need new heat pump system in coastal area

9 years ago

Contractor is recommending the Carrier coastal 3 ton heat pump w/ the FX4 air handler as the best and most reasonable option for my 1 level aprox 2500 sf home. he also carries Trane and says that he was a Trane believer until 2 yrs ago. he will sell me a Trane, but he recommends the Carrier unit for about $5400. It is the Comfort 13 HP w/ a SEER of 14.5. Is this a good unit and deal and should I also consider the extended warranty for another $1500. I was leaning toward Trane because my neighbor got one 2 yrs ago, but his contractor does not even carry Trane anymore, he went to Tempstar units now. Any advice would be helpful. Thanks

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Comments (15)

tigerdunes
9 years ago
Location please...

And complete model numbers for Carrier system.

Still believe Trane/AmStd are superior to Carrier for coastal environments.

IMO
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dannyboyy
Original Author
9 years ago
Model 25HBB3C This # is on the broshure. He said it was 14.5 seer.
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I actually have three other quotes: (1) CARRIER INFINITY 25HNB636A003* 3 TON 17 SEER 2 STAGE CONDENSER UNIT. (1) CARRIER INFINITY FE4ANF005000* VARIABLE SPEED ECM AIR HANDLER. (1) CARRIER INFINITY SYSTXCCUID01-V PROGRAMMABLE COMMUNICATING CONTROL. TO INSTALL THE NEW BRYANT EVOLUTION 2 STAGE, 17 SEER HEATPUMP CONDENSER UNIT OUTSIDE THE HOME ON HEAT PUMP LEGS AND AN ULTRALITE 36" X 36" X 2" PRECAST CONCRETE CONDENSER PAD IN REPLACEMENT OF EXISTING CONDENSER UNIT. TO INSTALL THE NEW BRYANT EVOLUTION VARIABLE SPEED ECM AIR HANDLER IN THE BASEMENT IN REPLACEMENT OF EXISTING AIR HANDLER. TO INSTALL TRANSITIONAL DUCTWORK TO EXISTING SUPPLY PLENUM. TO INSTALL A NEW RETURN PLENUM AND CONNECT TO EXISTING RETURN DROP. TO INSTALL A NEW 3/4" PVC DRAIN WITH TRAP FOR CONDENSATE REMOVAL. TO RE-USE EXISTING COPPER REFRIGERATION LINE SET FROM THE CONDENSER TO THE AIR HANDLER BY FLUSHING THE LINES AND CHARGING WITH R-410A REFRIGERANT. TO SUPPLY AND INSTALL A BRYANT EVOLUTION COMMUNICATING CONTROL WITH OUTDOOR SENSOR. TO REMOVE AND DISPOSE OF THE EXISTING CONDENSER AND AIR HANDLER. TO RUN AND TEST THE OPERATION OF THE SYSTEM. TO CLEAN THE WORK AREA TO CUSTOMER SATISFACTION. 10 YEAR WARRANTY ON COMPRESSOR. 10 YEAR WARRANTY ON COIL AND REMAINING PARTS. 10 YEAR WARRANTY ON INFINITY CONTROL. 1 YEAR WARRANTY ON ALL LABOR. Total Investment ***$8,995.00 - ($1,475.00 REBATES) = **$7,520.00 ** 0.00 BRYANT EVOLUTION 25HNB036 17 SEER, 2 STAGE, HEATPUMP CONDENSER UNIT. 0.00T BRYANT EVOLUTION FE4ANF05000 VARIABLE SPEED ECM, AIR HANDLER BRYANT EVOLUTION COMMUNICATING CONTROL TOTAL INVESTMENT: $8495.00 - ($1375.00 REBATES) = $7120.00 OPTION 2 BRYANT LEGACY 215HNB36 15 SEER HEATPUMP CONDENSER UNIT 0.00T BRYANT LEGACY FB4ANF05000 MULTI POISE ECM, AIR HANDLER BRYANT LEGACY PROGRAMMABLE THERMOSTAT CONTROL TOTAL INVESTMENT: $6995.00 How do these compare? PArdon me for the all-caps font, just wanted that to stand out from rest of my text.
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Tigerdunes, thank you for the reply. Yes, we should have known about the filter location. When the installation was in progress, we didn't think to ask and they didn't bring it to our attention. I looked this morning at the thermostat and it showed 80% humidity. It was after pre-sale inspection that the new vapor barrier was installed. Some areas had no vapor barrier whatsoever. The inspection was done after a heavy rain and it was discovered that one corner of the crawl space had water. That is where the sump pump was then installed. It worked only for a short time. I could hear it run but there was not even a dribble of water coming from the pipe. I phoned the company that installed it last fall ( probably Sept), but they told me if there wasn't standing water, it was working. Recently we had a new sump pump installed and that, too, didn't start up. The company does not warranty the pumps. The serviceman was here yesterday and adjusted the float which made it start up. I don't think I will ever use that company again. Yes, we have vents and they are open. We are in an area with underground springs and have water flowing along in part of the back yard. We also have a drainage culvert pipe system ( concrete) that was failing when the flanges deteriorated so we had major digging in the back yard to replace much of that old line of pipes which is well below grade of the house and not close to the house. At that time we had almost all of the downspouts hooked into that drainage system. Only one downspout in the front goes above ground. The rest( 5)are piped away from the house. I have an extension ladder and clean out the gutters at first sign of a problem. We placed sieves at each downspout to keep large material from clogging the underground drainage. I guess we felt the inspection and subsequent recommended course would take care of things. Obviously it did not. Another potential problem is moles. They have tunneled and dug up so much of the property. When I would walk next to the house, the ground would sink. I've tried all sorts of repellents from granular to sonic, to castor oil. So far nothing has worked. I believe that constant digging is a problem as the ground along the house foundation should be firm and higher than elsewhere. I keep pounding it down. We are not in a floodplain. At least that is good!
