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jterrilynn

What would you do to this investment rental kitchen?

jterrilynn
13 years ago

Hi, I can get a great deal on the this 1,500 sf 3/2 townhouse. It's in a great school district and mailing address plus close to a university. I'm thinking of buying and renting it out with the idea of possibly selling when the market turns around (could be years). The rent range is $1,100 to 1,400 a month. I don't want to spend a lot and am even thinking of keeping the countertops as they are in good decent condition. If I end up buying I will want to get it rented quickly. Maybe change out a few cabinets with ikea and do a two tone with a change of appliances? The floor tile is beige/cream. Not a lot of rental competition, 3 total with one about the same and two slightly better.

What would you do?

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Comments (47)

  • User
    13 years ago

    nothing if all the gear is in working order- this is a rental.

  • weissman
    13 years ago

    I agree with antss - you're too TKO :-)

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  • chicagoans
    13 years ago

    I'm with antss. Hard to tell from the pic, but the cabinets look decent and it looks like a nice space with good counter space, etc. As long as it's clean and everything works, looks like a quite nice kitchen for a rental, especially if there is little rental competition. I've never owned a rental property, so clearly no expert, but I'd be hard pressed to make any changes unless I got some push back or had problems renting it out. If you're considering an upgrade, you could think about doing that if you get a great renter and are coming to the end of a lease, and approach it like, "hey, we hope you stick around, and we're thinking of doing xyz as a thank you for being a great tenant." Just a thought.

  • steff_1
    13 years ago

    I agree it looks like good shape for a rental. Go ahead and list it and see where the market is. If you get negative feedback on something then fix that item.

    Wait until you are ready to sell to put money into it.

  • User
    13 years ago

    Don't do anything to it. It looks functional and clean. I would keep everything as is, until you have to replace it. My tenants have basically demolished my kraftmaid kitchen in my one property. The kitchen was a few years old when we moved. I think too many people watch hgtv in their free time. My first tenant decided to fill all the distressing holes ( that were extra) in the cabinets and slapped a not close enough matte paint over the filler. My second tenant caused 42k in damages to the property and the third tenant repainted the kraftmaid cabinets a new color. Although it looks improved, I doubt the prep was correct so it may start peeling.

    If you are lucky you may find people that take care of your property but my experiences is that most people do not.

  • remodelfla
    13 years ago

    For rent that reasonable for a 3/2 I wouldn't do much of anything. I'll be renting my home but they go for more then 2x that so I am having to do some upgrades even though it'll be a rental.

  • jakabedy
    13 years ago

    I agree with the others. Don't change a thing. Just make sure everything is in good working order and clean.

  • formerlyflorantha
    13 years ago

    Hit the Goodwill and see if you can find a few color-coordinated items to give the room a bit of life. Then give tenant permission to paint (under supervision) IF she/he signs intent to live there for 2 years.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    What do the kitchens look like in the competition? And how are you defining the competition--are there similar (not necessarily identical) apartments or townhouses, say with one more or less bedroom or 1 or 1/2 more or less baths, that rent for a little more than yours? If so, what do their kitchens look like?

    The reason I ask is that if the competition is nicer, those landlords will have their choice of tenants. You might have no problem getting a tenant, but what you want is a GOOD tenant. Someone reliable with good credit who will take care of, or at the very least not trash, your townhouse. Several of my relatives are residential landlords and I'm a commercial one, so I can tell you, a bad tenant is worse than no tenant at all.

    When my brother was starting out he tarted his apartments up really nicely--ripped up the carpets and refinished the hardwood floors underneath, painted the walls cool colors, etc.--and was swarmed with people wanting to live there, so he cherry-picked the ones with the best credit, best references, nicest personalities, most intense cat/dog allergies so they wouldn't try to sneak in a pet (haha), etc. The competition was left with the tenants my brother didn't want. That's always the approach I would recommend if you can afford it, and if you can't right now then I would still recommend socking away some of the rent you get in your first year for the purpose of tarting the place up next year. Having good tenants saves you infinite headaches, and it feels good to know that what you're offering is high quality.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    PS I'm with Florantha--at the very least, do what she suggests. Also, what's up with the broiler on that stove? It looks like the door is falling off. Can you fix that?

