At this point the CC is out for me. I get the whole cooks over looks thing but I do have my limit and I have reached it.

I was going to post again right after my first post but the software rejected my post.

This goes beyond "looks" and impedes on function.

Can you place a skillet bigger than 12 inches?

Can you drag pots across that divider? without horribly scratching it?

They need to look at the BS and come up with something similar.

The 30" is the biggest seller.

My eye keeps getting drawn to the center pull out handle on the drip tray and to me it really looks out of place. The style isn't even the same as the main handle. It's very sleek and slim and I believe there's a gap in the middle, kind of looks like a kitchen cupboard handle which could clash with your own cupboard/drawer handles. Would look a lot better if there were no handle.

Nothing to add but agreement. Not only ugly but doesn't make sense with that height. And for the first time I'm agreeing with the opinions on the drip tray handle. No handle at all would look a lot nicer and cleaner.

deeageaux - For future reference you just need to change the subject line in order to post back to back on a thread.

I don't care for the center strip either but ... isn't that exactly what Bluestars have? Now, I've never thought Bluestars were attractive either - partly because of that strip and partly, well ... the dodgy finishing (aka personal preferences, I guess).

But anyhow ...
Exhibit A.
and Exhibit B.

The mind envisions one Surjit Kalsi getting a panicked midnight call on the red phone from a certain "Mister Lawson" from Massachusetts.

Raymond Loewy, where are you?

mindstorm,

I think everyone here is considering the RNB.

I have not seen a 30" RCS in a store or for sale in while.

Plessers has a few 36" left.

Here is a link that might be useful: Exhibit Correct

Isn't the BS RCS the sorta entry level BS? The CC is not entry level its the 'IT' range. Even so the strip on the RCS is flat which would be preferable.

While I can live with the center drip pan handle I assumed there would be 2 one for each set of burners, like is on the larger ranges.

Heck even most of the 2k ranges at lowes have continuous grates!

I'm sure this isn't the case but it almost seems like "well it's only the 30" so it doesn't matter". Can you just picture how nasty and scratched up that center piece will get?

I have already ordered the 30" but need to rethink that.

The Culinarian is such a nice range but there are all these little niggling things on the 30 -- on the manual you cannot get a gliding oven rack. The door handle and the handle on the pullout tray just don't seem to work together. The knobs are a little "different" from what we're used to seeing on the other pro ranges. And now-- this center filler piece --

It is ironic that at the very moment Blue Star is fixing some of the annoyances and looking better, the CC (at least the 30) is exhibiting some significant (taken cumulatively) aesthetic/design inhibitors.

You all may want to see the pictures in the following referenced post in another thread regarding how BS addresses the space between the burners on the 30" range.

FWIW, BS appears to have continuous grates, same height, same color, same material, etc.

RE: Can someone clarify: Is Bluestar doing a 'Fix'? (Follow-Up #43)
posted by: carecooks on 07.13.2010 at 05:09 pm in Appliances Forum

sayde,

I agree it is ironic, although I love the knobs, and I don't expect any range to be 100% looks wise, the bar in the center kills it. The range is rounded and smooth then this square hunk of metal, doesn't match the rest of the range in form or color. What are they thinking? Hey we have super open burners so it doesn't matter?If they are going to go this rout might as well get a BS.

We have already ordered the slate slabs for each side of the range a Liebherr fridge, marble backsplash and new tile for the floor, oh and the new range hood is installed. Obviously the almond colored Kenmore ain't gonna work.

The thing I am most frustrated about is now I don't have a range to buy.

I could buy a Wolf I suppose but it is a lot of money for a range I don't love. A red BS was worth it to me. I could redo my layout and plan for a wall oven and cooktop. I could just buy a Berta, an NXR or some very inexpensive range until things sort themselves out.

I guess I am glad that I have not ordered my cabinets.

1st post at gardenweb.

Odiegirl13, I wouldn't accept this. I think you should call Trevor and get him involved. It seems the problem is that the oven is too big for 4 burners. Maybe you could have them configure it with 5 burners, one in the middle?

