ok ...

you need a can of landscape paint .... it sprays pointing down.. and a yard stick ...

go to each tree ... insert the yardstick to the trunk.. and spray a bit of paint 3 feet out from each trunk ... go down the whole line.. front and back ... [or 2 feet .. the darn things grow.. so a little extra is OK .. whatever makes you happy]

then make a dashed line between all said marks... one foot marked .. one foot skipped ...

make some nice ends ...using the yard stick as a compass ...

then get a pump tank ... and PRACTICE WITH IT ... learn how to make big drops of WATER... VERY LOW PRESSURE ... and by adjusting the end tip ... big drops of water fall to the earth due to gravity.. rather than wafting in the wind ...

generic roundup is cheaper..

AND IT AINT FRENCH PERFUME .... more power.. or pressure ... is NOT better ... in this situation ...

on my 2.5 gal tank.. i do about ONLY 25 pumps ... which is not a lot ...

so you have the proper dilution [according to the label instructions].. in a tank you know how to use .... and you choose a day without a gale blowing .... when you get better.. wind wont even matter ...

also .. concentrate is cheaper than premixed ...

anyway .. as a novice.. i recommend you shoot for about 50% kill the first time.. you will go back in about a week ... for the rest ... and do NOT walk thru the sprayed area.. or you will have mysterious dead spots in the shape of your shoes.. all over the yard .. been there done that.. ONLY ONCE ... lol ..

now.. go out to the line of trees ... and spray everything between the trees ... just to start ... you will need to drench the plant to kill it.. so dont worry about a drop or two here or there ... if you sneeze or a bee attacks.. have your snippers in your back pocket.. and snip off anything you drench ...

now go out to the painted line... put the nozzle about 3 inches above the paint.. angled 45 degrees down and facing int the bed .. and walk the whole line.. spraying into the bed .... BUT NOT ONTO THE TREES

if you can figure out what is left between what you did first on the interior .. and what you sprayed on the line.. then fill in the rest .. as best you can.. without worrying about perfection ... i make more mistakes when trying to do a perfect job

then go put the sprayer in the garage and release the pressure .. and crack a 6 pack ... and wait 3 to 6 days.. to see the result ... it will start turning a sickly green in a few days .... and once it is dry... it is rainproof ... dew proof .. etc

then next week .. pressure it back up .... and anything that is still a vibrant green.. hit that stuff ...

if and when you finally get to what is left hiding under or near the plants... a second person to pull back branches... might help ..

inside of a few weeks.. you should be all set.. and within a month .. all the grass will have rotted away ... depending on weather ...

then every other month or two.. go spot spray the weeds...

if you are going to add a line of mulch ... do it when the grass is dead ... and hold it back about 6 inches from the lawn.. so you dont suck it all up in the mower ....

it all makes sense to me.. but i will not guarantee i typed everything.. ask any questions you may have ...

once you become a wizard with your wand [keep your mind out of the gutter] ... you will be using the roundup everywhere you thought you needed to weedwhip ..

the key really is .. low pressure ...

do properly clean out your tank when you are done ... though the roundup will hold over for a week .. i wouldnt leave it in there much longer ...

ken

To add to Ken's advice.......if'n ya think this might be a tech you'll be using more in the future, invest a little over a hundero in a backpack sprayer. Solo makes the industry standard.....used them for years, and lately, I'm really liking the one offered by Stihl-the chainsaw guys.

One note about the Stihl version....while I feel it is superior to Solo's in most respects, it is not as comfortable to wear for long periods. We (My crew at work) fastened waste belts to ours. This helps a lot. We used old waste belts from climbing harnesses, something you'll likely not have, but any type of wide, comfortable belt will work.

When doing the very edge of the planting bed, the interface between mulched area and lawn, always move the wand in the same direction as the contour of the bed, lengthwise, so to speak. And watch out not to get carried away with the width of this sprayed edge. Just catch the grass at the very interface I mention above. It's no harm done really if you go wider, but the "whitewalls" or in this case, "Brownish orange walls" you will be creating are jarring to some at first. Remember too that glyphosate-type herbicides like Roundup do nothing to prevent subsequent weed seed germination, so if you make your edges very wide, that area will just fill back in with crab grass or some other junk.

