Can paste used to install vinyl bleed thru as 'red' ?

edythe_2010

14 years ago

Hello -- several years ago had vinyl kitchen flooring (simulated wood pattern) installed... over time 'red' blotchy-areas started showing all over the entire flooring and the vinyl seams are pulling apart where it was 'matched' to cover full width of room ....could the 'red' bleeding be the paste that was used? Is there any danger? I do not want the original 'store' to redo the job - they tried 2 times with various 'errors' ...so we just let what they finally install stay in place until the above situations started appearing...and 'no' - we didn't throw out our money - they refunded the full amount to us since they finally acknowledged the jobs were poorly done... ... (we have the name of another place with a very good reputation. I'm sure we'll have to pay to have the existing vinyl removed by the new store) thanks in advance Edythe

Featured Answer

glennsfc

14 years ago

Don't use CAPS.

I have been in retail flooring forever. My suggestions are to help you track down the problem you are having with your flooring.

Perhaps you will want to hire an independent flooring inspector to look at your flooring and help you find the cause of the 'vinyl bleed'.

Have a nice day.

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Comments (11)

glennsfc
14 years ago
Very peculiar... Did the flooring go over a red painted substrate? Or...is anything else painted red in your house, such as a painted basement or garage floor? How about a bright red carpet?...got one of those?
edythe_2010
Original Author
14 years ago
''Very peculiar... Did the flooring go over a red painted substrate? Or...is anything else painted red in your house, such as a painted basement or garage floor? How about a bright red carpet?...got one of those? ''
--------------------
none of the above - this is in the kitchen (cement flooring) over removed old vinyl flooring(sheet) a 'levelling' compound was used first I believe to 'smooth' out the 'rough' concrete, then the 'paste' over that... Edythe
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glennsfc
14 years ago
Most peculiar... Perhaps it is some kind of mold growth. Mold under/in sheet vinyl flooring usually shows up black or green...never seen red though.

What color was the leveling compound they used?
edythe_2010
Original Author
14 years ago
Most peculiar... Perhaps it is some kind of mold growth. Mold under/in sheet vinyl flooring usually shows up black or green...never seen red though.
What color was the leveling compound they used?
------------------------------------------
nope this is definitely 'reddish' - sort of a 'faded' color tho..not 'bold deep red''...no definite 'boarders' to the 'spots' - sort of 'bleeding' type of look as if liquid was spilled and spread but it's not on the surface - nothing 'wet' to the touch ... no black/green...
Dont know what color levelling compound used ...
Next floor i purchase i will only agree to use the store if they deliver the compound (paste/levelling) manufacturerd 'or' recommended by the flooring manufacturer which of course i will check-out personally.
I will also make sure it is a 'sealed' bucket also only to be opened at my home. Didn't do that originally so who knows 'what' gradation/product was used but the flooring was a major manufacturer but they're not responsible for installation - i understand that - floor installed a good 3 yrs i think...been living with this 'floor' as is but obviously it's gotten much worse within last year - didn't show all of these 'defects' for quite a while after installation. Thanks again - Edythe
glennsfc
14 years ago
If they used a white compound, then that may be the cause of your problem...micro-organisms love that stuff.

