Good luck on stopping...you are suffering from AMS.(addicted maple syndrome). There are no cures-The first year you get 5 maples; the 2nd year you get 10 more maples; the third year another 10; the 4th year you get 20 more, by the 5 th year you are an acerholic collecting every maple you set your eyes on.....Hello everyone, my name is...

LOL- Koniferkid

People started calling me for the latest in Japanese Maples because it became widely known that I had this problem. I sell enough of them now to keep the sickness going. What a deal!!!!!!!

Kent

Can anyone top this? I found someone who has FOUR HUNDRED PLUS CULTIVARS!!! The amazing thing is that he can converse intelligently about every single one of 'em! He has no TV and no computer to eat up his time or distract him from his focus. Folks, I'm not even going to try to come close...!

Susan

I would love to see his place. It must be amazing.

Kent

The most I have ever seen at one place was over 250 cultivars and I studied each one of them.[whew] Took the full day and 1 gallon of water,1 diet coke, and yes a giant Snickers bar. What a day.
400 Japanese maples -That's what I call Biggie Sizing It.
I would need a double cheeseburger,large fry, and extra large coke to look at all of them. I used 8 rolls of film just going through 250......400 would require a definite digital camera purchase.....
Silvervista, I am making a pilgramage to Portland,Oregon this fall.....Hello Nursery capital of America...

I've spent about $130 on JMs this year, but not a lot on any single plant. I bought 7 newly grafted trees for $15 each, and one 2-year plant for $25. Now I just have to find places to plant them all. For the time being I am growing them in pots on my deck and patio.

I am afraid that the size of my yard will limit the further growth of my JM collection. If I buy any more trees, I will need to either remove some other trees and shrubs, create some new planting areas or keep the maples in containers.

I have learned the hard way not to go too far overboard when collecting plants. I used to have more than 50 varieties of hostas and a bunch of different daylilies until the deer started eating them. The only way I can enjoy my hostas and daylilies now is to continually spray them with deer repellent through the growing season. I also went a little overboard with crepe myrtles one summer, because I had a friend who was growing them and had a lot of different varieties. Now I am considering removing some of the crepe myrtles to make room for more Japanese maples.

Here in Iowa we don't exactly bump into mature JM gardens every time we go around a corner. I had a very sobering experience this weekend by touring the Missouri Botanical Garden Japanese garden in St Louis, and seeing that those cute little maples that I've been buying in one gallon pots and popping in my woodland garden are someday going to be as big as a garage. Yikes! I'm going to end up with an arboretum, not a shaded flower garden. Maybe I shouldn't have planted eleven more this spring.

Hawki, unless you have the space to just let them grow and reach maturity and full size like you saw at the garden, learn to prune. It is amazing how long you can keep a tree in a confined space once you learn the art of pruning. Maybe I should be afraid? But I'm not. I have a very small lot in St. Louis and I have 50+ JM in my garden. I'm into my eighth year here and the maples are looking very good. I finally think I am getting a handle on how to prune them to keep them looking good. Being so close to the MBG and seeing large specimens does make me wish I had more space so that I could see them in their full glory, but that's not realistic for me here. Even so, I can't be without my collection so I have to work with what I have.

Kent
PS, by the way, I will be with the Head of Developement for the MBG tomorrow morning.

Regarding money spent: Too much...and yet I don't have enough trees! Also, my new balcony is bigger than the last place I lived at and it's still too small!

*sigh*

Layne

Kent, just curous, how big is your lot? how many of the 50 are planted in ground vs in containers?

Thanks

My back yard is about 33ft deep and 50ft wide. Both sides of the house are planted up to the neighbors homes. Those spaces are about 50ft long and 15ft wide. In the front of the house the planting area is about 12ft deep and 50ft wide. I have 21 in the ground and 55 in containers. Half of those in containers are in nursery pots and the other half are in cedar boxes or ceramic pots.

Kent

Do any of you know where you can purchase seedlings for a really reasonable prices? I have only one that my daughter gave me for Mothers day two years ago.I want more.

Dawgie, you struck a nerve. I have 22 varieties of Crape Myrtles, (almost all red), probably 40 different hosta and the same number of heuchera, tiarella and heucherella. I also have a 20-count red maple collection, and am now on my 60th JM cultivar. I'm not going to pull out my CMs or maples, because I have no other trees. They'll eventually provide partial shade for my JM collection. I also have 6.5 acres.