    Speaking of permission to paint, as Florantha was, to protect yourself against the problems Cleo2007 described, please make sure that your contract specifically says they cannot paint anything without your written permission [written can include email to make this less of a hassle], and talk about that when you're showing the place or at least when you're sitting down to ink the deal. You can talk about it in an open-minded way; I mean, you can ask them if there's anything they think they might want to paint, and say something like, "If you want to paint the room a different color I'm probably going to be fine with that, assuming you use drop cloths and so on, but I want to know up front so we can discuss it. I mean, for example, if you want to paint it a neat color that people like, that's great, but if you want it eggplant purple or something, I'm going to need to repaint when you leave and that will come out of your deposit--so we should talk before you paint so that you can decide, okay, do I want a purple room bad enough that I'm okay losing my deposit for it? So it's probably okay to repaint rooms, but we need to talk first. But painting anything else--you know, cabinets, floors, anything other than walls and ceilings--that's got to be done professionally if it's done at all, so if you want that done, don't do it yourself. Call me. I mention this because I have a friend who--" (and here you describe what happened to Cleo2007). That way you sound like you're not a total hardass, but you set down some parameters that they're more likely to remember; stuff that's written in your lease is less likely to stick in their memory than this conversation.

    My theory, and so far it hasn't been disproven, is that if a place looks bad, THAT ALONE will cause people to not take care of it. Living in an ugly place is a little depressing and people just aren't motivated to take care of it. Whereas if a place looks nice, most people--random jerks excepted--will take better care of it. Unfortunately, some people may define "taking care of it" as "sprucing up the paint job on the cabinets by themselves despite their lack of painting skills," which is why you have to have the conversation I just described.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Thank you all! I was looking at nicer more expensive town homes in a different section of my area as an investment. With this one (pictured) I needed to change my thought process a lot as far as what to do or not to do to the property. We were thinking of buying a more upscale nice area townhouse (not pictured) as a possible place to downsize to in a few years but I do not feel comfortable spending $30,000 more plus an addition $200 more on monthly maintenance fee's (even though it's a deal) on what will be a rental for now. So, I need to wrap my head around new thoughts as both my home and the town house will be sold if and when the market turns around and we will buy something with less land and upkeep.

    The rental completion: 2 has newer but cheap ugly (imo) cabinets and slightly better appliances & one is about the same. My mortgage will be cheap on this pick and I am going to hire a company to screen my tenants with credit checks and so on. I will lose the first month rent but for me it will be worth it I hope. I will not do the property management option though that includes a monthly fee.
    So, I do need to think about this pick different.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Oops! Meant to say rental competition!

  • michellemarie
    13 years ago

    I also buy foreclosures and have rental properties. Leave it! Renters are hard on stuff. As long as everything works, leave it
    You can update the property at the time you are serious about listing it.

  • kaismom
    13 years ago

    jterrylynn,
    having been a landlord for years, I sugest that you learn how to screen tenants yourself. We do not trust the rental company to do it right. They don't get paid unless the property is rented. They also do not have any real legal obligation if things don't work out. So their objective is to get it rented fast. So it is in your best interest to rent to people that will work out for you, not rented out fast. Not sure how to explain it but there is a right feel.

    We take ieagirls brother's approach to renting. We make the place "better" than the competetion. Slightly better but not TKO better! This also means that you need to continously update. Recently, a dryer died in our rental. We bought them a 'high end' W/D to replace the broken unit. It was more expensive than the cheapest out there, but the good tenants will appreciate that and stay longer knowing that they get to live in a nicer place.

    If you are in a University town, graduate students with committed stipend, medical/dental/law (professional) students are far better renters than undergrads, as you know. Even if the parents are willing to sign for their young undergrad's lease, the headache of dealing with loud tenants (to the neighbors) is not worth it to us to have such young people. Even if the grad studnts don't have the "income" on paper, they do have "resources' in student loans. Having been in that situation, I know.

    Families with little kids, even with the qualitifed income, are often "hard" on the house, in my experience. The kids are actually harder on the house than most pets.... including in my own house.

    The tenants are NOT allowed to paint. No exceptions. I don't want them to paint with cheap paint that will peel, wrong paint (bathrooms are a good example of this), paint over trim with big sloppy motion etc. They don't like it, they don't have to rent from us. If you are needing to paint anyrate, you can have the tenant pick the color (that is not too out there!) and you or your painter paints, not the tenant.

