puppies and kibble and poop, oh MY!

17 years ago

Puppy came from the breeder with a brand-name, mainstream puppy chow. Then I slowly switched her to a premium puppy food, thinking it'd be better for her. Then at our obedience classes, I was told that *both* of these products were full of corn (which is indigestible) and other products that weren't too good for puppy.

She then named some dog foods that I have NEVER heard of before, saying that they were much healthier and the dog would feel better and probably behave better and certainly poop much less (which would be a miracle in and of itself).

So my question is, does anyone here have first hand experience/knowledge about this stuff? Is it worth the extra money? Is this boutique puppy food or is it really good food?

Rose

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Comments (19)

rachelacey
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
Rose,
I personally feel that a high quality of food is better for any animal. When I had danes I was lucky that I never had the big D with any food I fed. Now that I have greyhounds, that's not the case. While my girl has an iron gut (LOL), my boy has a really sensitive stomach and I had to go through some trial and errors to find a good food that didn't upset his stomach. With a good quality food you will feed less and the stools should be firmer and less "smelly." Here's a how to pick list that's floated around on some dog forums I've frequented and I believe was also in the whole dog journal.
How to grade your dog's food.

Start with a grade of 100, then:

1) For every listing of "by-product", subtract 10 points
2) For every non-specific animal source ("meat" or "poultry", meat meal or fat) reference, subtract 10 points
3) If the food contains BHA, BHT, or ethoxyquin, subtract 10 points
4) For every grain "mill run" or non-specific grain source, subtract 5 points
5) If the same grain ingredient is used 2 or more times in the first five ingredients (i.e. "ground brown rice", "brewers rice", "rice flour" are all the same grain), subtract 5 points
6) If the protein sources are not meat meal and there are less than 2 meats in the top 3 ingredients, subtract 3 points
7) If it contains any artificial colorants, subtract 3 points
8 ) If it contains any ground corn or whole grain corn, subtract 3 points
9) If corn is listed in the top 5 ingredients, subtract 2 more points
10) If the food contains any animal fat other than fish oil, subtract 2 points
11) If lamb is the only animal protein source (unless your dog is allergic to other protein sources), subtract 2 points
12) If it contains soy or soybeans, subtract 2 points
13) If it contains wheat (unless you know that your dog is not allergic to wheat), subtract 2 points
14) If it contains beef (unless you know that your dog is not allergic to beef), subtract 1 point
15) If it contains salt, subtract 1 point

Extra Credit:
1) If any of the meat sources are organic, add 5 points
2) If the food is endorsed by any major breed group or nutritionist, add 5 points
3) If the food is baked not extruded, add 5 points
4) If the food contains probiotics, add 3 points
5) If the food contains fruit, add 3 points
6) If the food contains vegetables (NOT corn or other grains), add 3 points
7) If the animal sources are hormone-free and antibiotic-free, add 2 points
8 ) If the food contains barley, add 2 points
9) If the food contains flax seed oil (not just the seeds), add 2 points
10) If the food contains oats or oatmeal, add 1 point
11) If the food contains sunflower oil, add 1 point
12) For every different specific animal protein source (other than the first one; count "chicken" and "chicken meal" as only one protein
source, but "chicken" and "turkey" as 2 different sources), add 1 point
13) If it contains glucosamine and chondroitin, add 1 point
14) If the vegetables have been tested for pesticides and are pesticide-free, add 1 point
FINAL GRADES:
94-100+ = A
86-93 = B
78-85 = C
70-77 = D
Rachel
msmarion
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
Your vet will tell you that feeding a raw diet is best. Uncooked chicken, turkey backs etc. It's extra work but the rewards are endless. A healthy dog, small poops. You can Google raw diet and read the facts yourself. There is also several ready to serve products, Barf is one, it cones frozen at the vet. We feed Peati lots of raw meat and buy dry Solid Gold (Wolf Mix). The dry has NO by-products, everything is natural ie; Bison, fish meal, blueberries, cranberries. Heck, I'd eat it. There are other brands like Wellness. Peati gets cooked sweet potato mixed in, the only table food she gets is meat scraps. Her treats are raw carrots and frozen green beans.
I'd have a talk with your vet before you shop. Also remember to slowly add new food to the old food.
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I also agree with Ginny. I've fed my dogs a home cooked diet for as long as I can remember, and my parents did too. Real food is the best food. Stay away from rice though, because it can be sticky and promote tooth decay. I use pasta instead. I agree, it sounds like your puppy needs more fiber. When I don't have time to cook and I feed canned food, I know all 4 of my dogs will be runny for a couple days; they dislike canned or dry food; I guess they're gourmets.... My dogs especially like raw carrots, raw sweet potato, dried fish chews, and pizzles as treats. My 7 month old Beagle has been on home cooked since she was 7 weeks old. She saw the vet on Monday and her check up result was she's healthy as can be. Variety is the spice of life for dogs, just like humans. Just become aware of the things you should not feed your dog, and they'll let you know the things they don't like. (My Beagle was a friend's gift after my 19 1/2 year old Westie died. As I've posted before, I had to confirm his age with paperwork because vets didn't believe it. I think his diet had a lot to do with his longevity). (The comments about prescription diets were right on. My deceased Westie, Hattie, was on a prescription diet for awhile for kidney stones. She hated it. She had to be nearly starving before she would eat it).
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Linda Wayman
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I feed our dogs Canidae, but there is only one store in memphis that carries it, so once a month I go there and buy 120 pounds of it. $$$$$