Still...this could be a 'trafficking' problem. You may be walking a staining substance off some surface and bringing that onto your floor; that is why I asked about any walking surface that might be red in color. What about driveway sealer? Do you regularly use that black stuff to seal a driveway? Red socks, maybe? Cheap, walking shoes with rubber soles made in China?
edythe_2010
Original Author
14 years ago
If they used a white compound, then that may be the cause of your problem...micro-organisms love that stuff. I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO SAY ...COULD YOU EXPLAIN?
Still...this could be a 'trafficking' problem. You may be walking a staining substance off some surface and bringing that onto your floor; that is why I asked about any walking surface that might be red in color. NO RED SURFACES NEARBY -JUST CARPET... What about driveway sealer? DRIVEWAY HASN'T BEEN RESEALED IN YEARS...Do you regularly use that black stuff to seal a driveway? HASN'T BEEN SEALED IN YEARS Red socks, maybe? DON'T OWN RED SOCKS NO Cheap, walking shoes with rubber soles made in China? HOW WOULD I KNOW 'WHERE' SHOES ARE MANUFACTURED? AND WOULDN'T THEY HAVE TO HAVE RED SOLES? NONE DO...CURIOUS ARE YOU A PROFESSIONAL INSTALLER? HOW ARE YOU ARRIVING AT THESE SUGGESTIONS? I'M CURIOUS TO GET OTHER IDEAS FROM THE READERS AT THIS SITE ... THANK YOU.
edythe_2010
Original Author
14 years ago
''Perhaps you will want to hire an independent flooring inspector to look at your flooring and help you find the cause of the 'vinyl bleed'.
------------------------------------
Hello - are you being cryptic and suggesting it could be a vinyl 'defect' ? that would be amazing since the sheet vinyal is a well-known manufacutrer's product!! ..but anway i'm sure the manuf. would disavow liability, claiming 'installation caused this problem.'' LOL ... only reason i wouldn't hire an inspector is that we ended up not paying for the floor - the store refunded our full deposit (after 2 tries to install sheet-vinyl with 2 different installers and admitting each attempt was terrible.) So at this point the best thing i think is to replace this floor via local recommendations and not deal with a 'chain' (not a 'box-store')... but an 'independent chain' . They were nice and apologetic and probably would attempt a 3rd try but i said 'thank you - but no thank-you' ...LOL ... thanks again for your replies.
echoflooring
14 years ago
I would guess they may have used a latex based patch. Your floor I bet is allowing moisture (not moisture that you can see or feel), just a type of vapor to rise through the slab, causing mildew growth under the vinyl, thus staining the vinyl. Some times, this moisture release can be seasonal based on outside temperature. Especially if frost occurs in your area. A moisture test should be taken on the cement before re-installing the vinyl. A cement based patch must be used. If it is continuing to occur, I would bet anything it is home condition and not installation. I am not saying that every precaution or test was properly taken, but I do believe something with that slab is causing the staining. It can at time be tough to determine. I would probably run from it as a carpet store, or i would skim that cement with a quality portland based patch, then use a good loose laid vinyl (Airstep Plus perhaps)...I do believe they warrant against staining from under (which is a foolish warranty IMO). I am not 100% sure on that , but I do know there are some vinyls today that warrant against it. Oh, by the way, Glen's post is right on the money.
edythe_2010
Original Author
14 years ago
would guess they may have used a latex based patch. WHILE GLENN DIDN'T LIKE CAPS, THERE IS NO OTHER WAY TO 'DISTINGUISH' MY REPLY AND IT'S TOO CUMBERSOME TO WRITE A NEW PARAGRAPH UNDER THIS ONE (OR ANY ANSWER) ...ANYWAY I DO REMEMBER THEY PATCHED WITH CEMENT...Your floor I bet is allowing moisture (not moisture that you can see or feel), just a type of vapor to rise through the slab, causing mildew growth under the vinyl, thus staining the vinyl. Some times, this moisture release can be seasonal based on outside temperature. Especially if frost occurs in your area. FLOOR IS IN THE SOUTH - HOT/HUMID..ANY FROST IS ONLY ABOUT 1-2 DAYS AT MOST 1X YEAR A moisture test should be taken on the cement before re-installing the vinyl. O.K.A cement based patch must be used. O.K. If it is continuing to occur, I would bet anything it is home condition and not installation. I am not saying that every precaution or test was properly taken, but I do believe something with that slab is causing the staining. It can at time be tough to determine. I would probably run from it as a carpet store, or i would skim that cement with a quality portland based patch, then use a good loose laid vinyl (Airstep Plus perhaps)...I do believe they warrant against staining from under (which is a foolish warranty IMO). I am not 100% sure on that , but I do know there are some vinyls today that warrant against it. Oh, by the way, Glen's post is right on the money. NOT BOTHERING TO CONTACT MFG - WE DIDN'T PAY FOR THE FLOOR - PRIOR VINYL WAS IN SAME AREA WITH NO PROBLEMS ...SO IF IT IS AN 'ATMOSPHERIC' PROBLEM THAT FLOOR NEVER SHOWED PROBLEMS... thanks anyway ... we'll just let a new store do the job (after checking references)and seeing the paste-bucket with the flooring manufacturer logo 'unopened' !! appreciate all the help !
susanjn
14 years ago
Edythe,

Using all caps is considered shouting in email and forums.

Your previous responses with the ----- between looked nice and were easy to read.

Susan

Can paste used to install vinyl bleed thru as 'red' ?

glennsfc

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Can paste used to install vinyl bleed thru as 'red' ?

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