    I would swap out appliances first before swapping out the cabinets, if you really want to spruce up. You can even replace the appliances with used ones from Cragslist if they "look" good. You can even "swap" them out of your own house if you want a newer DW, new W/D etc for yourself.

    I might paint the cabs a neutral and trendy color so it stands out; ie dark grey bottom and lighter color upper that picks up the tone in the countertop only if you can do this cheaply. If you are hiring a painter, it can get expensive. If the cost of the painting is getting closer to the new cabinet/install cost, then it will be better to just replace the whole thing.

  • kaismom
    13 years ago

    The reason you replace the appliance is because by law, you have to have working appliances. So if one breaks, unless you can fix it yourself quickly, you have to get in an appliance repair man ASAP. It is quicker and cheaper to start out with new appliances that will not give you any trouble for a few years. A new DW is $300 to $500. A visit with the repairman is $200 to $300. You see the math!

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    Screening people with credit checks is a great idea--pretty much mandatory, IMHO. (Not sure it's worth a month's rent, since you can run credit and check references yourself, but that expense may be deductible anyway so it's down to what you prefer.)

    But you have to also make the people who come through those checks with flying colors WANT to live in your place. And based on your description of the competition, this place is in the bottom half rather than the top half.

    So can I suggest something really simple? What if you replaced that broken-down looking sad little range with a smoothtop? The link below is to a nice-looking GE smoothtop that you can get on AJ Madison in white for A MERE $459(!!!), or if you want to go CleanSteel (a selling point especially if you're renting to people with kids), for exactly $500. You could either go white to match the fridge, or stainless to look spiffier, with perhaps the intention of replacing the fridge with stainless whenever it dies. Put the sad-looking electric coil range on Craigslist for free to whoever will haul it, or even try $100-$200 if your perusal of other electric-coil ranges on Craigslist shows that you could get that for it. Or maybe there's a Habitat Restore or something like that in your area; they could come get it and you could take a tax deduction on it.

    Dollar for dollar, I don't think there's any other change you can make that would have that much impact. Smoothtop ranges look much better and are so much easier to clean, and you also get to tell your prospective tenants that this is a BRAND NEW RANGE. Throw on another $100 or whatever for the extended warranty, and now you have as headache-free an appliance as it is possible to have; if the tenant has a problem with the range, they can call in for warranty repairs themselves and it will be free. You don't have to handle it or pay for it at all.

    There are tons of $400-$600 smoothtop ranges on AJ Madison. I really think this change would put your place in the top half rather than the bottom, and so you would have more your pick of tenants. No prospective tenant is EVER going to visit your competition and think, "Well, I like this place, but the last place I saw had an old electric-coil range, and I love those." Hahaha! That just does not happen in this universe. But someone may well visit your competition and think, "This place looks nicer overall, but that other place had a brand new smoothtop range. It looked good and it was brand new! Yeah, that townhouse was a little boring color-wise, but he said I could probably paint the walls... Hm... I think I like that one better."

    Here is a link that might be useful: Smoothtop range for $500

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    PS: I just noticed that you have a white range hood. So, go with the white smoothtop range at the low low price of $459 or whatever, unless somehow you find a deal that includes a free hood or something.

    See the link below for more ranges like that; if it doesn't work, go to AJMadison.com, search for electric ranges, pick smoothtop and 30" as your options and then make it display them in order of price, lowest to highest. The cheapest one they have is a Frigidaire that's only $389 in white. THREE HUNDRED AND EIGHTY NINE DOLLARS for a brand-new smoothtop range! Add your extended warranty and you're still right around $500, max. There is NOTHING you can do for that little money that would have nearly as much impact on rentability as this.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Thanks for all the advice Kaismon and ideagirl!!!
    Yes I do need to screen tenets myself, I know you are right. My thought behind hiring a company was due to the fact that husband is the biggest softie in the world and I didn't want conflicts. It's funny, I sold the last two houses myself and my crazy but sweet husband would take the side of the buyer when negotiating. I had to argue with him and the buyer. Husband was too nervous always about losing the sale and was willing to cave on literally everything. On the second house I told him nothing of the negotiating until after.
    At first glance on this townhouse I was thinking of removing the top cabinets and replacing with cream/almond colored cabinets 2/ with glass doors. I would keep the bottom and countertops and replace some of the appliances. But then I would need cream/almond appliances because white would not look good with the beige/almond floor & countertops with off white/almond uppers and with stainless I'm getting into some money. Strangely, I like almond colored appliances but do not think anyone else does.
    So, perhaps I just need to get over the fact that those cabinets make me want to vomit and just do some nice but cheap new white appliances.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    Oh, you're not alone in hating the cabinets--I'm with ya on that! :-) But fixing them would cost a lot more than replacing that sad old range with a new smoothtop, unless you could do the work yourself. And if your budget means you have to choose, I would replace the range first. (Of course, if you did the background/credit checks yourself, saving a month's rent, you could probably do both.)

