sshrivastava - Soft Water DW Etching question
peggross1
16 years ago
Featured Answer
Sort by:Oldest
Comments (44)
nwesterner
16 years agoRelated Discussions
Miele Inspira, Advanta dishwasher Q's: cleaning, drying, etching?
Comments (8)I'll give you my thoughts based on what I have read and my experience with my prior Miele DW purchased in 1996 and my current LaPerla purchased in 2006(Kitchen remodel), so this is not to be taken as "official" Miele speak. All of the models use condensation type drying, however most of the models also use a technique that uses a fan which makes the drying better. The Advanta does not use a fan. It just sits there - thus the phrase passive - it does nothing to help things along. You can open the door and that might help it a bit. The other models use the fan technique, speeding the drying and helping to remove the moisture better. The inspira, Optima and all the models up the line use the fan. I don't think etching is unique to Miele DW because almost every detergent and rinse aid now claims to have some etch protection agent in it. Soft water combined with higher temps can speed the process. Some of the programs on the Miele DW use HOT water. You can connect it to cold water if you want to because it will heat it to the required temperature. Pots and Pans is around 168F to 170F, Sani cycle is also this hot. Heavy Soil is 150F. There is a program named Normal which is designed to clean most loads. I think it's temp is 130F. There is a china crystal program(Optima models and up) that uses 115F water. There are other options but you will pay slightly more for them. Starting with the OPTIMA the machines use sensors to vary the water temp according to the soil level. The programs will then operate in temperature ranges. For example if you use the Normal cycle it's max range will be 130F but if the soil level is light the temperature will be less than that. This helps reduce the chance of etching and improves energy usage. When you get to the Excella and LaPerla these have additional cycles that use lower ranges (104F through 120F) and take less time, but which will still clean a load. Miele describes these cycles as using their "glass care system" - (whatever) - designed to clean but be easier on glass. I used one today on a dirty mixed load and everything came out spotless. These models also have additional sensors which will adjust the number of water changes and match the water taken for each fill to the load size, and will also reduce or increase the cycle time based on soil level. The built in water softener is offered on the models starting with the Optima. This softener is not like those of the past or the one that was on my prior model. This one measures your water hardness as it is running in and will adjust it only as much as it needs to be, so that you don't get very very soft water being mixed with detergent and hot water. I wonder if the prevalence of etching has been caused by the way glasses are being made today? Or maybe it's enzyme detergents? Etching seems like a big issue now but I don't remember hearing that much about it in past years. Pre rinsing. I have never done it. Not with the model in 1996 a G885 and not with this one. I just scrape the food off the plate and load it in. I don't even do a rinse hold and sometime let everything sit inside for a day or two and everything comes out fine. And like aflowerfreak said most new DW don't require you to rinse before you load. There are others on the forum with this brand and the models you are considering so I am sure you'll get more input....See MoreIs a DW rinse agent necessary with soft water?
Comments (7)It seems like if you're satisfied with the performance without a rinse agent then it's not necessary. I never used one until I got a Miele that said it was absolutely necessary. Hmmmm....maybe if I quit using that the Miele would stop etching my glassware....that's one option I haven't tried....See MoreNew Bosch 800 Plus DW - Water Spots??
