I cannot address your recess lighting question. I have them in my current kitchen but we are moving our kitchen to another room and do not plan to put them in. The current kitchen is in the middle of the house and has no windows. The new kitchen has 3.

The former owners of our house bought a plug in flourescent light that is quite ugly and sticks out ....especially the cord that hangs down to the plug. Even though I have the recessed lights in there, I would hate to be without that one undercabinet light. It stays on 24/7 and does not get hot. I love it!!! I do almost all of my work in that one spot...and with 3 adult cooks in the house....well, that's why we're getting a new kitchen.

I am planning on getting undercabinet lighting in the new kitchen for task lighting and an island chandelier. I feel like the windows will provide enough "room light" and I will leave the one flourescent undercabinet light on 24/7 like I currently do.

Do you "need" undercabinet lighting??? To me it would depend on how much other light you have to accomplish your task lighting. What about pendant lights in planned task areas?

There is another thread where people are talking about either loving them or hating them. Maybe do a search for that one and it will help.

We don't have undercab lighting, and I didn't want recessed cans, but DH insisted on a few, so I wouldn't have regrets later. They are in key task areas (over the dish hutch, over the baking and breakfast areas, and at the counters to the sides of the rangetop where we use the micro and do prep). We have schoolhouse lights in the main area and a different style of pendant over the sink. Usually we just turn on the main lights, but it's nice to turn on just the task lights if we're sticking to that portion of the kitchen and don't need the whole room lit. There was a great discussion on this awhile back, but I suppose this forum moves so fast that it's long gone.

Here's a photo of our lights when they first went in so you can see style and general locations.

I love recessed lights but I think you're right that they don't match the period of your house. I think you would be fine with a chandelier over the table, pendants over the island, another pendant over the sink and a semi-flushmount in the middle of the kitchen close to the stove. I also highly recommend undercabinet lighting. In fact I just bought one last night from lowes (T5 flourescent) for less than $30. It's a plug in but I have some plugs inside cabinets so I just plug it there and I don't see the cords. They are wonderful and last forever. Specially good if you think you don't have too much light.

Hi Borngrace - - Your floor plan is divine and I know this new kitchen space is going to bless you and your family! I gave my kitchen lighting a TON of thought because I am very sensitive to lighting. Ambient and soft lighting are important to me, and if I have a task to do in a space I want it BRIGHT. Good and appropriate lighting keep me in good spirits! (I lived in Russia for two years where the sky is constantly grey and the sun rarely shines bright - - every room had multiple lamps that were on every minute I was awake to keep me from getting depressed!! :-) But that's another story!!)

Since this is the type of construction where UC lights could easily be wired for, I highly encourage you to do them. I wonder that you didn't like cooking in your last kithcen because the lighting was so poor. You always have the option to NOT turn them on if you don't like them, but should you NOT do them and find you need more light, well... it's hard to do back and do them.

I planned my lighting in layers:

1.) Just a few recessed lights for overall coverage (on a dimmer)
2.) Upper cabinet lights for ambience and gently morning light before I've had my caffiene ;-)
3.) UC lights for tasking on perimeter (on it's own switch - they can be on or not)
4.) Two mini chandeliers over island for general lighting and the 'bling' & 'sparkle' factor!
5.) Two mini can lights over my sink on their own switch
6.) Two mini cans over the island where I will use the prep sink and prep food - on it's own switch so I only turn this lighting on during the short times I need it.
7.) Then obviously, the light in the blower above my rangetop.

Every one of these different lights has it's own switch so that I'm only turning on the lighting that I need. Rarely will they all be on, and the cans and chandeliers are on dimmers, so I can even control the level of light. Different times of day and different tasks call for different lighting. I feel very well prepared to take on any task needed because I am COVERED in the lighting department! :-)

It's so easy to install the UC lights and simply not use them if you don't need them. You may have another family member who begins to cook and chooses to use them and you'll be glad you did it. I don't think you'll regret putting them in. Oh, and flourescent don't get hot, just barely warm and that's what I'm choosing.

