The forum is suppose to be a friendly, supportive & fun place. Some people just don't know how to have a good time without causing trouble. When I see a thread heading that way I try to stay out. Don't get your feelings hurt and leave, just don't say anything to get someone started.
Some boards have a button to report a bad thread. I think we could use that here.

Without being critical, I too feel the KT forum has changed over the years. Some of the people have left for various reasons and I do miss them. Yes we have a very few that are a bit more aggressive, but in reality the world itself has changed with the media putting out too much negative reporting. There are many times I type out an answer and then delete it. I agree with Joann, sometimes it is very hard to not post, but that is really the best way to go. I really do not know what the answer is.

Nice post. Stroll on BY is a very good thing to practice. Where ARE those funny funny 'old timers'. Nanny

I think most of them are in the "Empty Chairs"

I have seen a huge change in the KT over the past year or so. I post less because of it.

I think the posts that get out of hand are the ones where a poster is complaining about something or someone. Rosemary was complaining about the way she was treated, I had complained about a ugly treehouse and an unfair room mate. It's sad when we can't come here and say what's on our mind without getting scolded and called names.

I guess I'll just keep posting birthday wishes, American Idol updates and the occasional picture of a decorating project. lol Sadly, I don't think we'll ever get back to the old fun KT.

When I first came here ten years ago, it was bad. The recent stuff was Mary Poppins compared to back then. Back then, you could post as an 'anon'. In one thread, you could be all nice and sweet as yourself, then log out and come back as an anon and be nasty as ever. The trolls ran the board.

I'm a believer in "if you don't want an opinion, don't ask for one". You have to be able to accept the good with the bad. I used to agree with people here just to keep the peace. I no longer do that, both here and in my actual life. I also think that when a person leaves (I've done the same myself) because people don't agree with you, or call you out on something, it's your choice. Nobody can make anyone leave unless they want to.

I honestly believe this place is MUCH better than it used to be. But I also believe firmly, you should be able to say what you mean without people jumping all over you. Sometimes people don't read in the tone it was written. Does that make sense? The write could be just trying to make a point, and the reader will take it as being 'attacked'. That's when the wars start.

Just remember: most of us will never meet. We're letters on a white background. That's it. And never be afraid to say what's on your mind. We don't have to like it. But we also don't have to rebuttle......

Peace! :-)

debby ab - I haven't been here that long and never knew about posting as an 'anon' - I can easily see how that could get out of hand. I've peeked in at the Hot Topics forum but it seems those posts can get nasty quickly.

I do miss some of the posters who have left and I think it's a shame because the majority here seem to get along and it's too bad when someone leaves because of a few individuals.

Yes, it saddens me that things become out of hand here, and I do miss the old timers. It would be nice to express our opinions without getting all in a tizzy, but that will never happen, I fear. So many times, I start to answer a post but then don't send it, for fear of starting a ruckus. No, it is not the same as it was twelve years ago when I first came here.

I guess, I must have missed something or maybe this post is just a general observation. There have been some discussions that got too lively, but I don't see anything wrong with people expressing their views (politics and religion being the exception) and others answering with theirs.......as long as it doesn't get personal....like, that's dumb or your stupid. But we are adults and many are going to have a difference of opinion on subjects. I agree with Debby, if a person leaves, that's sad, but it's their choice. personally, no one has that kind of control over me.

I enjoyed the KT, and was more active in the beginning, but quickly got cut down by "them".
I think a lot of us have at some time or another been attacked by the attackers and then either left or quit posting at the KT for a while.

Just like in 'real life' there are going to be 'some' who are more outspoken, often to the point of being callous and rude. There are going to be those who seem to make a habit of twisting one's words. There will be those that don't understand or don't 'get it' about a post, and then try to convince others that their way of thinking is the one and only 'right' way of thinking. There will be those that can turn a thread about 'someone's' ball gown into a political rant, and then see nothing wrong with what they said and scream that the have the right to Freedom of Speech' almost as if the Forum Rules don't apply to them.

Here, just as in real life, there are going to be 'positive' folks, just as there are 'negative' folks.
There are going to be those that are almost always pleasant and have something 'nice' to add, and then there is going to be those that seldom, ever have anything 'nice' to add.

There are going to be those that understand, and then those who just don't understand, (don't get it) and then want to argue.

I choose to surround myself in real life with pleasant people, who can always see both side of a situation, but can do so in a nice or even complimentary way.

Believe it or not, there are a lot of posts that I tend to just scroll on by, but occasionally I just have to take a stand when I see someone being bashed.

End of rant.

I read all the posts. I enjoy the KT and like to see what's happening.