Linda
oldrustybucket
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
The fancy name brands are great "if" the animal will eat it! But Miss Penny is very picky and after having tried many "vet" and "pet" store recommendations...the only thing she will eat is one discovered accidentally during a trip to see the kids recently... Miss Penny would not eat her $15.00 5lb bag "pet store" food & had not been even before the trip. But, while visiting constantly cleaned the dish of daughter's beautiful pooch which contained Dollar General Store Healthy Mix. Thinking it was a competition thing, upon returning home we tried the "good for doggie" stuff again, changed to another one even and no luck, she still won't eat it! Nothing except the DG brand mentioned, Oh well...she's healthy and happy and my wallet is a little thicker...$7.00 for 24 lb bags!

It works beautifully, meeting our request for less trips outside and a well balanced food...
bigfoot_liz
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
dollar general store pet food has been on several dog food recall lists over the last 2 yrs. you might actually go check right now as there is another pet recall starting...check out the food lists BTW to see that many of the generic brands are the same only sold under many different names.

mine are currently on diet prescript food from the vet as they need to lose a few lbs. they gained weight while boarded at the vet :-0 during our cruise in dec. they usually eat wellness/solid gold w/ meat & veg added. beautiful coats on both dogs, our vet loves to stroke their fur when we are in lol ~ liz
rachelacey
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I forgot I also kept of list of foods with their scores - if anyone is interested, here it is :)

Scores of some popular commercial dog foods:

Grade A:

Artemis Large/Medium Breed Puppy / Score 114
Authority Harvest Baked / Score 116
Beowulf Back to Basics / Score 101
Blue Buffalo Chicken and Rice / Score 106
Burns Chicken and Brown Rice / Score 107
Canidae / Score 112
Chicken Soup Senior / Score 115
Diamond Large Breed 60+ Formula / Score 99
Dick Van Patten's Natural Balance Ultra Premium / Score 122
Dick Van Patten's Natural Balance Venison and Brown Rice / Score 106
Dick Van Patten's Duck and Potato / Score 106
EaglePack Holistic / Score 102
Flint River Senior / Score 101
Foundations / Score 106
Innova Dog / Score 114
Innova Evo / Score 114
Innova Large Breed Puppy / Score 122
Kirkland Signature Chicken, Rice, and Vegetables / Score 110
Merrick Wilderness Blend / Score 127
Nature's Recipe / Score 100
Nature's Recipe Healthy Skin Venison and Rice / Score 116
Nature's Variety Raw Instinct / Score 122
Nutrience Junior Medium Breed Puppy / Score 101
Nutro Natural Choice Lamb and Rice / Score 98
Nutro Natural Choice Senior / Score 95
Nutro Ultra Adult / Score 104
Premium Edge Chicken, Rice and Vegetables Adult Dry / Score 109
Pro Plan Sensitive Stomach / Score 94
Royal Canin Boxer / Score 103
Royal Canin Bulldog / Score 100
Royal Canin Natural Blend Adult / Score 106
Sensible Choice Chicken and Rice / Score 97
Solid Gold / Score 99
Summit / Score 99
Timberwolf Organics Wild & Natural Dry / Score 120
Wellness Super5 Mix Chicken / Score 110
Wolfking Adult Dog (bison) by Solid Gold / Score 97
Grade B:

