Not sure if my question was clear enough, since the original post was written while waiting for my 4 yo grandtwins to get to sleep - after several trips in and out of bed, they finally fell asleep after midnight!

I fear that my kitchen area is not WIDE enough to get good circulation for a decent sized island. I was hoping to remove the peninsula to clear up several problems - first, I'm forever splashing the cab to the left of the dishwasher. second, I find it a PITN to serve and clear up the table - rarely get assistance, so it means that I'm literally running in circles around the peninsula.

I should also mention that I currently have a 33" LG french door fridge in the 36" space which sticks out 34.5" with handles. I also have an above-the-range micro which I would like to move as indicated above. I'm short and it's somewhat dangerous to remove or stir anything in the micro if I have stuff on the stove. It's just my husband and me living here, but we watch our grandkids on a daily basis, and have large get-togethers at least once a week, so the kitchen's a hot spot.

And an oops....the dashed line on the LEFT (not the right as mentioned in the first posting) in the layouts represents the end of the kitchen area, currently defined by the side of the peninsula.

"Flow" would be better with an island, but I'm a realist and realize that if it won't fit properly and would become a 'barrier island, I'll just have to live with the peninsula. In that case, I'm hoping that some of you kitchen gurus can give me some feedback re peninsula vs. island and if suggest some improvements to the current layout plans.

Thanks,

Helene

The national kitchen and bath (NKBA) website has good information on clearances. They recommend minimums. Some people go with less and it works for them but they know what they getting themselves into. They recommend 42" for work aisles. I'm not sure what you mean about the table and chairs where they are now. How far from the island?

Here is a link that might be useful: NKBA guidelines

I'm not good with layout advice but there are several here on this site who are. Maybe if you repost this with a different subject title you may get better response. Try this:

New here-need layout advice

What are the exact dimensions of your kitchen?? 11 x 13 is what I'm seeing which isn't a bad sized space. You should post what things can't be changed and what things can. How many will be working in the kitchen at one time-just you or?? Label your diagram N, S, E, and W. If you put the island in how much aisle space will you have on the 4 sides??

What exactly is on the other side of the dash line? Is that the dining room or eat-in area?
Also, do you want the isand to sit at or to control the traffic flow?
I think your trash it too far from the sink and your fridge is in the traffic path, but I need more info about what's on the other side. Thanks

A great suggestion I read in the FAQ is to put down blue painters tape on the floor in the garage with the layout you are considering, and "walk through it" as you imagine completing different kitchen tasks. C
- clearing the table and loading the diswasher
- getting drinks out of the fridge
- taking ingredients out of the fridge and prepping a meal
- bringing home groceries and putting them away

You could even take one or two of your DR chairs out there to put them where they would be in relation to the island and see if you think it's too close.

Where do *you* sit at the dining room table? If you sit at the top left in the diagram, I think that adding the island might help with circulation.

The island is not for seating, just as a "landing spot" or work area, right? If the seats in the DR that back up to the island are primarily used by the grandchildren, could you consider using a bench that slides under the table for seating, rather than chairs with arms and backs? (I'm envisioning like a piano bench, or a Shaker-style bench if that works in your dining room.)

Have you considered moving the refrigerator to the left in the diagram, so that it is at the end of that bank of cabinets, rather than in the middle? That way it would be further away from the door at the bottom right that goes to the office and the garage.

If you could get around the penisula, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to get around the island. I would move the island down closer the the range, 48" seems would be too big a space for me there. I know it wouldn't be a straight line from the sink to fridge but it wouldn't be more that a side step to get around it.

Here's another blank plan, hopefully clearer this time. ;-)

It's going to be a one-person kitchen - my husband hasn't yet found the dishwasher or sink, we've been here almost 9 years. He recently discovered the toaster, which has been sitting on the counter all these years.

The issue is that >>canI have been in kitchens with the 38" to 40" clearance and that's not a problem. I just wanted some feedback to determine if I'm just looking for an island for an island's sake, or am I gaining anything by getting one? I might even be losing counter space with the island as compared to a peninsula.

Also, you'll note that there's only 21" between the peninsula and the chairs when they're pushed in. I generally sit in the chair right where the arrow is pointing. It's really difficult to get around the table to clear it off if there are people sitting there. I would push the island towards the right (as shown in my potential island layout) just to gain a drop more room, but I'm not sure if that even gives me enough 'circulating room'.

This is not easy, but thanks for your help.

Helene

Seems as though you have sufficient aisle space around the proposed island. It sounds like you really would rather have an island than a peninsula so go for it!!

I didn't find this forum in time so granite was templated and cut so I was stuck with my peninsula. It would have been so easy to make some minor changes-eliminating the peninsula and getting an island similar to your size. Don't be like me, saying "if only."

I absolutely think you have room for an island, especially if for a one-woman kitchen, and that you'll have the better flow around the room that you'd like...At least I know I'd prefer it, since I don't like the dead-end and hemmed in space created by a peninsula.

I would do as others suggested and move the island toward the range a bit. We have 36" between our rangetop and island and it's really more than plenty, even when 2 are cooking at the stove. I tried to design it that way to discourage people trying to get through that way while someone else is cooking, but there is still plenty of room when someone wants to get past that way. Since you have an oven to open there, you might want to go to 42", but I wouldn't want any more.

