It's a Downy; their beaks are short-about half the length of their heads- with a conspicuous tuft at the base, and there are spots on the white tail feathers.
But ID is easy for me-if I see a woodpecker on my suet feeder (which hangs 2 ft from the picture window)-it's a Downy; Hairies are too spooky!

While the Hairy woodpeckers may be a bit timid, that is certainly not the case with the Downy.

I usually have to go out and fill my feeders about twice a day and the moment the birds see me coming they fly away, however I make a point of softly speaking "Chic a dee dee dee, Chic a dee dee dee" and within moments the Chickadees will reappear, often coming right down to the feeder while I am still pouring the seed. On more than one occasion I have seen the Downy reappear on the suet feeder 5ft away while I am still standing there.

Today I saw 5 woodpeckers, 3 downy's, a Hairy and a Red Belly all competing for the suet feeder so I thought I would make it a bit easier for them by hanging a second suet feeder on the same tree. While I was hanging the new suet feeder a Downy was on the original one less than two feet away.

I have also noted that while the Downy may be the smallest of the bunch, it does not back down to other birds. When the Bluejays or Starlings try to come to the suet feeder the little Downy's will hold their ground with the best of them, but then I guess when you have a bill that can punch holes in a tree you command respect from the other birds

In the attached photo the suet feeder on the right is the one I put up today.

Great picture! The angle on that is perfect for seeing the length of the beak. That is definitely a Downy.

lazypup, your picture reminded me I need to make suet cakes today! I thought I had some in the freezer but don't.

The titmouse seems to be the most skittish to me.

Thanks one and all. I don't think I have seen a Hairy.

i have a suet cage 5 1/2 inches square and a woodpecker block cage 6 inches tall. the male downey i get often is pretty close to being the same lenght as the 6 inch cage.
three different female downeys come everyday. the smallest about 3 1/2 inches long another 4 inches and the largest 5 inches long. their bills compared to the spaceings on the cages are 1/2 to 3/4 inches long. I don't get hairy's here in the pinyon and juniper trees but my sister lives about 20 minutes away in the pine and aspen trees and gets hairys most days and they are 8 to 9 inches long and their bills well over 1 inch to 1 1/2 inche3 long

Lazypup, is there one that looks similiar to both yet has red cap on his head? It wasn't the yellow-bellied sapsucker. Not the right color. Looked almost like the both the others, but a bit larger and as I said, had a red cap on his head. Wish I had a pic but only saw him for one day.

Also, just chatting - I have a downy. I guess two, both a male & female, after looking at your pic, checking my book and realizing the male has the red neck. But I just wish mine were bold like yours. Starlings 'kill' my suet feeder and so the downy doesn't seem to feed from that. They only seem to come when no one else is around and then spend a LONG time on the fruit & nut seed bell I have.

I have all my feeders on a 4 part sheppard's hook, so is that the problem? Everything too close together?

I found a pic of that red-headed bird on another GW member's photobucket site by accident. Don't quite know how to post it. I'll try....

Here is a link that might be useful:

From my experience I would guess that your feeders are too close together and the birds feel they have to compete for access.

As you see, I have two suet feeders on the same level but one is on the front of the tree and the second one on the side. I did it that way because I shoot my pics from a window about 50 ft away and when the birds are on the suet feeder on the front of the tree I get the top view of the bird, but when they are on the suet feeder on the side of the tree I get the side view.

My main seed hopper feeder is on a limb at the same elevation about 5 ft to the right of the suet feeders so when i have the camera on the tripod I can quickly pan from the suet feeder to the hopper and both the elevation and focus remain the same.

The Blue jays, Doves, Junco's and in most instances, the sparrows prefer to eat on the ground although they will go to the hopper feeder by necessity. As a rule, when i fill the hopper I also sprinkle about a 1/2 cup of seed on the ground to reduce competition on the feeder.

My hopper feeder is hung on a light weight cable so when the larger birds come and go it cause the feeder to rotate, which gives me opportunity to get photos of all views.

