Consumer Reports has some biases, but the biggest one is that they don't give much value to the "best money can buy". They also don't do a good job with unusual models and small brands. For looking for best value per dollar and name brands, they're a useful tool. I'd think their reviews of the ones you've mentioned should be okay.

I prefer to read a lot of individual reports here, and perhaps elsewhere on the web than rely solely on CR. You can ask the repairmen at the appliance store which ones have the best no-repair-needed record, as well as which cost least to repair. Also, check the manufacturer's websites online, and read through all the instruction manuals to get a good idea of how the particular machine works.

In general, the large brands do a good job on the appliances they're known for. That is, a Whirlpool washer and dryer ought to be good because that's what Whirlpool does, but not necessarily a stove (do they make stoves?). GE is the only one that is traditionally pretty good across the board for kitchen appliances. So just on general reputation your choices are probably fine.

The people here far prefer front loading washers. Their consensus is that the new conservation standards have ruined the quality of top loaders. The front loaders start out more expensive, but reputedly use less resources (power, water, detergent). (I don't have an opinion--I like my old washer.)

If you have room for full sized doors on your fridge, you might want to consider a bottom mount freezer. Most people prefer them to side-by-sides, which were invented for tiny apartment kitchens where there wasn't room for full sized doors.

That doesn't mean that a side-by-side or top loader aren't good. Since they aren't the most preferred, however, you might need to scour a few more forums, as well as vendor websites that post reviews, to find your specific models mentioned. You can also post another thread here with the makers and perhaps model numbers in the title.

When it comes to CR, I think they're ok in a relativistic sense. That is, their ratings show how the items relate to each other. But you have to take into account their testing methodology. What they may think is important you may think is trivial. For example, I have one of their top rated cars. They think it is wonderful. I think it is the most annoying vehicle I've ever owned.

There have been many instances where people reported buying CRs Recommended unit only to have it fall apart after a couple years. If you look around, I think you'll find examples of GE SxS fridges from a few years ago that stopped working after a year or two.

However, if you go check the Laundry forum, I think that the Cabrio is considered ok for a top-loader.

I think new GE appliances are pretty unreliable. I know two families who have entire kitchens and laundry rooms of them, one because that's what they decided on for their remodel two years ago, another because that's what their new, "green" condo came with. In case #1, every single kitchen appliance needed multiple repairs within the first year. In case two, the washing machine did.

I bought the twin to the Cabrio, the Maytag Bravo. I passed by the Cabrio because it lacked a heater to heat incoming water and the ability to add a dryer rack. I really like my Maytag with only a few minor issues. I've had it about 6 months.

The dryer, however, is a different story. I have the steam version and I'm not happy with its design. You cannot extend the cycle (set it to more dry when it's set on dry) unless you power it off. That is simply annoying. My old Maytag allowed this. I've already had a major in-warranty repair as well. And, using the dryer rack is simply a pain in the butt compared to my old Maytag.

Overall, I don't think there is a great laundry pair out there. The old Maytag company was ruined when they sent the work overseas and now it is owned by Whirlpool and IMHO they are a mediocre company.

susan - Does your Maytag Bravo have the agitator? The first Cabrio I looked at, which was the one CR gave a high rating, had the agitator. I found another model that didn't have the agitator. The salesman claimed it's more efficient and easier on your clothes. Just wondering if it's as good as it sounds. I'm not looking at the front loaders, because I'm trying to keep my costs down and I keep hearing about how you have to keep the door open so you don't have a mildew problem.

I really like the looks of the LG fridge, but they don't seem to be highly rated. Any personal experience with them?

One more question. I saw a couple of fridges that had a titanium and clear steel finish. I liked it because it looks like it wouldn't show fingerprints as easily, but do you think it would be noticeable if the dishwasher and stove are SS and the fridge is the other?

Laurie

My take on CR...they offer good tips on what to look for and stay away from (in general) but I don't give much consideration to their ratings. They seem to never mesh with "real life" reviews (such as those found here). They put too much emphasis on cost as part of their equation. Personally, I don't want that to determine how good (or bad) a product rates. I'll determine if I think a product is worth the cost or if I can afford it.
Monica

I completely agree, Monica. They're worth visiting to see what's out there and compare different products' main features and prices in general, but they don't time-test anything as far as I can tell. What I DO like about them is that if you click on a particular model, it will take you to a more detailed page about it and there you'll find user reviews. Click on that and you'll get the useful stuff. It's only consumers who are able to give you real-life examples and are more likely to tell the truth.