I have been spending between $11.00 and $30.00 for 1 and 2 year grafts. Some are going to gasp in horror, but I've been buying them on eBay from 4 different vendors. They happen to be vendors I checked out with their local BBB and emailed some of their repeat eBay customers. So far, not only have they been fantastic, but when last winter killed 3 of my cultivars (I started buying in November), they were replaced without hesitation.

Of course, I do my research and check out the variety locally, if I can find it, but frequently end up purchasing from my favorite eBay vendors anyway. So far, they're fabulous!

I pot them, then bury the pots in my raised beds that actually get some shade. This way I can move them around for the appropriate sun, etc. Hopefully, this will also slow their growth so the CMs and red maples spread to create shade for their more permanant homes.

I am feeling rather insane with all these little trees, but if it turns red, I MUST have it. Plus, they're just so gracefully beautiful!

Thank you for understanding and not looking at me funny.

rkburgess? What's the MBG?

Christine
New to JMs last year.

Whew, makes me feel better, thought I was going overboard and not even coming close. I only have a dozen in 3 seasons, but I have 8.5 acres so time will tell.

I just started my collection this year. And, Im trying to control myself, I dont want to be out of too much money from mistakes. Here is a link to my collection progress.

http://www.candlesupplycenter.com/jm/

Unix3000, nice yard you have going on there.

I am not a big fan of soldier formation myself, but I think you will have a nice speciman style garden in 10 years. Maybe if I have that much yard space I would plant it like that too.

About your plans, my comments are you don't need to mulch them so deep for such a small tree, the bark might not like it and develop some pale color under the mulch, I have small trees like these too and I only dress with a layer of compost less than 1" deep. As long as the roots are not laying out in the sun to dry it seems to be very happy.

About prey mantis, as I have read about them, usually like to eat hoppers but will also eat each other. Ladybugs might be a more effective pest control and hopefully some dragonfly will come too.

CFMuehling- would you care to divulge, either here or via email, your four ebay vendors that you have been purchasing from? LMK if you'd rather email.

Thanks PoorOwner,

Any advise helps. I have never done this before so, I still have many mistakes to make.

Problem is with the ladybugs, we have "Asian Lady Beetles" here from all the cornfields. They eat all the lady bugs, I haven't seen a real red lady bug for years; or not since the farmers brought the Asian ones here. Lady Bugs wouldnt last long. The Lady Beetles are not all that bad, because they eat pests, but they horrible for humans because they bite. I thought the Prey Mantis would be a dual purpose, by eating the Lady Beetles and other pests.

I was planning to put the mulch for cold protection (Zone 5). No mulch touches the trunk, because the pipe blocks it. I was even told for Zone 5 I needed 12" of mulch.. I thought that was a little much, so I was going to play it even at 8".

Hopefully, after I find out what their final look will be, I can move them around a little. But, my real plans are for future propagation so the look of the formation is not high on my list.

Please let me know if you see any other issues...

lambeaufan71, if it's appropriate, I'd be happy to share my favorite vendors. I'm not sure of protocol ...? Anyone else mind?

Naturally, no affiliation, connection, etc., exists other than the fact I give them a lot of money and get great little trees in exchange. [lol] They feed my habit.

Unix, lovely garden. I tend to line things up, too, so I enlist the help of a friend who doesn't think as linearly as I. Nonetheless, I get a military look upon occasion, so I did stuff up and move it. I usually think I've done really well, then I look to the left or right and realize I've lined things up on the diagonal. Even building a stone wall last night, my DH had to keep moving my stones so they interlocked vs lining up. Ah well. Nice yard, though, and it looks like you're putting in a lot of care and work!

Poorowner... I have a GUDZILLION Japanese beatles. Of course. Then I also have these beatles that look like the JBs on steroids. They're about as big as a 50 cent piece and knock into the house with a big "THUNK." I also have a ton of butterflies (thank you, Buddleia), a myriad of dragon flies, and a few, lone praying mantis. Since you seem to know bugs a bit, am I getting the healthy type? I need something to kill those darned white files, though, that are descimating my hibiscus and 'chocolate' snake root.

