Grout not level with tile - is this normal? PICS
I want to gather some opinions before I kill the tile guy....
I know nothing about tile installation, we had to do this install within one week I didn't have any time to research - ended up going with pretty much the cheapest installer :(
I am wondering if it is normal to NOT have the tile and grout be level and flush? (ie: grout coming up to the very top of the tile edge)
We can feel the space between each tile when we walk on it because the grout is lower than the tiles.
is this shoddy work? should I have them put in more grout? please help!
click on thumbnails for bigger pics
Comments (16)
karenn
14 years agoRelated Discussions
What is a 'normal' moisture level for a shower?
Comments (9)Eternally wet shower floors are usually the result of the membrane being placed flat on the subfloor, then a sloped layer of mud is placed on the flat membrane, then the tile going over the sloped mud. A flat membrane is bad practice and a code violation. Code requires that the membrane itself be sloped. This usually means a sloped layer of deck mud on the subfloor, then the membrane goes over the sloped mud, then another layer of mud goes on top of the sloped membrane. When the two-part clamping drain is installed, there are secondary weep holes along the throat of the drain. The intent is that any moisture that gets under the grout/tile and into the mud bed beneath the tile will hit the sloped membrane, then travel down the slope (code min 1/4" per foot, code max 1/2" per foot, with 1/4" per foot being standard) to the drain. The moisture will go through the secondary weep holes and down the drain. Normal practice is that when placing the second layer of deck mud (the layer that goes on top of the sloped membrane) the installer will first place a bit of small stone or tile spacers near the weep holes, then pack the deck mud around the stone/spacers. If not done, deck mud that is packed right up over the weep holes can clog the weep holes, and slow or prevent moisture water from escaping. As to the cracked grout lines at the changes of plane, that's why changes of plane (wall-wall intersections, etc) are usually caulked instead of grouted in lightweight shower construction. Here's a good reference on how to do a sloped membrane on a shower floor: Harry at Ontario Tile Sealing tile is sort of superfluous. In general, unless it's handmade or some sort of artisan tile, porcelain tile itself is pretty much waterproof. I'm not a fan of sealing grout, but that's my personal preference. If grout is sealed, a vapor permeable sealer should be used. Lastly, and going backwards a bit, cracked grout around a bench can sometimes indicate poor waterproofing. Thin hairline cracks can indicate movement cracks, but if the cracks are wide, it can sometimes indicate wet and swollen wood underneath the tile. The swelling of the wood is causing excessive movement, and thus, larger than typical cracks. Again, supposition on my part, but based on the nasties I've seen over the years...I'm simply putting them out there for your consideration....See MoreIs grout color variation normal?
Comments (7)Bill, I switched to Firefox and that seemed to help. Thanks for your generous offer to post pics. I resized to 'website size'. I've posted pics where the grout looks ok and then not ok for comparison. And while I'm being all posty, I added a the photo of my toilet that looks too far out. The work done by the guys has generally been good up to this and they took great pains to get all the tile layout just so. The overall look is great but the toilet bugs me as does the uneven grout color. Grout color looks ok here Grout color too variable Toilet too far out. Otherwise nice tile work!...See MoreTile Installation Issue - Is this normal way to install tiles?
Comments (5)I am not an expert, but I agree a bullnose would be nice. Google bullnose tile to see what that looks like if you are not familiar. I know on some kinds of tiles (maybe just natural marbles, travertine, etc, though) they can use a grinder to smooth the profile to be rounded, not sharp. Don't know if they can do that with your kind of tile, though. I am in agreement with your PB that the mitered 45 degree wouldn't be ideal, that would make a sharp edge (think about babyproofing a fireplace hearth or something, you gotta put that rubber rounded piece on it to make it safer.)...See MoreShower tile job - is this normal?
Comments (46)Jenna, keep a very careful paper/electronic trail of all your communication with the contractor. I had a contractor quit, and then later sued me saying that I fired hiim which I did not. We had a very good paper/electronic trail of all our communications proving that they quit. We prevailed in court, but we would not have if we didn't have that paper/electronic trail. If you are missing any evidence that they refused to fix, create a retro-active trail of that communication by sending an email to the contractor that says something like this: "Thank you for meeting us at the work site yesterday to discuss the poor tile placement and faulty waterproofing of the shower you built. We were really hoping that you would decide to move forward to fix the problems, but since you refused, we are now stuck in a situation where we need to hire a new contractor to re-build the shower. I would like a refund of [$$$] to cover [$$$] to re-puprchase tiles, and [$$$] to hire a new contractor to re-demo and re-build the faulty installation. Please bring a check, or mail one to [address] today." Make it *kinda *polite. Then save his response. You need a piece of the paper/electronic trail that proves that he refused to fix anything, or else he could claim that he was totally willing to fix, you were unreasonable and fired him instead. In most states you have to give the contractor a chance to fix. If they botch the fix or refuse to do anything, then you can legally fire them. That's what someone did to us, and they sued us, but we had the paper trail to show the judge that they had quit. They said it in an email plain as day and judge awarded us everything we asked for in our counter-suit. You need proof that he refused. Probably he will respond to your email in some rude way, and probably will not refute your description of him refusing to fix. That should work as proof. Sorry this has happened to you. I would post my "Goes South" story, but I have a feeling everyone is sick of it. But if you want to look it up it's called "What to do when a project goes completely SOUTH." Good luck, and take tons of photos of every layer of everything that is underneath those tiles. You may need them one day. We did....See Morejerry_t
14 years agohomebound
14 years ago
Darrell Miller
3 years ago
millworkman
3 years agoJohn S
3 years agoHi Darrell and millworkman, was wondering if you could weigh in on a more recent problem since I'm unable to start my own discussion for some reason using the app.
Are these grout lines too low? I feel them with my feet more than I thought I would. My contractor really made a mess out of my two bathrooms and kitchens and now I'm just noticing yet another problem. Any advice on how to fix? I used power grout epoxy. Can I redo just the bathroom floors without disturbing the showers as a worst case scenario?
I appreciate any help or guidance you can provide!
John S
3 years agoHi Darrell and millworkman, was wondering if you could weigh in on a more recent problem since I'm unable to start my own discussion for some reason using the app.
Are these grout lines too low? I feel them with my feet more than I thought I would. My contractor really made a mess out of my two bathrooms and kitchens and now I'm just noticing yet another problem. Any advice on how to fix? I used power grout epoxy. Can I redo just the bathroom floors without disturbing the showers as a worst case scenario?
I appreciate any help or guidance you can provide!
Darrell Miller
3 years agomillworkman
3 years agoDarrell Miller
3 years agoJohn S
3 years agoHi Darrell. Is there an easy way to tell whether crossville’s Luna moonstruck tile is rectified? The contractor leveled the floor with what I’m thinking now was a thick layer of thinset (which as I read is a no-no but I didn’t catch it in time. I think that is contributing to the lipping. Some joints are level to the tile on one side then don’t meet the other tile next to it because it’s slightly raised.
John S
3 years agoDarrell Miller
3 years agoDarrell Miller
3 years agoJohn S
3 years ago
organicnoob