I have a second tube type seed feeder and a tube type thistle feeder hung about 12 ft from the window, which attracts a lot of finches, titmice and Chicadee's

(NOTE-the white specks in the photos are not defects in the pictures, that is snow falling while i was taking the shots.)

From your description i am guessing that you are seeing a "Red Bellied Woodpecker" I am attaching four photos that will show you all views of the Red Belly. In the last photo you can clearly see how it gets the name Red Belly

Yep it is a Downey, once you are familiar with woodpeckers it is easy to tell the difference. We have all three of the ones you are talking about year round at our feeders. Friday in just a short time I took pics of all three too.....

Downey male.....

Hairy male....

Red-Bellied male....

Donna

Isn't that funny ???!!! I guess it was YOUR photo that I posted :) And yes, that was it. And as you suggested, I moved my suet feeder and although the starlings are still at it, I saw my downy at it today. First time for him.

This snowstorm we had has really drawn massive birds to the feeders. More cardinals that I've ever seen !!

And good to know that the titmouse, chickadee, & finches (which I've yet to see one) like thistle. Had been looking to buy a feeder for that seed. Think I will now !!

bonnie aka brit5467

I have wp's at my suet feeder. I'll have to post a couple of my pics. I have both downeys and hairys. I believe that the downey is a smaller bird, and the red spot on the back of its neck is a dead give away. Also the size of the beak. Whereas, the hairy is a slightly larger bird, larger beak (or longer) and I think it has more black and white markings on its body. I only saw a red headed wp a couple of x's and last winter. I did see a pileated here once and have heard the pileated several x's. My wp's were here just about every day and often at the suet feeders but not lately. I do hope they come again like they were.

lizbeth - would love to see your pics. Accoring to my Audubon book, you're right about the size and beak of the downy. I was surprised it didn't have a pic of the read-headed. If I could keep the darn starlings away, I know the downy would visit more. I'm going to try setting up a separate feeder on the side of the house, away from the ones I watch out front and go to the expense of putting the 'good' stuff that they (starling & blackbirds, too) seem to go for in it as to keep them away.

I'd LOVE to see a pileated come by and visit !

I got the laugh of a lifetime today. There was 5 woodpeckers politely taking turns on my two suet feeders and all seemed to be having a good time until a starling flew up and landed on one feeder scaring a hairy away. Immediately the Red Belly that had been on the other suet feeder stepped over to challenge the starling. I snapped a picture of the Red Belly and moments later a tiny downy flew down, landing on the starlings back and proceeded pecking the back of his head like he was intent on building a nesting hole in it. Within about 10 seconds the starling dropped to the ground laying there motionless for about a full minute. I actually thought it was dead but it finally got to its feet and walked over under the pine tree nearby.

Later when i went out to refill the feeder I notice that there was blood on the snow where the startling landed.

For the rest of the afternoon the woodpeckers, nuthatches and chickadee's all seemed to peacefully share the suet feeder but I did not see the starlings come back.

Just a quick correction - Donna, when I said it was "your pic" I meant lazypup' pic. But you had posted your pics after and I didn't pay attention. Sorry. Didn't want any confusion there :0 But those ARE some great pics, donna !!!

Lazypup, that's hilarious !! Not that I wish harm to ANY birds, but considering how piggish starlings are, maybe that's what I need to do. Draw some blood. Noooo, not really. I'll just hire me a WP to do the job FOR me :) Great pic, BTW.

Lazypup, what a great shot of the RB woodpecker challenging the Starling! So far, we haven't had too many of them and I hope it stays that way.

Note to brit: I quit buying the very expensive thistle seed and am using only hen scratch ($6.00/100lbs) and Black Oil Sunflower Seeds. I was worried the tiny birds wouldn't stay, but they have. I still have Juncos, canaries, titmouse/mice and all the others. I don't see any change in species. I am pleased with the results.

my favorite bird this winter is a male flicker. He is here before sunup eeryday and comes back 2 or 3 times a day he eats just abour everything i put out and shares with the other birds. He's weird in that i have never saw him on the side of a tree or hanging on a suet feeder. he always perches on limbs and reaches for the suet or sits in the platform feeder. He plays nice with all the other birds except starlings which he can't stand and challanges even groups of them.

lizbethpa......you said... I have both downeys and hairys. I believe that the downey is a smaller bird, and the red spot on the back of its neck is a dead give away. Also the size of the beak. Whereas, the hairy is a slightly larger bird, larger beak (or longer) and I think it has more black and white markings on its body.