    That being said, I don't think your cabinets need to match the appliances. The right shade of light yellow on the cabinets would work with both white appliances (white looks great with yellow) and the beige counters/floors (beige and yellow are both warm colors). Benjamin Moore "Provence Creme" reads as yellow. Go get a bunch of yellowish/cream-ish paint chips and see how they look in your kitchen. Avoid yellows with green in them, ESPECIALLY if the kitchen has fluorescent lighting. Pure yellows and yellowish-creams are your best bet. If the counters or floors have an orange-ish cast, the yellowish-creams might work best. Just play with paint chips and samples until you find one you like.

    But god knows, unless the boxes are falling apart, you don't need to remove and replace the cabinets. You could just repaint them and the kitchen would be utterly transformed. If you wanted to spend a bit more, you could repaint them all and then replace the top doors with glass ones. Drawerbuilder.com, a.k.a. the Drawer Depot, was great to deal with when my mom refaced her cabinets, and they were amazingly inexpensive, but I don't know if they do glass doors. See link below, you can ask them.

    I repainted my mom's cabinet boxes inside and out before she refaced them, and her contractor painted the door and drawer fronts to match (Drawer Builder can send them to you unpainted/unstained--it's cheaper that way). It was not an easy job, and it required a very thorough cleaning beforehand--and in your case it will also require the right kind of primer; my mom's cabinets were painted already--but if you're at all handy, it's certainly doable and insanely cheap.

    Here is a link that might be useful: The Drawer Depot

  • Fori
    13 years ago

    Paint the walls something that doesn't look like primer. :) It's not a great photo, so maybe they look nicer. Are the cabinets real wood?

  • formerlyflorantha
    13 years ago

    REmember, you're not decorating for you, you're decorating for the generic tenant. Doesn't matter what you would love to do to decorate. Unless appliances are crummy or not working, keep them. To test: make a cake, freeze some items, keep milk fresh, wash some dishes, broil a steak, run the hood over steam and over bacon.

    If you find they're not working, replace single items with white replacements from Craig's List. Don't worry about introducing stainless as replacement for white unless you can find a whole stainless set all for sale at a good price--they are very likely being sold by someone who is upgrading and are all of the same age. White is not just for the lower classes--it's perfectly acceptable for this kitchen. As noted, much more important is being very clean and setting a standard of "this is good, this works" so that there is no physical disrespect of the place. (College students without a lot of perspective may not know how to protect things so you gotta nip disrespective behavior in the bud.) I disagree about smoothtop--again, for college students, the more bulletproof and universal, the better.

    I would also suggest giving younger renters a tutorial about each appliance--how to maximize DW use, how to keep ice cream cold at right temp, how to clean refrig, how to use hood to vent oven smells, etc. The personal touch banter shown above is not a bad idea, but I'd include a written set of mandates as well. [former teacher speaking here]

    If you want to do a pretty cheap upgrade, watch eBay for new cabinet knobs, something rather classy on the cheap. Ikea undercab lights can be daisy-chained from an outlet--no need to wire them in. A distinctive light fixture can be had in my town in the bargain room at a number of lighting stores.

    If you stage the room with placemats and matching fabric napkins, hotpads, jug of utensils, rug at door, maybe a blind (Goodwill if possible) it will set a visual precedent that may linger in renter's mind. Offer the lot for $50 or so and see if it helps keep the place good looking.

  • palimpsest
    13 years ago

    I would go for new appliances if there is any functional question about those at all--They appear to be 25 years old(?). If you wanted to go really crazy you could add some hardware to the cabinets.

