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California Gardening

Bob and Jerry's Soil optimizer

16 years ago

Has anyone used this product?

I bought a Siberia winter tomato and it was recommended that this product be added because of the humic acid content.

I didn't buy it, but I've been doing a little web surfing and it sounds like a good all around product. Any comments?

wanda

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Comments (6)

wanda
Original Author
16 years ago
Oops! Make that Bob and John's Soil Optimizer. Must have had Ice cream on the brain. LOL
caavonldy
16 years ago
I saw some in our local garden shop. It's very pricy. I am just using my Osmacoat. I'm putting my tomatoes(I bought 2) in 5 gal buckets with drainage holes. We have been moving the tomatoes into the garage at night since the deer ate 3 baby tomatoes as the plants sat next to my front porch.
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What is your main goal here? Save money on potting mix? Use peat because the particular plants like acid soil? or keep the large pots light so they can be moved? You can build lasagna beds in containers. You can do it with or without peat and you like. Personally, I'm not that huge a fan of peat anymore. I've mixed compost, grass clippings, and aged manure together and put it in containers before and done fine. I've also used the free compost from the county to fill containers and done fine. I've decided not to buy dirt substitutes anymore. I actually buy very little in the way of soil amendments anymore and what I do buy is usually very cheap (like 4 yards of mushroom compost for $5.) I like the idea of using water and drink bottles to take up space in the bottom of over large containers. That would keep things light. If you are going to spend money on "potting soil" or potting mix. Go ahead and buy the good stuff as it will be worth it for the season. Here is a link that might be useful: My Compost
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len, That you don't understand, comprehend or like the science is fine. I'm not trying to convert you into a believer. But, your notion of using gypsum without established good reason is, in western U.S. soils, just plain reckless. It can, in a number of areas, result in excessive soil Ca levels, with very negative effects for plants. It has been well tried, tested, studied and proven. That's a point you just don't seem to get - the soils in the Western U.S. are not like yours, and the same treatments will not have the same effects. Try this from the Colorado Extension Service: Gypsum is a mineral found in large quantities in most Colorado soils. The belief persists that adding gypsum can "break up" the compact clay soils so typical of the Front Range area. This is not true and here is why. Calcium sulfate or gypsum when added to our clay soils only increases the already high calcium content. Since plants growing in our soils already have all the calcium they need, the added gypsum does nothing to improve plant growth. Spending money and time to add gypsum to a soil that is already high in calcium is a waste of money and effort. As far as relieving soil compaction, gypsum has no effect. Loosening soils is a physical process, not a chemical one. The way to break up tight, clay soils is through adding and mixing in organic amendments. The amendment holds the clay particles apart creating more space for the air so critical to plant root growth. Improve the aeration and drainage of your clay soils with organic amendments such as compost, peat and manure. Add a two inch layer of the organic amendment on the surface of the soil and till or spade in to a four to six inch depth. When purchasing organic soil amendments, buy four cubic yards for every thousand square feet of area. It's easy for gardeners frustrated by hard, clay soils to grasp at anything that sounds like it might work. With gypsum, the expression "If it sounds too good to be true, it is too good to be true" applies. Decades of research has proven gypsum is not the answer for us. The secret to developing a good soil for gardening in our area is one organic gardeners have known for years - organic amendments Here is a link that might be useful: Colorado - What About Gypsum?
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Blutarski Fertilizing depends very much on what you're growing, as you know. Something like Adenium or Pachypodium can be fertilized like any other tropical plant all summer long, whereas a slow growing succulent like Lithops needs a completely different fertilizing regimen. For controlled applications, mainly for slow growing and dwarf succulents, I use diluted Algoflash. It has everything the plant needs. Occasionally I supplement with a liquid Calcium feed. One can use Epsom salts as well for a Magnesium boost. For tropicals and robust "succulents", I use the Osmocote 3-4 or 5-6 month slow release formulation. I also add Magnesium and Manganese (via slow release crushed spikes) for added trace elements, along with gypsum for added Calcium. All these are added in the spring at the onset of growth. I assume they are pretty much used up by the time dormancy arrives. During the winter slowdown, fertilizer is not needed. For some tropicals that keep growing in the winter, I just use the Algoflash as needed. I prefer the slow release fertilizers because you apply once, and that's it. What I like most about the super well drained and aerated inorganic mix is that I can leave even sensitive plants outside without protection from rain and I have no fear of rot - well, almost :-) x
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habitat_gardener
16 years ago
I bought some at one of the end-of-season sales but haven't used it yet. I was going to try some winter tomatoes but injured my hand before I could buy them, then had to stay away from soil and compost for a month :( I still have a healthy Sungold, so maybe it's worth trying, though the Sungold is too big to make a frost-protection tent.

Most years, a few tomatoes keep producing until the first frost finally kills them off. Usually the temperatures don't stay cold for long -- it's the freeze/thaw of the ice crystals that settle on the leaves and stems, so if you can make an overhead shelter and the weather cooperates, you may be able to nurture it along.

When I grew Siberia last year (planted between monsoons in late March), I got 286 tomatoes during the regular season (compared to 261 from an Early Girl), even though the plant stayed compact and never got taller than a couple feet. One day in the middle of August I picked 48 of them. Then picked 24 a week later. Monthly totals were July 30, August 156, September 19, October 58, and November 23. It would be interesting to see how it does with a late start.
wanda
Original Author
16 years ago
I'll keep you posted on it's progress. One of my local nurseries had about 15 or more varieties tomatoes in gallon pots that were labelled "Winter Tomatoes". I had to try one. I planted it in a 15 gallon black nursery pot. It's got lots of flowers and I noticed a tiny green tomato this morning.

My Sungold and San Francisco Fog are still producing and I have ripening fruits on Shady Lady and a beefsteak variety.
In past years, I've always had tomatoes up til December with Celebrity, which I grew in a pot.

The humus in John and Bob's is supposed to make the uptake of nutrients better in the colder weather. I decided to go for it.
I have the tomato out in the open and I really didn't plan to make any sort of cover for it.
greenwitch
16 years ago
I buy liquid humic acid in a gallon jug from a farm supply store, not expensive although I can't recall the price. AgRx is where I buy it in SoCal.
Disasterguy13
12 years ago
Wanda, This is definitely worth the money. When I originally spoke with John Valentino (one of the founders of John and Bobs) I thought some of his claims were just 'crazy talk :)' , but I decided to try it anyway. I just applied it to the right side of my porch for the first season. A little over a year and a half later the soil the right side of my porch is rich lush soil that looks like I have been amending it with compost and other amendments for years, on the left side my soil is a hard clay hard pan(this was my original soil). On the tomato side of things I use this product extensively. The humic acid does allow the plants to produce more and produce later. I also learned that you can take the Penetrate product and combine it with Kelp or seaweed extract for a foliage spray. I use 1 tablespoon of the Penetrate and the kelp extract in a gallon of water weekly. This really pumped up my tomato production. As far as cost I would note that each product is packaged to treat 1000 sq feet. In other words a little bit goes a long way. Hope this helps!

Here is a link that might be useful: Everbearing Services

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