The post for free pickup above should have save HAVE. Sorry, Pat

It's funny, I thought I recognized that turquoise blue..we were just in the caribbean and the water's the same color when the sky reflects off the white sand.. That is a really great photo.

I kind of have a different take on this post. Alot of parents raise their kids to be their whole life. They throw themselves into their children so much that sometimes the children end up becoming the more dominate personality. These parents have no interests of their own and probably don't even know what to do with themselves when their children aren't there. This happens a lot with children of divorce because of a competition element that presents itself, or maybe even because one or both of the parents are emotionally messed up and the child(ren) feel they have to protect their parent(s). Here are two examples: #1 - A very dear friend of mine who's son and my son are very close friends. She still sleeps in the same bed with her 9-1/2 y/o and her 7 y/o. Almost every night they guilt her into sleeping with them. She hasn't slept in the same bed with her husband in almost 10 years! If DS wants to sleep over with her DS, they have to do it over there because my friend doesn't allow sleepovers away from their home. I had a party for DS and she insisted on sleeping over with him. That wasn't a problem. The problem was that because she always has her kids with her, I HAD to include her daughter in this all-boy birthday party and sleepover. It is my opinion that she uses her kids as a sheild so she doesn't have to deal with her very real marriage issues (alcoholism, infidelity, extreme debt, and more). #2 - My sister. My niece is accustumed to having access to everything and everybody. If there is a closed door in the house, like say I went to the restroom, she will bang on it until I come out or open the door. Not that she wants what is on the other side of the door. She just wants to have access whenever she wants. If she doesn't get her way, she will scream bloody murder until my sister thinks she's having an asthma attack (never even been diagnosed with asthma) and picks her up and cuddles her until it's over. It's very plain to see who has the more dominate personality. So when these children grow up, roles tend to be reversed. The children EXPECT the parents to answer to them and the parents feel obligated to inform the children of everything. I see this in real life with my brother-in-law. His mother informs him of EVERYTHING and he is in the Navy living 1,000 miles away with a family of his own. My BIL, on the other hand, gets mad if he finds out the tiniest little thing that happens and she didn't tell him. If this is the dynamic of a family, anyone who marries into it should work within the dynamic and then raise their own children differently, if they so choose. It's like playing two ballgames at once. It will be hard, but that's why the poster on the birthday thread is having such a hard time. In my own relationship with my parents, we are not like that. My mom had emergency surgery to remove her gall bladder and no one told me until my aunt called from Arizona to tell me. I was a little miffed, seeing as it was and emergency procedure with the risk pof infection, but still it is THEIR business and does not effect me in any way. I am the only relative living anywhere close to them and all I expect is to be informed if I need to help in any way (feed animals, pick up mail, watch house) or if it's life-threatening (my father's heartattack in May of last year when my mom was 2 hours away and I was 20 minutes away). To me, they are adults and they deserve to make their own decisions independent of me, just as I expect of them.

What a glorious harvest that you have! That's a huge tomato ... do the extra large ones like that taste as good as the regular-sized ones? Pictures just a tiny bit hung over the right edge ... but when I slid the slider across ... I got an ad ... so I only did it once. Last year I took a dozen or so ears of corn to the churches on one Sunday, and figured that there'd be a great harvest the next week. There were dozens of ears ... strewn on the ground ... with a bit chewed on each. I made the mistake of counting - 12 dozen! Corn out in tassel, this year ... should ask the landlord if he has a gun that I can borrow to cramp the coons' syle. Beans something of a disappointment - got a few two weeks ago, some last weekend, but noticed that there were few flowers, and not many ripening now. Last year I had large pickings for about three weeks. Maybe the lack of rain (after an overabundance in the spring) may be the main reason. Looks like a good crop of tomatoes coming. I may be fairly well preserved in body ... but not in the canning line ... but I freeze some beans, peas, etc. Oh - the peas were a disappointment - planted a fairly large number, but only about a half dozen plants deigned to make an appearance. Good wishes for a bountiful winter. ole joyful P.S. Jes wonderin' ... how many babboon's a$$es you son may have seen, for comparison purposes?? o j