Thanks for the replies, in response to Ken Adrian it,s a transplant (last fall) that,s in the ground. I,m suprised to hear that it is probably 2-4 years old, they grow that slow? I have a Beech that grows a ft approx a year and I thought it was slow. All my white oaks are under 3 ft, I,ll be waiting a long time before I get any shade from them I guess.I,m glad for my red oaks that are shooting for the sky.They grow about 3 ft a year or more. I know the white oaks are grander in character though, once mature, I got acorns from England for English oak and 3 put down roots they haven,t got leaves yet but I can see the taproot down in the soil and I was wondering if anyone knows if these are slow growers also? They are in the white oak family , right? My chestnut oak has no bristle tips and its one of the fastest growing trees I have , actually I have 2 Chestnut oaks that grow fast, they are considered in the white oak family from what I,ve read. I do realize that Quercus Alba is seperate from the other white oak family members. Any educated guesses on the English and Chestnut oak growth rates is appreciated. My soil is rich and loamy, dark and fertile, I mulch around all my trees, water in drought. Give bunny manure bedding composted to all my small trees that are starting out. Poaky1

I called and talked to Darin yesterday. I will Report to this thread as promises are full filled.. He was very nice and apologetic. maybe I'm too passive.. I don't mind waiting.. I mean.. I called after I sent my payment. but that was to check that the postal money order I sent was received. The Lady that answered the phone seemed very surprised that I wasn't calling to ask where my plants were. I told her that I know they are busy that time of year.. I just wanted to make sure they received their payment... honestly.. the page says wait 3-4 weeks for delivery.. I would have given 4-6 weeks.. but I did receive them 4 weeks almost to the day. If you look at the bid page you can "review" the bidders history " who won". you can read their comments about buying these trees.. if you click on their name and click on feed back left for others.. I read all of them.. the only complaints were late trees. and a few that weren't happy with the size of the trees. but not one about being the wrong tree. I find it hard to believe that out of 40+ buyers that we are ALL so unknowledgeable about citrus trees as I am. (think I need a citrus for dummies book) LOL since the trees I got were wrong ones.. I can't comment on how good of condition they ship citrus. but the trifoliate were shipped well. He said I could dispose of the trees I got as I see fit.. so I am going to throw one outside and see if it is as cold hardy as I have been reading.. will look good out on my parents farm. need to figure out what I am going to do with the others. I've considered trying budding and grafting. if it doesn't work out.. I'm not out any thing.. wonder how long I should wait on my seedlings to try to graft them?? which of my seedlings would be good candidates to learn with?? which citrus have highest grafting success??? my surviving stock.. tangerine, tangelo, clementine, lemons, and nagami kumquat. which would benefit most from being grafted to dwarfing root stock? and then there is budding or grafting? so many questions.. (wonder about that citrus for dummies book again) I've looked and looked at T-budding web pages ( really like the ones with pictures) and that doesn't look too bad.. I haven't been able to find a decent page with decent pictures for grafting.. I am seriously considering taking a horticulture class.. Might be able to get my parents to foot that bill.. they are trying to "farm" and just moved here from New Mexico. Aside from their cherry trees that have been on the property for who knows how long their crops so far have been very small and unprofitable. Anyway.. I'll keep everyone updated.. Thanks for all comments and Help on this thread. Gina *BabyBlue*

For seedlings I'm using about 1/2 Miracle Grow Potting mix with 1/2 perlite. Then with a liberal addition of worm castings, charcoal, sharp sand, and a touch of lime. When I feed I am using Dyna-Gro products and sometimes adding a little bit of kept powder to keep up trace minerals. The adult plant mixes are the same but with far, far less Miracle Grow Potting mix and sharp sand and a great deal more and larger perlite. The lower half of the larger pots are also filled with big chunky perlite only. I'm still learning and adjusting as I go.

What an interesting topic, Hyn. Everything I've ever read said not to allow seedlings to go dormant because they did not have the reserves to support dormancy. The questions for me have always been: What constitutes a seedling? Under 6 months, a year, or three? From what I have read, a seedling is any adenium under age 1 year. After 1 year, they are referred to as 'yearlings,' then 'young trees,' and finally 'fully mature' at age 3 years +. The other obvious question is: What does true dormancy mean? I understand it s a state of hibernation, evidenced by fallen leaves, zero growth, and scant to no water uptake. From what I have observed, there is a huge difference between a semi dormant state and true dormancy. In semi dormancy, growth is significantly stalled but continues. Leaves are not shed and any new growth is painfully slow, compact, and small. I believe what you experienced with your seedlings was semi dormancy. I also experienced the same. It would be interesting to learn the details of how you overwintered these seedlings. In my climate, daytime temps remain in the mid to upper 80s year-round and nighttime lows just barely fall to 68/70 during Jan/Feb. There is a cold, clammy morning dew during those months that subsides as the sun warms into the high 70s by 10am. My seedlings remained outdoors during this period, and experienced these drastic temp changes, from 84 to 68, every day. Watering was reduced to once every two weeks. I observed the same growth stalls you did. However, in March, most of my seedlings began growing at an accelerated rate, very suddenly putting out leaves that were visibly 4x the size of their Jan/Feb output. They looked odd! There were giant (normal) leaves above tiny infantile leaves. As the summer progressed, all the small growth was aborted and they just "caught up." Note that I said most ... some of my seedlings never "caught up." They remain stalled as of today and are in 4" pots, barely 6" tall at age 1 year. They are the size of some of my 6 month olds. I wonder how this growth stall effects blooming, as none of the stalled plants have bloomed yet. All this to say, Hyn, did your seedlings actually experience full dormancy or semi dormancy? You say you barely watered them during this period. Can you share the entire growth culture during this period? We know seedlings can survive semi dormancy with stalled growth. However, does the fact remain that they cannot / do not have the reserves to survive true dormancy? Maria Elena