Like Ken said, practice a bit, don't worry about perfection, and I'll bet that in no time, you will wonder how you managed without this tool and tech.

+oM

i spray endlessly in my hosta beds ...

and spend.. even while spraying.. a lot of time bending over to pull out yearling trees ... and other stuff ...

a backpack does not work well in this circumstance ...

ken

Rather than spraying a bunch of nasty chemicals that might also damage your trees or leach into groundwater, you could also just mulch heavily or lay cardboard or tarpaulin down during a really hot week then just rip the grass out. Spraying toxins seems more trouble than its worth.

I'd posit that without the judicious use of non-selective herbicides, the use of widespread mulching would be near impractical. Yes you can smother out much of the surrounding turf/weeds with the mulch itself, but inevitably, the tougher perennial weeds and turf grasses themselves will creep back in around the edges.....continuously.

It's not a matter of either/or, but both used together wisely. Been doing that for decades now.

Toxic? Meh.....if you're a green plant sure...poison even. But I believe the evidence showing an extremely low level of risk to the applicator and the environment at large when glyphosate-containing herbicides are used correctly.

+oM

I'm just not sure that I'd want to be responsible for spraying anything that came with an extensive warning label and poison control contact info onto my or anybody else's property. Theres no reason for it when there are similar, safer, and less damaging options. I'm no chemist, whats the breakdown rate of the compounds used, how long does it stick around in the soil and water table? What are it's effects on humans? Surely it will come into contact with the thuja roots, what effect does it have?

Seems like way more trouble then its worth, I would discourage the use of herbicides for anybody who's not too lazy to do some old fashioned digging or weed pulling (but lets face it, PLENTY of people are lazy). The one or two weeds that occassionally might germinate or get through the mulch can be easily removed and
hardly warrant the uses of roundup or anything similarly nasty.

That might be true if you've got few mulch beds, but some folks have several, or a few large ones. So far I mostly pull a few weeds here and there as I saunter around our yard admiring the trees & shrubs, but I'm already wondering at what point that's going to become too onerous. It becomes a lot more than 'one or two weeds' and a lot more often than 'occasionally.'

Richard.

Hey theforestprimeval, I admire your concern. You are exactly where I was once at in terms of your views towards herbicides. Thing is......and please allow me to apologize in advance as this is going to come across as condescending.....but I held the views like you do back in the 1970's! I guess you'd have to say I've learned a thing or two since then!

The other thing I'm noticing is that you are lumping all herbicides together as though they are all the same. I specifically noted that I was talking about those materials based on the active ingredient glyphosate, precisely because this is a safe and reasonable material to use, and because it is so well suited to what the OP is asking us.

All pesticide containers are required to carry specific information on their labels. The signal word, ie. "caution", "warning", "danger", etc. has a specific meaning and tells the user what level of risk they are dealing with.
If you are able to dig up a label for Roundup online, you will be able to see that it features the word "caution" which indicates it to be of moderate risk.

Now a few specifics: No, it will not harm the Thuja's root system, no, it will not get into the groundwater or move deeply into the soil profile, and yes, it is degraded rapidly by soil bacteria.

If you saw what I see on a daily basis on my job, you would I think, come to some different conclusions over time.

BTW, by no means am I saying that all currently used herbicides are safe. The triazamines and phenoxies used to kill dandelions and other broadleaf weeds in lawns, for example, are many times more toxic than the stuff I brought up in this thread.

For me, and many other long-time environmentalists, it ain't about drawing a hard line in the sand, but about learning about relative risks, regardless what you are doing.

Imagine if you will, what a full disclosure statement would have to look like on a bottle of beer were one required! IT would easily be as involved as that of a jug of glyphosate herbicide!

+oM

For me, and many other long-time environmentalists, it ain't about drawing a hard line in the sand, but about learning about relative risks, regardless what you are doing.