At the risk of playing High End Range Designer without the proper credentials, I would think that the space in between the four burners on a thirty inch range would have a grate of the same material, at the same height as the burner grates, so that pots could be moved anywhere across/around the top without having to lift from one section to another.

My current range, a GE Profile all gas, has a middle grate configuration that does just that (and also sits over the round oven vent toward the back of the top).

At first, I thought that the piece of stainless might be a cover for a narrow charbroiler, but I don't see enough control knobs for that to be the case.

I'm leaning toward a 36" six burner, or possibly a 48" with six burners and the charbroiler, so I'm not as concerned about this as other who were contemplating the 30" Culinarian. Given the high emphasis on quality, function and style that I saw on the 48" Culinarian, this is a bit of a surprise.

For those thinking about a 30 incher, I wouldn't jump off the closest bridge just yet. The amount of feedback this has generated overnight is what our friends in law enforcement call a clue, and I expect that the right people will pick up on it immediately.

gregfl - I think the existing Capital Precision ranges (someone correct me on this is I am wrong) have 4 and 5 burner options. I always thought 5 burners on a 30'' made things kind of crowded so I only want 4 burners. For me, I would go to a 36'' to get 5 or 6 burners.

You guys are right. It needs to actually be a continuous grate like I see on every other range. I agree with thusie that it seems like they are treating this as an entry level range but not at an entry level price. Are they that clueless?

This morning I emailed the owner, not that I feel I changed his mind, but here is the reply.

Dear xxxx,
I do see your point. I am the last person to ignore my customer's opinions. As it happens I was pushed into showing something for a perticular customer who was in a hurry to make a decision and wanted to see something to fill the middle space. My engineering department is already working on a final design which, trust me, will meet your standard of excellence. Be patient and you will not have to change your mind about buying the CULINARIAN.
Regards.
Surjit.

Well that is encouraging but does it seem odd to just throw something on there that you know is only temporary? I wanted 30'' pics so I could make a decision. I could have put something like that on there myself.

thusie - I forgot to say thanks for emailing Mr. Kalsi.

but does it seem odd to just throw something on there that you know is only temporary? >>>

I agree, but as long as it is changed to something more acceptable, looks like it belongs on the range and is actually useful, I'm fine with it:-) Now fingers and toes crossed that it is all of the above.

Having SS in the center as a filler is not new but it has not been popular for quite some time. The height of this filler though does seem out of place. It would have been better to have the filler be level with the top of the front bezel. My only guess is they wanted to keep the continuous level but I don't think anyone would want to drag a heavy pot over the SS for fear of scratching it. My guess is, that this is a filler piece that can be removed and replaced easily with a filler grate or some other piece pretty easily. Hopefully, they see these complaints and provide the filler grates from day one. They likely fabricated the SS filler in house but a grate would have to be cast off-site so would take longer. Hopefully, either Trevor or Surjit can comment here and clarify what the final solution is even if they don't have pictures.

Where is Trevor? If they don't at least make a grate piece to replace the SS in the center, it won't sell. I agree easy slide racks would also be good and last but not least the handles could be better matched or eliminate the grease pull out handle with just a bent piece.

From a conversation this morning with the factory and Mr Kalsi, the 30" 4 Burner range will have a center fill grate made from cast iron, that is my understanding, i have asked for pictures as soon as possible.

I think even "idothecooking" should be impressed with how fast Capital moved once the customers spoke.

If the filler piece would have even been open on the end toward the front of the range it wouldn't have been quite so glaring. Still not good. Also that chunk of metal makes the grease pan handle more noticeable.

I would prefer two grease trays like on the the larger ranges, but that isn't a deal breaker for me. Nothing is 100% and everyone has their 'deal breaker'.

When we were out looking at ranges a couple weeks ago, DH loved the fit and finish on the Wolf, his 'deal breaker'? The red knobs, he absolutely detested them:-)

Yes we were told we could get black for extra $$.

Perhaps now it's clear why some of us have been a trifle cautious about raving about a cake before it is baked, out of the oven and taste-able.

While this range is being lauded as something akin to the next trip to the space station and built for "cooks," and testimonials are pouring in, had a professionally trained cook even been consulted on the design this thread might never have existed.