When anyone mentions CU I always have this cartoonish scene in my mind's eye of an auto or appliance CEO at a meeting with his engineers:

"Jones, Consumer Reports says that the stuff your team designs is 15% better than the competition's for the same price. Don't you like working here? One more slip up like that and you're all canned! To make up for this, stop supply chain component orders immediately until you figure out how to run the line 15% faster for a cheaper version replacement model."

I find that Consumer Reports is frequently the only one that does actual testing, so there is definite value to their report. I take their picks with a grain of salt, because they weight low price too heavily for my taste. I like to start my research at consumersearch.com. They select best buys based on all of the reviews they can find, including Consumer Reports and any other magazines or professional reviews, as well as factoring in user reviews from Amazon, Sears, AJ Madison, etc. As for GE, anyone with 10 or 15 year old GE appliances swears by them. People who bought them more recently it seems to be more of a 50\50 split.

Here is a link that might be useful: Consumer Search

CR has useful user reviews. I had an LG French Door frig. It had a glitch that made it stop working. Our repair guy could not find out why from the company but found on a forum that he had to cut some insulation out from around the coils in the bottom. Then it worked like a charm after that. Nice looking and easy to use. But I did a major remodel and had always lusted after a counter depth all refrigerator column. So I got the Thermador. My trusty LG is in the shed and serves as my Party frig now.

Consumer Reports doesn't always test the items I am looking for, but their testing is valuable, unbiased, and I have had pretty good luck relying on their ratings for consumer goods. I am a member of Consumers Union and have been for quite a few years now and definitely support the work they do. I am particularly impressed with their stressing of the importance of product safety. Their ratings and reviews have more than once waved me off of a product with serious safety issues.

Of prime importance is their refusal to take ad dollars from the manufacturers of the products they review. This independence helps to insure that product reviews are unbiased and accurate. This does not mean the CR is immune from making mistakes, but the likelihood that there is some hidden financial factor boosting a products rating is quite low with CR; not the case when it comes to other print, broadcast, or net-based media.

Well I for one find it interesting that often their highest rated products have the lowest rated user reviews and vice-versa. I noticed that in more than a few cases and it's hard to ignore the contrast.

I agree that they seem to favor the cheaper products, which is annoying (though probably isn't to most of the country, and shouldn't be annoying to me just cause I should be budgeting better!). I like being able to compare products on CR but I tell you, the MOST important factor for me isn't in whether or not a product has been tested, but in how many were tested and for how long. Their testing can't stand up to the test of time that only multiple consumers can really experience, I think. I'm really grateful for their consumer reviews - that alone is probably half the reason I go to their site.

In general, I've often found CR reviews helpful, though sometimes they do not have the specific model number I'd been looking for. Often their issue had tested a previous model vs. the current model.

We do subscribe, and I fill out our annual survey where I do get to rate all our appliances and cars, so the ratings of frequency of repairs do come from consumers.

I find that reviews are often on old models and not the particular ones I'm looking at. Sometimes they are similar and sometimes they are nowhere close. The last one I remember being the same was when the Calypso came out and it was the top rated washer. True, they stated a reservation that the model was new and longevity was uncertain. They jinxed us all! LOL

Anyway, I disagree that they are unbiased. Maybe they don't have a brand bias in testing, but they do seem to have a bias for value and don't seem to think anyone needs more than basic function from an appliance. They don't show that same attitude towards cars or electronics though.

What I don't like about CR now is that they seem to give you less information than they used to about how they tested and what they were looking for, what they didn't look for. They also don't tell you what is behind reader surveys and reliability ratings that people value a lot. I have answered some of their surveys and the questions don't separate things like standard service on a car from a breakdown.

I like the idea, but I'd like more from them if I'm going to pay for it. Seems I get more user input from websites with customer reviews (if you sift through those folks who post comments on the wrong model, botched delivery, etc.) Take in all the information you can get and think about what they are telling you and what they are not telling you.

I agree with berone about GE products. The ones I do have are 10-14 years old without a repair ever. My stove and dishwasher are Whirlpool. Both are 14 years old, still going, and never needed a repair.
It seems that in general, they just don't make appliances to last like they used to.

CR provides basic information on appliances, especially entry level and basic models. However, I feel their reporting fails on three fronts.

