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babs711_gw

Wood island countertop people...more questions (sorry!!)

babs711
12 years ago

OK. Now that we've finally started our build and I'm working with cabinet people, I started with getting online quotes for our roughly 60x90 island top. I'd like either flat or edge grain (not end grain) walnut or cherry with a simple 1/8 or 1/4 eased edge).

Oh my goodness! Grothouse quoted me around $5200 plus delivery. That's like $137 per square foot! Another online vendor quoted around $3700 which is around $100. And these are without installation. I tried to look at John Boos online prices and guesstimate. He may be the most reasonable. There's only one local place to get his products from.

Last week when I mentioned wood to a cabinet person, they said the few houses they've seen it in, the countertops weren't wearing well over time.

Those of you who did wood. Where did you source it from?

How is the finish wearing?

Was the cost higher or lower per square foot than your perimeter countertops?

Who did the install?

I guess I'm trying to figure out if it's normal for wood to be a budget buster. My vision is marble on the perimeter and a wood island. But now I'm wondering if we may end up with marble or granite on the perimeter with granite or quartz on the island because of cost. I just wasn't prepared for wood to be double the price of stone!

Thank you again. I know I've asked other questions in the past. But now that we're closer and I've looked at the cost, more questions came up. I appreciate your help!

Comments (27)

  • alexisls
    12 years ago

    Since you want a simple edge profile, you might want to consider Craft Art DIY butcherblock. It comes with a 1/8 eased edge and one coat of Waterlox, you do the additional 4 coats. The black walnut edge grain is about $30 per square foot - they also have cherry and other wood styles.

    I did the finish on mine (countertops) myself and am very happy with the result. We've had them for a couple months now and liquid just beads up on the surface - even if it has sat for a while it's fine.

    It has started to get some fine scratches - I did the high gloss finish and based on the instructions was prepared for the development of a patina over time. You can also do a more matte finish - there are quite a few threads on GW about finishing butcherblock with Waterlox.

    From what I understand, with a Waterlox finish if you have some kind of accident that damages a sopt, you can just sand that section and re-apply waterlox (as opposed to having to refinish the entire surface like you would with varnish) but I haven't so far had to worry about that.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Craft Art DIY

  • nini804
    12 years ago

    We got our walnut island top through J. Thompson in NC. Www.jthompsontops.com
    I know that it cost more than our Carrara perimeter, but to me it was completely worth it. It is a statement, and the heart of our kitchen. We currently have the mineral oil finish and it is holding up beautifully. I am going to have the finish changed to waterlox, though, just because I think I want more of a sheen to my counters, and I don't cut on mine so there is no good reason to have the oil finish. I did check out some walnut countertops in our area, and the owners are not reporting maintenance issues. They looked great! One was 5 years old.

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  • juliekcmo
    12 years ago

    Ours is John Boos hard rock maple with oiled finish.
    Our contractor took care of it--I believe he may have sourced via our cabinet shop, but it may have also been a local countertop company.

    It was ordered in as a rectangle, and then was shop fabricated to curve the edge where the stools are, and the cutout for the sink was made.

    It was less expensive than doing granite. This was all done about 10 years ago.

    We adore the oiled finish and cut right on it. Its a 7 foot long cutting board.

  • allison0704
    12 years ago

    Our island is antique pine. The pine was ordered from a local lumber yard. Then it was made into the counter at a shop. After we had ours installed (it was priced with my cabinets, so I don't know how it was broken down), our builder had it priced for the next house he was building and it was extremely expensive. More than granite, marble, etc.

  • fnzzy
    12 years ago

    ours is from Grothouse and from what I remember it was far more reasonable than anything I could have found locally (in MA) and much better quality. It was still about $1000 more than granite which surprised me, but it was the vision I wanted (and still am happy we chose).

    We have walnut with the hard finish (not the food grade) and there is no sink etc in our island. The island is used as an eating surface, and all around big flat work surface. It's the most used area I think in the house. We are not at all careful with it nor do I make a fuss over it, so after 4 years it is showing some bits of normal use (someone used a pen on paper on the wood...etc) but overall still looks REALLY good. The finish it perfectly fine.

    So even though it was a a big budget item it was something I really wanted and planned for. And I'm always happy now that I did as it really warms up our kitchen.

  • fnzzy
    12 years ago

    oh I forgot, ours is flat grain, and most of the boards are fairly big. I couldn't find anyone that could do flat grain.

  • ci_lantro
    12 years ago

    Another shopping alternative...