Comments (8)Misunderstood method of testing for softness. Would prefer more precise method but what you've described is, essentially, "no reading" so I think assumption of soft OK. Also agree from your description the heat is OK. Keying on your last post, got a couple of ideas that would be easy to try and maybe tell the tale. If you have soft water and are using whole tabs, that's likely about 4x overdose. If you're willing, I would suggest this experiment: 1) Turn your rinse aid dispenser off. 2) Load machine as you usually do including a bunch of glasses. Select the same cycle you always use. 3) Use scant teaspoon of some powdered DW detergent in the pre-wash; heaping teaspoon in main wash. Don't care what powder used but do NOT use tabs and do NOT use more than this. 4) When the final rinse fills and starts, open the door and quickly add about 4-5 drops of rinse aid manually, then close door and complete the cycle. Obviously, I'm thinking maybe detergent residue or conflict with the rinse aid which, itself, may not be dispensing properly. I predict this experiment will show you clean dishes dishes with no spots on your glasses. If you choose to do it, please return and say what observed....See MoreWould like feedback on appliances
Comments (4)We bought a Bosch for our former house when the Aska Asea failed in less then four years. We bought the top of the line (this would be about 1997?) and it was SUPERB. Flexible loading and everything came out clean. Unfortunately we chose to leave it with the house. We replaced the terrible GE dishwasher in the next house with the top-of-the-line Bosch....but guess what? It doesn't load as easily and it does NOT always get the dishes clean. The top rack is now VERY hard to remove and replace...it always takes me five minutes. My son and a friend both bought a cheaper Bosch model. One says the dishes are always clean. My son refuses to rinse the dishes as much as I do...and his dishes do NOT come clean. I probably would not buy another Bosch dishwasher...and it pains me greatly to say that. I would not be tempted to have a dishwasher in a drawer near the dining room. One house we considered actually had 2.5 dishwashers....one in the kitchen at the normal height, one raised about a foot (which a friend has, and it makes loading SO easy!), and one in a sink in the butler's pantry. Read the reviews carefully and make sure you're looking at reviews of CURRENT models. I only wish I could buy back my old Bosch.......See Morenwesterner
16 years agodadoes
16 years agoUser
16 years agojobird
16 years agojobird
16 years agorococogurl
16 years agoeandhl
16 years agovillandry
16 years agosparky823
16 years agovillandry
16 years agopeggross1
16 years agovillandry
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agovillandry
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agosshrivastava
16 years agovillandry
16 years agomando_p
16 years agopeggross1
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agopeggross1
16 years agonwesterner
16 years agovillandry
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agopeggross1
16 years agonwesterner
16 years agovillandry
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agovillandry
16 years agopeggross1
16 years agoUser
16 years ago3katz4me
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agosshrivastava
16 years agopatsyann
16 years agojerrod6
16 years agolooser
16 years agosshrivastava
16 years agorolls_rapide
16 years ago3katz4me
16 years agojuliettls
6 years ago
Related Stories
GREEN BUILDINGConsidering Concrete Floors? 3 Green-Minded Questions to Ask
Learn what’s in your concrete and about sustainability to make a healthy choice for your home and the earth
Full StoryGREAT HOME PROJECTSHow to Switch to a Tankless Water Heater
New project for a new year: Swap your conventional heater for an energy-saving model — and don’t be fooled by misinformation
Full StoryBEDROOMSDreaming in Color: 10 Beautiful Blue Bedrooms
Whether soft and sleepy or bold and splashy, see why blue can be the perfect hue in your bedroom
Full StoryHOUSEKEEPINGDishwasher vs. Hand-Washing Debate Finally Solved — Sort Of
Readers in 8 countries weigh in on whether an appliance saves time, water and sanity or if washing by hand is the only saving grace
Full StoryHOUSEKEEPINGHow to Clean Marble Countertops and Tile
Acidic solutions can damage your marble surfaces. Here’s how to keep marble looking clean and amazing
Full StoryHOUSEKEEPINGHow to Clean Grout — Stains and All
If your grout is grossing you out, this deep-cleaning method will help it look new again
Full StoryKITCHEN DESIGNUsing White Marble: Hot Debate Over a Classic Beauty
Do you love perfection or patina? Here's how to see if marble's right for you
Full StoryHOUSEKEEPINGTackle Big Messes Better With a Sparkling-Clean Dishwasher
You might think it’s self-cleaning, but your dishwasher needs regular upkeep to keep it working hard for you
Full StoryREMODELING GUIDESWhy Marble Might Be Wrong for Your Bathroom
You love its beauty and instant high-quality appeal, but bathroom marble has its drawbacks. Here's what to know before you buy
Full StoryKITCHEN DESIGNHow to Keep Your White Kitchen White
Sure, white kitchens are beautiful — when they’re sparkling clean. Here’s how to keep them that way
Full Story
sparky823