gardening goof

a couple of suggestions and concerns.

let's start with the upstairs system. you should re-check mdl number of the Bryant condenser. If I understand correctly, you are talking about going from a three ton Rheem to a two ton Bryant. Is that correct? if so that bothers me for an upstairs system in hotlanta. at this time, I am not going to comment on particular condenser mdls. perhaps later. other options might be to substitute a HP condenser or even consider going HP/air handler and drop the furnace altogether.

I don't care when linesets were replaced-they must be correctly sized for the condensers. going from a three ton to a two ton or even a 2 1/2 would indicate a different size. this is a big deal. not an issue to overlook.

now to the first floor system. I will assume it is not practical to relocate furnace from attic to basement and go to a 95% eff furnace. One of the problems with 80% eff furnaces, a dealer has to oversize to get the efficiency of the condenser necessary to qualify for tax credit. your situation is a perfect example. However, I would try to get a system that qualifies using the smaller mdl furnace 315(A,J)AV060110. five ton configurations that qualify for tax credit using that particular mdl/size are available. Here again, even for Atlanta, you might consider a HP upgrade for the first floor system. here again, you are certain five ton condenser is correct size for downstairs system?

I would definitely look at condenser upgrades whether AC or HP condensers.

IMO

Tigerdunes:

Exactly the person I was hoping to respond!

A couple of responses for you:

1. Just double checked the upstairs unit. It is a Rheem RAKA-024JAZ. I deciphered the code as a 2 ton unit not a 3 ton as I had originally stated. Not sure why I thought it was a 3 ton.

2. I definitely agree that need to have a combo setup. HP with the gas furnace backup. I would make both setups combo systems.

3. The linesets were replaced because the builderÂs contractor ran the wrong size.

4. Cannot move the furnaces from the attic. My contractor thought the same thing  what was the builder thinking by putting both units in the attic.

5. Contractor worked with the Bryant rep on my setup. Originally thought he could drop down to a 4 ton but since both furnaces are in the attic they decided to keep to same size as being replaced.

Let me know.

Tigerdunes: Not sure if you saw my response from last week. Let me know your thoughts!

if your in atlanta heatpumps would serve you well. You could probably just have sraight heatpumps without natural gas but if you want to keep natural gas definetly spend more and get heatpumps.

Neo: Thanks. I am waiting to hear back from HVAC contractor tomorrow on the updated model info which includes the hybrid/duel fuel setup. Will post once I have the info.

Thanks

gardening roof

any new info from dealer?

I have been thinking about your situation especially regardings dual fuel and the use of HPs as your primary source of winter heating.

Carrier/Bryant makes this difficult if not impossible for your situation by forcing you to oversize your 80% furnace on downstairs system to get the tax credit. I am assuming you need the five ton condenser. Wish dealer would perform a load calc to confirm that assumption. And I am not picking on Carrier/Bryant as this would be true on other brands as well.

So what to do? I think correct/closer sizing is more important than to force an issue. With that in mind, I would go with the smaller 80% furnace-315(A,J)AV060110 paired with Performance 17 two stg AC. You can still go dual fuel for upstairs system if you like.

post back when you have details from your dealer. I would like to know his thoughts.

IMO

Tigerdunes:

Thanks. Just finished talking to him this afternoon.

Changes to my original post are as follows for the dual fuel system:

Main Floor:
A/C: Bryant, 226A, Single stage, 5 Ton 16 SEER **UPDATED**
Furnace: Bryant, 315AAV, 135K BTU, 80%, Two stage, 5 Ton, 16 SEER **NO CHANGE**
Coil: Bryant, CNPVP, Tin plated, 5 Ton **NO CHANGE**
Controller: Bryant Evolution **NO CHANGE**
Price: $6,300 with the $1,500 tax credit applied. Additional $975 for the 226.

2nd Floor:
A/C: Bryant, 226A, Single stage, 2 Ton 16 SEER **UPDATED**
Furnace: Bryant, 315AAV, 70K BTU, 80%, Two stage, 3 Ton, 16 SEER **NO CHANGE**
Coil: Bryant, CNPVP, Tin Plated, 2.5 Ton **NO CHANGE**
Controller: Bryant Evolution **NO CHANGE**
Price: $4,800 Additional $875 for the 226.

Let me know what you think.

GG

I would pull the trigger on those systems with the heatpump.

Thats alot of heating and cooling. 8 tons total. I read about the sq. footage. 2.5 tons sounds about right on 2nd floor.
I guess the 5 tons sounds right on the first floor. You could probably go a bit less on 1st floor since the great room opens up to the second floor which has enough sizing.
How does the 5 ton do now? Does it shortcycle? 4 tons might be good on floor 1 but maybe you should stick with 5.

Are you well-insulated?

I imagine you need the 135k btu furnace to handle the 5 ton heatpump. I can't ever imagining ever needing that kind of heat in atlanta.

Does your dealer participate in the Bryant rebate program?

http://www.bryant.com/support/promotions/bryantbonus.shtml

Neo: Thanks and a couple of answers to your questions:

1. The attic is well insulated (R-49 about 3 years ago) but the house is south facing and stucco. Tons of windows (about 38 (med/lg on 1st floor and 6 med size windows on the 2nd floor. I don't think the stucco does as well as a brick home when it comes to insulating from the heat and cold.

2. The 5 ton today does not short cycle. It is pretty consistent and have been told with a variable system we would definitely see a cooler and less humid home.

3. Atlanta does get cold. It is not uncommon to see the coldest temps in the teens and average around mid-30's to low 40's.

Organic Possum: Thanks and will check.

GG

wow. R49 in the attic is nice. Those are alot of windows though. If the 5-ton is currently not short cycling then thats fine. You will discover the heatpump works great above freezing for the majority of your weather 30's/40's.

When it gets in the teens gas is appropriate. You'll probably want to have your switchpoint at 30 degrees. Some do you lower but you probably won't get a ton of weather below 30 degrees and you might as weel use the gas sometime.

Neo: Thanks. BTW - do you think the pricing is appropriate?

GG

Tigerdunes: Let me know your thoughts....I think answered most of your questions.

Thanks,

GG

The pricing isn't cheap, but its not crazy high. You are getting hi-quality equipment with the fancy controls. Sounds like the furnaces have variable speed blowers. Those add alot of cost.

I think the price is appropriate. You might want to verify they are replacing the copper lineset. These heatpump systems will save you lots of money in energy over the long haul. They should also make your house very comfy.

Neo: Thanks for your input it is greatly appreciated!

GG

Tigerdunes: Let me know if you have any final thoughts.

Thanks,

GG

gardening goof

I stand by my last post from 9/10.

So what to do? I think correct/closer sizing is more important than to force an issue. With that in mind, I would go with the smaller 80% furnace-315(A,J)AV060110 paired with Performance 17 two stg AC. Forget HP for downstairs. You can still go dual fuel for upstairs system if you like.

3638239 Active Systems PERFORMANCE 17 PURON AC CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 24APA760A**31 CNPV*6124A**+UI 58CV(A,X)110-20 59000 13.00 16.00

IMO