Rorion, you're probably better off starting a brand new message, instead of tacking onto an older message thread. Also, please include where you live and zone. And if your trees are in the ground or container (sounds like you're talking about container citrus, so your topic is quite different that the original poster's thread). Patty S.

Hi guys! Sorry I've not been around lately - been a busy Summer. Shortly, will be heading to the Northeast for a coupla weeks to experience REAL summer!... For comparison, it's been hovering around 64F all season in my part of SF with intermittent fog and sun and CONSTANT breeze/wind, so looking forward to some warmth in the Hudson Valley! Mike, interesting question you pose (and again, gorgeous trees!!!)! (As you know), I'm trying to grow both in-ground and potted citrus. It started I would say, after a visit to Hearst Castle and seeing how Mr. Hearst himself grew a variety of citrus for their ornamental value. A bit of research led me to identify the Meyer as the ideal citrus to grow here, so I planted 3 on the right side of my driveway - I also figured they'd eventually serve good wind-screens. The 1 potted Meyer I have was a rescue that then became an experiment. I wanted to see how it did in the 511 mix AND on a much cooler-summer + wind-exposed (but very well lit - approx. 12 hrs sun(!) - area. I can't yet tell you if there's a difference in fruiting/flavor with these, but I hope to get back to you in a few years. What I can tell you is that wind is definitely a factor, since the potted Meyer in an exposed location has much less healthy looking (smaller, slightly curled) leaves. I may yet be forced to try to grow this Meyer year-round in the house(!). My 4 other citrus are also experiments, you could say. Trovita orange/Cara Cara orange: In-ground and both planted in the same planting hole, since I read this is possible AND I'm out of garden space to plant. In the sunniest part of the garden, but also most exposed to cold summer winds! Orange supposedly cannot grow in SF so am giving it a try to see. Both Cara Cara & Trovita hang long on the tree and need less warmth to ripen they say, so we'll see. Gold Nugget mandarin: In-ground. Mandarins are rumored to grow here, and I LOVE the taste of GN's! Bearss lime: Latest (and hopefully last!) acquisition - thanks for the recommendation, jkom(!). Potted in regular potting soil with wicks; resides indoors. Am testing my NE/SW facing window to see if it can sustain citrus indoors year-round. I'm also seeing how well the wick system does as compared to 511/gritty mix. So what basically started off as passing interest has morphed into a little obsession (and a bit of experimenting). But I'm sure none of you can relate... :-) Cheers, Tim

It's not "semantics", it is simply a wrong use of terminology, John. There is no chemical reaction going on, or excretion of some chemical or poison, causing graft failure. So for me, using the word "poison" isn't really descriptive of what is happening. Sorry, I have a science background, and I think I provided a pretty clear explanation, John. Steve, the Meyer lemon (or other incompatible cultivars) does not excrete something that kills the rootstock. It is just an inability to make that cellular connection well enough to support the transport of nutrients up through the rootstock and to the scion cultivar. More an "apples and oranges" analogy, since John is fond of analogies. Or, square hole in a round peg. There is basic incompatibilities between several cultivars and trifoliate rootstocks, Meyer being just one. If I have a chance to snap a photo of my container Chironja orangelo, I'll post it to show a scion/rootstock graft issue. I didn't want folks new to citrus to think that a citrus scion had the ability to poison the rootstock, definitely not what's happening at the graft. Patty S.

Susan, I love your light stand and always will love it. I realize it was the best solution for you, but if I told Tim I wanted to buy one of those, he'd hand me a hammer and tell me to build my own....which is why I have the one that I have. : ) Mine is hidden away out of sight in a room where guests rarely venture, although anyone who knows me and who knows I raise my own seedlings always asks to go upstairs and see it in the spring. So much for putting it out of sight....I just should have set it up in the dining room or breakfast room or something.... I am sure you'll be deliriously happy with it and will have many wonder seed-starting adventures and I look forward to hearing all about them. I think you got a great deal considering it was Gardener's Supply. I never buy anything of theirs for full price. They have sales often enough (and especially in November when, I think, some of us gardeners are shopping for ourselves) that a person can be patient and get a good price during their periodic sales. I've noticed that prices often are not as good in December when gardeners' spouses or family members are doing what I call "panic Christmas buying" and cannot afford, time-wise, to wait for a sale. I don't think you were repetitive at all. The more we all share about what we do, how we do it and why we do it (as well as pointing out what didn't work for us!), the better for all of us to learn from one another's experiences! Carol, Our weather is just like yours. Our high was 70 degrees yesterday and it was so gorgeous outside I could hardly stand it. I wanted to jump up and down and scream "Spring Is Here!". That was exacerbated by the smell of the orange blossoms on my little orange tree. However, I controlled myself because I knew it was a false spring and that winter was returning today. It was 56 degrees around 7 a.m. here at our house and now it is 36 degrees and we have had very, very light rain but lots of thunder. Phooey on winter! I think you showed those folks at the co-op that one benefit of being a gardener is that it keeps your muscles and joints strong, healthy and fit. I'd rather "work out" in the garden any day, than walk on the treadmill or work out on the weight machine. Who wouldn't? Trees, Nope, sorry, I just haven't gotten to it. I am trying. Watch for it in a couple of hours or in the morning. I'm about to start typing mow after I close up the chicken coops, put out the deer corn for my favorite deer, refill the bird feeders (those little birdies are eating nonstop today trying to stay warm), etc. I'm kind of dreading going out into the cold wind but I need to do it now before it gets dark. I have to warn you that I don't use the same planting schemes every year because I don't want to get stuck in a rut, but I'll try to mention some of the planting schemes in my usual rotation. Dawn