    I don't have first hand experience with the company but maybe someone else does?

    Here is a link that might be useful: Hardwood Lumber Company

  • kitchen2011
    12 years ago

    I just had my wood top installed. It's cherry and "face" grain aka "plank". Basically looks like a nice cherry table top.

    When I started looking I was also blown away by the prices I was finding - I had expected wood to be an affordable option! I solved the problem by finding a local wood worker who did it for me for about 1/2 to 2/3 of what I was hearing from name brand counter top makers. I can't tell you yet how it will wear, but he used the same Waterlox finish that's on many of the high end tops, so I have high hopes

    And I think you can get edge grain that's not too outrageous if you google "butcher block" or ask for it in you local lumber yard, but if you want "plank/face/flat" grain, I was only able to find that through the very pricey "custom counter top" folks. Good luck!

    - Anne

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    Brooks Custom did cherry in our old house (now 10 yrs old) and we were so happy with it that we used them again in our new house.

    This time we went with subtle hand hewn cherry in s dark "Boston" finish. Not a year old yet but so far so good. We paid $160 sq/ft as spec'd below.

    Premium Wide Plank CHERRY Countertop
    � Boards 4" - 8" Wide, At Random
    � Marine Oil Finish, Hand Rubbed Semi Gloss
    � 1 1/2" Thick
    � Hand-Hewned Finish
    � Eased Square Edge
    � (1) Undermount Sink Cutout
    � (1) Set of Finger Groove Drainboard
    � No Backsplash

    Here is a link that might be useful: some samples

  • babs711
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    ZoeCat, I think because of the size being not a stock size, we'd have to go through a dealer, right? Our cabinets will run 48x78 (roughly). That's how I came up with the rough 60x90 figure. It will be a little over that actually.

    kitchen2011, butcherblock is end grain. Edge is the edge of the board, not the end, so the planks aren't face up but to the side. Does that make sense? The strips are thinner so you get more variation on the top. How did you find your woodworker? I've tried online with no luck.

    I have one source for woodworking that I know of. Because of our professional relationship (He is a customer of mine), I don't know if it would be awkward to ask him about doing something like this. We do have a very good relationship though. But it's his hobby and he loves it. The last time I saw him, he told me about it randomly. I've known him for six years and never knew he did that. I wonder if that was fate? Maybe I should just ask once I know my final dimensions and see how he responds?

    Assuming I do get a woodworker to do this, how does a wood top attach to the island? Is this different than a stone?

    I appreciate all of the feedback. I'm going to head to the John Boos place later this week to see if I can get a price first.

  • breezygirl
    12 years ago

    Hi Babs. Sounds like you're making good progress!

    My plank, black walnut top was made by a local woodworker. I got quotes from a few of the big names mentioned here and was also surprised at the cost so began looking for cheaper places. I got a quote from Craft Art and another local shop for a DIY finish top, but with the house reno, DH's work schedule, the kids, lack of workspace, and our tight timeline at the end of our project, we knew we wouldn't be able to DIY it ourselves. The cost of the unfinished top from either place plus the cost of someone to do the finish work wound up costing as much as using the local woodworker to make the whole thing. Plus, with a sink in the island, we were concerned that the cutout be done correctly.

    So, with the cost of the counter fabrication, sink cut out, upcharge for insetting of the sink higher into the top to decrease the undermount depth, sink mounting, runnels, finishing, delivery, and installation worked out to about $110 sq ft. Yes, it was more expensive than I thought it would be, but cheaper than it might have been.

    I rarely get compliments from visitors on the new kitchen in general, but most people comment on the beauty of the island. It's really amazing IMHO and worth the splurge.

    Mine is finished with Osmo Polyx Oil only because my woodworker has been using it on counters for years. It's a green, food-safe product. I had planned on using Waterlox, but decided to trust and go with the flow. I really like how it doesn't look like it has any sort of coating on the wood. It is matte, yet has subtle glow. Looks natural. The other benefit is that I can quickly rub on more Osmo on an area if it needs it, like around the sink, without having to do the whole top.

    We've only had the top a short time so I can't comment on longevity, but I've gotten scratches and even dents from dropping something heavy. Comes with the territory. My woodworker came over the other day to look at another project and brought his sander with him. He gave the top a quick sand and a new coat of Osmo. Scratches gone in only a few minutes! I could never do that with my marble. ;)

    Keep searching around. Ask your customer. You never know what will happen.