Off to feed the menagerie..
Thanks!
Christine

I don't think that it would be against protocol, as plant sources are discussed quite frequently here. Brick & mortar, ebay, or other online outlet, a source is a source (of course, of course) :-)

Hi Christine, if you don't mind sharing your list of dealer
here on Ebay we can go check it out.

Or you can email me privately if you want..
Thanks!

PS, Dragonflies and prey mantis are the good guys.

Given the fact I just received 3 more maples today and am crowing about my beautiful little babies, I'll be happy to share! Today I received a Red Emperor, Winter Flame and Tsukushi Gata. YEAH!

Anyway, these trees range in size from 8-10'' to 3'.

My favorite vendors are:

John Herter
Pam Leder
Cedric (I don't remember his last name)
Frank of California Maples
Eileen Hal (who only lists in the fall)

Warning: New Vendor Saga follows:
I just received my Red Emperor from another vendor I was trying out. I won on the 10th, emailed her 3 times with questions, (sometimes they offer a 2nd chance auction and I was interested in a tree I missed), and finally paid without hearing from her on the 19th. When she finally actually responded, evidently her husband was in the hospital and she asked me to resend my question. Again, no response. I emailed to ask again, only to be told she didn't have time to answer every email and I shouldn't criticize until I've walked a mile in her shoes. Evidently, "I am still looking for a response to my past email(s). I hope your husband is feeling better and things are getting back to normal for you" is criticism. Ah well. The tree arrived today loosely tied in a plastic shopping bag, no pot, damp-ish roots (thank goodness in 100 degree heat1) but healthy foliage. I potted immediately and watered thoroughly. I won't purchas from JWilliams again.

If you happen to decide to bid on these maples, my ID is CF.Muehling, so don't steal my auctions. [LOL] But I'd be honored if you let the vendors know you received their name from me. I'd love to meet each of them.

(and I just won a Hogyoku from John tonight!)

Good luck. :)
Christine

Wow! From a quick look at your bid history, you certainly have been building a nice collection. I'd always wondered about jherter's auctions. He always has a lot of stuff listed, but I'd never heard a quality report from anyone regarding his items. Thanks for providing the information that you did, as it's always sort of hit or miss when buying plant material on ebay. It's nice to hear some firsthand reports from those who've purchased from various sellers.

I bought my Autumn Moon from Cedric. They are very friendly and helpful. The tree was very healhy but, they are shipped bagged root. I like mine in a pot. I get the rest of mine from Nishikimapleman he ships in plastic pots ( the way I like) his trees are healthy are well grafted.

I haven't bought from Nishikimapleman, but his selection has been mundane when I've looked.

I don't mind Cedric's bags, because the roots are carefully wrapped and always arrive moist and healthy. What I care about in packaging is that the box is sturdy (not smashable) and the tree arrives in good shape. So far, so good! Everyone else I mentioned does pots, now that you mention it.

Oh, and I've bought 4 Disco Belle hibiscus, Black Knight Buddleia, Dynamite Crape Myrtle, American Sycamore, and Scarlet Oaks from John, too. Just fine!

Christine

Consider that many of the 4" pots you are buying off of ebay, especially those of newer varieties are simply sellers on ebay reselling plants they are buying at wholesale prices. Most of these trees come out of Oregon. Don't expect some sellers to have any knowledge of the trees they are providing. Not all sellers do this and some are better than others when it comes to knowledge. Not that this matters much, but it is interesting.

So far, I'm actually doing well with communication, which is why I am happy with these particular vendors. I don't ask a lot about the maples, but do appreciate a response if I ask something. "I don't know" is a fabulous, honest answer!

Anyway...
Today I've won an Arakawa, Burgundy Lace, and Oshio Beni.
I'm almost done with my "must have" list, although I'm sure there will be more on it.

Good luck everyone! I would love to hear what you purchase -- and why!? I'm so new to this I find it very interesting.

