repairing bathroom...wet ceilings and missing grout and

13 years ago

Is it ridiculously expensive to have the grout redone professionally? I'm lazy but I'm cheap. I started removing loose stuff but don't want to finish. :)

And, the tub surround has a dropped ceiling and is tiled only about 5 feet up. It gets damp up there! Is there a good paint for this? Can I do a solid surface on the walls above the tub (and ceiling)? I don't think tile would look right. I am considering wallpapering the room (tacky, sure, but appropriate). Is vinyl paper with caulked seams good enough?

What would you do? Okay, if you didn't want to rip it out, THEN what would you do? :) Thanks!

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Comments (7)

paige16
13 years ago
First of all I'm sure you know there is a special material these days added to any paint color for kitchens and baths. I might also inquire at a paint store about paint used on boats. I don't suppose you feel you can lower the shower head? Wallpaper wise I would bring that question to the store selling it. I think a solid color whether it be paint or paper would be my choice. You might be able to find a sturdy paper with some texture to add a design element to the room.
Fori
Original Author
13 years ago
Thanks Paige. I'm actually thinking of an obnoxious tropical print wallpaper if I can find one in vinyl--it IS a pink bathroom after all, and a kids' one at that. A solid on the ceiling would be good, though. I like the tile job, but the colors aren't my favorite so I'd like to downplay them. Two wrongs make a right.

I could lower the shower head I think. That would help a lot with splatter (and the kids are still short. From what I understand, tall people make do when they run across lower shower heads. Not MY problem! :) ).

