Eleanor's VF-11 and fortified perlite

15 years ago

I bought some VF-11 and wanted to start using it on my plants, but upon reading the directions it said not to use along with any fertilizers. My question is my perlite is fortified with miracle grow food. Is there enough fertilizer to hurt if i start using the VF-11?The soil that is mixed with this perlite has been in the pots for about 8 weeks now. I can't seem to find any perlite that is not fortified. My soil that i use to mix my perlite with is just plain soil so it is just the perlite that is in question.(I have recently found some plain ole everyday perlite yeah)I also went ahead and used VF-11 but only mixing it not quite 1/2 strength. Any ideas on if this could be harmful or not? Sure could use some thoughts on this for me and my pretty little plants. I have not so far seen ill effects.

Ann

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Comments (13)

Denise
15 years ago
I use the "fortified" perlite, too, and use the VF-11 at full strength at every watering and I foliar feed. It really isn't as much a fertilizer as a mineral boost. And besides, chances are you don't use enough of the perlite in your mix to make a whole lot of difference.

Denise in Omaha
luvofroses
Original Author
15 years ago
Thank you Densie I was hoping that was the answer. I have other house plants including Violets and I was thinking that since VF-11 was not a fertilizer and since i was hoping that there was not that much miracle grow in the perlite that it would be safe. I really wanted to try it since everyone seems to have fantastic results, but I have also read that some saw no difference at all so I wanted to try. My hoya collection seems to be growing. Hoyas and violets seem to have carried me away.
Ann
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Hmmmm. The guaranteed analysis of the primary macronutrients (NPK) in Eleanor's is Analysis: 0.15 - 0.85 - 0.55 This is less than 1% of ANY of the majors. 1/8 of 1% N, 7/8 of 1% P, 1/2 of 1% K. This is EXTREMELY low in fertility. Since I cannot find the rest of the analysis, I'm going to guess the rest of the nutrients are probably nonexistent or nearly so. Did you find anything to show the % of Ca, Mg, and the minor elements. I'm interested in just how much of these elements it contains. Would you share your source of information, please? Joel - your answer is pretty complicated, but I'll try to explain it in as easy to understand terms as I can. I have to start with where the N comes from in fertilizers, because of its effect on what can be used as a Ca source. There are plenty of sources of water-soluble nitrogen, some of which only supply nitrogen - like either urea or ammonium nitrate. For the rest of the nutrients, though, there are far fewer choices. In fact, the only source of Ca for water-soluble fertilizers is calcium nitrate. There is also typically only one source of potassium, potassium nitrate. Magnesium is supplied either as magnesium nitrate or sulfate. Because there are such limitations in the number of fertilizer salts that can be used to blend various fertilizers, the ratio of the 5 macronutrients has a direct affect on the percent ammoniacal nitrogen in the fertilizer. To give an example, fertilizers that have good amounts of calcium tend to also be high in nitrate, because (noted above) calcium nitrate is the only water-soluble source of calcium. Fertilizers that are high in phosphorus are often also high in ammonium because phosphorus is usually supplied as monoammonium phosphate. Certain fertilizers generally cannot be mixed at high concentrations. Fertilizer compounds containing sulfate, (for example magnesium sulfate), are not compatible in solution with calcium nitrate because a reaction occurs where insoluble calcium sulfate (gypsum) will form as a precipitate (solid). If a blended fertilizer contains both calcium and magnesium, then the sources have to be calcium nitrate and magnesium nitrate. Similarly, calcium nitrate and monoammonium phosphate cannot be mixed in the same concentrated solution because insoluble calcium phosphate will form as a precipitate. Sorry, but you asked. ;o) The short version is that the chemicals used in soluble fertilizers tend to cause Ca to precipitate (fall out) of solution as an insoluble solid where is if no value to the plant, so why include it? A few fertilizers, like Foliage-Pro 9-3-6 DO contain good amounts of Ca and Mg in the proper proportions. It should be an excellent fertilizer for houseplants. Al
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maidinmontana
15 years ago
Hi Ann,
I too use VF-11 (thanks to Denise) and fortified perlite. To be honest, I didn't even realize there could be a potential problem.

I have been using it for a little over a month now, and I am seeing huge results. But I was talkin to my sis yesterday (I shared some VF-11 w/her) and I mentioned to her, it's hard to tell if it's the VF-11 or the simple fact that it's spring and everything is growing. Weather it's the VF-11 or not, I don't want to stop using it to find out.

I had a sick, almost dead, scheff and since I started w/ VF-11 it has two new leaves and the color change is remarkable. No bad comments here. . . Thanks Denise!

Good luck,
pmb72
14 years ago
Greetings-

Maybe it's just that I am one of those wacky California transplants, who has climbed onto the organic bandwagon; but does anyone out there care about the ingredients in what you put in your garden and/or home? I have searched high and low, but can't find an ingredient listing for Eleanor's VF-11 anywhere. Not even on the company website. I don't care how good something purports to be, if they won't disclose the ingredients, I am not using it. If this is due to some "proprietary formula" protection claim, that's just nonsense. Sounds like the perfume and cosmetic industry, who make this very same claim. Meanwhile, they continue to put poisons into their products.