Christine

Hi Christine,
yes this is a very addicting hobby. I have purchased a great many of mine from Ebay also. John Herter is one of my favorites because he is more local to us on the east coast, and his trees have averaged larger than others. I got my first on elast spring, and have some that are 4-5ft tall. Speaking of your bad dealing with the vendor, i think it can happen from all of them at some point. I have had some bad dealings with others on your list. Trees that would make pencils seem huge, bare rooted tress, etc. But i would hesitate to write them up on line. There are alot of things going on with these vendors, and it can get hard for them. We are buying fragile trees, at very cheap prices, so i tend to take a deep breathe sometimes, and realize other factors might be involved. I have read about John being given bad marks from someone on Ebay, and since i have had nothing but success, i question it. I would be gentle online, and maybe hold negative comments to private emails.
On that subject, i would love to chat with you via email. Us east coasters have to stick together, LOL. It sounds like we have many of the same trees from the same vendors, so i would love to compare notes over the seasons. I purhcased about 20 from a vendor in NY this spring. YOu have to branch out, when you got all of the ones on Ebay, LOL. She has a extensive collection. If interested email me, and i will give you her contact info.

Mike Wilson
Acer palmatum 'Crazy'
Ebay jmwclemson

Mike,
That was gentle. I made it very clear, I'd thought, that it was my first experience and I was more disappointed in the weird email, let alone the lack thereof. I'm sure the tree will be fine; I soaked it overnight and it perked up. Nonetheless, although I see your point but I don't apologize. As you pointed out, everyone has different experiences with different vendors and must make their own decisions based upon their own experiences.

Sure, I'd love to know your kind-of local vendor!
Christine

Just thought I would expand on what Christine said earlier about people driving up the price of online auctions and additionly what Mike has said.

What is done by a couple of sellers mentioned thus far is that they pay as little as $5 to buy a 4" pot wholesale (This is also done by website sellers, but they offer a fixed price) and then either immediately or after growing them on for a season, they sell them at acution on ebay. Sometimes, a seller may have some stock plants of common nursery varieties the he grafts himself, but orders in the new plants he does not have stock plants for.

So when we go into an auction, the value of that auction for a first year plant is in obtaining a very low price. Additionally, some sellers will ship at very reasonable prices, but others are much too high in my opinion. So when we drive the price of these often very small plants up, we pay nearly as much as we would from someone who sells maples though a hosted website (Wildwood, Mountain Maples, Eastwood). This is where I feel it is better to turn to a web-based nursery than persist with ebay auctions. Even those that have nurseries like Jherter and Nishikimaplesman choose to sell through ebay and the reason being is that more times than not, they will average higher prices in the auctions. Some will even fudge a bit to call a plant a two year tree when it is not. If we are going to spend $30-50 then we might as well establish with an online nursery that will guarantee their plants and is ethical enough to sell through a web-based business. As much as ebay wants us to feel it is a business, it is not!

It can be enjoyable to buy from ebay in the winter when not much else is happening and I buy during the growing season also. But I also frequent local nurseries in Oregon.

So in anycase, whether or not we buy from ebay, it is nice to have a balance between local sellers where we can go and see the trees and buying online. It is only in going to an actual nursery that we will learn about the plants and those that care enough to propagate them. Establishing an entire collection over ebay is something that I would not enjoy as I would miss the interaction with the growers and nurserymen who also love maples. Of course there are unfortunate areas of the country where local establishments are not accessible and thereby it is understandable to have to use online sellers only. There is something said for establishing relationships and I do not believe that will be done on ebay--it is about the money to be had by auctioning trees.

As Mike said in different words, it is "Buyer Beware" and now with this thread, equally as interesting, "Seller Beware!" I have had equally good and bad experiences with almost every seller mentioned here so far, but I will say that Cedric (Bonsaibob) seems to know the most about maples and had the best communication practices--problem is that his enhanced photography seems to lead to a higher frequency of auctions where the price is driven up. There is no reason to pay those kind of prices unless we feel there is no other avenue to obtain the plant and we have to have it.

MJH

I agree on the enhanced photography! But, I guess it works and we cant blame him. Photos are everything for online business. But, you need to be sure your not being deceiving.

