I suggest changes to the upstairs bedrooms. For the bedroom on the right, I would take out the bath over the foyer and use that space for a walk in closet. That makes that room a great size. For the bedroom on the left, I would switch the closet and the bathroom, making the bathroom with a hall entry. For one preteen, there will be no competition for the bath unless guests are visiting. Meanwhile, you can use the extra space in the right bedroom instead of having a bathroom that is infrequently used.

I don't know about the shared bath. I guess it depends on how often you have guests. . . I like my guests to have a seperate bath and not share with a child. We do have occasional overnight female babysitters as well as our teenage niece and we have all boys so I think a seperate attached bath is a plus. I do have a concern about the window on the south wall in that bedroom. I presume it was put there not for light purposes but for exterior purposes?

I would consider either moving it to the far left in the alcove - might be nice if you put a cozy chair in there. Otherwise I would eliminate it or do what we had to do (which actually worked great for us), and put a false window with closed shutters on the outside so we wouldn't have a long stretch with no windows (it is a prominent area of our house overlooking our friends porch approach). This would improve your bed wall greatly!

{{gwi:1477036}}

Need to go back to kindergarten I guess :)

I'm confused. Do you have 'two kitchens'? What use is the vacant area left of the kitchen table?

How do you enter the house coming from the garage? What's the path to the kitchen to bring in groceries?

Where is the 'family entry door'? Is there a 'back hall/mudroom' there, with a powder room?

How do you access the screened porch? Via the 'mudroom'??

Do you need a coat closet in the foyer? (Ours goes unused.)

You don't have enough room for the furniture sketched in the 'hearth room'. You need more than three feet walk-though behind that sofa. What use is that portion of the island behind the sofa? (IS that an island?)

Where will your family 'live'? I suspect it's the hearth room, and that LR and DR will be wasted space that you just clean.

I don't like a straight run of stairs with no landing.

The MBR is HUGE. Doesn't need to be once you have a walk-in closet. What will you do in there besides sleep? Do you really want an 'office' accessed via your MBR?

To be frank, there's very little I like (or understand?)about this plan.

Chisue thanks for the thought provoking questions. Here are some answers, not meant to be defensive, rather as explanations for why we chose this plan and why we made some of the changes we did.

1) Do you have 'two kitchens'? What use is the vacant area left of the kitchen table? No, its the "cleanup" area or baking area or Im not really sure. Pretty much anything in this HR/kitchen can be rearranged. My only true requirement of this "hearth room" is that we maintain natural light from the south and get natural light from either north or west also. (I hate a dark dreary kitchen, and this end of the current house is already inherently dark so Im trying to do everything to avoid that.) Ideas welcome!

2) How do you enter the house coming from the garage? What's the path to the kitchen to bring in groceries? Here is an elevation shot to help. We enter the house from garage through the deck/screened porch from the south side (stairs are there). I didnt draw a door, I guess. Groceries will come in either this way or through the front door (parking area there and I rarely park in the garage unless its snowing.)

3) Where is the 'family entry door'? Is there a 'back hall/mudroom' there, with a powder room? Family entry door is through the screened porch and/or mudroom. I put mudroom where it is b/c I dont want to see any of the junk/coats/shoes that DH & DD tend to drop on the floor the second they walk in; but I also want to have an unobstructed view through to the screened porch and outside.

Close up of hearth room/mudroom:

4) How do you access the screened porch? Via the 'mudroom'?? Yes, sort of - through the opening and French doors to the left of the fireplace. Mudroom is behind FP to minimize loss of possible windows/natural light and to keep junk hidden. The little "vestibule" to mudroom is, again, to try to keep that "long view" open.

5) Do you need a coat closet in the foyer? (Ours goes unused.) In my current house, we are suffering from a serious lack of any closet space i.e., the vacuum cleaner usually just sits in the corner of the FR b/c theres nowhere to store it. We live in the Northeast and have lots of coats/hats, etc. We are also "dump it at the closest spot" kind of people so it will be unrealistic to expect my family members to take extra coats or boots upstairs to personal closets. I see this hall one as the "dress coat" or "guest coat" closet.