First, CR rates independent appliance retailers as the best place to buy appliances but their ratings tend to be on appliances carried by big box stores. The big box love affair applies to detergents and other items also. Brown goods, white goods, cheap goods and junk. That disconnect is an oversight all the way to the lead editor.

2nd, repair data citing statistics have a margin of error +/- 30 to 70%. In other words, 30-70% of the reviews are correct and 30-70% are incorrect. As long as the data compares items that have substantially different warranties ALL repair information is completely unreliable. The paper trail generated by warranty calls will always skew in favor of the cheaper, less reliable model at the expense of a well built unit with a 3 year warranty. Where is the Editor-in-Charge on this one?

And does anyone realize that 1 year warranties instead of 2, 3, or longer ones are a direct result of CR's flawed information.

3rd, information listed on the appliance charts have so many errors that I find it more dangerous than helpful. Dishwashers are a prime example. Miele's have SS interiors. (Plastic in several CR reviews from 2 years ago. The Asko dishwasher information was done on a specialty model that is not to be used as a primary dishwasher. A used car salesman could provide more accurate, non biased information.

CR has a duty and responsibility to provide balanced,unbiased an in-depth data with less errors. They should also refrain from cherry picking certain items to promote or bash until the discrepencies are eliminated.

When Whirlpool manufactured the bulk of Kenmore's items in the 90's, why did the Kenmore cost more, was always rated
higher, yet the items were for all intensive purposes the same? I don't blame Whirlpool for scaling back their partnership with Kenmore with that kind of treatment.

Consumer Reports publishes member satisfaction survey results of large and online retailers by name. Independents, small sellers without survey sample sizes big enough to report on individually, get binned into "independents."

CR does not rate independents as the "best place" to buy anything. CR reports that for large appliance purchases, independents received the highest percentage of satisfied respondents. But they also report that HHGregg was within two percentage points (86 vs. 88% satisfied respondents) of the top scorer and that the margin of error is 4%. For small appliances, the highest rated seller was Amazon.

I am not sure where the assertion CR is responsible for short warrantees is coming from, either. If anything, the one thing I have heard about short warrantees is that retailers like them because it gives them a shot at the extended warranty upsell at 50 to 100% markup, all of it pure gravy.

In any case, the chief reason we do not have longer warrantees here is that our political donor class responsible for paying for the reelection campaigns of our representatives do not want them.

In Europe, when you sell an appliance it is guaranteed for two years by law. Congress could enact identical or more stringent product warranty laws tomorrow, but won't do it when they know that the US Chamber of Commerce will come after them with a several-hundred-million-dollar campaign war chest if they do.

Blaming CU for our crap warrantees just doesn't pass the BS test as far as I am concerned.

Also, I do not know where or how this 30-70% "margin of error" stuff is coming from. First of all, this description of what a margin of error is, isn't. A margin of error is half the confidence interval around a given stat at a known confidence level, typically 95%. What that means is that 95 times out of a hundred, the true value of the of the measured population will equal the test value plus or minus the margin of error. SO, to make this plainer, if I publish a study saying 88% of white dudes can't shake a tailfeather and the margin of error is 4%, what that means is that I am 95% sure that the number of white dudes who can't shake a tailfeather is between 84% and 92%..

Since the statistic described, in this case, percentage of respondents reporting any problems, has a universe of possible values from 0% to 100%, a margin of error of 70% would imply the possibility that a negative percentage of people reported problems, or more than all the people in the study could have reported problems. Both of these are impossibilities unless you are a registered voter on the South side of Chicago.

As far as Whirlpool/Kenmore or other sour grapes stuff goes, it comes with the territory. I would say that if you have proof that CR is somehow biased towards Sears and is misreporting reliability numbers, then I am sure several manufacturers would just love to hear from you as would we. But CR, while it has made some mistakes over the years -- some of them doozies -- still has never had to pay a claim to any manufacturer accusing them of libel or bias.

And yes, CR does not spend a lot of money buying high-end boutique appliances only available to very wealthy cognoscenti. This is due to the practical limits of what is possible within their limited resources. CR buys every appliance they test and they are trying to serve the largest possible segment of the population so their product choices are going to inevitably fall toward higher volume items. And where are those higher volume items most often sold? Yeah, the big box chains.

Thanks, mojavean, for the margin of error explanation. I teach research methods at a university, so we go through how it's calculated, and it's useful for talking about election polling, etc.

Usually in the CR ratings, they allude to the margin of error and say "differences of x points are not meaningful" or something like that. So, if an independent appliance center has a rating of 88, and hhgregg has 86, there is no difference if the number they give is 4 because it's within the margin of error. Of course, my students sometimes have a hard time with this, too.