So I humbly offer a photo of the superb and well-tested configuration of the grates on my tragically underpowered and inferior little sealed burner range along with four little words: steal this grate design.

Of course, none of us are paid for our advice here (though perhaps a discount is in order for contributor/purchasers) and we helpless bystanders can only hope to be heard so at least some of our forum friends can get a good range out of this fandango, whether now or in the future.

Why can't there be four large grates that take up the entire top of the stove, instead of having any filler pieces at all? Am I missing something?

thusie -- you might want to doublecheck -- I'm pretty sure Wolf will give your your choice of red or black knobs -- no upcharge for the black. I had the same thought as you about wanting black.

Meanwhile, on the CC we're back to where we were a few days ago, waiting to see what the 30 will really look like. I'm wondering, if that pushy customer who wanted to see the grate on the 30 (yours truly) had actually decided to order this now, whether what I'm seeing in the photo is what would have come through on my range. If not, why show it? Very hard to understand.

In a couple of days there will be a 30 inch hole in my kitchen. Tick, tock . . .

That was extremely responsive of Capital, and the range will be beautiful with a grate in the middle. Sounds like just a minor blurb and the problem is solved thanks to Trevor and to the forum.

regarding the drip tray handle - I noticed the 36" Capital precision which Trevor had in his shop had a very different pull handle (more simple, single piece of stainless) and when I asked if my CC would have that longer, simpler pull handle too he said he thought so. Now I see on the website that all the precision models have that handle - it matches the length of the oven door handle but is a much smaller scale.

I'm now wondering if it would be possible to order the oven with the precision handle or alternatively without a handle on the drip tray at all? What do people think? If the oven was hot it would be to hard to pull it out, right?

sadie

Hey, I thought I was the pushy customer. LOL! Glad to know I am not the only one who wants to see what they are buying.

sadie - I totally agree on the drip handle. It just adds one more thing to an already busy front.

I may sign off for a while. (We will see how long that lasts I guess). My project is delayed indefinitely and I don't have that much to contribute to the current discussion. I will be checking in though and I hope everyone gets the range of their dreams.

Christine

Sayde,

Was told that by the only dealer around this area, DH and I both thought it a bit..Odd? To say the least:-) I also agree with why show the CC and IS that the way it was going to look.
Glad you got pushy!

Odiegirl stick around you always have something useful to add.

thusie - you are so sweet. And here I am posting 5 minutes after I was signing off forever! What willpower.

I am just super frustrated with this whole process and I feel like that is being reflected in my posts. My kitchen project was the one thing in my life where I thought I was actually accomplishing something. What was I thinking!

As I said to a friend:

Deep breath, sip of margarita, deep breath, sip of margarita.

This is my first post! Will be re-doing the kitchen in about 6 months, have been first seduced by the 30 BLUESTAR, but a little concerned with the complaints I've read on GW.

Recently I've been intrigued by the CAPITAL CULINARIAN, ...though I must admit the looks of it is way too shiny for my taste, with handles that seem out of proportion, and I've not seen one in person yet.

My latest infatuation stems from just learning that AMERICAN RANGE will be offering an open-burner residential range in late-September. I haven't seen photos of it, but the specs sound wonderful, ...2500 btu!

Anyone hear anything on it? I'm assuming it'll be the AR residential body w/ their restaurant range top.

I might have a solution for Capital for how to handle that annoying center section of the range. I suggest licensing some famous TV celebrities and screen-printing their images under flame-proof epoxy or other suitable industrial coating and "Just say goodbye to those annoying scratches!Â"

I call this one the "Hasselbeckian"

What do you think?

Now I see on the website that all the precision models have that handle - it matches the length of the oven door handle but is a much smaller scale.

This would be my preference. It looks integrated and part of the whole.

Grabbing it by the side(without handles) seems anti form following function. Bad design.

Ditmaspork - that is very interesting about the future American range with open burners. It's been years that Viking and Bluestar were the only game in town for open burners, and now we may have a 4th entry to the field! Can't wait to see it. But are you certain it's true? Where did you hear that? Is there a link somewhere to a press release or something?

Hmmm 25k BTU open burner?

More conventinal pro-style design.

Color also available,like red.