6) You don't have enough room for the furniture sketched in the 'hearth room'. You need more than three feet walk-though behind that sofa. What use is that portion of the island behind the sofa? (IS that an island?) Yes, its an island. This wont really be used as a family room per se. I really dislike TV, especially in the kitchen. But youre right, theres not enough room for the furniture as is. Another reason Im asking for suggestions in this area!

7) Where will your family 'live'? I suspect it's the hearth room, and that LR and DR will be wasted space that you just clean. Nope to the wasted space. I cant wait for a LR/DR! Yes, we will probably spend a lot of time in the hearth room. But I had a DR in my Minnesota house and we used it every day. I dont have one now and its one of the major things I hate about this house. I also have nice LR furniture currently sitting in a storage container because I dont have a LR anymore, and I miss it. I am not a "clean" cook I like to cook and then move away from the mess to another spot to eat in peace and then later relax, watch a movie, whatever, without all the clutter. We usually clean hours later or the next morning. Sorry, thats just us, and a new house isnt going to change our habits. Also, LR will probably have hidden TV in it; and I like a "pretty" uncluttered LR for holidays like Christmas.

8) The MBR is HUGE. Doesn't need to be once you have a walk-in closet. What will you do in there besides sleep? Yes, it is right now but Im assuming a lot of that space will be taken up with the closet/bath once its drawn in. I also love to stretch out on a clean made-up bed and read or do laptop work etc during the day. In my previous homes, about 50% of my awake time was spent between kitchen and bedroom.

9) Do you really want an 'office' accessed via your MBR? We are both professionals and have a boatload of books to store. I dont see anywhere downstairs in this plan for that or for an office. Also DH often does computer-type work from home in the evening, so it seemed to make sense he could be in there and I could be reading in bed.

Anyway, please keep the suggestions coming especially in regards to the kitchen/HR/mudroom. It can all be rearranged however. Im very uncreative that way so open to all suggestions.

As far as furniture goes, that is one thing I can do (floor plans not so much!). Yes, there is insufficient room for a walkway behind the island and NO room for stools, etc. However, you leave a lot of area between the club chairs and the fireplace/wall. We have club chairs flanking our fireplace and they are now less than 2 feet from the wall, but angled, with an ottoman in the middle. The ottoman is almost (3 or 4 inches) from the hearth. You can easily do this if the hearth is flush . . . it reads as having more room since the hearth takes up almost 2 feet. Definitely do a flush hearth for this reason.

Also there seems to be SO much space devoted to kitchen and not nearly enough to living. Do you really want/need that much cabinetry (very expensive) ? Wouldn't you rather have a large walk in pantry (very cheap) and less cabinetry?

I would rather you move the kitchen over towards the breakfast area and open up the hearth room to the entire space . . .

Thanks athensmom.

Does no one else have any ideas or opinions? I was hoping to hear from some of the architects and designers on this forum. Is the plan really that awful? This is a Russell Versaci design.

I know it's not a perfect plan, and I'm sure we will need to compromise somewhere. And like I said before, anything in that HR/kitchen is completely flexible. I just stuffed things in there to fill up the space. Please help!

What are your needs/wants? Do you really want a huge living room and very little space devoted to casual living? And a huge expensive but inefficient kitchen because it is spread across the length of the house?

Why did you choose this plan? What drew you to it?