Still, it gets very steamy in there so I feel that I should do something to save the walls. I did get off my rear and repair the grout and caulk. When the repair fails I'll have a pro come in and do it properly.
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Was the repair listed in the disclosure? Get a hold of your agent and start squawking. Is the shower floor tiled or a one-piece? If the latter is there any flex whatsoever in the shower floor, especially around the drain? What's closest to the hole in your ceiling? The tub plumbing/drain? the shower? For low-tech sleuthing get a light up there, if you can reach even unroll some paper towels, then turn on the tub. Try with the drain open and closed. Watch where the overflow lever comes out of the tub. Watch the trap itself. Same with the other fixtures. If you find nothing, then try running the water with someone standing on the tub and/or standing in the shower. Plastic shower pans and plastic tubs can flex around the drains. Plastic tubs can also flex causing the caulk to fail where the tub mets the wall. I've even seen shower head arms cross threaded, they slowly leak over time inside the wall. Time to put on your Inspector Detector cap. Mongo
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Well doesn't look like holding back is an option so if a few things we care about we may have to push closing up. I'm still waiting on a response from the builder. Usually I have an instant response so my guess is that he is looking into things to give us an idea. It is possible closing could be pushed up no matter what too. I'm not sure if sloppy is it either, but rather us visiting sooner than expected for a walk through. Actually there are several items on the list that I would expect the builder to want to collect together such as wanting the painter to come out only once so I can understand waiting and piling some items up. Same with electrical items, flooring people to finish and fix their screw-ups. I have no idea what the splatter is, but my guess is paint. It is white so seems like a reasonable thing. Could be drywall mud too at least in kitchen from patching drywall after granite install. The things that concerns me as far as closing are: 1, 12, 23, maybe 24-26 and possibly the exhaust fan. The reason for the first ones are the disruption to us especially if they are ripping the floor up to fix and having the light moved will create a mess. Same if they have to pull out the oven cabinet. My DH lifted the oven up some so it is possible if the bottom vent of the oven is large enough they can shim it up a little to cover the cut. The hood vent would be an issue if we'd be cooking immediately which we won't due to not fully moving in for a few weeks. Exhaust fan in bath by wet areas I'm not sure if we have a case or not as there is no code requiring one, but I put it on there anyways. We changed the appliances from Stainless to black and I was told I had to get the same oven except the color due to the cut already being done for that particular oven from the cabinet maker. I'm thinking somebody did a bobo messing up on the installation of the oven and why it is missing some of the pieces that attaches to it. Builder may already be on top of this one and hence install isn't finished. As for the trim guys, I don't think they are the ones that chipped the corner trim. I think it was the wood flooring installers when they installed the quarter round. I have a photo of that corner (just by chance) and it didn't have the corner chipped in the photo before the floors. Floors were just done last week so still possible builder knows about it and just trying to get them back to fix and finish. Seems the real sloppy ones so far are the wood flooring installers since there are several items related to them. The closet rods - I've never lived somewhere where they were not poly'd at least. I agree on paint, but so easy to get splinters without some kind of finish. That one is the least of my worries though and if it is common in other areas that may be so here too. We are 90 miles away from where we currently live so ...
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@ Joseph Corlett, LLC - The way you use "ANY" above would mean that since the color of the tile grout is half a shade different than shown on the package, you don't owe the $50,000.00 balance on your addition. I know it is sensational to take a single word out of context and try to make a ridiculous argument from it, but it is not so effective when everyone can see the post you are misquoting. First, I clearly say that you have a duty to protect your family. I am not sure how a different shade of grout is a health danger, but if it were then you absolutely have a duty. Second, I said nothing about who has to pay for it. In fact, I specifically say, "The right thing to do is to take action immediately to protect anyone from getting injured by falling beams and worry later about who has to pay." Really in the end, you are the person who needs to learn qualifiers. You have no obligation in any state to let anyone ever fix a problem that they created. The law that you are misrepresenting only has to do with financial reimbursement. You just assumed we were all talking about money. In fact, money is mentioned very infrequently in this thread. Many people have said pay to get it fixed now and worry about who is responsible later. You, however, can't look past, this might cost the contractor money, to get to make sure you are safe. That is simply crazy. You are telling me that if you walked into your house and a decorative 4 x 4 beam was sitting beside your child's bed, you would say, "well we better call the contractor who did the work and see when he can get here to fix this before the two above the bed fall on our kid." I don't think you would. I think you would fix the problem, look for other problems, and only later try to figure out who is responsible for fixing and/or paying. Edit: I'd be willing to bet that it was "reasoning" like yours that caused the Florida legislature to wisely protect honest contractors from unscrupulous homeowners. - This is another absolutely ridiculous misrepresentation of the law. First, Florida didn't do anything special, right to repair laws have been around a long time. Second, the Florida right to repair laws don't protect anyone. You have the exact same recourse under Florida's right to repair law that you do without it. The Florida, statute even says clearly that it creates "no additional rights." The Florida right to repair laws serve one purpose, and one purpose only, to reduce court loads, it exists only to create dialogue between the two parties, in fact, the Florida statute affords absolutely no power to the contractor. It is actually one of the weakest as the homeowner can simply reject ANY offer from the contractor and sue without further notice. Many states set limits on recoverability, establish lower statutes of limitation, and establish affirmative defenses for contractors. Florida doesn't, I guess they were not that worried about protecting contractors, or maybe Florida felt the homeowners were not the unscrupulous ones. I don't know.
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What the other kids wrote. Walls, floors, and ceilings can move independently of one another. Not big movement. But micro-movement. That movement can show itself in the corners where these independent surfaces meet. Rigid materials like grout can crack when the surfaces move. Soft materials like caulk can flex. That's why millworkman wrote that changes-in-plane are caulked. And then there's what enduring wrote. Cementitious grout has a certain shelf life. Cement hydrates over time, meaning it's undergoing the same chemical reaction in the bag that gives it strength when it's mixed up and applied to a surface. If the portland in the bag sees any moisture (liquid, humidity, etc) than it's undergoing hydration. My opinion. Old grout can undergo partial hydration while in the bag, so when you mix up old grout and apply it, it may look good in the trowel, but it may eventually crumble away after it cures because much of it's binding strength has already been spent. Not only can it not fully bind to the surfaces in the grout joint, the individual particles can't fully bind to themselves. Thus the crumbling. Unopened bags of grout have a published shelf life as long as the bags are stored under optimal conditions. I try to get the freshest stuff on the shelves. But I don't use anything older than 6-12 months. Manufacturing dates are listed in the bag. That's not a hard rule, that's my recommendation. Some manufacturers list a 24-month shelf life. Opened bags of grout? Again, it depends. The manufacturer usually has a recommendation on the back of the bag. I've tossed bags that were opened for just a few weeks, others have been in good shape after several months. Depends on storage, humidity, etc. In general, any grout bags open longer than 6 months should be tossed. Again, just my recommendation. Any clumpy or lumpy grout should be tossed (or returned if you just bought it) no matter what the age. Back to caulk: You can usually find color- and texture-matched caulk, so the caulk you place in those joints will somewhat match the color and texture of the grout already on the walls. It's not always a perfect match. But close.
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pricklypearcactus
13 years ago
Let me preface this by saying that I am not a wallpaper or moisture expert in any way shape or form. However, I am currently working on remodeling my powder room. The previous owners had at some point had wallpaper on the walls. Some (but not all) of the paper and paste was removed. Some remained and was painted over. We recently fixed a waste pipe leak in the adjacent laundry room that had allowed water to seep under the flooring (previously 2 layers of laminate) and into the subfloor and into the walls behind the baseboards. As a result, the room had excess moisture (not visible) for a few months. The result of this was that the painted wallpaper and paste crackled, pealed, and generally looked bad enough that I finally realized there was wallpaper under there. My (long winded) point is that using wallpaper may make matters worse for you. Instead of damp walls/ceiling, you may end up with pealing or crackling wallpaper since wallpaper paste is water soluble (since that's how you remove the paper).

