Stove pipe question. Am I being had?

18 years ago

I purchased a harman oakwood in November from the only local dealer in my area to replace my existing stove (came with the house and did not know about it and wanted a non cat stove). When I was at the dealer I told him that there was about a 6 inch decorative box coming from the ceiling about 5 inchs from the pipe, and he said it would not be an issue. When the installer arrived on 12/28(same guy I spoke with at the dealer) he said it was an issue, but it would only be about 100-150 dollars to fix. He was going to put a double wall pipe or triple wall pipe the length of the six inch overhang to the triple wall pipe in the ceiling. I was fine with that because I want it to be safe and up to code. He left and said he would call within the hour to give me a final estimate. Well, never called and I spoke to him this AM after a few follow-up calls. My 150 dollars turned into 1,500 dollars. Apparently he says that the entire piping has to be replaced because no EPA certified stove can use the triple walled stove pipe that I have and the entire length needs to be replaced to the chimney. What I do not understand is he knew it was all triple wall pipe when he was at my house on the 28th. He never said anything about it then. He now says to me that the my triple wall pipe with air between each layer is a fire hazard and do not use stove untill it is replaced. Your help is much appreciated as I am a novice with this, but have been using the stove regularly for 3 yrs without a problem. I have had it cleaned twice by certified sweeps, and the only issue was that of the 6 inch overhang. None of them mentioned anything about the triple wall pipe.

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Comments (9)

Xanndra
18 years ago
I would get a second or even third estimate.
tsco29
18 years ago
Something definately doesn't sound right about this one. I never heard of an EPA certified stove not being allow to use triple wall pipe. Harman's Oakwood Owners manual talks about clearences with double and single wall pipe. Triple wall pipe is just making everything safer....i think this installer needs to go back and take his certification again for wood stoves.
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The refusal of the chimney sweep company to work on the open fire pit strongly suggests that the entire set up is not code compliant. Many non-compliant installations are grandfathered, but once there is any new work done, everything must be brought up to code. What your insurance company might have to say is another matter entirely. They do not have to continue insurance for anything they deem unsafe even if it is grandfathered under local and/or state building codes. A close look at the transition piece from the stove pipe to the Class A does not inspire confidence, to put it mildly, in the entire installation. The bottom of any transition piece should fit within the pipe below it, not be wrapped around the outside. As far as I can see, there are no sheet metal screws holding anything together. Relying on friction to keep everything in place is truly dangerous. If the rest of the installation displays an equally cavalier attitude toward basic safety issues such as clearances to flammable surfaces, I would definitely not use this as a wood burning appliance. It will probably be difficult to check clearances, but it really should be done. Even triple wall pipe needs some space between anything flammable and the pipe surface. A proper transition piece also needs to be installed. The people at Northline Express or Woodman's Parts are very knowledgeable and should be able to help you identify the brand of what you have and suggest what you need. Whether all this is worth doing for what certainly seems to be a very iffy set up is, imho, a very real question.
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Xanndra
18 years ago
Since we can't see the actual pipe, we don't know if there are installation issues such as improper clearances/material/condition or if there wasn't any way to connect another piece of triple-wall due to unavailability of that particular brand. There are just so many things that could be affecting this which is why I said to get a couple more estimates. I would NOT assume that they are trying to rip him off unless I had a couple more installers inspect it and say something contrary.
sbors
Original Author
18 years ago
xanndra, I appreciate your insight to these posts. The installer was quite clear in the fact that his issue was with the triple wall pipe and it not meeting any of the "code" requirements of modern day stoves. Is this a true fact? Is it a current NFPA standard that all new chimney stove pipes must be double wall and not tripple wall? He told me that there is still heat transfer since there is only air between the three walls and not insulation. If any one has any information on this claim it would be appreciated. Am I to assume that all stoves that were at one time installed with triple wall pipe are now a hazard?
kyrsyan
18 years ago
sbors, Depending on how old the original stove is the pipe it use may not longer be usable by any stove. As Xanndra said, it could be any of a variety of items up to and including, the pipe is no longer considered safe or has not been tested for the stove you installed or is no longer manufactured. Without being able to actually examine your existing pipe there really can't be a firmer answer. Your best bet, if you do not trust your current installer, is to contact another store and see if they will inspect the install/pipe and give you their opinion.
jjj123
18 years ago
Was just looking at duravent plus pipe made by Simpson myself for a stove i'm considering buying and this is also triple wall pipe for corn or wood pellet stoves; i sure hope this stuff also is legit else why are they selling this stuff? I would assume it qualifies for code standards provided it is ok per stove manufacturer and code requirements it states to be used for corn or wood pellet stoves?
berlin
18 years ago
something that needs to be clarified is that generally tripple wall is not inherently safer; tripple wall pipe is generally uninsulated and each wall is separated by an air space, whereas double wall pipe is generally two walls separated by a very effective insulation and is generally more common today. there are of course exceptions such as double wall gas vent, tripple insulated for special apps etc. however most commonly for residential woodstoves what i metioned above generally holds true.
birdgardner
18 years ago
Call your town's building inspector and ask what the local code is.
mountainstoveguy
18 years ago
Dura plus is not a true triple wall, its a insulated pipe with one air cooled chamber, it gives you a 2100 degree rating opposed to 1800 degree rating on duratech. Dura plus is a bit safer because it will contain a chimney fire longer. But i sell duratech 90 percent of the time. When i first started reading this post i thought the triple wall pipe thats already there might be to big for the stove he picked out, a valid reason to change the pipe. I have never heard in my area that triple wall is not ok for woodstoves. Just usually not praticle.

Stove pipe question. Am I being had?

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