I'm not an architect or designer, but I play one on my own build.... :) So, here are my humble 2 cents. A custom home is custom to the homeowner, and although we may have ideas on how spaces should layout, you ultimately know best whether it will work for your family. I think some of the comments are based on the fact that this floorplan seems out of line with the current tend toward eliminating less used formal spaces. The majority of your floorplan is dedicated to the dining room and large living room, and you have your kitchen, hearth room and casual eating area shoved into the old footprint of your house. If you live like this and spend the majority of your time in your living room and dining room, then this seems like a good floorplan for you. For me personally, since we spend so much time in the kitchen, the rooms that are open to the kitchen would get the most use and dedicated space. Also, I just like being around people/my family when I am home, and I am not a fan of isolated spaces. Even if we aren't in the same room, I like feeling connected by having open sight lines into other rooms. We have some smaller nooks in the house (a la the "away spaces" in the Not So Big House" concept). I think the idea is that common open spaces should be the larger spaces in the home, and the smaller quiet spaces should be the smaller spaces in the home. In your plan (and I'm really not trying to be critical), it's the opposite. Your common (kitchen, hearth, and casual eating) is shoved into a smaller footprint, and the two isolated formal spaces take up a lot of room. Again though, it sounds like you have a more formal lifestyle, so this may suit you.

Anyway, some more specific comments about your floorplan--I don't like the idea of having to go through the screened in porch to get to the mudroom. If your hands are full, then that is 2 doors you have to open to get inside. Also, I'd turn your kitchen 90 degrees so that it is running the length between your dining room and mudroom. Right now it is very odd how you have to walk right through the kitchen to get to the rest of that space. Plus, it would create weird traffic flow issues. You should ask the Kitchen forum about that. They are great. By doing that, you could move that fireplace and put an entry to the mudroom there and eliminate the jog in your mudroom, getting rid of that inefficient L configuration for your mudroom that eats into your screened in porch. I personally prefer the opening to the living room in the original plan. I think that stairs are beautiful and that it would be nice to see the staircase from the living room. I agree with keeping the separate guest bath. I'd put the W/D against the wall and not against the window. That way you could probably have a bigger window. I do like all the windows on this plan. Good luck!

I find it puzzling that homeowners so often feel they need to present an architect with a completed design thereby failing to avail themselves of experienced professional design advice.

Unless the architect is incompetent or just a draftsperson pretending to be an architect, I recommend working on the the "program" and asking the architect to put it all together.

This rarely happens to me but when it does we usually have to go back and start the design process again.

Thanks for answeing my questions. I hope an architect can do something much better for you. This doesn't work on too many levels.

You may be trying too hard to 'use' the portion of the house you are required to keep standing. We did a teardown and only had to keep a chimney. We kept the basement and did some crawls off it.

I would never have a house without a 'back hall' to contain 'the mess'. That's where we have a huge closet tohold family coats, some staples, ironing board, mops, central vac hose, etc. Wall hooks take in-season coats and hats. There's a powder room at one end. (This is the most-used toilet in our house.) Access to our garage, kitchen, and back yard are all through this space. I wash our Westie's paws in the laundry tub in the laundry room end of the hall. Outgoing mail, library books, cell phones, etc. have a home on a countertop in there.

This plan has you trekking across the kitchen with groceries. Your DH and DD will trek to use the powder room -- small and inconveniently located.

We have a 'library' -- where we watch TV! -- and a LR, where we read! (Go figure.) Anyway we do use both spaces daily. If you are going to Dine in your Dining Room daily, fine. But then you probably only need some bar stools in the kitchen and can have a much larger 'hearth room'. We have breakfast, lunch and dinner in our 'Breakfast Room' (seats six comfortably) unless we have company.

Perhaps your climate isn't 'screen porch friendly'? There's no place for table and chairs if you wanted to eat out there, and the egress is awkward.

How about making your kitchen in the 'top' part of the drawing and switching LR and DR/butler's pantry. Then you'd have lots of 'hearth room' and traffic could flow between it and the LR without crossing the kitchen.

IMO having a sightline from entry door to rear is not all that attractive unless the perspective widens out from the entry door -- isn't constrained through a narrow hallway.

(Sometimes when you don't get a lot of replies it's because people don't think a plan could work.)

One thing you might want to work out before the meeting is the main stairway. It will need to have at least one more tread if the first floor ceiling height is 8 ft. or greater and the second floor stair opening will need to be about 2 ft longer in order to provide adequate headroom and, of course, to meet any building code that might be in effect.