Thanks for the explanation!

Check out the following website for some info - scroll down to see the washer ratings:

http://www.allbrandservicenaperville.com/products-washer.html

Thanks for all the opinions and explanations.

Chefmom - Thanks for the link! They highly recommend Whirlpool and Roper side-by-sides. Whirlpool is at the top of CR's list, so is it safe to say that's one of the top fridge's? I was kind of thinking about going with either a GE or Kenmore, but that website says to avoid GE due to a history of high repairs. It says to check Kenmore's model number to determine which mfg. makes it, but it doesn't say you can you tell. The one I'm looking at just says model 5101, so I'm not sure how to know who makes that.
The Consumer Search website that berone linked to recommends the same GE model that CR recommends. Do I go with GE, because it's highly rated on these two sites or do I avoid it because the possibly of repairs? Gosh, how do you ever decide?

Laurie

msrose, welcome to the wwww (wonderful world wide web) where you can find all the information about everything you ever wanted to know about. The outcome...It's called analysis paralysis (g) FYI: I have a GE sidexside. It's had a couple service calls. A part recall and this Jan we had to replace a $420 circuit board. Bought in 2002. Even back then, I read warnings about GE fridges but it was the only one in my price range that had everything I wanted so I took my chances.
Monica

I bought a new Cabrio washer (without agitator) and dryer (without the steam option) last November. My only two complaints are that the HE model so thoroughly sucks out the water in the washer and it causes all of the pant legs to be wrinkly. My Mother In Law says that if I would just take the time to shake out each pair before putting them in the dryer that would fix the problem. But, with 4 kids and a middle schooler who wears almost nothing but jeans, that could take awhile and laundry is time consuming enough! It's also not terribly gentle on clothing unless you run it on the delicate cycle. Consumer Reports had rated it "fair" on gentleness, no kidding! But, perhaps these issues I'm having would be the case with any HE model and not just the Cabrio. My only complaint with the dryer is that they did not offer a stainless interior and so it is already pretty heavily stained with all the blue jeans that I dry around here. Not major but just a little annoying in something so new. The washer basin is stainless though, which is nice and it does hold A LOT! Cabrio has an offer where you can send off for a free dryer rack (since it is not standard)but I forgot to do that within the four month period after purchase! All in all, the Cabrio is okay but I must say my Kenmore set performed just fine for more than 15 years (not one single repair) until the dryer died last fall. The new models are all so much more complex though and so I would bet money this new set will not last nearly as long as my first set. My parents had a Kenmore for like 20 or 25 years before it finally died. They just don't make appliances like they used to! I think it's sort of on purpose too so that we will have to go out and spend more money! Incidentally, I have a 15 year old GE Profile refrigerator in my garage and it's still going strong and not a single repair that I can recall! I also had a GE VCR that lasted forever and would probably still be going if my kids had not messed it up!

They just don't make appliances like they used to! I think it's sort of on purpose too so that we will have to go out and spend more money!

Appliance companies did not want cosmumers to go out and spend more money 30 years ago?

I think manufacturers cared more about craftsmanship and their reputation 30 years ago. Also, technology was not changing nearly as rapidly as it is today. I think today's consumer gets "tired" of things faster and wants to replace more frequently to get the newest and latest. I've been told by more than one repair shop that appliances are not made as well as they used to be so I think unfortunately that is a matter of fact. And, it does not seem to hurt their sales either. Look at the high repair rate for Viking and yet they are still in business. There are some people who only want a name brand and really don't care how much they have to spend to have it serviced. I guess if you can afford the high end brands then perhaps you can afford the frequent maintenance too.

I think manufacturers cared more about craftsmanship and their reputation 30 years ago.

I don't think so.

I think today's consumer gets "tired" of things faster and wants to replace more frequently to get the newest and latest.

I think this is true.

Americans want ever bigger appliances and ever more features.

With luxury styling.

They want made in Germany quality but only willing to pay made in China prices.

The price pressure on appliance manufacturers is relentless.

The end result is big high feature appliances with the lowest price wins in the marketplace.That leads to lower quality.

The typcial American looks at price while the typical German looks at value. The average German is willing to sacrafice some size for quality.

That expains the difference in size and quality of appliances available here vs what is available in Germany.

apbnash - So, would you buy the Cabrio again or are wrinkly pants enough of a pain that you would get something else? I'm trying to remember what the plus is on the no-agitator. I think it supposed to be more energy efficient, but I can't remember the other benefit.

