Hi again, Being I would have to see the flower, it is hard to say. But since they came out easy, maybe. It isn't that they are drying in the dead flower, they are ripening. When the flower is finished, the seeds are starting to develop. How long depends on the type of flower. For some it is very quick, 4 O'Clocks come to mind. Other seem to take forever to ripen. When flowers like marigolds are finished, the seeds as you know ripen in the base of where the flower was. You have to wait for the base to dry up before taking the seeds out to ensure they have properly ripened. So the whole process is sort of like a pregnancy. The flower blooming part is when the sex happens. Then the seed ripening time is like a baby developing. If you remove the seeds too soon, they haven't developed properly. It is like a premature birth. The drying once you remove the seeds, is because there is a residual amount of moisture in them. If you store them before it is gone, you risk the chance of moisture collecting and causing mold which kills the seed. Hope that makes sense, Remy

Steve, I watched your video on tomato seed saving. My comments: You did not address whether the San Marzano from which you were saving seed is a hybrid or an open pollinated version. There are both. And there are issues with saving seed from hybrid tomatoes. You indicated you were saving the seed from a "slightly smaller tomato" in hopes of getting smaller versions of San Marzano next season. All the seeds from the same plant will yield the same genetics regardless of the size of the individual tomato you took seeds from off that individual plant. Did the entire plant give smaller tomatoes than your other San Marzano plants? You added quite a bit of water to the pulp from only one tomato. I'm thinking the fermentation wouldn't be complete in two or three days with that excess amount of added water. And if the pulp you poured into the strainer is any indication of the degree of fermentation, then my supposition is correct ... there was minimal decomposition. And in that case, you only separated the seed from the gel and didn't get the full anticeptic benefits of more advanced fermentation. Personally, I prefer to follow any fermentation and initial rinsing and seed separation with an adequate bleach bath and final rinsing to ensure the death of pathogens on the seed coat. There are also issues that should be addressed with regard to how long to air dry the seeds before storing, and materials appropriate for storage as well as temperature and humidity issues while in storage. And we haven't even scratched the surface of methods to prevent stray seed issues when processing seed from many different tomato varieties. Bill

Bleach can be used - and it really works - but bleach is way harsh. I use 3% hydrogen peroxide solution with impunity around seeds and plants. It doesn't seem to bother them at all. Not sure how effective H2O2 would be on salmonella, but I wouldn't be worrying much about it anyway. Remember, salmonella is already in the environment, just not in large quantities as in some poultry. Dennis

For genetic reasons one should never save seeds from just one fruit, better many fruits from one plant and better still many fruits from two plants, etc. And that hasto do with thepossibility of natural X pollinations if you don't bag blossoms or grow plants at isolation distances. There's a great article here at GW on how to prevent cross pollination which you can find by going to the top of this page, clicking on the FAQ's and scrolling down until you see that article. With pictures. Tom Wagner does single line seed saving which is quite different from the rest of us and he also uses TSP, which is very caustic and I don't reccommend it for us home growers. he also saves seed from unripe fruits and can do that b'c he is using TSP. TOm is a tomato breeder and so uses methods that many of us wouldn't. As to how to process seeds, Trudi knows that I suggest fermentation over any of the oxidative methods and the main reason for that, and I think there's a thread here which discusses it indetail,maybe elsewhere, I can't remember right now, is b'c there's no data to say how effective those methods are nor what infectious pathogens they might remove. But there is such data from Dr. Helene Dillard who had grants from Campbells and Heinz when she was at the USDA station in Geneva, NY. For sure the oxidative methods are quicker, not smelly, etc., but I'm one of many who will stick with fermentation until I see the kind of data I want to see for the alternative. Why not try both and see how it goes? Pete, you know the female parent for the cross you mentioned, which is Indian Stripe, a variety I introduced andlike very much, but how do you know what the male pollen parent could be when bees, which do most of the X pollination, can fly a very long way? If all the ovules in the tomato ovary of IS were X pollinatged then all the seeds you saved would be F1 hybrid seeds, but that's not usually the case, so with your saved F2 seeds you could get almost anything including normal IS plants that were self pollenized. But remember that if Stupice is involved, since it has PL foliage you may not see that showing up in the initial growout b'c that trait is recessive. If you have the greatest bee activity early in the season, then save fruits from later maturing ones, and the reverse holds true as well. That is if you're not bagging blossoms, etc. Having catfaced fruits early in the season is quite common and usually indicates self pollenization when temps are low. There's nothing wrong with saving seeds from cat faced fruits if you want to, but I usually pick the best fruits for seed saving and not jsut all the big ones. There;s genetic diversity within a variety so saving seeds form fruits of different sizes is a good thing. And it's sure fun to work with accidental crosses if you have the room, same for those who do directed crosses these days. Been there, done that. LOL Carolyn