Sometimes things get confrontational, and sometimes people's words are misconstrued. No one is always right and no one is always wrong.

I've been hit on and get ticked for a while, but I always come back.....that's not to say others are wrong, for not coming back. But I wish they would......

It shouldn't be a wishy-washy forum where everything is daisies. Of course we all want the birthday wishes, and good thoughts for illness, and congratulations for a new baby, puppy or job. But there's no reason we can't post something that makes one think, or creates a discussion showing both sides.
I enjoy those posts, and often see a different point of view, that I wouldn't have otherwise, had someone not mentioned it.

It does sometimes escalate into a tirade, but not that often, I believe. There were some posters who deliberately posted just to raise everyone's ire, and succeeded, but thankfully I don't see them here anymore. One was very recent.

Anyway, I would like to think that we should all feel comfortable in posting, whether it causes a ruckus or not. If it does cause a ruckus, when it shouldn't, then don't rise to the bait or just ignore the poster. But don't *not* post, just in case, please. We need variety here, and I love a lively discussion as much as anyone.

I agree with jasdip.

Also, I've been here a long time and it WAS different. But it's evolved, as life itself does. Things are never the same as they used to be. I get tired of people saying how wonderful it was here in the old days. Things change over time and dynamics are just that - dynamic. As with life, I think that focusing on how great things used to be sometimes interferes with growing and enjoying what it is now.

Some day these will be "the good old days".

Suzieque

I've been here, off and on, since Day One. It's always ebbed and flowed, and people have left, people have returned, people try to cajole others to stay (who are undoubtedly lurking & reading all the "kind" words), etc.

It's just an Internet forum, people.

You don't know me. I don't know you. I'm a screen name.

That said, I have met a few people from here - and other boards - in real life.

All I can say is that the art of insult is definitely a thing of the past. My dad had a sister and you wouldn't know that she had f'd you off until after you had left. And this is after you hugged and kissed her goodbye.

She seldom was nasty and cursed, but she opened your eyes.

Just post around them. In other words, don't respond to those who are irritating you in your thread and walk away if you have to. That way you both think you've "won".

Words are a "double edged sword". If one believes that the good wishes and prayers help our friends cope with what is happening in their life....How does one just let the hurtful words roll off one;s back?

It seems to me that readers could err on the positive side when responding to a post.... at least until one is certain they understand the subject as the poster meant it. Just a thought. Nanny

I got my feelings hurt once, maybe 2 years ago, when someone of "them" posted something that upset me. I stayed away for about 3 weeks, but found myself missing all the regulars, so I came back, with my tail tween my legs, and jumped right back in. I guess I'm a "lifer." Until I get too old to type or my keyboard breaks...

I wonder who "they" or "them" ....are?
Do "they" or "them" know that they are, in fact, "they" or "them"??
I mean, maybe you are talking about ME being a "they" or "them", but I'm not sure?
Perhaps "they" or "them" could step up to the plate & identify themselves, so we would all know who "they" or "them" are.
Maybe one poster's "they" or "them" is different from another poster's "they" or "them".... then what do we do?
Does one instance of ticking one person off qualify one to now be labeled as a "they" or "them"? or does it take multiple instances??

I do know for a FACT that some of the old, long ago "they" or "them" (that anyone would recognize back then) have left lonnnnnggggg ago, never to be seen again.

I really would like to know who the current "they" or "them" are. I came here in about May 1999 & was an active poster for years, then inactive for years, not real active now, but I think I was Bee back then. Some of the current people who say they were here @ the turn of the century must have had different names. I do know of one under a different screen name, but others names ring no bells.

/rambling

They & them are different people to different people.
Let's just not get bothered by they's & them's an all will be fine. Let's all get along.

If we all take up the saying "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all" things will work out.

Now if an opinion is asked, then I'd say they asked for your opinion.

I like jasdip's reply. Stuff happens, and I don't think KT is going down the drain at all. It's still a great group of people. But it's an open forum, so we will have a mixture members.

Like Jannie, I got irked once and left for a few weeks, but then I missed everyone and came back. Actually, someone from KT emailed me to ask where I went, and it really made me feel good. (Thanks to her, if she's reading.) I guess it's like family, sometimes you just need a break.

I don't mind different opinions, but MEAN-NESS and NAME-CALLING, we just cannot tolerate that.

I've been on the Internet daily, on many different boards, since 1996. The kind of behavior you see here is no different than behavior on any other board. People are people everywhere...some are nice, some are outspoken, some are argumentative.

I wouldn't take any of it personally, just scroll on by if something upsets you.

I know that's easier said than done sometimes.

Seriously? :) This has got to be the niciest nice board I've ever attended.

