First of all, thank you all for your thoughtful comments. Not much to report, really. First an almost-funny but not really aspect of the visit... earlier in the afternoon DS said to me, "They're not going to stick that q-tip thing down my throat are they?" I said of course not, that's for strep. Again, he is the best kid, never a drama queen (older DS has that job), but he has this vomiting phobia which includes a huge fear of that strep test because of the gagging issue. He has had strep once, and has had the test maybe twice, but it was so traumatic! And PS the last time he had it done was at least 5 years ago and it was a huge ordeal. So, we went to the doctor -- who was not our usual doc, but one we haven't seen before -- and explained the situation. By then DS was beside himself, could not get comfortable in the exam room, kept going back and forth to the bathroom, etc., while we waited in the exam room for the doc to show up. Doc examined him, noted that he has gained something like 15-20 lbs. since Oct. (he has also grown about 4-5 inches since then), and sees that he has a low temp of 99-point-something. So he says, "It could possibly be strep -- sometimes the only symptom is stomach upset. We need to do a test." And DS loses his mind. It was almost comical but not really. It took a good 20 minutes to get him to cooperate. It was ridiculous, really. And again, this is my kid who gives us NO trouble, ever, so it's just weird to see him act like this (tears, refusing to open his mouth, acting like he's going to leave the room). Anyway... after all that, the quick test was negative. (I was actually hoping it was strep so we could show him that the test was worth doing! Not to mention an easy fix w/ antibiotics. So, basically the doc said there is a stomach bug going around (as well as strep), and that is likely what he has. He said to call if it gets worse, of course, but he thinks it will resolve itself. He didn't seem overly concerned about the on-and-off minor stomach issues that I mentioned, but I also didn't press the issue because frankly, after the Huge Drama over the strep test, I just wanted to get out of there. My plan now is to see what happens over the next few weeks, especially as school gets closer. He's going to high school in Sept., so I'm thinking a new school may mean some anxiety and we'll see if stomach issues come up again. If so, we will make an appt. to see his regular doc and talk about what to do. What I think, knowing DS and observing him all this time, is that he gets nervous about things sometimes. Older DS has major anxiety issues and is very vocal. Younger DS probably has some minor anxiety issues but he is not vocal about them at all, so he stuffs it inside and it affects his stomach. Then he has this vomiting phobia which compounds the original problem, because then he's afraid of vomiting, which makes him more nervous and thereby makes his stomach feel worse. I could totally see it yesterday. When he was home, he seemed OK -- not eating much, still going into the bathroom occasionally when he thought he might vomit, but basically OK. When we got to the doc's office, I think he became even more worried about vomiting in public, so he was antsy and going back and forth to the bathroom every 5 minutes. While I was watching him, I realized he was acting the same exact way in the airport in June when he was feeling sick. We were in the security line and he was convinced he was going to vomit and his whole demeanor was exactly the same as in the doc's office... and he never did throw up. And he was totally fine by the next day. DS is sooo much like DH in almost every way -- they look alike, they act alike, and I suspect DS has inherited the adolescent stress issues that DH had at the same age. DH confirmed last night that he was the same exact age when he started getting really bad migraines. They stopped after a year or two. Maybe it's growth/puberty related? He has been growing like crazy -- as I said, about 4-5" since last fall. Anyway, I will definitely keep an eye on him and by the way, he slept through the night last night without getting up, and is still sound asleep, so I suspect he might be feeling better today. I still can't be sure if this particular stomach issue is really just a little stomach bug, or if it's anxiety about camp, but either way, hopefully the 'bug' will pass within the next 1-2 days, or the anxiety will pass once he gets to camp and gets into the routine there. (Camp is only an hour from home, so worst case scenario, we can run up and get him at any time.) Then I'd like to visit his own doc at a time when DS is actually feeling okay, so he's not emotional or just feeling ill, so we can talk about the whole situation. He actually has a physical coming up in Sept/Oct so that may be the perfect opportunity, unless things get worse before then.

Hi Cornflakegirl I don't like the humiliation idea, she doesn't deserve that. You said she was a lovely girl, so treat her as that. Help her with love, and happiness in your voice. I have posted here, about a similar situation with my daughter, and I know how annoying the mess can be, and how frustrated you can get. But you know, I changed my mind about it all, after hearing what people said here. I think in your situation, perhaps you can just go around together, once a day/week/ etc, and just "show" her how a tidy house should be. It just hasn't registered with her how to do this. Go from the angle, that YOU must maintain the standard, that means not putting pads on her pillow ! Things will get better for you both. You have each other, you can work together on this, and she will blossom, and be the lovely daughter that you want, and need. I think a bit of untidiness is okay, and lets face it, her bedroom is her domain, and I think she should be able to have things the way she wants BUT...when its a case of hygiene then you both must stick to the standard. Work together as a team, then she will feel that you are not on her case the whole time. All the best to you, I wish you and your daughter well. Let us know how you get on. POPI

I think it hard to know what book your kids may like without knowing your morality about sex. Are you wanting to preach abstinence before marriage, sex only with love (you may even need to go into a deeper understanding of what real love means to you), or are you just after a precationary/safe sex education for your kids? I would go to Amazon and type in something like "teenagers and sex" and read some of the explanations and comments on the books listed until you find one that is close to your thinking. I too would recommned talking to your sons over getting a book. I go on walks to talk with my sons, but I know/realize not all families feel comfortable with talking about sex. If you really don't think you can bring yourself to talk about sex, a book may help a little. Maybe it will even help spark some discussion on the matter. I also find commented about things happening on tv may help teach kids values. Your comments, thoughts, and even judgements on the subject may help educate. If you see people casually having sex (not like in a porn but like a night time soap opera) you can say stuff like..."Didn't she JUST meet him in a bar?, I certainly hope he's using a condom since AIDS can be deadly, He shouldn't be cheating on his wife; that's just awful". Don't just let things you watch slide, use the shows as an educational tool of (usually) what not to do. Laugh about the Herpes adds and add comments like, "It only takes one time or I'd hate to have tell a girlfriend I had herpes; that's why they make condoms".

It sounds like you are in a terrible situation. If the 17 and 19 year olds are behaving so badly, is the 14 year old soon to follow? And does your husband really think he is helping his kids by letting them get away with bad behavior? It has been a foundational belief of mine that to have real love you have to have respect. Your husband's kids don't respect him if they treat both of you the way you describe. Kids like to push their parents buttons and see what happens. They are obviously very unhappy or else they wouldn't act the way they do. Encourage your husband to try and view his kids as an outsider would. Then ask him what he sees. Maybe by doing this he can see that he isn't helping them by the way he handles the situation. Even if the kids break off some contact with him, he would be showing them that he doesn't accept the bad behavior, and he needs to gain their respect to have any influence over them in the future. Ask him if he would respect someone who he could walk all over and get away with it. I sure wouldn't! It sounds like you have invested substantial time and emotion into your relationship, and if you can stand it for a few more years, it would be worth it to try. Your husband has probably already lost the two middle kids if he keeps letting them get away with bad behavior. I think it is worth the risk for him to tell his kids to act right or he's not going to be around them. I would guess that their mom wouldn't want them around her all the time with their attitudes either, and they might get the message. You might also remind your husband that he has a 14 year old who is watching how everyone is acting and reacting, and that he has a chance to save his youngest from going down the wrong path like the 17 and 19 year olds. Good luck to you and your family.