I appreciate pics of the leaves, but some of these pictures are taken in the fall when the trees are the most attractive. I think this is deceptive if you expect the plant to be that color the majority of the time. I usually trust the pictures that have a measuring device next to the tree for comparison and the tree is in its summer color. As far as buying a maple through an auction is concerned I bought a Fireglow through JHerter (my first experience with them.) I didn't know what to expect, but wasn't terribly surprised to find the tree to be half the size of my size 1 Waterfall and Orangeola. I guess I can't complain since the Fireglow set me back less than $20.00 after shipping. My latest auction win is a Peaches and Cream from CalMaples? I hope to get it by the end of this week in fairly good shape. I might stick to buying my trees through a reputable e-tailer than find out the hard way that the auction is not the way to go. Then again if I didn't I doubt I'd have another chance at a Peaches and Cream.

Oh, by the way JHerter has small Peaches and Cream trees available for about $25.00. That's what he quoted me this morning anyway.

Frank (CalMaples) wraps with postage tape that is somewhat of a PIA! The trees are so securely wrapped, it's sometimes hard to get them out of the packaging. It'll be a nice tree.

I think you have to use common sense when you buy online, auction or not. Of course, they'll show fall colors. There are those of us who are looking for that "umph" in our landscaping, since most summer colors are 1) green, 2) burgundy, 3) green or burgundy. A vendor who has some web design experience and available time might offer pictures from all seasons. If they don't, it doesn't take much effort on our part as a consumer to research the tree to see what it looks like during the summer. And when they say it'll be between 8 to 12''? Why expect anything different?

At least the vendors I happen to choose I know are actually nursery people. Pam Leder told me yesterday that she's behind because she is grafting 38,000 maples right now. My $15 - 30 is hardly a burp on the radar in the face of the volume they do. I don't wonder that their web descriptions are abbreviated.

If you are interested in Big, buy locally. If you're interested in unusual varieties, don't mind the time investment to grow and develop the trees yourself, and want to pay a little less to get more out of your budget? Well....

Interestingly enough, although I'm near several of the most renown nurseries in the DC area, their selection is boring. I'm having more fun and better luck online. But I gotta stop! (Don't I?)

Christine

It's really unfortunate that (as far as I know) that there is only one nursery in Houston that offers Japanese Maples. That one nursery offers $500+ maples, but they are far too expensive for my taste not to mention that the only ones they offer are coral bark, butterfly and crimson queen. I currently have:

Orangeola $35.00 JHerter
Kamagata $35.00 Blueridgebamboo
Osakazuki Blueridgebamboo gave to me free with the Kamagata
Fireglow $20.00 Ebay
Waterfall $35.00 blueridge bamboo (I really like this one)
Peaches and Cream $25.00 CalMaples. I'll get this one later this week.

I'd really like to get an Orange Dream if anyone knows any online shops that has it.

I have also spent close to $600 this year mostly buying 1 year grafts and just yesterday $200+ from Worldplants in Oregon. http://www.worldplants.com/mapleintro.htm
They are inexpensive, almost all 1 year grafts are priced at $15, the two orders I placed in spring arrived in very good condition and their shipping rates are very good. Their plants were larger and seemed more vigorous than the ones I bought from jherter or forest farms. They ship by USPS priority mail and the plants have arrived in very good conditon here on the East coast. The only downside is that they take about 2-3 weeks to process your order but don't charge your credit card until they're ready to ship. So if you can wait (I know, Iknow, its hard to wait that long) they are a bargain. They've sold out of a lot of their stock but there are still some finds to be had. I just bought a ao kanzashi, green trompenburg, sazanami, osakazuki, katsura, koshibori nishiki, aka shigitatsusawa, red willow, aconitifolium, kinran, kihachijo, and butterfly.

Also Forestfarm www.forestfarm.com is another source of JMs at fairly good prices 17.95 on up. This is where I bought my tsumagaki that died. On reading Vertrees I think this tree died of fusarium so although they promptly gave me credit Iam a little leery about ordering other trees although I will buy one to use up the credit.

We saw large seiryu, beni otake, villa taranto, sango kaku and various dissectums offered at home depot for $79.99. We couldn't pass up the bargain and bought 2 villa taranto and 1 beni otake to replace some plum trees that I removed because I got tired of fighting bugs and birds. The beni otake is over 6 feet tall and the villa tarantos are about 5 feet.

So fortunately or unfortunately I've gotten the jm fever very badly. Now to find space to plant them all.