Well said. And, if someone has concerns about a little glysophate being used on a temporary basis in someone's garden...I hope they plant to eat only organic grains, vegetables and meats for the rest of their life, because factory farming uses literally 100X the herbicides, pesticides, etc. as home horticulturalists.

How about grass-b-gone...kills grass but not trees

Tom, not condescending at all, at least not the latter part. I still wouldnt touch the stuff or call it harmless necessarily but a knowledgabe, civil reply is appreciated. My beef is with the ease with which much of the American public unquestionably uses herbicides and the damage that Ive seen come from such mindless and lazy use of it. Most people dont have any idea, such as you do, about the difference in compounds and the long lasting effects they can have or their respective breakdown rates. You had little effect on my opinion regarding this subject, but I can at least respect your knowledge and stance.

David, no offense but your reply was somewhat off topic and irrelevant.

Anyway, I still say just lay down mulch and do the occasional weeding but apparently Im in the minority here.

Woah, just read up on ROUNDUP, that stuff is toxic as hell! Glyphosphate also isnt the only important ingredient...check out the wikipedia article, about nine paragraphs concerning its danger to humans and wildlife and its potential as an endocrine disruptor. No Thanks... I'd rather stick to pulling some weeds as opposed to spraying that stuff in mulch beds where I'm likely to be digging and working...."MONSANTO - A name you can trust."

Okay tfp, I am glad this isn't a tea party conversation we're having here! As it's been some time since I read the Material Safety Data Sheet-an official document which must be provided for any and all materials we use-I did go to wiki and read their page on glyphosate. On the whole, it backs up what I've said above-that this material is relatively safe. And this is important to me personally as I do use it a lot at my job, as well as in my own projects. Incidentally, on that note, my workplace provides yearly health screenings, of which I avail myself. And in the blood panel, my liver stuff is all in very good ranges, kidney function is good, etc. Doesn't prove anything, but at least in the case of this one frequent applicator (Me), things seem to be okay.

Where I'm not so sure about where this tech is leading us is precisely in the area of "Roundup-Ready" crops. First, because, by applying this material over such vast acreage, the opportunity for resistance in this or that weed species is greatly increased, and second, it simply means a lot more of the material is being applied to the land. Much different than a person like myself or the OP doing some spot-spraying. But even here, as the wiki article mentions, the alachlor and atrazine alternatives have much more worrisome attributes. And we ain't changing big ag's reliance on chemical herbicides any time soon.

Still, I remain convinced that judicious application by someone who is responsible is a valid thing. And my beer angle was no joke. If that product were required to have the same level of safety info attached to its container, it seems likely that many would have second.......and third thoughts about ever taking a sip.

+oM

Ken - the backpack did not work for me either. I found a 3 gallon tank sprayer on wheels, which is wonderful!!!

I marked it Round Up only and I tend to keep it in there all the time. Is there a reason to clean it out each time? I have been using it this way for at least 7 or 8 years.

I do not like to use Round Up but we are located next to woodlands and my beds would get filled with multiflora and mile-a-minute weed and I have to keep it under control. If anyone has a better way of getting rid of the invasives, please let me know.

first.. i use glycophosphate... the generic ...

i have found.. that it can goo up the innards if left in too long .... hence the cleaning suggestions ... especially the pump insides ...

maybe roundup itself doesnt cause such .. and why it costs near twice as much ...

as to TFP ... i have 5 acres.. have planted over 100 trees .. 500 conifers.. and 1800 hosta... i use round up .... to keep my park in order .. i figure.. mother earth.. net 2000 plants.. i do not feel bad about having to use the stuff ...

when i was in suburbia.. frankly.. found no real need for it ...

and i respect your not using it..

to each .. his/her own ...

ken

Any of the various generic versions I've used will gum up the works if not cleaned occasionally. Worse if ya got hard water.

+oM

hey shemp

how are moe and larry .....

did you pull the trigger???

lets see some pix of dead grass

ken

hey

how did this ever work out???

ken

My neighbor has pachysandra planted beneath, prevents grass growth.