ian:

I hate to be a poop, but did you know that it is illegal to collect plants or even seeds of plants from native plants in California?

It is only legal if you do it on private land (with the owner's permission, of course) or if you have the appropriate academic research papers.

Is the "specific locale" you refer to in Wrightwood on someone's property? Do you not know the owner?

Joe

Ditto to what Joe has written. I am just a short 10 min. drive from Wrightwood but not into collecting our native seeds and shipping them out of the area. Too many of our natives are disappearing due to overdevelopment of the area and I prefer to let the seeds remain in their native habitat, hopefully to replace the joshuas being bulldozed on a regular basis.

Diana

Got it. So if that's the case, how do California nurseries specializing in native plants obtain seed from which to propagate plants? Is there some kind of permit they can get or is collecting from private land the only option? How can I find more information about this? Thanks.

Coincidentally or not, I've noticed in my travels in California that few native plants are used in gardens and landscapes, compared to the Pacific Northwest. Those that are seen tend to be larger pre-existing trees and the like; it doesn't look like many people are planting natives.

Not to stir the pot but rather discussion. Pardon my rambling musings........

Thousands of Joshua Trees were/are presently being destroyed by fires along with their seeds. Hopefully someone salvaged some seeds to assist in the replanting. Perhaps fire assists in their propogation....I don't know. Zoos remove endangered animals in order to ensure their survival and hopefully return them to their native land. Plants come and go. The environment changes, sometimes quickly, sometimes slowly - sometimes by natural means, sometimes by accidental means and sometimes by intentional means; sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. What was once dessert is now jungle. Once was jungle is now dessert. Who's to say what is native and what is not? Fossils abound to demonstrate change in our environment. Ideas in appropriate protection or introduction of native plants also change. What's good for today may not be good for tomorrow. Do we allow forests set ablaze by "natural" means to burn without intervention? Some say yes, some say no. Who's right, who's wrong? Is a law right because it is the law? Laws change too.

Well I'm not aiming to disobey any laws because I would rather not get myself in trouble whether the laws are right or not..... :-) Nor do I advocate destruction of wild plants for development or other purposes.

However, I hope that in the future the laws can be rewritten or crafted in such a way that encourages cultivation of native and endangered plants, and raises public interest in doing so. As it is, a law such as the one we are talking about applies the same penalty to someone who collects seeds to make more plants (and, I might add, more plants than they would make by themselves in nature), as one who destroys wild plants heedlessly. A severe dichotomy is created between preserving nature and gardening, as if humanity did not belong on the earth at all. Somehow the powers that be have forgotten that our cultivaion of plants can be a means of preserving them.

ian:

Reputable native plant nurseries propagate plants from their own existing mother stock or they buy/get seed from reputable seed dealers who deal in native plant seeds. These seed dealers get THEIR seed from their own mother stock or from mature plants in botanical gardens or on private properties.

mikey:

Bottom line -- until the laws "evolve", we pay attention to them. Civil disobedience to push the evolution of laws is a noble philosphy when it comes to peoples rights but when it comes to potential destruction of plants, I don't want to be the one to speak for the plants.

Zoos do, indeed, collect endangered animals in an effort to save them from extinction. Believe it or not, though, the process is a quantifiable one and the zoos have the formula for doing it right (although even they sometimes "miss"). Amateur botanists don't have anything close to a formula for "saving" plants. Any action on their part is risky at best.

Joe

Ian:
I also live about 20 min's from Wrightwood but the uniqueness of the Joshua Tree is that it grows in the Mojave Desert in certain places only as the soil conditions must be absolutely perfect for this tree to grow and thrive. The only other place that it grows is said to be somewhere in the Middle East. We CA residents living in the area can adopt a Joshua that has been moved or will be moved but the tree must then be planted again at exactly the same position, as in East side facing East and so on. For additional info, you could contact Stuart Kellogg at the Daily Press, Victorville. He is quite knowledgable of the tree.

Hi there, I live in Victorville, just moved last month. I inheritare a mature, nice and healhly Joshua Tree in my back yard and it has 2-3 babies.

Yesterday, I found a dry fruit on the ground. I am planning to plant them on starter pot. I believe it's not the only fruit/seed pod I get. More coming. I don't think I have enought space to grow Joshua trees from these seeds. I would be happy to share the seeds with anyone who want it.

Let me know.

Did you ever get some seeds? I usually have more then I need (although not this year 2008). I have perhaps the largest living Joshua tree in the Victorville area. It is easily 40 ft tall. I am a desert landscape designer and have used Yucca brevifolia many times. When young the plants can be transplanted with little regard to original orientation. As the "trees" get larger transplantation becomes more problematic. Larger plants dug out of the ground usually will not survive due to extensive root damage. Small container grown plants or volunteers can be planted into almost any well drained location with full sun. It doesn't matter how they were facing. Their growth rate is dependent on water. The more water they get the faster they will grow. They will not tolerate water logged and clay type soils. Sandy soils are preferred as well as overhead watering.

Seeds germinate better if soaked in water or scarified.

I have read of people having specimen plants in England and the Eastern US. I sent some seeds to a gentleman in France last year.
Their native range includes not only the Ca Mojave Desert, but parts of AZ, NV and UT.