Laurie

Well, I guess it depends if the wrinkly pants are just a part of the HE phenomenon. This is my very first HE set and my neighbor says that she has the same issues with her Maytag Neptune series. I think these models just use so little water and they just suck it right out of your clothes. I thought that a machine without an agitator would be less rough on my clothing but I think this one is a little rougher. Maybe on the flip side the clothes are getting more thoroughly cleaned?? It spins very, very fast. It literally sounds like a motorcycle engine revving when it is on. It's almost comical. That's neither bad nor good it's just an observation. I hate to tell you to not get the Cabrio because I haven't had any repair issues or anything of that nature. I went with no agitator because I thought it might vibrate less (on a 2nd story) and also felt like it would hold more and get off balance less (which is true). I like the digital controls and how you can adjust the settings. It is very easy to operate compared to my old dial turn washer and dryer. I would maybe continue to ask around and see if the wrinkly pants issue is commonplace amongst those with HE machines. I do tend to wash very large loads, which may worsen the problem. My clothes tend to come out of the washer in one tangled up blob. I think if you ask me five years down the road I can give you a better answer. How trouble free it remains in the long run will really help me to determine if I would purchase this set again. I will say that it has a delicate setting and so if you wanted you could wash everything on that cycle and it would be easier on your clothes. I might even try that and see if my pants wrinkle less that way. I'll let you know.

"CR does not rate independents as the "best place" to buy anything. CR reports that for large appliance purchases, independents received the highest percentage of satisfied respondents."

IMHO I respectfully disagree with the implication of this specific rating, although the symantics you refer to are "partially" correct. I feel that highest percentage of satisfied respondents infers best to the general public. I also didn't address the amount of respondents as being anemic, especially when used by a major magazine that does influence purchasing, intential or not. Thanks for pointing that out because it does raise a few eyebrows.

My beef with CR is not about their alterior motives, but about quality control that misses, or overlooks discrepencies that seem prevelant. This applies to my assertion regarding Sears, Kenmore and Whirlpool. Several years ago the discrepency regarding this triangle was presented to me. Being skeptical and somewhat cycnical, I walked the walk and visited Sears and saw for myself, almost identical appliances, 2 different brands, and the higher cost item rated higher by "responents" in CR. "Respondents" should sever any bias. However, that means a non controlled survey of too few respondents is providing a result that is flawed. IMHO, to continue to publish the same survey year to year when it produces a result that circumvents the whole point of a survey implies something else must be going on. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck.....

Also, thanks for your information an input.

Do the front loaders have the same problem with the wrinkly clothes?

Laurie

The presence or absence of an agitator has no bearing on vibration during spin.

Wrinkling is largely a function of spin speed. Old-style Kenmore (Whirlpool-built) toploaders (more than ~25 years old) of the belt-drive design spun at 500 to 550 RPM. Direct-drive machines (~25 years to current) spin at 640 RPM. The Oasis/Bravos/Cabrio models can reach 950 to 1100.

Tangling in the HE impeller machines can be reduced/minimized by proper loading techniques. Don't grab up the load as a whole and blindly dump it into the machine or lay items over the impeller. Instead, place each item around the basket, alternating large and small pieces. When loading larger items such as jeans, sheets, and towels, pick up the item and drop it straight down as a bundle, not wrapped around. A single very large-bulky items such as a queen-size quilt or comforter should be washed alone using the designated Bulky Item cycle (which has wash action designed to handle such an item). Load either arranged balanced around the impeller or gathered into a loose bundle and dropped in. Try both loading methods for bulky items to see which works best for you.

Regarding construction quality/durability of whitegoods nowadays: A mid-line Whirlpool washer cost $370 in 1976. Consider that a similar machine can be bought today, 34 years later, for between $330 and $470 depending on the brand-name and features ... something has to "give" to allow that price-point.

Regarding CR: As I recall, their yearly survey asks only about appliance 5 years old or less, so my 11 years old Fisher & Paykel washer (a brand CR rates high in repair frequency) that has *never* needed any repairs would not qualify for inclusion in their survey. I have also noted errors in their listings of product features. I once advised them of an error in the listings on their web site. They thanked me for bringing it to their attention, but they DID NOT make a correction (I checked several times over a period of weeks after receiving their acknowledgment).

