Frances Williams: does leaf form develop over time?

14 years ago

I planted one of these in an area of my garden a few years ago. It turned out to be great, big and lush, with crinkled leaves. Though only maybe 3 years old now, it took off like a rocket and now is huge. I planted about 5 different kinds at the same time but forgot the name of several. I remembered the name Frances Williams but now IÂm not sure which of 2 hostas are that one. BOTH are big and lush and crinkled! Any way to ID the other one? I checked my records but did not write that one down. Must have been an impulse buy I just plugged into the row.

I am planting a new bed and had my heart set on another Frances Williams. I found one today and bought it, but the leaves donÂt look much like the older one. Leaves are smaller (like les than a third of the size) and smoother, and the creamy yellow edge is much narrower. Tag was stapled on so no chance of a switch.

Am I correct in thinkingÂthe leaf form develops as the plant gets older?

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Comments (11)

Teresa_MN
14 years ago
I have three and it took five years to develop the larger corrugated leaves they have now.
hosta_freak
14 years ago
If you want a plant that looks like Frances Williams,and grows much faster try Olive Bailey Langdon. Mine is only three years old ,and is waaay bigger than any of my FW's. Phil
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Same here, but I expected it. I've always heard FW is very slow to expand. I think mine could do better but it is directly under a pagoda dogwood and I don't give it much additional food or water. A few years ago I read a study done by commercial hosta growers. They claimed using alfalfa doubled or tripled the mass of hostas (over a control group that did not receive the alfalfa). It might be worth a try. Spread a few cups of pellets around the base and water it in. Maybe one more application later in the season and another next April. If you still see no results, pass Frannie along to someone else.
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Mine did the same thing, just dwindled down to two small eyes and even they were smaller than the year before. Last year I dug it up and put it in a large pot. Before I knew it, the eyes were getting larger, then it grew a new one. This year I moved the pot to dig out some giant grass that grew behind it and I forgot to move the pot back to the shade. I could tell it was kind of enjoying the new location so I left it. Now it is getting 6 hours of morning/noon sun and heavy watering twice a week. It has 5 big healthy eyes and only one leaf has any "sunburn". I don't know how it does it, but the blue is just as pretty in the sun as it was in the shade. I thought it was suppose to burn off. So this year I dug up my other Frances Williams and put it in a large pot and sure enough it is also growing pretty fast. I hope this helps with your problem.
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ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
14 years ago
how about some pix?

are you aware of the hosta library???

no matter what the immature shape... the coloration should be there

ken
aka_margo
14 years ago
It does take a few year for an immature Frances Williams to develop the mature leaf texture. I was told that Frances Williams comes from a lineage of plants that develops rust colored spots on the leaves, no matter if it's happy or not. So that might be one way to determine which one is Frances Williams. After being told this I checked and sure enough my Frances Williams and my Samarui both had these spots on their leaves.
Jen
arcy_gw
14 years ago
Thanks Jen for that nugget. I asked years ago about the spots on my Francis Williams and no one suggested it was part and parcel of the type. I haven't found Hosta Library to be overly helpful when trying to determine the difference in looks over a labeled immature plant and one that just needs time to grow. Your better bet was to ask here. You will find many share their real life experiences joyfully.
linnea56 (zone 5b Chicago)
Original Author
14 years ago
From what I recall (vaguelyÂas I was planting several new beds at the same time) the first Frances Williams was nice in the pot, but not THAT impressive when I bought and planted it. Then the next summer, I sat up and took notice. And more "wow" since. I donÂt need it to grow faster, this was fast enough for me.

Compared to other varieties I have, and IÂm not a huge collector; it was a bigger transformation. Other varieties are more or less the same as when they were potted, maybe the leaves a little bigger and of course, the whole plant bigger. (For me, comparing with what I have, that means Gold Standard, June, Guacamole, Sagae, Regal Splendor, Krossa Regal, Love Pat, Fire and Ice, Abby, and Golden Tiara.)

When I shopped yesterday, nothing stood out as being distinctive enough. Though under the shade of a mature Mugho pine, it is a very visible garden right next to the front sidewalk. I want things that will "glow" in the shade. It gets morning sun and filtered afternoon shade. I only bought the Frances Williams because I was on the lookout for one. I really like wide leaves and contrasting edges: but probably only want some puckered. I looked at Wide Brim but put that back. IÂm hoping to find a nice blue too. I'm hoping for maybe 3 medium to big ones (but not tall) in total, and the rest smaller.

I wonder what other varieties have such a distinctive change, that I might be overlooking because they are not so "special" when young?
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
14 years ago
the problem with FW is NOT a 'rust' per se ....

its a spring desiccation problem ....

ken
sally_grower
14 years ago
Have you considered a nice gold one to brighten your area. 'Sun Power' is a nice gold that will give you some glow.
aka_margo
14 years ago
When I was at Foxfire Gardens this spring one of the owners said the "rust" colored spots were part of the lineage. They had Frances Williams and all of it's sports in one area, and all of them had the "rust" colored spots. They also had the great, great, grandmother of Frances William (which I can't remember the name of) and it also had them. It was really interesting. I think they told me why, but I can't remember their explanation (not a big surprise) other than it was genetic. You're right Ken, it's not a rust. But if you are trying to figure out what hostas in your garden are Frances Williams, the rust colored spots are a dead giveaway.
Jen
linnea56 (zone 5b Chicago)
Original Author
14 years ago
You know, I goofed. I realize now (especially reading about the "rust" spots) that the one I thought was Frances Williams is not. However, Frances Williams must be the OTHER one I really liked out of the group. Both easily the best I have. I compared the pictures I found online and saw those rust spots on hosta #2. The one I originally thought was "her" has much wider creamy margins and much less puckering. Plus leaves are larger, not cupped, and the ? hosta is a little more upright.

I DO want a gold one; does Sun Power bleach less than Gold Standard? My GS gets morning sun and the frontward leaves are almost white. Exposure is similar in this new bed.
hosta_freak
14 years ago
Frances Williams will grow without much of the leaf margin dessication,if grown in a lot of shade,but it's in the genetics,and there's nothing anyone can do about that. I have some grown in shade,that show none of the problem,but by and large all the rest look like all other FW's. Phil

Frances Williams: does leaf form develop over time?

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Frances Williams: does leaf form develop over time?

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