Authority Harvest Baked Less Active / Score 93
Diamond Lamb Meal & Rice / Score 92
Hund-n-Flocken Adult Dog (lamb) by Solid Gold / Score 93
Nutrisource Lamb and Rice / Score 87
Nutro Max Adult / Score 93
Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Puppy / Score 87
Nutro Natural Choice Puppy Wheat Free / Score 86

Grades C & D:

Blackwood 3000 Lamb and Rice / Score 83
Diamond Performance / Score 85
Eukanuba Adult / Score 81
Eukanuba Puppy / Score 79
Iams Lamb Meal & Rice Formula Premium / Score 73
Member's Mark Chicken and Rice / Score 84
Nutra Nuggets Super Premium Lamb Meal and Rice / Score 81
Pro Nature Puppy / Score 80

Failed:

Bil-Jac Select / Score 68
Diamond Maintenance / Score 64
Purina Dog / Score 62
Purina One Large Breed Puppy / Score 62
Science Diet Advanced Protein Senior 7+ / Score 63
Science Diet for Large Breed Puppies / Score 69

Hall of Shame:

Pet Gold Adult with Lamb & Rice / Score 23
Purina Beneful / Score 17
Purina Come-n-Get It / Score 16
jannie
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
Just be careful when switching brands. My dog has a touchy stomach and vomits when I feed her something new. Mix the two brands, gradually increasing the amount of the new food.
Tally
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
There are so many brands and mixes of pet foods out there. Pet owners really need to educate themselves on reading labels. The link below is a must read for all pet owners. It's a good introduction to the ingredients and methods of manufacturing pet food.

What foods did she recommend?
wildchild
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
You know you don't have to be science smart to run an obedience class. The "animal" industry draws a lot of "loonytunes".

Every vet I know and I've had this discussion with many, says any dog food that is formulated for the age,size and activity level of the animal. For example if you have a large breed puppy the food today is formulated to slow growth for healthier bones. In the past some breeders would mix adult food with puppy food in order to accomplish the same result.

I've always fed my dogs Nutro Max. I can't tell you how many times I've had the "loonies" come up and comment on how healthy my dogs' coats look. Then they would try to suggest a "better" diet. LOL I've always asked "well didn't you just say my dogs look great?" "yes". "Welll then..."

You'll have to do quite a bit of vet shopping to find a "holistic" type who approves a raw diet. Vet practices see the dangers of this fad first hand.

Read the link.

Pick a food your pup will eat that is balanced for it's age,weight and breed. I do think it beat to stay away from all the artificially colored and shaped to please people foods though. You dog won't know the difference and doesn't need the added chemicals to make it look pretty.

Another thing I learned from a past vet who was very, very much into nutritional studies was that a few years back there was as study that larger,puffy kibble was more nutritional than small dense kibble. Probably due to the sprayed on vitamins but at the time that was the finding.
barbara3
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I feed Henry the Eagle Pack Holistic Lamb and Rice (or Chicken when he gets bored with the lamb). Our vet said it is a very good food for dogs. He's a happy and healthy boy.
ruthieg__tx
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I forget the name but we feed our Aussie a high end "expensive" food. It was recommended and she does well and her coat is beautiful.
tannatonk23_fl_z9a
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I feed Sedona Natural Balance Duck & Potato and she does great on it. After two years of food related problems and many $$$$$, food trials, etc, we finally have her allergies under control with diet. She gets the dry kibble only with raw veggies for treats. And the occasional bite of ice cream cuz it's her favorite thing in the whole world. Guess even dogs have to have just one small vice.

~Betsy
Tally
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
Have to agree with Wildchild regarding raw food. My vet won't recommend it. Neither will the holistic vet in his practise.

Heck, we can't even regulate salmonella in human food processing. And lets not even talk about toxoplasmosis, parasites and other bacteria.

Nope, no raw diet for our cats either and they are obligate carnivores, which distinguish them from dogs. We feed Evo.

As for animals that won't eat "good" food, I find that is mostly rubbish. Of course they love the bad food. Who doesn't like junk food? Most of us eat too much of it because it tastes good. But we don't feed our kids a constant diet of high fat, loads of indigestible grains and preservatives. Why would we feed out pets that?