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tigerdunes - I have learned a lot from reading your postings on this forum and I appreciate your inputs. Your minimum specs list has already been very useful (though a lot of sales people really struggle to find answers about some of the items on that list), and IÃ¢ÂÂm leaning now toward the XL15i instead of the $660 more expensive XL16i. I still havenÃ¢ÂÂt completely ruled out Carrier and Rheem, but a neighbor has had a 4-ton Trane XL14i for over three years and I like the way it does not seem to have collected very many of the evergreen needles that are everywhere around here. I am curious though just why the XL16i has so much trouble with dehumidification, and whether that is important to our well-shaded house just outside of Seattle. We havenÃ¢ÂÂt bothered to run our heat pump in cooling mode for at least the last decade, so I remain mostly concerned with heating performance and expect to use very little cooling. Also, is the XL16i any less reliable that the XL15i, or is it just (as I understand from other forum postings) that it is more complex to hook up and hence more prone to improper installation? I am also puzzled when I compare ARI heating performance of the XL15i and XL16i. At 47 degrees their ARI heat capacity and COP are identical, and at 17 degrees the 15i has only 1% more heat capacity. The 16i has the better 17 degree COP, 2.86 versus 2.82, but it falls down on HSPF to 8.50 versus 9.00 for the 15i. This seems to imply that the 16i spends more time in defrost mode, but I do not understand why. Returning of your spec list, I assume Ã¢ÂÂstaged backup heat stripsÃ¢ÂÂ refers to the capability to selectively turn on part instead of all of the backup heat? Our old heat pump has this feature, but I have yet to find a sales person who can tell be whether modern systems can do this. One issue is not really relevant until our new heat pump is being installed, but opinions about it are so amusingly diverse I cannot resist asking. Our power utility offers an extra rebate if we install a lockout control. What should it control? We have a lockout set at 32 degrees on our old heat pump and I understood it prevents the backup heat from coming unless the outdoor temperatures is below 32 degrees. The Ã¢ÂÂenergy expertÃ¢ÂÂ I talked to at our power company agreed, but said the lockout should also turn off the heat pump compressor at 32 degrees to Ã¢ÂÂprevent a spike in our electric bill.Ã¢ÂÂ I recognize efficiency is down at that temperature, but unless there is a lot of icing up it still seems to make sense to run the compressor. Sale personnel were about evenly split whether the lockout should turn off the compressor. Is there any clear answer on this?
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tigerdunes, thanks for responding. We are located about 35 miles east of Pittsburgh, PA. All the systems are 2.5 ton. On quote 3, the only model numbers mentioned in the quote are what I wrote down. I think the FB4CNF036L00 is the air handler. No specific model of thermostat is listed for 1, but we discussed the XL950, XL850 and XL 824. 2. has no model # but says Infinity wi-fi touchscreen thermostat. 3. just says programmable thermostat. dovetonsils, thank you also. I tried looking on the Bryant website as well and could not find the model that was quoted. Maybe he's trying to sell me an old unit? I'll have to check on that.
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tigerdunes
9 years ago
And location?
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dannyboyy
Original Author
9 years ago
atlantic beach, nc
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sktn77a
9 years ago
That's a high price for the system and an awful price for an extended warranty (should be half that, unless it includes 10 years of annual maintenance). Carrier has a no-cost 10 year parts warranty on all its equipment but no longer offers manufacturer-backed extended labor warranties. The dealer should give a 1 year labor warranty and appears to be offering you a 10 year third party extended labor warranty for the $1500. Bear in mind, HVAC dealers come and go so if you pay up-front for an "extended warranty" make sure its with a company that has a long business history and has a high probability of staying in business.