  • babs711
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thank you all so very much for all your input.

    Is a wood top installed the same as a stone top or differently?

    Breezy, your top is stunning. Everyone in this thread, you all have incredible islands and kitchens. They're gorgeous. I have several of your kitchens in my inspirations folder. I greatly appreciate your feedback as my kitchen adventures continue!

  • babs711
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thank you all so very much for all your input.

    Is a wood top installed the same as a stone top or differently?

    Breezy, your top is stunning. Everyone in this thread, you all have incredible islands and kitchens. They're gorgeous. I have several of your kitchens in my inspirations folder. I greatly appreciate your feedback as my kitchen adventures continue!

  • LMM170
    12 years ago

    My mother had wood tops in her kitchen for thirty years. We all loved the tops! Great choice.

  • fnzzy
    12 years ago

    babs - A wood top needs to be installed in a way in which it will move and breathe, so it's not glued or anchored tightly to your cabinets.

  • westtoeast
    12 years ago

    Question...do any of your kids do art projects/homework on the wood top? I LOVE the look, but don't want to constantly nag my 3 young kids to be careful. Our island will be the only seating in our kitchen, so they will be sitting there all the time.

  • marjen
    12 years ago

    I have a cherry butcher block island top. Its about 3 years old. It has held up pretty well. Has some scratches, mostly from the dog when she is trying to steal someones dinner. I am 95% sure I got it from blocktop.net and want to say it was around $1500 or so. It is 102"x42"x1.5 I absolutely love it, one of the best decisions we made.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Blocktop

  • MichelleDT
    12 years ago

    These countertops are stunning. Do u actually use them to do prep work? I would guess u still use a cutting board or they would look horrible. I know...silly question but....I saw a beautiful mixed walnut with darks and gray tones that would look cool in a more modern/contemp kitchen and Mister said that would be nuts - not functional at all. We will have two large islands and I thought this would be a great way to break up all the cold white perimeter stone and island counters. Also thought it would cut down on stone expense but looks pricier.

    M

  • BeastBaby
    12 years ago

    I used these instructions - I think I heard about them on GW actually. I got a Craft Art DIY not long ago and these instructions are on their website and they sent a hard copy.

    So, I don't know if it's the same as stone, but may help.

    Here is a link that might be useful: www.craft-art.com/tech

  • CEFreeman
    12 years ago

    I think "doesn't wear well" is a pretty darned stupid thing to tell someone. Reminds me of the thread discussing frameless cabinets.

    If they were to day "the finish doesn't wear well" I'd buy it more. But then, it depends upon the finish, doesn't it?

    Do you plan to treat yours as furniture with a glossy finish that you polish? Do you plan to treat yours as a countertop with a sealed finish not for cutting? Do you plan to use yours as a cutting board? a chopping block? a carpentry work bench? See what I mean, bean?

    There are BB/wood countertops that are 100s of years old and are still in use and beautiful. Ok, maybe not 100s plural, but you get my point. They wear just fine. It's the finish that is in question. Some dry out from no care, but I highly doubt you're not going to care for them in some fashion.

    And BTW. I've made my own.
    A 24" countertop for a 24" cabinet next to my stove, and a 16'10" run along the wall on the other side of the stove. I bought the maple at a reuse center, glued the stuff together and sanded the crap out of it. Probably cost me about $200 total.
    I'm now debating over stain color and will probably Waterlox. A friend is going to come over and route the edge, since I have no idea how to use the router yet.

    So it's not the big deal people make them out to be. Even the labor of this amateur was only a day or two when all the hours were added together. Gluing takes the most time.

    Go with it. It's warm and beautiful.
    Christine

  • BeastBaby
    12 years ago

    CEFreeman - I actually agree that anyone who really knows a wood countertop, would also know that the defining feature of wear is the finish used. I actually did an extensive amount of research for my project and agree that finishing it yourself isn't hard. Waterlox is the way to go and there are some threads that I've seen on specific finishing instructions etc.

    However, DIYers in general reaaaaally may have a tough time gluing boards together and having it last. It's a big job. I tried it and didn't have success, so I bought a "DIY wood countertop" that was a "blank" aka boards pre-glued to a certain size. I'm assuming it seems amateur to you because you had some experience? (I hope. otherwise I'm a dumb kid?).

    When you go through a season cycle, those glue seams are the first to show trouble. I'm sure yours worked out, but the way it's done is not super simple for your average bear.