You are right the Downey is the smaller bird with a much shorter beak. The black/white/red is almost identical on both the Downey and Hairy however the Downey has black spots on the outer white tail feathers. The males of both species has a red spot on the back of the head and the female lacks this red. The Hairy is almost as big as a Red Bellied with almost as long of a beak too. The Downey is about 3 inches shorter so it is a big difference. You can see in the pics I posted of the Downey and Hairy how much shorter the beak is on the Downey.

Donna

lazypup -- great pic of the starling v. the woodie! Loved seeing it.

Donna, thanks!

I took early retirement for medical reasons last June. Since I live alone and don't drive so I am basically home bound, except that in the milder months I can take long nature walks in the nearby woods and fields.

Since the weather got cold I mounted my camera on a tripod focused in on my bird feeders 50ft away, and I sit here most of the day watching the action. On average I shoot about 5-600 shots a day.

For the most part all the birds in my neighborhood play nice, but for reasons known only to the birds when the starlings show up the drama begins.

The little downy WP is funny. When a starling flies up to the feeder the Downy drops down and flies completely around the tree hitting them from behind. On the other hand, the Red Bellies simply go toe to toe with the starlings.

Here is another shot I took this morning. If you examine the red markings on the head you can clearly see it is a different Red Belly, but the action played out the same.

It happened again this morning, only this time it was a different Red Belly.

lazyput - your pics are just great. It's like nature at it's best !!!!

goldnol - tks for the tip. I saw the price on the thistle and really cannot afford to spend that much. Where do you get henscrach? A feed store? I'm sure there's one around here, but we aren't really 'rural' so I'm not sure if they'd be as cheap. That's a GREAT price. And I keep seeing somewhere about using the Black Oil Sunflower seeds, but I remember last year (when my ex was taking care of all this) that he said it attracted unwanted birds and I think the squirrels. I can see the tiny birds going for the scratch, but what do you see eating the sunflower seeds?

Hi Brit 5467,

I hope you don't mind my putting my two cents' in. I joined this forum last summer, so I'm pretty much still a "newbie" at backyard birdwatching.

I've been reading books and following this forum, and from everything I have read (lots of different sources), black oil sunflower seed is the best staple seed for backyard bird feeders. Just about all birds love it. I got a 20-lb. bag pretty inexpensively at Walmart but likely you could get it in a larger quantity and less expensively at a feed and seed store.

Of course, birds love shelled sunflower hearts, peanuts, and safflower seed, but all are more expensive. You can't really go wrong with the black oil sunflower.

Squirrels do eat it too, but I just either put the feeder well out of their reach or put a baffle between them and the feeder.

One type of seed I have learned not to put out by itself is cracked corn. Juncos and mourning doves love it, but so do starlings and house sparrows.

The cracked corn is a great addition to homemade suet, though.

I hope this is helpful -

the chickadees here love the black sunflowers. but most all the birds eat it too. i differ from most on here and feed lots of cracked corn, My woodpeckers love it as well as the towhees and juncos and doves. I have to chase off the starlings cause they eat it but they eat anything i put out.
I buy almost all my bird seed and cracked corn and niger and black sunflower from the ranch and farm supply stores.
i get 50 lbs bags very reasonable. Cracked corn was 5.79 for 50 lbs the other day and about 8.00 not on sale.
Mixed bird seed that i like was 11.00 for 50 lbs. and the
black sunflower seed was a lot cheaper than the other stores. Here almost all the ranch and farm stores have web pages that i can check what they carry and the price so i know ahead of time where i want to go. The Cenex and Big R
and Tracor Suupply stores also put out circulars in the newspapers for sales.