    One of the large rental property owners around here paints their apartments a distinctive very pale yellow, and another paints theirs a taupe-ish color. It sets them apart from the ultracheap chalky off white you see in a lot of rentals.

  • writersblock (9b/10a)
    13 years ago

    I rented for many years and I was the most desirable tenant there is: single professional female, non-smoker, no pets, etc.

    I put up with butcherblock formica cabinets and all that sort of thing because it IS a rental. And I can tell you that my landlord still had a lot of expense with just the usual maintenance: water heater, ac needed replacing, etc. Don't stretch yourself. As long as it's clean or cleanable, even a really good tenant understands the difference between a rental and a house you own.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    I do like the idea of painted taupe-ish cabinets. However, these cabs are fake wood, sort of a picture of wood on something but not a mica. With the right treatment would paint last a year in a rental?

  • ellendi
    13 years ago

    Very, very good advise. We own rental properties too. My husband manages them. His properties are always clean, most not updated. But he usually prices a bit lower. We get better tenants because they can AFFORD to stay for the long run. When he screens them, he "reads them the riot act." "If you like to have loud parties, this is not the place for you, I run a QUIET building. Any problems, loud noise, drugs etc, the finger points to you."
    In a long distance property we give a discount in the rent so the couple can be our eyes and ears. However we have found they do not have good screening skills. We were told one woman was "very nice". When my husband met her, she was dirty, smelled of alochol and let it slip in the conversation that she lost her children in a divorce.! Motto, do your own screening. We find the humor in this story though. It goes to show you how people see things differently.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    **With the right treatment would paint last a year in a rental?**

    That's a question I would punt to the guys at your local paint store. Not Home Depot, like an actual paint store. If you can tell them what material the surfaces of your cabinets are made of--formica? Contact paper?!?--they should be able to advise you. The choice of primer would be key, as would the preparation you do before painting (you might need to "scuff up" the surfaces a bit), and of course for anything that gets this much use, and especially considering it's a wet area by nature, you would probably want semigloss paint. Maybe maybe maybe satin, but I'd be surprised. The thing with semigloss is the surface beneath has to be unmarred, because any weird texture issues or pits or whatever really show up under the sheen. But it is very durable.

    So just tell them you want the most indestructible paint you can find that will stay on X material (your cabinets) in a kitchen. In a rental. See what they say.

    And here's a weird idea... what is UNDER the surfaces of your cabinets? Could you check by, say, peeping under a corner of the tops of the cabinets? I'm just wondering whether, if it turns out your cabinet surfaces are made of teflon or something (haha), if you might actually get a better paint job by peeling it off and whacking what's under it with ten coats of paint or something. I have discovered that if you paint particle board enough times, the surface stops looking like particle board. :-)

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    **If you find they're not working, replace single items with white replacements from Craig's List.**

    Dealing with appliance breakdowns is a hassle for landlords, so I don't agree with that advice because used appliances are more likely to break down and that problem falls entirely on your shoulders. It's easier to get very cheap new appliances and then spring for the extended warranty. Then you can tell your tenants to call whoever the warranty says to call if they have problems, and for the first five years (assuming you get the five-year warranty), the cost and hassle of that is not going to fall on you.

    Also, with perfectly decent nice-looking low-end ranges going for under $400 on AJ Madison, how much are you going to save with Craigslist? Not that much. You might get a $1000 range for $350 instead of getting a $350 range for $350, but that's not much consolation if it breaks and you have to deal with a potentially freaking-out tenant and pay hundreds for the repairs. You also have to move the thing yourself on Craigslist, whereas at least AJ Madison will deliver to your driveway so all you have to deal with is getting it into your house (not out of someone else's house, into your truck, etc.). And if you find a cheap one in your local appliance store's scratch-and-dent or closeout sale, they will deliver it into your house--very handy.

    Craigslist is fabulous for furniture and for appliances for your own use, but once you're a landlord, you have two sets of appliances (or more--depending how many units you have) that are your responsibility. That multiplies the potential hassle and cost.

    Oh, PS on a different subject: whatever color you decide on for the walls, it would look much better if you took off the outlet covers and painted them to match. The eye goes straight to them right now... and the eye is not rewarded by the sight. :-)
    And make sure you use at least eggshell and maybe ideally satin for the walls, not flat paint... this is a kitchen after all, and a rental one to boot.