If you go for the Carrier equipment, get the FV4CNF005L air handler. At the coast, it has better dehumidification performance. Also make sure the L suffix (the new aluminum coil).
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dannyboyy
Original Author
9 years ago
Carrier Coastal System

25HBB336C003 OUTDOOR UNIT

FX4DNF037T00 AIR HANDLER

CE0901N10 HEATER

Thanks for your advice SKTN77
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tigerdunes
9 years ago
This appears to be the AHRI HP matching number.

Average performance/efficiency numbers.

6938002 Active Systems CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING COMFORT SERIES PURON HP CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 25HBB336C31 FX4DN(B,F)037L 1200 35200 12.00 14.50 35000 8.50 21800 1 HRCU-A-CB 301 818

Pay attention. You want the L suffix on the air handler model number for aluminum coil.

Still believe Trane or AmStd is a better choice for coastal environment.

IMO
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dannyboyy
Original Author
9 years ago
Would I be better off going with the FV4CNF005L variable speed air handler? Matched up with the 25HBB336C003. Thanks, Dan
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zippity1
9 years ago
our new home, south of houston, tx has a Tempstar, which we had never heard of- we won't be moving there until next week
the builder assured us that tempstar was "an excellent choice" --as if we had one??)
our neighbor in Houston owns a HVAC company in houston reassures us that we'll be happy with a tempstar-he's thinking of picking up that line himself he uses American Standard now
hope these guys know what they're talking about.....
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tigerdunes
9 years ago
for dannyboy

Yes a nicer system.with the var speed air handler. Make certain you get the Edge Thermidistat. I would think an 8-10 KW heat strip.

6938000 Active Systems CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING COMFORT SERIES PURON HP CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 25HBB336C31 FV4CN(B,F)005L 1050 35400 12.00 15.00 34200 9.00 21400 1 HRCU-A-CB 293 772

Still prefer Trane/AmStd for coastal environments.

IMO
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jackfre
9 years ago
Aftermarket warranties give me heartburn. Manuf do not like to provide the factory ext warranty. Because they have to carry those liabilities on their books, hence the aftermarket type. If you go with one, I'd push very hard on price reduction on the warranty, once all other costs have been settled. It is a separate transaction, in my mind.

In my experience Warranty companies are good for about 10 years. They sell a lot of product and once the payments become to much they go belly up. Research it carefully..
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ryanvu1
9 years ago
Hey tigerdunes, which model or series of Amstd or Trane condenser units would be best for the original poster? Having trouble finding the "coastal" units that these companies make. I would be interested in "heat pump" models rather than straight cool. Thanks
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tigerdunes
9 years ago
It's bad forum etiquette to piggyback onto another person's thread.

However, Trane coils are designed with material that fights harsh coastal environments more so than other brands. For most applications, there is nothing that needs to be added. However, at one time they did offer an add on protective shield. Not certain it is still available and not sure I would recommend it. Why?. Not necessary.

IMO
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fsanto
9 years ago
Which is the best model 15 seer heat pump for price and efficiency .
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tigerdunes
9 years ago
For above poster...start your own thread...go to bottom of home page...size?

TD
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need new heat pump system in coastal area

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need new heat pump system in coastal area

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