Lazypup: Great photos and story about the red-belly, the starlings and the downy!

I've never seen a downy attack a starling, but I've been impressed by the red-bellies standing up to grackles and starlings.
A year ago I saw a red-belly standing its ground at a heated birdbath when a bunch of starlings showed up. The red-belly stayed when it was faced with five starlings:

but apparently decided that eight starlings was a bit too much and left discretely:

A sensible bird, the Red-bellied Woodpecker.

Claire

Given that I have nothing to do all day but take pictures of the birds, I have set out to get photos in three categories.

My field guide lists 413 species of birds native to Ohio. The first time I observe a species I set out to get a field guide a photo to confirm its presence for my personal album. Once I have confirmed the presence of the bird, I then set out to get a "field guide" quality photo in which I control both the setting and the background. Once that has been completed I set out to get photos of the birds habits or how they interact with the other birds. To that end I probably have upwards of 1,000 photos of every species I have noted.

Perhaps some would say I have too much time on my hands, and they would probably be right, but everyone does now, or will eventually need a retirement hobby and this certainly beats drinking beer all day, sitting around in a senior center playing cards or going to the race track.

Many people are seeking feeds that will attract the desirable birds to the exclusion of the less desirable ones. In the course of my observations I have tried about every type of seed or feed materials available, including a variety of table scraps, and while it can be said that each species has a seed or feed that they prefer, it also stands that when the preferred item is not available they will all partake of the less desirable types. But then, the same can be said about people, we all like a nice steak, but when were hungry and our resources are low even a baloney sandwich on dry bread or Ramen noodles will suffice.

From my observations the most desirable birds, Cardinals, Chickadee's. Titmice, Nuthatches Woodpeckers seem to prefer a pure seed mix with a high percentage of black oilseed, while the Junco's, Blue Jays, Sparrows, Doves and Starlings all like the basic seed mix that has black oilseed and cracked corn in it and although the Finches will go to the seed feeder, without question, they prefer the Nyger or thistle seed. In addition, Blue Jays and Starlings seem to like stale bread.

It is true that the seed sold at the Feed Mill is cheaper than it is at Walmart we have to consider the other side of that picture as well. Walmart sells a 40lb bag of mixed bird seed for $12.95, while the same seed mix is available at my local feed mill in a 50lb bag for the same price. The difference here is that most consumers will already be in the Walmart at least once or twice a month, whereas they would have to make a special trip to a feed mill, and when you consider commuting cost, in the end i doubt they would save much. On the other hand, wild birdseed is a seasonal item at Walmart, and by mid January they are starting to put out their Spring line so they may not have any Wild Bird Seed in stock, whereas my local feed mill keeps it in stock year round. I have a slight advantage. My sister has a 60 acre horse farm next door so when she is going to the feed mill to buy feed for her horses I ride along so I don't have to factor in commuting cost.

Generally I buy 50lb bags of Premium Wild Bird seed, one 50lb bag of an economy blend that has 20% cracked corn and 50lb bag of black oilseed. I then mix extra black oilseed into the premium seed mix that I put in the hopper for the most desirable birds, then I sprinkle a three or four cups of the economy seed on the ground under the feeder. In that manner the less desirable birds have the seed they prefer on the ground, which is where they prefer to eat, not to mention that it also provides a food source for my friendly squirrel so he doesn't make any attempt to get to the hopper feeder. Oh,yes, and did I mention that I also get a few wild turkeys that feed on the ground, and on most days my friendly wild bunny family shows up.

I also go to a local commercial bakery outlet store and buy what they list as "Bird Bread" which is stale bread or rolls that they sell for non-human consumption at 10 loaves for $1.25.

Now getting back to the original question in this forum, is it a Downy or Hairy? While it has been pointed out that the Downy has a short beak, it must also be noted that the Downy has a tuft of fluffy feathers at the base of the beak. According to one of my field books, the reason the downy has those fluffy feathers is to keep sawdust out of their nostrils while pecking holes with that short bill.