    Do you have more advice on it though? You clearly had an easier time at it than others of us. Maybe my question is for a different thread...? I'd love to see some photos of your awesome project, though!

  • MIssyV
    12 years ago

    Hey there babs. Wood with marble ....YUM! Go for it!

    We did Bianco Antico perimeter (chickened out on marble) and Mahogany top for our island and yes, made by a local small town custom wood worker. I paid $710 for our top. I have no idea how many sq ft it is but guessing around 30-35.... we quoted me for maple (or was it oak...can't remember now, which ever is the hardest!) and then he realized I wanted a darker top then that wood could provide, so he gave me the mahogany at the same price because he had it on hand. Lucky me!

    I chose to have it finished with a sealer vs oil....whatever sealer he uses, not sure what its called. He did tell me mahogany was about a 6 on the hardness scale of wood (10 being hardest). I wanted walnut based on all the beauties I have seen on GW, but it would have cost me more and I felt like I was already getting a deal by getting mahogany for the price of maple / oak. Truthfully, I an really happy with what we have. I get a lot of compliments on it. But then again, while its often seen on here, NO ONE in our area has anything like it. I did have him tint it/stain it so it would be less red than what mahogany is.

    Durability....it has only been in since the first week of December, so early to say. NO dings of any sort, but fine hairline scratches. I use this all the time, I do all my prep work on it, when I should be doing it on the granite. I suppose had we chose the oiled option they would be less noticeable, but they aren't noticeable from a distance, just up close or from the right angle. If you are considering marble, I would venture to say these wouldn't bother you. You can't feel them with your hand, just see them, they are that hairline fine.

    I did call to get a quote from a place in Michigan that ships anywhere. He was a bit more reasonable in price, but it seemed more sensible to have a local guy do it in case we had any problems.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Block Top in Michigan

  • CEFreeman
    12 years ago

    Beastbaby, No, no experience whatsoever.
    It's only about 3 weeks old, so no history.

    I entertained the idea of securing them with my Kreg pocket hole jig, but can't figure out how to use the clamp thing. So glue it was.

    However, I have wide, wide cabinets. I'm thinking of pulling the drawers out and using metal reinforcing straps underneath. Given the fact that wood reacts to moisture in the air, I think I'll wait for it to experience a season.

    If I could have afford another way, I sure would have done it.

    christine

  • judy1975
    12 years ago

    great stuff. i just found this site so i thought i would share my experience.

    i'm much less of a diy'er to build my own stuff so i went with the southside woodshop for my walnut island top. the tops turned out perfectly and i am very happy with the whole experience (workmanship, customer service and price). i also bake a lot so i opted for the mineral oil finish and am looking forward to my countertop developing some 'character marks' and patina over the years.

    for the op - i think i paid around $100/sf for the top and shipping, combined. a friend of our's helped with the installation (very easy and we should have done it ourselves). i chose the southside woodshop because of their quick response to my initial quote and follow up emails (all with the owner). they seemed to offer the best deal among the other companies that specialize in this kind of work. i did have a local guy price it, and he was a little less, but after reading about problems others have experienced, opted to go with a company that specializes in this kind of work.

    good luck with your decision and purcahse.

    Here is a link that might be useful: the southside woodshop

  • furletcity
    12 years ago

    We had a woodworker extraordinaire make our 4x6 cherry counter top. It cost around $900 and is beautiful. We left it natural and just applied his homemade blend onto it. Sorry about the poor picture quality, but it's very hard in my dimly lit cabin!


  • motherof3sons
    12 years ago

    Our 6x5 walnut island top will be 1 1/4" with an ogee edge. The cost is $700 approx. installed.

  • KCRemodeler
    12 years ago

    I bought my walnut edge grain countetops (permeter and peninsula, so a fair amount of top incl sink cut out and joints) from CraftArt homeowner DIY. With shipping and finish it was around $35/sq ft. I then asked my cabinet maker to receive the shipment and go ahead and finish and install the tops for me. He charged about $12/sq ft to do this, including ogee edge, sink cut out, joints, Waterlox coats, and installed. He also called Craft Art for their recommendations on a few items (he was new to Waterlox) and said they were extremely helpful.

    OK so the tops are being installed Monday....so I can't say yet that I know if this was a good idea or not. But we will be eating and prepping on these tops, and I'm sure my toddler and baby on the way will eventually be doing homework on them. So I'm hoping (fingers crossed) my diligence of re-sealing every year or so is enough to protect against haphazard use. And if not...we'll do a light sand and put on more Waterlox.