Would a recessed chandelier be more fitting to your style home?

Here is a link that might be useful: Recessed Chandeliers

This is a good question for the lighting forum! They will help you actually design your plan if you post it. They can also help with the type and wattage of lights.
I went to a lighting place(Rexell) in pennsylvania with a kitchen plan and the lighting cordinator helped with a plan. It did not cost a thing and he did not try to sell me anything. He is trained in lighting design and had good ideas about the type of lights to put in each area. My DH wanted recessed lights too, but I find that most generate a lot of heat. Am getting regular pendants and schoolhouse lights.
Good luck!

Thanks for all the good ideas -- I didn't even know there WAS a lighting forum -- how silly of me -- there is a forum for everything -- how cool is that!

Thanks for the pics and links. For my style schoolhouse lights, sconces, iron chandeliers are right. The recessed chandeliers are too Victorian for this house which is more Colonial/Federal. Not that I am searching for historically accurate (because then I would be out cooking in the yard) but I think if you like a certain style of house you gravitate to things that have a similar feel.

I'm off to the lighting forum. . .

Borngrace, what a wonderful kitchen design. Another issue that I'm thinking about now is cutting into our planned tongue and groove ceiling for recessed cans. Mistakes will have to be lived with for a long time, I think. I know that surface mounted can lights are out of fashion but I saw some in an Caribbean style show house that were surface mounted and aimed toward the white painted tongue and groove ceiling. The reflected light gave a good glow of ambient light to the room and also acted as accent lighting for the beautiful ceiling.

I know this is "out of character" for an old style home in principle but in actuality it looked great. The small white cans blended into the ceiling even when I was staring at them and most people rarely walk around staring at the ceiling. I'd be interested in hearing opinions from people who have seen or used this type of lighting. Maybe this is something for you to consider also, borngrace.

borngrace -- I love your floor plan. Can I ask the dimensions of your room(s) (main room, eating area and pantry)? What a lovely space. Sorry no clues on lighting. I haven't gotten that far just yet.

Sarschlos --
The exact measurements are not on my drawings since we are still figuring things out (how to tie into existing house without ruining lines blah blah blah)

But - rough estimate as drawn -- the kitchen (including eating area) is 20 x 22 1/2 and the pantry is 20 x 7 1/2

As drawn the cabinets are a standard 24", 4 feet aisles and island is 4 x 8.
' Just looked at fine print -- breakfast area is 7'6" x 19'8" so they have matched the breakfast area and pantry because they are slightly inset from main kitchen area and need to be balanced.

hth

Well, the lighting forum seems to have gone to sleep - not much action over there :-( Thought I would bump this up again here.

flseadog -- in our old kitchen that had the tongue and groove ceiling the electrician did cut a whole in the wrong place -- oops I don't think anyone ever noticed it (it was visible), however, I purposely had them do the ceiling to look like we had annexed an old barn as opposed to having every joint tight so it didn't scream MISTAKE they way it could have.

I have talked with architect about having some modern looking small ceiling mounted lights (maybe behind beams?) that give task lighting -- I'm just not sure . . .

OK, old kitchen, no recessed lights over the cabinets (don't know where the "ring" of recessed were) and no under cabinet lighting, and not enough light. No, it likely won't be any different if you don't do anything different. The biggest reason for recessed lights along cabinets is to light the perimeter of the room, where by the way, most of the work is done. UC lights light up the counter top all the way to the backsplash, WHERE YOU ARE WORKING. Emphasis, not yelling. :) Recessed lights with white rims in a white ceiling should not be obvious OR interfere with the look of the room. We are not talking about making swiss cheese out of the ceiling here. I put a recessed light over each upper cabinet, an UC light under each, and pendant over the sink where there is no upper cabinet. Unless you are going to put "school house lights" all over the ceiling, you will still not have light over your work surfaces around the perimeter and under upper cabinets. Maybe you have a big enough kitchen that you will never need to use the counter top areas under the upper cabinets as work spaces. You decide. You need SOMETHING over the sink, a pendant, recessed or ceiling light of some type. You decide. The smartest thing would be to have all the rough electrical for UC and recessed lights done. You can always have the holes cut in the ceiling and the lights installed later if you want. But plan for it in case you need it. I think you will.