It is fun hearing about others with the addiction! I like mucknmire started out last year with an order of 10 from worldplants, 30 or so from Ebay, and 10 from a local nursery. I have now gone from 1-150 in the last year. It is definitely an addiction. I travel alot with work, so at night i travel around the new towns looking for maples to appreciate.

Having to keep track of all of them can be quite a chore. Last year i took the appendix from 'Japanese Maples' and entered it into an access table. I then entered my cultivars in, and can now print each one with the charateristics listed in the appendix. All 150 fit on three sheets, so it is easy to carry around. That way you can check what you have while at a nusery or prowling Ebay for more maples. If anyone uses access or any database much, i could send you an export of the appendix. For others who dont use datbases much, i could create a small standalone program to help keep track of your maples. Let me know if there is any interest in that. I am a little busy with work right now, but this fall i might can get something put together. Eventually i plan on adding the ability to link in pictures of your maples to it. I got a new camera this spring, but havent had much time to start taking the pics yet. I would like to have pics for each season, close up of leaves, etc.

Mike Wilson
Acer palamtum 'Crazy'

My only online dealing was from worldplants. They have been good for the price.

I still prefer to see the plant in person as I like to inspect the graft and branch strutures. When you buy online you don't get to choose what comes to you. Sometimes it is just a trade off, when I come across the right plant I would not mind spending more to get it.

I have been noticing with JMs, sometimes you do get what you paid for, this is just in general, I am not bashing any vendors here. I have been noticing the different appearance of the graft based on price. Some of the grafts on my more expensive (and local purchases) are done very low, barely 1-3" off the ground and is barely visible. I could also go to a nursery that has cheaper prices and I would find that the grafts are done much higher and not as clean looking. I prefer the V shaped graft where the scion is inserted.

On some of the cultivars with a distinct white and red bark color I would personally try to find that tree from a source I can see in person.

And then there are the bargains from big box stores.. I have gotten 5 gallon maples from costco for $30, that has not shown what the tag says it is. I can't say for sure until next year when the leaves might show it's truer characteristics, but in the worse case I might have bought the infamous "no name seedling grafted to a rootstock" from nursery doing bad business. But then $30 for a no name JM that is 5 gallon isn't too bad, it is just the land, time and frustration that is somewhat wasted on a tree if it isn't the focal tree I wanted it to be.

One vendor I like is mountain maples, even though I paid $45 for 1 gallon plants might sound expensive, but they are growing much faster, than the 4" pot plants that I'm 'nursing'. They can go into the ground sooner for me, along with a better looking graft sometimes these things justify the price for me. Some of their maples are bought from oregon but some they propagate themselves and the grafts done by Don are excellent.

I like Worldplants for their price and decent quality. Just one word of caution. I placed some large orders for my personal collection this year. I left the moss they pack around the trunk of a number of trees. I lost 10+ trees from rot caused by the moss (look for discoloration away from green color) and because bugs had made a home in the moss and burrowed through the trunks. If you order from WP, make sure you remove the moss immediately and inspect the condition of the trunks. Other than that I have many perfectly happy maples from WP.

Regarding what I've spent on maples since my addiction began (I hope there's a 12-step program somewhere for people like us), I can't list what I've spent because my wife might find out...

mapler,
Thanks for the warning about removing the moss from trees purchased from Worldplants. I planted several with the moss intact but haven't lost any of the six I bought in the spring. In fact the trees are thriving with the Oridono nishiki (Orido nishiki-Vetrees) about 2 1/2 feet tall now and the Beni kawa at about 2 feet with many new shoots. I probably did not suffer any tree loss due to rot or bugs becasue we've been experiencing almost drought like conditions in NJ. I did remove the moss just in case.

PoorOwner, you're right about the grafts from cut rate places being rather high on the plant. The more expensive bigger trees I bought have the graft almost at ground level or only a couple of inches or so above ground level but I'm willing to live with the high graft for the choices and cheap cost of the trees. I cannot find very many varieties at the local nurseries.

I noticed the grafts on the trees from world plants are just secured with scotch magic tape while the ones from JHerter used the grafting rubber band. I thought it is ingenious and a faster method to use the magic tape and it's harder to remove the rubber band although it would probably just rot off with the uv light exposure. The tape seems to work just fine and would be a lot cheaper.