If you will go back to the first picture in this thread, or the photo I am attaching you can clearly see the fluffy feathers at the base of the bill.

Lazypup..While BlueJays will eat bread if you really want to attract them they greatly favor peanuts more than anything else, shelled or in the shell they don't care they LOVE peanuts. Also in the early Fall they LOVE to dig sunflower seeds out of the sunflower heads from the plants we grow. We usually grow about 3 - 10 ft rows of giant sunflowers, I so love to watch the BlueJays and the finches pick out the seeds. The sunflowers actually attract many different birds as the Bluebird will sit among them watching for bugs and the warblers will hang upside down eating bugs from the underside of the leaves.
Here are some Blue Jay shots....

Helping itself to the sunflowers still on the plant....

We put the heads on the deck when we clear the garden out and the Blue Jays just love this, they prefer the Grey Stripe sunflowers.....

We also always put out peanuts for them, they love love love these and stuff so many into their mouths at one time...

Just waiting its turn at the feeder....

Oh and if you look again at this Hairy Woodpecker you will see they have the nasal hairs too just like the Downeys however I do think the Downeys are a little more pronounced....

Donna

Donna,

We also have an abundance of Blue Jays.

Like you, I planted five rows of sunflowers last year as an experiment and that worked out so well that I have already made a agreement with my sister to get her tractor and corn planter from the farm and I an going to plant about two acres of sunflowers.

I also have a thick stand of Teasel, which is a weed that produces a seed almost identical to Nyger seed. The finches love it.

The Premium wild bird seed that I get from the feed mill has raw peanuts in it.

Here are a couple picks of my Blue Jays at the feeder.

Two acres of sunflowers!! How totally awesome!! I just love them but the stalks are a pain to get out of the garden in the Fall unless it is nice and wet. I suppose with acreage and an actual tractor you could just till them up. I would love to just have a whole garden of them, I can't imagine 2 acres. You will have Blue Jays galore!! I love watching the Blue Jays, got to watch young ones follow their parents to the feeder this Summer, it was funny to watch such a large fledgling begging for food. I am used to the Blue birds feeding their young. In the Spring/Summer if we get Bluebirds nesting in one of our four yard birdhouses I train them to come to a mealworm feeder and then eventually the fledglings come also. They are so fun to watch.

Here are two fledgling Bluebirds from the second nesting this past Summer....

And here are the two fledgling Blue Jays at one of our birdbaths.....

And while I was looking for these pics I ran across this pic I took of a fledgling Red Bellied Woodpecker from this past Summer....

Oh and since we are sharing..here is a shot of a Baby Chickadee a day before it fledged the nest. I was so happy to have Chickadees nesting this past Summer. Had to battle a wren that wanted to take over the Dees nest but I won that battle....

Donna

chickadee....thanks for the info about the seed. My goodness, all you guys with access to feed stores are really making out good compared to me going to Ace Hardware (more covenient for me like lazypup pointed out) and paying $9 for 20 lbs.!! I WOULD have to travel a bit to our nearest feed store. Of course, I could stock up and not have to make as many trips to Ace, huh? But my space is limited as to where to store it.

As far as the black oil sunflower seeds, I know everyone on here is saying all the little birds like them and I certainly am not disputing that, by any means. But when I sit and watch the different little ones come to the dish I have about 3 ft. from my window, I never see them eating or taking sunflowers seeds. Like the chickadees. They'll come, eat a seed or two, then grab one and fly off and do this over and over again. I don't know the difference between the littler seeds, just know that whatever they and the sparrows and the titmouse are eating....it's tiny.

Maybe if sunflower seeds is all they had, they'd eat it like lazypup said.