  • riosamba
    13 years ago

    My family has owned rentals since the 60s and we have had exactly two problem tenants in all of that time, both of them chosen by property managers. All of the tenants screened by my grandparents/parents/myself have been problem free- rent always paid, good communication, nothing beyond normal wear and tear, tenants that stayed many years & often became friends. We just look for people that impress us as being respectful and kind and have great references.

    I think when the property looks nice and has decent, functional appliances it attracts people who want to have a nice home, and who will care for the property. That is why I think it is also a mistake not to allow painting- just require prior approval. My mother actually buys the paint if the tenants want to paint and the unit needs it.

    We also underprice just a bit. We get loads of applicants and can be choosy.

    So what does all of that mean for your kitchen? Think about the kind of tenant you would most like to have and decorate/update with them in mind. Grad students may be happy with clean and functional, young professionals or families might look for something a little more- but keep the budget in mind. Best of luck to you!

  • steff_1
    13 years ago

    It's really hard to get paint to stick on a plastic or formica cabinet. Even with oil primer the paint will just peel right off. I've seen a newer primer that's made for laminate but I've never tried it.

    We had rental properties for many years and it's really hard to pick a good tenant. Sometimes the ones you think will be great turn out the worst. Doing a few updates might help upgrade the type of tenant you attract but there are no guarantees. Property managers are not really worth the cost because they can't do much if the tenant quits paying, skips out or trashes the place. They just call you and let you know what happened so you can deal with it. List with a realtor, but do the rest yourself.

    Look into a home warranty policy. For about $400 a year you can have someone to call when something breaks down.

    Get a new range with a guarantee and delivery. We got a smooth top stainless steel range for a flip house last year from Sears for $405 with free delivery during one of their special online sales. Completely worth it.

  • lazy_gardens
    13 years ago

    Speaking as an experienced landlord ... I would thoroughly clean it, make sure everything works, paint it a neutral grey or beige, and rent it out. Period.

    I always bought used appliances from a local dealer with a good reputation for refurbishing them.

  • calimama
    13 years ago

    having been a landlord and a tenant, I agree with most posters that you don't need to do a lot of improvement. It doesn't matter who you rent to: things break, carpets wear out and walls need painting. If you are dead set on changes, I wouldn't recommend glass cabinet doors, as there is breakage potential and not everyone has nice stuff to display.

    Put your money in things that protect all and your investment, i.e. extra smoke alarms, programmable thermostats, good locks, automatic sprinklers, etc.

    Good luck!!

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    You have all given me much to think about. Our realtor bought a townhouse in the same development and he will not rent to college students because of the turn over and a month or two here and there with the place vacant while repairing and finding new renters. He sticks with families with young children because they do not want to move often and change schools. Another friend will only rent to people over 50, I'm in Florida so lots of over 50's. I do think I will take the graduate student over an undergrad. I would allow a pet less than 25 lbs with a middle aged couple without children but not college students or young families because pets are often not trained properly if at all. I do not want them to paint, if it needs a touch up I will do it, most people do not know how to paint right. I will do a background/credit check but I can see a problem in the credit area here due to all the people that have lost their properties. References, yes! I want cleanliness which is a hard thing to judge as I have known many women with immaculate appearances who are piggys at home. A peek in their car might give me an idea although my car is not spotless but my house very clean. The type of person I would like to rent to would also hate the kitchen, so there lays my dilemma. If I buy it I will take a door to my Benjamin Moore paint store and get an idea on paint and paint longevity. If painting seems like it would be a big upkeep I will skip it and just get some new appliances.

  • bostonpam
    13 years ago

    Don't paint the cabinets with tenants. They are so hard on things. Also, if you can help it don't take college students (under grads). They are really rough and are stupid when it comes to renting (1st time living on their own). I had 4 girls living in one apt and they called to tell me their light bulb was out. "So?! Go to CVS and get a replacement." A few weeks later I was talking to the boys upstairs and they wouldn't go down to the girls apt because "they have a rat living in their oven. The girls named it and it would come and go whenever he wanted." I got NO call on that one from the girls. (It was a mouse and we got rid of him/them very quickly).

    I get great rents here but the undergrads can be slobs and it's a lot of work on my part. I also have to repair multiple holes in walls (fists, feet, body, etc.) every year. Here's a "good" picture of one of the kitchens (I cleaned it a bit to stage it) - I have this apt up on craigslist right now - 5 bed, 2 bath for $3300/month starting 9/1.