Once the island is moved, if you could scoot the fridge so it's in line with the aisle in front of the stove, the work layout would be a bit improved...but I see that may block the doorway to the right. Did you say you're keeping the std-depth fridge?

The NKBA guidelines are nice, but others here are quite happy with less than 42" aisles. Best if you can mock it up somehow and judge for yourself.

Helene, I had a very similar size and layout to yours, with the penninsula, which was the main reason for my kitchen remodel. I now have a fabulous island, one side has a little less than 42" clearance, and I couldn't be happier.

The penninsula really boxed in the eating area, so we use it much more now, and we added seating at the island, so the kitchen is much more functional, access to storage is better, traffic actually flows, and I have had 15 people in the kitchen and we could still get around each other. Now, if i could just decide on a backsplash.....

Good luck to you, and I am sure you will love it!

I had forgotten to address some of the questions to the earlier posting - but I don't have a prayer of having any seating at that proposed island - I'm a realist. What I would like is to have an island which is an added benefit to the kitchen, not just one squished(?) in.

I was considering pushing the island more towards the stove, as Rhome mentioned and then moving the fridge to the right also - making the utility/roll-out cab smaller. As to moving the fridge to the left as Eastbaymom mentioned, then the island would truly become, in Buehl's words, a barrier island. I don't worry so much about moving traffic around it, but rather, pulling it out for repair. It's ONLY 5 years old, but I'm not ready to get rid of it. Ideally, a counter-depth would fit in and make sense there - but not until some date in the future unless this one truly dies!!

As calimama said, the peninsula boxes in the eating area. An island, if one can circumnavigate it, would definitely improve this kitchen. My sticking point, I guess, is the space between the eating area and the island. If the chairs closest to the peninsula are pushed in and not being used, there's 21" behind them. I can scoot the placement of the island over a couple of inches, but I probably couldn't get anywhere near 15"- I don't think. Maybe I just don't have the vision for this.

Helene

If you scoot the island toward the stove 9" (to get a 42" aisle there), then subtract 6" from the island, you'll have your 15" for a more comfortable 36" between chairs and island...Not perfect but way better. A 45" island is still a good and useful length.

I totally see what you mean about the fridge and the island. My bad!

I have a friend who was set on getting an island, but not quite sure about placement.... so they ordered the island, gutted the kitchen, and when the island arrived they did not secure it to the floor immediately. Instead, they set it down temporarily (a week or two) with plywood of the right dimensions on top, and scooted the plywood to the left and right till they knew what would work for them. Then they recentered the cabinet under the desired location for the island's countertop, and secured the island to the floor.

That approach would let you try out Rhome410's idea.

If your kitchen is not yet gutted, you could try the same idea on the end of the island closest to the stove by building out that end of the peninsula with a cardboard box. (Can you tell that I'm big on the idea of trying things out?) That would let you check how close you can get the island to the stove without blocking traffic behind you.

Good luck with whatever you choose!

Rhome, your idea of making the island a little smaller just might work. What kind of cabs should I put in the island to make it really useful?

I didn't want to put the trash in the island - I'd rather keep the trash in an end cab - either near the stove or, if I was doing a peninsula, and the end of the peninsula - so that it's accessible to everyone even passing through the kitchen. Homechef mentioned that the trash might be too far from the sink, but it would actually be closer than it is now sitting at the end of the peninsula.

I have taped off the floor in several variations, but everyone seems to step on it - I guess the best idea would be to put some sort of a box to provide a more realistic situation.

Helene

Well, it would be good to map out places for everything in your kitchen and see what would be best for you in the island. I do have the trash in my island. It's across from the main sink and also close to the stove and prep area, so it's accessible from all those places. I also keep knives, cutting boards, Tupperware, and plastic wrap, foil, etc. in island cabinets. The other side faces my baking area, so besides the sink cab on that side, I store my bread mixer and bread pans, so I can pull them out to use them on the island surface...But that's what works best for me. May not be right choices for you.

bump

Rhome, I've been admiring your gorgeous kitchen for quite some time now and was following along when you talked about your aisle clearances. I would be quite happy with them; I just have to convince my husband he'd be happy with them - although, as I said, he's not a kitchen person, so why should his vote count?? (said with a wink! - we've been married almost 42 years - I'm not changin' him now!)

I'm afraid if I put my trash cab in the island, no one would be happy. It would requireus to walk around the island to throw anything away, because of the east-west nature of the island with regard to the rest of the kitchen. It would feel like an obstacle. I figured I'd put the trash in the last cab on the end of the stove wall. It would be no further than the stand-alone trash can is now at the end of the peninsula- really just a step or two away. Said trash can broke last night - think it's telling me something??

What would be the best combination of cabs for a 45" island? Ideally, I'd like to have at least a 36" set of drawers, but that would make the remainder fairly useless to me unless it was upright storage for baking pans and cutting boards, but I suspect 9" wouldn't be large enough. If I go the custom route, depending on pricing, then I could be more flexible, but it remains to be seen.

Helene

I'm quite happy with the 30" drawers I have in a couple places, and I think 27" would even be a good size. I would determine what size you have to have the smaller cabinet to make it useful, then do the rest in the big drawers.