And once again, to everyone -- some really beautiful pics. And yes, lazypup, what you're doing is MUCH more constructive AND rewarding that drinking beer or playing cards with "old people"...LOL !! Keep up the good work. Looks like you love what you do :)

bonnie aka brit5467

I'm lucky that i live 2 miles from town and off from the highway. But also it's only 2 miles to a commercial area where theres a home depot a walmart super store a bsain coop farm and ranch store and a large natural foods health food store I get the large sacks for a better price. The health food store has bulk bins of rolled oats and other bulk stuff by the pound a lot cheaper than the grocery stores. I have a storage shed next to the house for garden stuff and overflow from the house. I get 5 gallon buckets with lids free from a local restuarent that uses bulk mayo and pickles and salsa ect. and i store the extra seed or feed in the buckets in the storage shed. Also have an enclosed back porch not heated that i keep a couple buckets of what i'm useing everyday. my variety of birds especially the little ones love rolled oats and i sprinkle a little on most everything i put out and the chickadees come flocking in before i even move away to start on the stuff.
Like lazypup i have a sister nearby and she has a debit card for my checking account. She goes past the Big R ranch store fairly often and she can get the cracked corn and mixed seed and other stuff i want there. And delivers it to me when she is here. Oh a bit of trivia in that the horse lovers around here have been buying lots of black oil sunflower for their horses claim it gives a lot of sheen to their coats. and has raised the price of the sunflowers a little because of more demand

Donna, That is the cutest picture of baby Blues that I have ever seen.

dklucius,

you are absolutely correct that the price of black oilseed is on the rise, but i doubt that the local riding horse market is generating a major impact because they have been using sunflower seeds of all variety, and especially the black oilseed as a supliment in both Equine and Bovine feeds for a number of years.

I think you will find a much greater impact is coming from the oil industry. Although black oil seed has not been extensively farmed in the past, there are now finding that black oilseed it much cheaper than corn to produce and it has a higher yield for making biofuel. As the biofuel industry expands we can expect to see a big demand on sunflower seeds of all varieties.

It is a great deal for the farmers because their initial planting and tilling costs are less and they can plant & harvest the oilseed with the same equipment they currently use for corn. If the biofuel industry kicks off as expected we will see the price of sunflower seeds fluctuate very quickly, It could go through the roof or on the other hand, once more farmers get into the production the price could drop tremmendiously.

However it turns out, I will be okay because I have unlimited access to 10 acres where I can grow my own oilseed, or convert some of it to open meadow bird preserve.

Last year we had to cut down two 65ft high Maple trees in the yard. We sold off the firewood, but I took all the brush and limbs and built a living fence along the creek which provides excellent habitat for birds, rabbits, and a couple ground hogs, now to mention that the open meadow area provides a hunting ground for the hawks and Bald Eagles.

As soon as the weather breaks I will be building some hunting blinds in that area where i can sit all day and shoot pictures.

i was born on a farm not too far from here. for most of my life it was wheat and pintos beans In the last 1/2 dozen years it has shifted to sunflowers safflowers and hay.
there are more horses in this area than ever before and instead of everything shipped out to other areas there is a biodeisel plant near by and they run year around processing the sunflowers and safflowers for oil and also the waste for cattle and horse feed and silage. the prices farmers get has risen in last few years so the reail prices has also risen.
Plus the demand from Phoenix and southern california has
really increased and a lot of the crops are shipped there which increases retail cause wholesellers can get more shipping it out rather than selling local. I get 1/4 of the crop sales from our old farm as lease money But i'm in my 70's and retired so i'm not involved in farming but do salvage some for my personal use.

Donna-I've seen a lot of bird photos and have taken a lot myself. Your bluebird fledgling photo is one of the most beautiful I've ever seen. Good work!
Robin

I have a difficult time telling the difference between the Hairy and Downy, too. The hubby is pretty good at making the call. We see lots Red-bellieds as well. Jays, Cardinals, Tufted Tittmouse, Carolina Chickadees, Carolina Wrens, House Finches, Gold Finches, Robins, Eastern Blue Birds, Brown-headed Nuthatches, White-breasted Nuthatches, Pine Warblers, Song Sparrows, Chipping Sparrows, Brown Thrashers, Northern Mockingbirds, Starlings, Grackles, Brown-headed Cowbirds, Red-winged Blackbirds and lately Crows are regular visitors to our backyard and feeders. Here are pics of a Jay, Carolina Chickadee and a Red-bellied-