And for the record, as one omnivore to another, I don't eat raw meat either and my coat is fine :)
kathleen44
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
If you want a healthy puppy/dog and live longer.

Then buy the more healthier expensive foods on the markets.

Don't buy the cheap stuff from stores, go to pet stores and read the ingredients.

You don't want anything that has by products as that is just garbage meats that they use.
No whole wheats at all.
And yes, no corn products at all for dogs or cats.

They put them in because they are cheap and not good for our pets at all.

I checked all kinds of foods and what is in them and didn't like what they put in them at all.

I spent alot of time checking them all out and what can be bought around here.

Also big suggestion is after you have checked around, then buy, don't buy huge bag, just buy the smallest bag to test your dog out on it first to make sure its liked as some dogs don't like certain ones.

Our female dog, it drove me crazy as she would only eat dry and canned foods with chicken in it and so I had to search for them and found one brand and then the pet store didn't always have them and I finally had to give up and look and try another one.

You can check on the internet for brands and check the ingredients what is in it.

Yes, you will be paying a fortune but then again is your dog worth it?

After hearing and still hearing of pets dying of kidney problems I worry about the cheap foods that people are still buying and feeding their pets and may still be a problem.

Also so they don't get the runs, go slowly on introducing a new food, so mix it with the old food and put more and more of the new one until finally its used to it and no more old food.

Now, tons have gone to the raw meats, at our local place we buy bones for our dog, they do the raw meats and tons come in and buy them up.

I refuse to do that. I can't imagine giving raw meats to them.

No, its cooked meats for our dog.
gneegirl
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I've been giving my little dog various organic foods but I have to switch off every now and then. The vet and pet store folks told me it was from boredom. I recently started her on Halo - I purchased from QVC with the Elen Degeneras show. So far, VERY GOOD. The show host was eating it - OK, it may be a gimmick, but she owns a lot of animals and swears by it. She said she's been using it for years, befoe Ellen, and has had great results. I guess it's expensive but so was the other product. The problem is stock - they sold out so quickly. I'm going to check Halo's website for price and availability.

Not sure I'd try the raw food bit because I don't where that is coming from either. At least cooking might get rid of some harmful things.
whidbeykathy
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
We feed our lab Solid Gold Wolf Pack. No fillers, no corn, wheat, chicken or eggs.
His breeder sent her home with purina and I added the solid gold " wolf cub" half and half and switched her after three days to just solid gold. She gets NOTHING else and her coat is amazing and no bowel problems ever. She's thriving and doing good. Our previous dog had horrendoous skin problems and so I wanted to remove everything that caused them before they ever started with the lab.
Cherryfizz
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
With the better foods the dogs stools will be smaller because more of the nutrients are absorbed so there is less waste. I noticed this with my dogs over the years. Switch to cheaper foods the stools get bigger.

Lot less to clean up in the back yard after the winter thaw. LOL

Anne
Tally
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
One more point about the "expensive" food. I've found that in the end it isn't all that more expensive because they eat less of it. Better food is more dense with nutrients.

Cheaper foods with a lot of grains and other fillers require them to eat more to get enough nutrition.
JaniceP
17 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
I've fed my dachshunds a raw diet for over 11 years and have never had any problems with it. My vet (who is a holistic vet, as well) highly approves and wishes more of her patients were on a raw diet.

Whenever I read of a dog being poisoned by a raw food diet, I discover that the meat given to them was "Not for Human Consumption" (that can include meat from diseased animals, roadkill, etc.) My dogs only got freshly butchered meat from my local butcher and I always used organic when I could.

Dogs are descended from wolves. Wolves don't have stoves in the wild. They also don't need the fillers (corn, rice bran, barley, etc.) that are in most commercial foods. The premium foods might be more expensive but, as Tally said, they end up being more economical because the dog requires much less volume when eating premium food.

I used to make their food, but have gotten lazy over the years and now give them Nature's Variety Frozen Raw. It's a great food that is rated very highly on the chart listed above (which I've sent on to my friends who insist on feeding their dogs supermarket dogfood). My dogs, who are 12 and 13 years old are hale, hearty, and look and act like puppies.

puppies and kibble and poop, oh MY!

Comments (19)

rachelacey

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