My sister has my grandmothers refrigerator. My grandmother died MANY years ago and it was an old fridge when she had it. Dont know the brand. I think Kenmore. Ancient fridge and never given any sort of good care - used to be in an old shed - but still works great.

Was glad to see this topic near the top and more glad I'm not alone in my confusion. I picked up a recent issue for guidance about large appliances. It helped me absolutely zero.

Besides testing mostly mainstream brands I couldn't understand why a more expensive product with better scores in the most important categories wasn't recommended. The cost could preclude a "best buy" rating but the overall choices seemed totally arbitrary.

I'm sure decisions aren't influenced by manufacturers but the recommendations seemed almost political.

The ratings are numerical scores based upon performance criteria that are spelled out when you click the "What's this?" link accompanying the reported numerical value. It is typically based upon a 0 - 100 scale. The weighting of the various tested criteria are presented in ordinal fashion reading left to right. So, for dishwashers, the most important criterion is washing performance, next energy use, next noise, and lastly, ease of use. Consumer Reports doesn't post how the weighting is accomplished in any easy place I could find.

Personally, I think they could aid themselves and consumers by reporting every result of every test and by publishing the numbers used to form the ratings. But since some of this endeavor includes reporting subjective results (ease of use, for instance) I can see how this could be difficult.

The recommendations, on the other hand, use not only the ratings, but take things such as repair frequency, cost/performance, and odds and ends about the testers impressions of the machines with the recommendations. One way to find out the reasons for a particular model's recommendation or lack thereof is to read the "highs and lows" of testing, which will usually give you a clue why a particular model got snubbed. "Mfgr. has highest repair frequency of all major brands" or "Icemaker capacity was judged inadequate" or something along those lines.

But not always. Sometimes the reasoning behind the choice whether to recommend or not is simply not apparent.

Consumer reports would do well to become more fastidious about their reporting to ensure that readers know the whole score and aren't left guessing.

I think we have been over the reasoning for concentrating on appliances under the big part of the bell curve. But take heart, fellow appliance snobs! They are actually testing built in refrigeration! Subzero is on Consumer Reports!

Way to go, mojavean! I saw this post and, as a long time Consumer Reports subscriber, felt compelled to respond. After reading all of your very thoughtful and cogent comments, however, I have nothing to substantive to add. You took the words right out of my mouth.

I am a long time CU subscriber who is currently trying to buy an 18,000 BTU AC. Aside from the fact that CU doesn't rate anything that size, what I find, time and time again, is that user reports don't match the ratings. The same is true on refrigerators.

So let me talk about what I we going on

- CU has often used oddball criteria to evaluate products. Back in the 70's, water usage was key to a washing machine's review. I am sure this sill goes on. They are, after all, engineers.

-no one looks at the long term. If you think this is a problem with appliances, think about what has been going on with pharmaceuticals.

- CU doesn't realize that style or design exist, therefore, you cannot sort refrigerators by counter depth or near counter depth - you can select by size though. For stoves, you can't sort by slide in. This is really annoying if you need a specific design.

-Perhaps the most famous example of CU calling a product wrong was a top ranked American Standard toilet, which became a class action law suit and which on, I think, Terry Love's plumbing site, there are an unbelievable number of negative reviews and criticisms. None of these guys could figure out why CU doesn't ask plumbers for their experience. I can pros and cons to this, but they have a point.

- there is no question that appliances are made more cheaply than in the past, so they don't last anywhere near as long. Parts that were formerly metal are now plastic, often cheap plastic. Add to this the fact that appliances often aren't packed with sufficiently strong materials so they often arrive damaged. Repairs of any type are out sourced, so they are not do e properly and are a major source of hassles.

- It is hard to evaluate user reports, because of all the fake reviews, positive and negative on sites. Also, many products have few or new reviews on line.

In the end, I found it impossible to figure out which AC to buy because the reviews and the rankings didn't agree. I planned to go to some privately owned stores, but THEY all had reviews that were as bad as the big boxes. So I went into the ONE store that had good reviews and bought what the salesman recommended, a GE, despite all the comments about the quality of GE products. One review said the store pushes cheaply made GEs - but everything is cheaply made. So I decided to trust what the salesman said "In this neighborhood, we wouldn't dare sell anything that isn't good." Now THAT is true - Park Slope, Brooklyn is famously whiney, entitled and quick to complain. It is also quite affluent.

Did I make the right choice? No idea. But I need an AC and this is as good a way to decide as any.

Good luck!