You should try being a member of a "therapists only" board. Wow. The passive aggressive, egotistical, tear you apart content there would have you in the corner in the fetal position in five seconds.

Nope, this place is like an angel luncheon. :)

I was on Gardenweb years ago, dropped out when he started charging. But I found it again years later. I do not remember my screen name back then. I was not very active, mostly a lurker. Back then I mostly read the Home Decor, Organizing and Pet forums, did not discover KT until a few years ago.
I too got my feelings hurt by some harsh criticism a few times. Even now, I am sometimes hesitant to post, I usually don't feel I have anything useful to add.

But I have received some wonderful advice, and found, for the most part, the members here to be kind and caring. I was so surprised, and tickled, the first time I got happy birthday wishes!! You could have knocked me over with a feather!

So, I will stick around, and hope you all do too. I just got back from a two week vacation and the first thing I did was check KT to see what has been going on. I know I will never meet any of you IRL, but it is fun to 'know' you online.

I have been here awhile as well..off and on since 2002, I think. At first I was a lurker mostly, and now I read most every day but post only when the subject interests me. Maybe I miss a lot by not reading every thread. By and large the people here are pretty nice, I think. If I want to get into something controversial, I go to HT.

beeohio, I think I went by either Cleo or Cleo199, or even Cleo199ca or was it cleo199ab?

I decided to change my name to my real name when I came back after we no longer had to pay (I refused to pay to use a message board which I why I left the first time).

As for who "they" or "them" are, I wish people would just come out and say who they believe those people are. If "they" or "them" are those who speak their own minds, then I'm one of them. Or they... hehehe

They are the ones that attack and bully posters.

They are the ones that copy and paste and quote and research trying to prove someone is lying. You know like when firemaswife was run out of town.

I always wondered when someone nice like Rosemary leaves, What? Mission accomplished? Smug cyber high fives all around?

They know who they are and love it. They call it lively and interesting. I call it childish and bullying.

Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion. State it and move on. Some keep coming back just to fuel the fire.

Bait thread? Ok I posted my opinion and will not came back to respond.

I have been "tee't off too. But I met so many of the people that were active between 2000 and 2010. Lots and lots of super nice people. Of course, I never felt attached by any of them. I joined here, when it was a pay forum.

I stay, cause of the fact that I know some, and I like reading what most have to say. I use the SOB option on several threads, that just don't interest me.

Right now, you all seem like a lifeline to me. I am glad to "know" all of you.

Moni

Well said chloecat. I know some of you have formed friendships and have personally met. That's great and I've enjoyed all the stories and pictures posted from those visits, but, most of us are just screen names. I was a lurker for many years before I became a joiner. If someone doesn't agree with me, I DON'T CARE! I'm not going to get all bent out of shape because "mary from mars" shows his/her ignorance and calls me a poopy head. This forum would be very boring if we all agreed on everything.

Internet conversations are much different than "real" life conversations are. You have to be soooo very careful what you say. I have two friends (neighbors) that told me about the KT...at that time I was too busy to post, but I have since retired. When I told one of my neighbors/friends that I was going to join the Gardenweb and then KT, she said she no longer posted here because of something that went on here that I will NOT discuss without her permission. I joined anyway, but do not post often, and am very careful of what I say. I try not to be controversial, and never intend to hurt anyone. What went on before I joined, I am not a privy to and feel bad for the ones who left. There will always and forever more be cybernet bullies, unfortunately!

Dad used to say, "When you get kicked by a jackass ...

... consider where it comes from!".

I agree.

I've seldom been carped at - but when it happens, I give some thought as to the validity of it, and alter my ways some if I feel that to be indicated. Or if others whose judgement I respect agree.

It is not my desire to hurt people or cut them down, and if I may have done so, if I find out about it, I apologize.

What kind of satisfaction does someone get from kicking others in the shins?

But I'm to be in charge of my life ... and it'd take a heck of a lot for someone to run me off of here, when I enjoy it.

Why let someone stop me having fun?

And for those of you who are in contact with some who have left - tell them to come on back and join in the fun. Many of us have missed the contributions of many of the folks who have left, and would like them to come back.

ole joyful

The best thing to do is when the ones who never have anything to do with the KT other than being nasty...
is just not reply to them.

I've said that over and over again...they'd go away if they couldn't get a rise out of us. They seem to live for that...(must not have much of a life)

But I also remember the fun between members...Dot and our resident cuban...they were so funny together. I imagine they are still at it (in another place and time now)

Brat Kat and Murphy were always entertaining. I miss Murphy
Don't know why she left...she just kind of faded out.
Brat...did you scare her off???? 8)

Ya Ya.....your chair is still open and waiting for you to come back...as is Buzzard's...where are all you rebel rousers????

