Bryant system questions

13 years ago

I received quotes on 2 Bryant systems from an experienced highly rated company. I live in MN. The load calculation recommended a 60,000 Btu furnace (95%) and a 2 1/2 ton a/c.

He seemed to be thorough in imputing data. He said I was at #57...what does that mean? I forgot to get his printout.

2200 sq. finished ft. plus 700 sq ft unconditioned basement.

25 yr old home with original 100,000 BTU furnace and 2 1/2 ton a/c.

The old furnace and a/c worked well.Changes to the house:

The house has had low air infiltration replacement storm windows added (not double pane), along with better doors, caulking, and that's about it. Good insulating to begin with.

The quotes:

#1 Bryant Evolution 355CAV042080 3 stage, variable blower

Bryant Evolution 187BNA036 16.5 seer 2 stage 3 ton

Evolution Thermostat

4 inch EZ flex media filter

replace lines,remount Honeywell humidifier (5 yrs old)

$8,990...$5,800 with rebates/credits or possibly even $3,025 if I get special State of MN offer

Options:

--$1600 more for HRV 1100 Air exchanger to help get rid of excessive condensation we get on windows when below 0 degrees, current system has no exchanger.

-- $1000 more for heat pump insted of a/c... Bryant 286BNA036 16 seer (11 cents=electricity rate) minus $300 rebate=$700

To get tax credit with an evolution system it had to be 80,000 BTU paired with 3 ton a/c, is this correct?

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#2 Bryant 95i 355BAV042060(FP6000) 60000 BTU 2 stage 3 speed 126BNA030 a/c 16 seer 1 stage 2 1/2 ton

FocusPro 6000 thermostat (VisionPro IAQ for $175 more, good idea with or without exchanger added?)

replace lines,same filter and remount humidifier.

$6,190...$4,000 after rebates/credits or possibly $1,850 if I get the special State of MN offer.

Same price and model air exchanger option.

$1000 more for heat pump 15.5 seer Bryant 215BNA030 minus $250 rebate=$750 15.5 seer

So if I do or don't get the special State of MN offer should I go with the Evolution or Prefered series? I am concerned that the Evolution is oversized and/or the Preferred is undersized. He couldn't pair an 80 BTU evolution and 2 1/2 ton and qualify for credits. All my credits and rebates depend on qualifying for federal tax credit guidelines.

Is the heat pump an option? If installed, electric co. would drop rate from 11 cents to 5.6 cents for electricity going to heat pump. I have read the reliability problems with heat pumps continue. Is the air exchanger a good idea/price? Would the current duct sizing handle that 3 ton 2 stage a/c?

Thanks for your imput.

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Comments (4)

neohioheatpump
13 years ago
wow - 5.6 cents per KW if you get a heatpump!! How can you pass that up? With a heatpump you'll have extra flexibility incase of gas price spikes. I like option 2 better because its a nice system and its less money. I think the 1000 upgrade to a heatpump is a little pricey. It doesn't take him hardly any extra work (but the equipment might cost an extra $500). I would still go with the heatpump.

If you do go with the heatpump I would run that down to about 25 degrees F and then let the gas take over. You could probably go down lower but for the sake of comfort I would say no. You will save money with the heatpump if your paying 5.6 total cents per KW.

BTW - heatpumps are very reliable. Just gotta have a good install. If you get the heatpump you will have a 3rd stage of heat. Your next stage (low stage on gas furnace) would only be getting used below freezing and shouldn't be oversized. Your high stage of gas furnace would only be used when SUPER COLD like around 0 or colder. So I don't think its a huge deal to go with 80K furance and 3ton heatpump unstead of 60K furance and 2.5 ton.
iamcold
Original Author
13 years ago
Sorry,
The saleman had the #s wrong. I checked with the electric co. Discount applies if you agree to allow them to shut off power to heatpump or a/c during highest demand periods (hapenned 16 days last year. They cycle the power on and off typically in 15 minute intervals) ....Heat pump electric rate would be 4.8 cents. and a/c rate would be 8 cents, if I agreed to the interuption program... 11 cents is the usuall rate.
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NC. Despite the sarcasm here, I don't think the quote is that bad but I guess it depends if it is new construction. A 95% furnace is of course over the top for Alabama. We have a 90% furnace and that was only because it is in the basement (and the exhaust for a 80% made them equal cost). Our NG bill for this year was about $200 total - and it was a really cold winter for all....Try to make 2 95% furnaces pay off in Alabama - I can't imagine. There are 2 levels of Infinity/Evolution - Seer 16 and Seer 19. Which one are you at? Again - trying to make these things make sense from a payback period is nuts to say the least. I'll assume that you don't have/want heat pump and your HDDs are 1/2 of ours. So you might have a $400 NG bill for the year. So those 95% are saving roughly $60 a year over the cheapy 80% furnaces. I expect you are paying around $3000 in increased costs since you have 2. That is a 50 year payback (neglecting time value of money and inflation). Since very few furnaces would last 50 years, they never pay off. Chew on that. Your best bet is straight heat pump. You would likely save $5000 up front and save $100 a year since I bet your electricity is less than or equal to $.10 a kilowatt. Unless you are planning for the next ice age or live in a really cold section of Alabama (is there one?). Why not heat pump? You have to answer that question to get a rational response here. Also plug in your zip and get HDDs. Also, is this new construction and if not, what is your envelope like? Do you have any insulation? If old construction, what did you have before? What were your costs?
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neohioheatpump
13 years ago
Right now gas is cheap. People aren't thinking about spending the extra money on a heatpump. But right now your replacing your hvac and now is the time to upgrade if your gonna ever do it. This new system your gonna have is probably going to be in your home 15 years or more. I have dual fuel and this year I"m probably gonna raise my switchpoint temp for heatpump to gas to 30 or 35 degrees since gas is cheap and electric is not exactly a bargain. Its nice to have extra options though.

If you can get a heatpump for some extra money like $500 its totally worth it. You can use it very little if you like (say at 40 degrees F and above since gas is inexpensive).
I would consider the interruption program. When that affects you - you'll be using the gas anyway cause thats during the most high demand cold weather. It might affect you in the summer.

I would try telling the contractor you have a deal on the quote if you give me the heatpump upgrade for 'X' amount of dollars.

I have a focus pro wireless thermostat kit. Its great for dual fuel and multiple stages of heat. I like it. Mine has an outdoor temp sensor that interfaces with it. I can't control humidity with mine but that is something used for climates with long hot humid summers. I think evolution can control house humidity.
iamcold
Original Author
13 years ago
Would the optional air exchanger help to alleviate the condensation problems? One of my children and I get dry itchy skin if the humidifier is not set to at least 15% during the winter. But on days below 0 (many in MN), the water pours off of the windows and ruins the wood. This quote seems high ($1600) Any thoughts? Thanks again.

Bryant system questions

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