It's difficult to understand the design with so much cabinet information. That level of detail seems premature. The mud room is puzzling. It might help to indicate doors and windows.

I would try to avoid putting a toilet over the living room or at least avoid bends and horizontal waste runs.

bump

So here is a revised version based on our conversations. Thanks gobruno and chisue for some great suggestions. Weve moved the kitchen and hearth and increased the porch size. I agree with you gobruno about keeping the original opening to the LR. My reason for closing it like I did was that I didnt want to walk in the front door and have it feel like Im walking directly into a LR. I never thought about having a view of the staircase! Something Ive always wanted is a lovely staircase and railing to decorate at Christmas. Now I can have that!

Also thanks for the explanation about why people are moving away from formal plans. Maybe I shouldve posted on the Old House forum instead. :-) Ive read the recent thread on open plans becoming passé, and many things listed there are why we choose to keep to a more formal plan. Call me old-fashioned but my intent has always been to build a new "old house." What drew us to this plan was precisely the historical vernacular of it. We chose this one in particular because we are limited to building within our current footprint, and this is the one that "fits" best. Maybe thats not the "right" reason, but it is what it is. We cannot afford to do a completely custom through an architect and yes, weve already researched that route, gotten several quotes, and its just not in the budget or timeframe we have.

One thing the architect suggested was making the LR smaller and adding a sunroom/study along the front of house. I cant decide if I like that or not. Anyone care to comment on the new layout?

Revised kitchen/mudroom/porch:

With sunroom (porch/mudroom would be as above):

jenswrens-
Definitely like the revised kitchen/hearthroom much better. Have you considered eliminating the informal dining area in this space? Here's my thought process: 1) You say you use your formal dining room everyday (I'm guessing for dinner each evening vs. breakfast & lunch which tend to be more informal & would most likely be eaten in the informal space). 2) The kitchen island is now over 11 ft long (definitely a plus in my book--love the work space!) which can easily provide seating for 5. Add in the informal dining area as drawn on the plan now & you have 3 designated eating spaces. Do you need 3 designated eating spaces? Eliminating the informal dining area & utilizing the island & the dining room for eating spaces would allow you to use that whole space on the south side for the hearth room. If you wanted extra "table seating" in that area, you could go with a smaller round "bar table". Friends of ours put one in the corner of their hearth room & it works out great for board/card games, puzzles, etc. without it appearing as "dining space".

I'd also consider making the closet in the hearth room a built-in. Putting in a set of glass french doors between the hearth room & living room where the closet currently is would be another option. Glass French doors would allow a wider view to the rear of the house from the front door while still allowing for separation between the 2 rooms.

The office through the master bedroom idea: I like it. Like you, my husband & I are both professionals & need the office space. I find I am drawn to plans that have the office space adjacent to the bedroom-probably because it will be a short trek to bed when I finish up my work for the evening. But it could also allow for conversation between the two rooms if the door is open (i.e. Did you remember to pack the kids' lunches?, Have you seen my book?, Where can I find the printer paper?, etc)

Looks like you are on the right track!

Is it logical to expect your family to make 'an end run' from the garage to where you have positioned the mudroom?

I'm still trying to get your family from the garage or back yard into the kitchen via a 'mudroom' with storage and a toilet and sink. Is it impossible to either move the garage to the north side of the house or to flip this plan?

Could you incorporate the portion that is now labled porch; push kitchen and hearth room east; place rear entry/mudroom/storage/toilet in the middle of the house? Screen the deck?

Maybe this car-to-house route is just MY obsession! LOL

I agree with Mydreamhome about not needing three eating areas. A small kitchen table could still be used for homework, crafts, puzzles.

I'm no fan of offices off master bedrooms. I don't want to be disturbed, or TO disturb if I'm working late -- or early. Our MBR is for *sleeping*. All clothing is in closets. (No dressers in the BR.) You have a 'spare BR' that could be used as an office.

I'd skip the 'sunroom'. Let the sun just come into a larger, unpartitioned LR. I like the more open LR too -- the foyer will add visual space to it.