Lot of others too...your chairs are all here and need to to have a butt dusting....

patti

I think a "perhaps" "maybe" "what if" etc can go a lot farther than a down and out condemnation of an act or of something someone says.
Just like "Please" and Thank You " still hold true even in today's world

I have been coming to the Garden Web site since the early '90s. I frequented two other threads in the early years here, but now I just come here mostly. I think a lot of people don't understand how strong written words can seem. And I do feel the anonimity that the internet allows leads others to take advantage and behave on message boards as if they are into a combative blood sport.

For the most part, I consider the people here to be kind and supportive. If I have a question about something, I know that someone here will have the answer for me if I ask.

I am sure that I am one of "them"......and that doesn't bother me one bit.......If a person cannot take criticism or handle a response different from the one they want, then they shouldn't be playing on a bulletin board. I have always been outspoken and refuse to be a ditto to all the responses made by people who just want to go along with the crowd, don't want to start something so they just give the expected answer. I know at least two who answered on this thread that never seem them to have trouble speaking their mind either.

Everyone talks about the old KT.....and how nice it was...no it wasn't nice.....everyone was afraid to say anything that wasn't all smiles and hugs and kisses. If the least bit of criticism occurred people ran off sucking their thumbs but only after a long drawn out good bye post telling everyone how terrible they are. If you post something stupid, there actually are a few people that will tell you it's stupid. One story I remember is a woman was pissed at her husband so she took the credit cards and ran them up to the nth degree and bragged about it..The responses she got at the KT...yea right on.....you go girl...that will teach him........well I'm here to tell you, that wasn't my answer nor the answer from my sista's......but the typical answer.....The KT now may have people who over do it, but at least the answers are honest...You may not like the answers but maybe they are actually more honest than what you just posted....

I've found, everything in life follows one rule-there are more good people than bad people. One example, 30- some crazed terrorists brought down planes, the World Trade Center Towers, and part of the Pentagon. Yet thousands and thousands rushed in to help the victims. More bad than good. We did a Christmas card exchange this past December. I got many lovely cards. And when my Mom died in January, someone who had my address from the card exchange sent me a lovely sympathy card. That more than makes up for the snarky person who criticized me on KT two years ago.And I won't tell the name of the person who reached out when Mom died. She knows who she is and everyone else can just guess.

LOL Ruthie, you can add my name to your post. I'm probably one of "them" too. I generally don't mince words.

I don't post a lot of "positive" comments because frankly, I'm not here for social networking and to be liked. I have neither the time nor the inclination to add another "you go girl" reply to a thread that's already collecting them, just so I can be counted in as supportive.

I am usually moved to post when I can add information or I feel strongly enough about a post to make the point.

As someone commented above, many of the complaining/whining threads will prompt more negative responses simply because some complaints are either just too petty, too repetitive or too unreasonable to let pass (and yes, I remember that credit card post well - OMG).

Fortunately, when a post begs a sanity check there are some who are honest enough to challenge it, and not be intimidated to do so. You know, once in a while that just might be more helpful than adding another unconditional "supportive" comment to the chorus.

As for the drama of the "Goodbye Cruel Forum" posts - ehhh. I see them on every board - they usually come back.

Well said Jasdip.

If a person cannot take criticism or handle a response different from the one they want, then they shouldn't be playing on a bulletin board

Exactly.

I am sure that I am one of "them" also to some. I like to learn. I don't lie. I like to think and I like to hear what others think.

My "them" are the nicey nice ones who are all about themselves. It is m not my job to give gold stars and ribbons out everyday and tell everyone how wonderful they are. Self-esteem must be earned. Same with respect. It's not free no matter what mommy taught some. So I just SOB.

I've definitely been one of "them" before and so long as people are respectful and are willing to state their opinions or questions politely, I see no reason not to be contrary. Sometimes I will have a strong belief one way and then when "they" come along and stir the pot, it can really open my mind or heart. (Or not, LOL!) I don't see any reason to be rude about it though and some of "them" can be. And no matter how polite you can be in questioning someone, there will invariably be a truckload of people who take complete offense.

I too only add to a post once in a while. I used to post a lot and when I had more time. Now I just Facebook and pop in there and post something silly and pop out. That's what the KT used to be like, but times and technology change things.

Blessings,
Haley

Wildchild is right too they usually do come back and you can bet your bottom dollar that they are around reading all the threads looking for people who are saying Oh poor so and so, she was so sweet, she was so smart, she didnt deserve that blah blah blah........ Those who leave, likely have done it more than once......It's a silly game they play. Poor little me......