    I think pricing your apt a little lower than everyone else helps you get the pick of tenants. I have much nicer apts and do this all the time. I can rent it immediately and my tenants usually stay for years if not decades. The key is to get good tenants. At my other 2 family I get a phone call twice a year. "Just calling to let you know that the 1st floor furance blew, we stopped the water, took our wet vacs and cleaned everything up. Found out it was a gasket, replaced it (had one in my toolbox) and everything is OK. You may want a HVAC guy to check it out on Mon when the rates are cheaper. First floor now has heat." Love these tenants. Good luck.

  • palimpsest
    13 years ago

    As a serial renovator and someone who is very picky about my own house and the quality of things, I did not care as much about the appearance of the kitchens and baths in places I have rented nearly as much as the functionality and whether or not it was easy to keep clean, things like that. I would much rather have that kitchen with its dark melamine faced cabinets intact than a surface that was painted over, possibly continually "sticky", and not that easy to keep clean or that peeled off.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    It is totally true about renting to undergrads, but you have to watch it with demographic preferences like that. It could create legal issues. Rather than stating those preferences in the ad, you can target your ad by posting it in the local law school/med school/business school etc., and not post it in any areas that undergrads frequent.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    How do you all advertise your places for rent?

  • bostonpam
    13 years ago

    craigslist.com and it's free. Better quality perspective tenants AND it's free (compared to the Boston Globe).

  • cindaintx
    13 years ago

    When I looked at the photos, my first thought was that Home and Garden show where they re-do basement apartments in Canada for rentals (and usually spend a bunch) - but the lessons I learned were: 1. staging - set it up to look nice for photos or visits 2. have something new (stove in your case) 3. Paint walls and clean carpets before showing. 4. Staging some more!

    Personally, I would replace counters before cabinets... It's cheaper (lots of granites are now below all other choices other than laminate) and renters notice surfaces more than cabinets. Oooooh, they have granite ! My son has rented 4 different spots in the last 5 years... all have had granite counters, all rented for under $1000/month.

    I have a friend with many rentals. He says there are two groups to be wary of - undergrads and lawyers. Your milage may vary....

  • janralix
    13 years ago

    As an apartment landlord (multiple units) for 24 years, I have learned you must keep up with the competition if you want competitive rents, so it's up to you to decide where you want to be on the rental scale. Nicer units bring not only higher rents but also a higher class of tenant, and the latter CANNOT be overemphasized! In my experience, by far the best screening method is a credit check, because RARELY will someone with bad credit be a good tenant, and USUALLY someone with good credit will be a good tenant. Of course, and this goes without saying (but I'll say it anyway), a tenant should have an income sufficient to pay the rent (one week's pay equals a month's rent is my standard). As for the condition of the unit, at a minimum I repaint (rarely does a touch-up suffice), have the carpet professionally steam-cleaned, make sure everything is in good working order, and CLEAN, CLEAN, CLEAN! It never ceases to amaze me when a prospective tenant walks in to look and the first thing they say is "Wow, this is really nice and clean compared to what I've been seeing!". This comment is also a clue that a person who appreciates a clean unit wants a clean unit, and is apt to keep it that way. Updated appliances are, in my experience, much more important to a tenant than newer cabinetry and countertops (and it's also much cheaper on the landlord), as long as the cabinetry is not beat-up, broken, etc. I've probably given you more information than you wanted, but the bottom line is to get the best tenants you possibly can for the longest possible time, and to do that you need to run credit checks and present the unit in the best possible light. As for students: avoid them at all costs, unless you're almost exclusively in the student market. They're generally (a) hell on wheels and (b) hell on an apartment, and the very last thing you need is a tenant that causes other tenants to be calling the police or, worse yet (if you have multiple contiguous units), move out.

  • bigdoglover
    13 years ago

    What an interesting discussion! My perspective is as a good tenant. DH and I rented for quite awhile before buying, and in several locations, and we were very desirable tenants. I loved my home and didn't think of it as a rental, but as my own while I was renting it, and we always beautified it to the best of our ability, with the LL's permission. We were very young so my taste then was not as developed as it is now, so I tend to agree with those who have said don't do a lot to this kitchen. I would put nice knobs on the cabinets, change the switch plates to beige, make sure the appliances aren't crummy (that's a big ugh for a nice clean renter), keep the formica unless it is chipped or otherwise compromised, and give everything a nice fresh coat of paint in a nice warm beige that will complement the rest of the house. Not stark white please, that is so impersonal.

