PermaBase� Cement Board without waterproofing
Bongo
9 years ago
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Comments (18)
StoneTech
9 years agoBongo
9 years agoRelated Discussions
Please help! Contractor tiled shower without waterproofing...
Comments (21)"My contractor used mastic everywhere he installed new tile for me--kitchen floor, foyer, etc. Is it okay in these areas since they aren't generally wet, or is this still a no no? " Laila, it depends. On your substrate and the size of the tile used. Substrate: Some manufacturers restrict the type of material that you can spread mastic on. Example, many prohibit OSB and chip board types of subfloors or underlayments. Tile size: Mastic cures by drying, so it needs exposure to a certain amount of free air. Some restrict the size of the tile you can install on floors and walls. Floors size is usually more restrictive due to the weight of walking on the tile. If the mastic can't see enough air the mastic can remain soft. One mastic I've used has I a maximum of 6" square tiles on floors and 10" square on walls. Another manufacturer restricts tile to 12". Some prohibit setting natural stone tile on floors with mastic. So within the entire family of mastics, each manufacturer may have their own limitations due to how they formulate their specific products....See Moremake my own waterproof foam backer board for shower walls? am i nuts?
Comments (19)I'll add this then: Durock? It's an approved substrate for any of the surface applied membranes. Sure it generates dust when cut with a power saw or angle grinder. But if you score and snap with a blade? It's pretty clean. It is heavy when compared to foam...but you'll be installing a half-dozen sheets max. Foam board? Sure, it's even lighter in weight. Here's all I recommend. Find the foam you want to use. Choose a membrane, example, Hydroban sheet membrane. Then call Laticrete's tech department and ask what thinset/adhesive they recommend for adhering their membrane to the EPS/XPS/foam of your choice. If you get a solid answer, by all means move onward with the project! If not, repeat for each foam/membrane/adhesive combo you can think of. Honestly, and again...I'm a guy who thoroughly appreciates the DIYer mentality...I built my own houses, boats, kayaks, canoes, airplane, swimming pool, I've drilled my own wells for water, I've done a couple of frame off car resto's...all solo. Trust me, I embrace the DIYer mentality. But showers? Here, on this forum, I do worry about compromised showers. Because houses are the most valuable investment most people on these forums will ever make, and water damage from a shower can just muck things up in tremendous fashion. Plus, it's near impossible to properly repair a shower short of tearing it out and rebuilding it. If your primary concern is weight and dust? Then I'll wave the bugger flag. And I'm waving it in an attempt to help you out. Just buy USG foam board and be done with it. Hydroban sheet is maybe $1.25 a foot? Kerdi about $2. Foam board? Maybe .40 cents. Adhesive? Who knows. Best case, you're saving yourself $1 a sqft by trying to make your own versus buying USG's product. For a shower of your size, that's maybe $75 you're saving. On an expenditure of how much for the entire shower? It's a fairly small percentage. Again...I THOROUGHLY embrace the DIY spirit. But with you being motivated by weight and dust? I'd spend the extra $75 to get the USG foam board. Lightweight. No dust. And you KNOW it's going to work. Plus you'll avoid the pain of having to lug a heavy and dusty bag of thinset home and the pain of trying to thinset or adhere the membrane of your choice to the foam of your choice with the adhesive of your choice on your own. Just my opinion. Worth the price paid. Good luck!! Seriously. Whichever way to proceed, I'd love to hear how things turn out....See More1/2" Gap Between Flange & Cement Board!?
Comments (14)I've never seen an installation detail showing the wall panel overlapping the flange. That would require shimming the panel after the base in in place and if the wall panel gets too close to the shower base water can be drawn up into the panel. In your case the mistake was cutting the wall panel so high above the pan flange creating the grouting problem bry mentioned. You might be able to use a Z flashing or larger tiles (see below). You could cut 1/2 or 3/8 x 12x 12 marble tiles in half and place them horizontally in a running bond pattern solving the bottom edge issue (see below). You could add a narrow 1/2" thick strip of wood at the bottom of the wall board to reduce the gap and install a Kerdi membrane over the entire wall. Its difficult to tell from your photo how close the shower base flange is to the studs but assuming it is no farther than 1/8" from them here is the standard tub and shower base detail for tile or solid surface panels: For an excessive gap a Z type flashing might be appropriate: Be aware that a silicone sealant joint should be deeper than it is tall so it forms an hour glass shape in section allowing the silicone to stretch without losing adhesion. This is easier to achieve with 1/2" or 3/8" thick marble tile than with eased edge ceramic tile....See MoreWhere to use cement board for bathroom? shower only?
Comments (38)@zealart - You are correct. As President Reagan said, trust but verify. I just finished a remodel including gutted bathrooms with new showers installed. I spent a lot of time on the Board reading about shower construction and horror stories. I followed links posted regarding shower construction. Much of it went over my head but I retained enough information so that I was able to ask reasonably questions regarding the materials used and how my shower was being constructed. I also checked out work done (including showers) by my designer and GC. All efforts put into researching and learning as much as possible will get you the best possible end product. And not just in terms of actual construction - but taking the time to read copiously enabled me to learn about how I wanted my space to function and what products or design elements could get me the results I wanted in both design and functionality. I did have a great designer but it really is more of a partnership as I needed to tell her how I wanted my space to work - and sometimes there was stuff I read about on this forum that I was able to tell her about :-) - like my toe kick step drawers. I also live in an area in which stuff is RIGOROUSLY inspected at every step by the City. My shower pan had to pass a 24 hour flood test for starters. I took pictures of my showers at various stages of construction which show the waterproofing and materials used. I do know that my shower is sloped - I can even see where it slopes even more markedly by the drain. There is no puddle or even small remnant of water left when I finish. And I doubt any slime or mold is growing anywhere either since my automatic fan runs until it registers a low humidity in the bathroom. FWIW, my curbs appear to be some kind of concrete and the curb is solid surface - constructed from a remnant of my counter and my bench is constructed of the same material. From everything I have read, solid surface for curbs and horizontal surfaces is recommended over tiles....See MoreUser
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