4.8 cu ft "Innovection Convection Oven Technology/Ruth's Chris Steakhouse" oven producing 1500 degree broiling temps.

Trevor sells American Range too.

With any range we should all be careful when it comes to factory numbers.

example culinarian Broiler according to factory.....

Broiler element temp 2500 degrees
Broiler Glass surface 1500 degrees
Top rack temp (where you cook) 483 degrees +

Usable size of the ovens and manufacturers size's do not relate to each other

Example Wolf 36" All Gas

cavity size 30" W x 19" D x 15 1/4 H
Usable size 29 W x 17" D x 13 H
( will not fit a full size sheet pan. )

Burners Btu power....(Boil test 1 gallon)

Capital 9:58
Bluestar 13:47

Nearly 4 mins difference is not related solely to the 1000 btu extra the Culinarian has, the difference here is about combustion (in my opinion.)

Just an observation.

alwaysfixinÂÂI had contacted American Range out of the blue to ask if they had any plans for producing a residential open-burner range. Got a response a day later saying that they will be producing 30 & 36 inch residential open burner units, and they will not be available until mid-end September 2010. He did indicate however, that they are accepting orders with down payments to reserve a range.

Since I'm not in the market for a range until Nov/Dec, I'll wait until it comes out. Want to see/touch the actual product. Have not seen any photos of the range, but they we nice enough to email me a design drawing of the 30 inch open burner range, got the impression the design of the range is still being fine tuned. Also, they haven't priced the 30 & 36 yet. They said the BTUs are 25000, 18000 & 12000.

Goodie, more open burner ranges, The American looks quite nice.

Sounds like the potential for a 'nother T-Test (T-Trevor):-)

odiegirl folks who know me well would call me about anything but sweet.. Appreciate the kind words. I so feel for you on the set back of your new kitchen..That just stinks, big time.

Ditmaspork - thanks for the update. It would be interesting if American is reading this thread and the other Culinarian threads on this Forum, and noting the likes and dislikes, and design preferences people have posted. (Yoo hoo, American, pay attention to handles, knobs, drip trays and continuous grates!). One small detail for me - IMHO, the grates should be unlaquered cast iron, the way the Bluestar's used to be, but I think are now porcelain-covered.

FWIW, I prefer the look of the steel center strip. But it seems like the cast iron one will be a little more functional in the long run. I always thought BlueStar RCS looked better than the RNB, if not as macho and pro. Maybe I could have the face of some politician I don't like screened onto a steel one.

Interesting news about AR - I called them last fall and asked if there was any chance of something like that and was told no. All the competition is good, but I think in the end the responsiveness of Capital will win out for me. The company is as important as the product with something this large.

Here you go!

Wow, that was fast! Awesome. Methinks we're not screaming loud enough about the height of the "island" trim!

It would be a pretty cool design to make the center strip a low power warming/simmer burner. Just run a burner rod down the middle. If they make the strip/rod capable of a bit more power, it could be used for poachers. :)

See told ya not to go anywhere odiegirl:-)

Perfect! Thanks!!!

Thanks for posting the new pics! Is it an optical illusion, or is the height of the center strip slightly higher than the grates?

Must be time for a LASIK tune-up, or better reading glasses. The center strip, while attractive, appears to my eyes to be slightly below the tine tips of the burner grates.

In any case, it's pre-production, and the company response shows receptiveness, urgency and a commitment to get it right.

The damn thing's probably level and fooling us all. An "optical seclusion," if you will. :-)

I agree on the island trim thing. That needs improvement.
Trevor what is your thought on that?

why can't the range ship with no riser at all for flush mounts against tile?

Also, I noticed the capital precision has convection. Will convection be an option on this range, and if so is it worth having?

Overall I like the new cast iron center.

I was hoping it would mimic the design of the grates but this is acceptable.

I wonder if the island trim is all about venting the oven. Why would it be needed in a cooktop?

Billy

Most Pro ranges are modular, Range top with an oven attached.
As such as range top still has the IT trim Attached.

Maybe a better name for the 3" Island Trim might be

....... 3" Trim.........

Its the same for the Bluestar, an Island Trim can still be used against a wall, so Island trim might not be the best name.