed and guaranteed child support/maintenance payment is $6,000/month, oldest son is in out-of-state private college with $40,000/year tuition, of which we pay 100%, we are still saving for college tuitions for younger kids, as well as for our retirement. My daughters are actually good girls. They are excellent students, involved in extracurricular school activities, they stay out of trouble, and were pretty upset by what happened with the step brother. They didn't want him to leave our home, and they think he's "dumb." I think the biggest difference between them and their step brothers is that the girls have always known what the rules were, and what was expected of them. I can't imagine my 14 yo ever skipping class (she is a straight A student), yet the boys were always doing that when they lived with their mom. I will share a funny story about BM. When oldest son first left for college, it was right after her remarriage and move to DC, so she was no longer receiving child support. She visited son at school, bought him 3 expensive NorthFace coats (we had bought him a new one before he left for school, we didn't realize he was going to need 3 more), and then called me to tell me she would need a reimbursement check. Her reasoning? Well, she was no longer getting child support. Never mind that she was still getting $2,000/month maintenance. I told her that oldest son was over 18, so no one gets child support for him, and that if any of us buy him something, it's a gift. She then said, well, she didn't want to ask for reimbursement, but her new husband thought she should. What a jerk. When I think of that compared to how DH treats my daughters, I have to feel sorry for BM, as well as my stepsons. What was my point? Oh, yes. We have a lot of financial obligations, plus my stepson DOES NOT want to live here (so long as I am here). He just wants to be able to "stay here" when it's not convenient for his BM. So I'm not sure that, at this point, my DH's 100% presence would make a difference.