Sue thanks for the details -- it is helping me "think"

In our old house the ring of recessed cans was probably centered in the aisles between the island and the L of cabinets. And I had a chandelier over the island. I always figured I needed to have had a pendant over sink -- but are you saying that in addition, the recessed lights should have been closer to the upper cabinets??? If so is there a "standard"?

In this kitchen (main area - not pantry) There aren't really many uppers. I have a think cabinet on either side of range and one beside fridge. Sink wall is all windows - no cabinets -- and dish hutch will prob house my cook books not be a working surface.

I'm not opposed to undercounter lighting, but I do/did have concerns about them getting hot and being more decorative rather than functional -- I'm gathering info here.

Do you think that sconces -- maybe 3 total between the 5 windows will be more decorative and not throw enough working light at the sink area????

Yes, they definately should have been closer to to the upper cabinets from what you describe. My kitchen installer marked the plan with the measurements that would make the lights center on each upper cabinet but be as close to the cabinet as possible. You want the light between you, standing at the counter, and the upper cabinet so you do not throw a shadow on the counter you are working at, which is what happens if the light is behind your head. Think of it this way, your base cabinets with counters are at least 25" deep (24" deep cabinets with 1"+ counter overhang. Your upper cabs are only 12" deep. You want the cans in that 12" space over the countertop. I had them put mine just a couple of inches beyond the upper cabinet. That way, even if I am bending my head forward or leaning over a little, none of the light is blocked and there is no shadow over the counter I am working at.
UC lights are great for lighting the area under the cabinets, where the upper cabs cast a shadow. Using both, you would be amazed at the difference in lighting, and will end up with true "task" lighting with no shadows.

I would think the areas on both sides of the range are prime work spaces that will need something.
Even without upper cabs, if the lights are behind you, you are going to be working in shadow.

Flurescent UC lights do not get hot at all. Even pucks or leds would help, although the pucks do get hot from what I understand, another reason I chose not to use them.

Sue

I have no recessed canned lighting in the kitchen, and I'm happy. We had to deal with California's Title 24 - mandating fluorescent fixtures to a certain percentage. What we have:

* Over the sink, an incandescent fixture that holds 2 60-watt bulbs.

* Over the island, a fluorescent fixture (meets the "new" requirements) that has 2 4' long bulbs. So far I haven't had to change a fluorescent bulb, so I'm relieved!!! The last fixture took the old style workroom bulbs and we were always changing them out.

* Over the counters, we have T5 fluorescent fixtures THAT I LOVE. I'm SO glad I went for undercabinet lighting!

* Over the table, a 6-bulb (60 watt each, incandescent) chandelier that is on a dimmer switch.

* The OTR MW has a light bulb, but I have yet to determine what variety. With the undercabinet lighting, I seldom turn it on!

DonnaR/CA

Every one has different amounts of lighting they feel are needed, depending on eyesight and personal preference. I first added UC fluorescent lights in my old kitchen and felt they mad a big difference. I had them hard wired this time. Because I was redoing the kitchen, it was a one time chance to add the recessed lights. Kitchen isn't done but I already like them. Neither are ABSOLUTELY necessary. If I had to choose just one, I would probably go with UC lights. But I didn't HAVE to choose just one, and didn't want to regret not taking the opportunity to add them and then wish I had. Lets face it, if you don't need a light you don't have to turn it on. If you need it and its not there you are out of luck.
UC lights I think are the most utilitarian, although they can be decorative, as well. My UC lights are hardwired fluorescents, and my recessed lights are dimmable fluorescent, so I can use them as general, task or ambient lighting.
They are not mandatory, just very nice to have.

Sue