    The floor is not showing. How is it? Ugly beat up old floors is another turn-off.

  • Adrienne2011
    13 years ago

    We own one rental house, and things can really get ugly. Our first tenant trashed the house, so my husband had to spend a few months fixing everything in his spare time. Our second tenant lived there a few years and was just disgustingly filthy. They never seemed to clean ANYTHING. You will be investing your time and money into this in some fashion, so I would save that for when it must be done. It can get VERY tiresome and frustrating to have to clean and repair a house every couple years (or months). More importantly is a properly written lease agreement. THAT is the thing that many first time landlords may not spend enough time on.

  • lascatx
    13 years ago

    I wouldn't do much. Make sure all appliances are in good working order and replace if needed. As for the cabinets, have you seen cabinets where they use inexpensive trim you can buy at Home Depot -- like a flat, minimalistic baseboard trim, and frame the doors of the cabinets, then paint to give a classic look at little cost. You need a miter saw (could rent one for a day) and the show I saw used something like liquid nails and glued them on -- then the right prep and paint to go on the surface of the cabinets. If you can DIY, that would be a worthwhile project, but I doubt I'd put the money into it to have someone else do it.

  • mabeldingeldine_gw
    13 years ago

    I was a landlord in my previous life. IMO, ideagirl and Kaismom gave you great suggestions. In my experience, it paid for itself to do my own very careful screening (most of the screening was disguised as friendly conversation) and thorough credit and reference checks. Only the best references were accepted.

    I also very carefully had slightly nicer appliances than the competition, and made sure each apartment was spotless for the new tenant. I also let each tenant know I expected the place to be spotless when they left. I once left a place vacant for 3 months (my longest vacancy) until I found a good tenant.

    I ended up with mostly long term renters, one for as long as 8 years and to whom I eventually sold the building. My shortest renter was there for 3 years and cried when she came to tell me she was moving out --to get married!

    I also agree with a previous poster than families are much harder on rental units. I converted a 3 BR to a 2 BR for that reason.

    I reiterate that in my experience it paid to have slightly nicer apartments and to be somewhat "visible" to tenants. I never had to evict a tenant, nor had much damage to repair.

  • pricklypearcactus
    13 years ago

    I have never been a landlord, but the kitchen looks pretty nice for a rental. IF I was going to do anything, I might add some hardware and paint the walls a color deeper than the appliances/countertops. The bright white seems to make the off-white appliances and counter look a little dirty. Otherwise, it looks great for a rental. At some point, you might look for nice used appliances, but there's nothing wrong with the ones there now.

  • ideagirl2
    13 years ago

    Great point about the stark white walls making everything that's off-white look a little dirty. Stark white walls are a total turnoff for me and I think for a lot of people. If you paint the walls a cream or or light yellow or warm beige, and replace the appliances with white, it will look 10x brighter in there.

  • jterrilynn
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Thank you so so much everyone! Let's hope one of these deals come into fruitation. One unite has mysteriously disappeared, one is 90% sold. The one we were interested had a dog and entrance was dodgy. The investors from other countries are out in swarms with a million on the table buying low for cash from the banks. Many have not done their Florida research and are buying in bad zips, bad schools and problematic low-end renter's area. However, some are getting good advice and are creeping in to my little corner. If it's meant to be it's meant to be, keeping my figures crossed but will not lose sleep over it.
    terri

  • gsciencechick
    13 years ago

    Good luck! If it's a larger university, they may have an off-campus housing office where you can list your unit. That way you can focus on grad/professional students. Grad students tend to want to live by themselves or they are with a spouse/partner.

    I owned a townhouse in a college town that was a middle unit next to a rental unit with students. I never had problems with underfrads--ever. One bunch was in a band and limited their practice to late afternoons only. OTOH, the unit on the other side of me with non-students had some really sketchy tenants with loud parties, etc. So, no, not all undergrads are a disaster.

    Another place you can try for inexpensive appliances is Sears Outlet if you have one near you. They even have bisque, lol.