Eleanor, if your reading, please come clean and reveal what's inside your product.
Denise
14 years ago
PMB - Please relax... VF-11 is just a mineral boost. Have you ever used SuperThrive? It's along the same line, but I like it much better. I would suggest you call Eleanor and talk to her. She's a very nice lady who will answer any questions you have.

Denise in Omaha
gabro14
14 years ago
PMB,

I don't know if you are simply on a rant about these "industries", or want to know what is in VF-11 because you are interested in trying it out.

If it is the former, please go to the Hot Topics forum. If it's the latter, Hawaii50 posted this from her conversation with Eleanor. So as Denise said, she is very sweet and will tell you what the ingredients are. This quote from Hawaii50 (on a post here) lists a bunch of the ingredients:

"Eleanor said that for best results VF-11 should be used regularly by itself without any other fertilizer. It may be used solely as a foliar spray. It may also be used on roots by watering, though I inferred from what she said that this would result in higher costs that might not be worth the added benefits. VF-11 balances the nutrients that plants obtain. It also hardens plant cells and seals in amino acids, thereby frustrating insects such as white fly. The N-P-K is .15 - .85 - .55 (hundredths). She got the formula from a "cantankerous" elderly chemist who grew healthy plants, including tomato plants that were 30 ft. long with the formula. She originally marketed it for houseplants, but now farmers are interested in it. VF-11 does not fit into any of the categories of plant products used by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, so, for example, she could not call it "plant food." Instead the label says it is "for plants." Also, she is not allowed to list the ingredients. She was once fined $35,000 for saying something like it "gets rid of bugs the natural way" because, to the Department of AgricultureÂs way of thinking, this would make it a pesticide. "VF" means verticillium/fusarium, signifying that it creates disease resistance. "11" signifies it has eleven ingredients. These ingredients include iron, boron, copper, zinc, and molybdenum (I couldnÂt write fast enough to get all of them) in an electrolyte balanced solution."

Gabi
Denise
14 years ago
Gabi,

I found all of that interesting, but when I looked up the two words "verticillium" & "fusarium", each is a genus of fungii that attacks plants (and, in the case of the latter, it would seem animals & humans sometimes, too!), so I'm not sure where the "disease resistance" part of the name comes in... I know you were quoting someone else, but now I'm dying of curiosity about that... I just always assumed that the "VF" part was probably the initials of the "cantankerous old man" who invented the stuff!

Denise in Omaha
bihai
14 years ago
If you are using potting mix with added fertilizer and it's working well for you, that's great.

I make it a point to never buy the mixes that have added fertilizer. The reason why is that I fertilize on a weekly basis with a full strength fertilizer anyway, and I do a foliar spray with chelated iron and all the trace elements every 3-4 months, and my plants are not houseplants. SO any potted plants I used that type of soil in would be overkill.

Besides, its more expensive to buy that mix, and if you don't really need it its a waste of dollars.

Fertilizers are very much an individual preference. What you use, how you use it, etc are dependent many times on your individual growing conditions.

Here in Florida, legislation was recently passed to require that the Phosphorous be removed from all the fertilizers (especially the water soluble ones like Miracle Grow or Peters)because its completely unnecessary in this state, as our soil is already naturally Phosphorous rich. We are only polluting when we add extra phosphates, which then run off and pollute groundwater, lakes, creeks etc.

So no more 'bloom special' here in the Sunshine State
saltarello
14 years ago
Hey Denise, where do you get superthrive? I have tried eleanors and I love it, but they don't sell it here, and it's expensive to order and ship it. I'm wondering if they sell any superthrive around here.

Thanks,

Jaclyn
hills
14 years ago
You can get it off Ebay. I bought a tiny pot at least three years ago and I'm nowhere near finishing it!
gabro14
14 years ago
I agree with Hills - I bought my tiny bottle off of Ebay a few years ago, and I have most of the bottle left!

You can also get it at a hydro store (I know the one near me sells it). If you live near Denise, then maybe she knows of a nursery nearby.

Gabi
saltarello
14 years ago
Thanks Hills and Gabi, I'll be trying it out as soon as I get it!!! Hope it works like VF-11 did!
Denise
14 years ago
I've seen it at about every nursery I've been to. It's a small bottle so sometimes hard to see, so I'd ask. Lasts a long time because it only calls for one drop in a gallon of water. (I use 1/2 gallon jugs, so when I use it, I guess I'm using it double strength!) Back when I bought mine (I think I'm still on my first bottle, too!), I got the bigger bottle and went to a pharmacy and got some little brown-glass eyedrop bottles and made me 3 bottles of it so I could have it in different places, so I wouldn't have to go looking for the bottle every time I watered...

Denise in Omaha

Eleanor's VF-11 and fortified perlite

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Eleanor's VF-11 and fortified perlite

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