Can the shower head be lowered to come out in the tile rather than out of the sheetrock? That seems wrong and like it's asking for a moisture problem. Also, is there sufficient ventilation in the room? If not, adding in a good quality ventilation fan should help. Is the sheetrock above the tub standard or greenboard?

Sorry I can't answer your question about the cost of removing grout. I would recommend calling around for some bids. I can absolutely understand why you would not want to do that.
Fori
Original Author
13 years ago
Thanks for the input, PPC. I've dealt with old wallpaper in bathrooms and it's not that nice, is it? At least the vinyl stuff comes off easier. :/

I believe the walls are plaster. I can lower the shower head but it's pretty low already for adults. The tile surround is only about 5 feet over the bottom of the tub. It may not have been equipped with a shower originally (shower stalls in this subdivision were tiled all the way up and over).

Ventilation is a good sized window, so not great. Bleh. This is the GOOD bathroom!
beth572
13 years ago
Can you take out the top row of tile if it is a bullnose and add a coordinating tile up to or close to the ceiling? That would seem to be easiest to protect the walls from water spatter.
Fori
Original Author
13 years ago
Beth, that's a good idea if I can find something that goes. I wouldn't have to take off the top row--it's flat on top. (Wonder if it's sloped a bit. I'd hope so.) You can sort of see it in this photo of the sink (best I have at the moment of the tile).

Coordinating is the hard part. I've already got 3 tiles, the brown, light peach (around the tub), and the mottled slightly brownier peach on the counter and floor. Toilet, sink, and tub are pinkier and I'd be willing to match that too...

Can I use a totally different tile? Pink Formica?

{{gwi:1435730}}
trancegemini_wa
13 years ago
I agree with adding an exhaust fan to get the steam out. The walls in our bathroom used to get wet from the steam condensing in there whenever someone used the shower and this was over all the walls. It only has a small window which is always open but it would have taken a day for that to dry out the room so we had to install one.

repairing bathroom...wet ceilings and missing grout and

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repairing bathroom...wet ceilings and missing grout and

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paige16

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