I joined this forum learning that cuttings were easy.

I don't see how this can be said
I too lost the best of my cuttings.

Edna & Barry,
I feel exactly the same way, I have lost soo many of the
cuttings I bought and it is sad, seems they would start off
just fine and the next thing ya know they were history.
Patiently waiting for spring.
Karen

i think ya'll all need to move to south louisiana.every cutting i got from barry,wildflower and karyn have rooted,in jars in my double kitchen window that faces east.
all i've done is add water when needed.will say it's past time to get 'em in some pots.got my soil.but we're gonna need to build an ark if the rain doesn't let up.thanks to all of you that shared with me!
patricia

I was running close to 100% until I hit ebay. Cuttings should be very easy to root. I was wondering why everyone was having so much trouble until I bought some. Out of like 45 I may have 4 that will make it. Now I have rooted hundreds with no problem. I have rooted tree limbs to Plumeria. It was no problem they were abused and force to survive in cold rainy weather. I all has to do with the quality of the cutting and your ability to keep things semi sanitized. In the long run plants from a good seller will make a grower happy as long as they have a wallet to support it. I hate to spend a $ 100.00 and then spend a $ 1,000.00 of time on something I should have trashed long ago. I learn from every cutting something that will help another.

Jeep461,
Yes, the cuttings that I recieved from friends are doing
the best but the ones I bought from ebay are the ones that
I have had trouble with not making it.

Karen

If I didn't have such a full greenhouse I'd offer to start cuttings if they all came from one or two approved buyers?

I have had very good results with almost all the cuttings I've received except the ones from a particular ebay seller.
Karyn

Karyn, we are all talking about the same seller, he promised Barry, he would replace our bad cuttings when the weather got better. I sure hope he is a man of his word. The funny thing is I did not have trouble with the pencil thin cuttings the thick ones were the ones that went south. I agree the way to go is to buy the plants. I bought 3 plants from ebay and 3 from Mark. Marks plants are hugh in 1 gallon pots, and they were about the same price as the ones I got on ebay in the 4 inch pots. Barbra,

I lost a lot of mine too. The worst were the bare root cuttings and the ones that looked like they got frozen. I will buy nothing but plants now also I think unless its from someone I know or if its spring where I can put them straight outside to root. I think some just don't do well rooting in winter.

If ya'll don't mind I would like to offer my experiences as a grower and seller of brugs. Hopefully this will help those of you who are somewhat new to brugs.

First as a grower of brugs. This time of year is not the best time to try to get cuttings to root. Right now brugs, as a general rule, are in some state of dormancy. And this presents the problem of trying to get a cutting to make roots when the plant material is not actively growing.

Two things that I have found to help overcome this hurdle are, to give the cutting as much supplemental light as possible. Even in a greenhouse at this time of the year, the amount of natural light is not that much and it does not have a lot of strength to it either. So supplemental light helps. Then, I find that gentle bottom heat will help the cuttings to root instead of rotting. But this is not the case with every single cutting. There are many other variables to consider such as; the over all health of the mother plant the cuttings were taken from and the particular cultivar. Some are harder to root than others.

It is also extremely important at this time of the year to make sure you use a very well draining mix to pot the cuttings up. I NEVER buy a potting or seed starting mix to pot up my cuttings. Personally, I use this to pot up cuttings.

Approximately
1 1/2 - 2 parts moist peat moss
1 part perlite
1 part vermiculite

Oh, and make sure that the container you are potting the cuttings in are not too large. I use a 3 or 4 inch pot for a "normal" size cutting.

Now as a seller, and this is just my opinion and is not meant to chastise any seller. I have been growing and hybridizing brugs for many years now. I just started selling them back in Dec. of 2005.

On the subject of small, green cuttings, I have a hard time getting green cuttings to root too. So don't feel bad about that, it is just a fact that the better the cutting, the better the chance for success. Personally I would not sell small green tip cuttings, because I would not want to receive them myself.

Also, this time of the year is not the best time to ship any tropical plant. Although, when I did sell on eBay most of my plants were sold and shipped in colder weather. However, I did pack my plants with a 60 hour Heat Pack to keep them from freezing. Towards the end of selling on eBay I made it a mandatory part of the purchase to include the Heat Pack during cold weather. There are many sellers of tropical plants that will not ship or guarantee the plant unless you purchase the Heat Pack also. So this is my opinion, if a seller is going to ship tropical plants at this time of the year, they should at least offer the Heat Packs as part of the transaction.

David, Thanks for that info.
Theresa

Thanks Dave I am not familiar with you, however we have discussed those very things for the past 6 months!
The only thing I can conclude here is that we got cuttings that were either in there dormancy, standing too long in water at a less than optimum condition, or were frozen.

I am not sure if it is ethical to sell cutting at this time of year, if they can be so difficult to root.

please e-mail me if you are shipping tropical plants in March. I would like to see what you have.

As Barbra stated, the small shriveled green cuttings we got last month rooted fairly well, but the "healthy" Thick hardwood ones turned to mush. Go figure.

And Dave, I whole heartedly agree with your potting mix.

Barry.. It is ethical.. and no one held a gun to your head.. LOL
I have lost a few this yr but with each yr of experience comes increasing success..
Learning from experience (altho can be expensive)is the best way to learn.. there is no straight set of rules becoz we all have different enviroments.. Don't be dissapointed in what you lost be proud of the ones that will be around all summer to preform Beautifully for you...

Let me tell you a story about my 1st plant/cutting. LOL I was watching the gate every day when I came home nothing. Now I have an electric gate well any way the post lady had set it over the fence next to the gate. Well it had fallen over and I proceeded to run over it with my truck. Then my wife ran over it with her car. I waited until about 8 PM to go out as it is really hot in the summer. I saw this box with a smashed plant. I was devastated. My 1st angel trumpet. Well I dug around on the internet and found garden web. I was told to soak it in water and pot it up the unsmashed pieces. Nothing to loose so I did it. Now these traveled in 100 + degree heat. Were left in the sun all day and were run over 2 times and looked dead to me. Well every piece rooted. I was amazed. Now you say what has this to do with the original subject? A quality healthy brug is one of the most hardiest plants in the world. Good cuttings will root. Sick cuttings will take a bunch of time.

As an experiment I tried what I read somewhere and took a long cutting and buried it. I had forgot about it and was out looking for my frozen banana tree and I saw little brugs coming out of the soil. I had rooted all by itself. No help.

Unless a plant is shipped with a well developed rootball I prefer unrooted cuttings. From what I've experienced over the years a plant with an undeveloped root system shocks so easily regardless of the time of year that it's been shipped. What works for one of us doesn't always work for someone else, even in a similar zone. After a while you figure out what works best for the conditions that you provide. I do think that many people, especially those who have recently started growing brugs (or any other variety of plant) pay way too much attention to them and kill their plants with kindness. I was certainly guilty of that, especially with orchids.
Karyn

I have started using the peat and perlite. Must have missed the part about vermiculite. Now I gotta go find some, lol.

JimJeep & David: Heartily agree with what you both have to say. I've lost way too many cuttings this year to be ALL from my stupidity! I've learned that yes, there is a good time for taking cuttings to root and it is Not during the time of year dormancy. My cuttings from earlier this year are thriving, but not the ones from later. I also have learned that very green and very thin cuttings just don't make it for me and certain sellers seem to send only this type.
I've also decided that for the same amount of money i can buy a healthy rooted plant instead of 3 puny cuttings and that's what I hope to do next season.
BTW several months ago Techdweeb and I had a discussion re: how successful plants given or traded by the folks on this forum were. I'm hoping this spring/summer I have some to trade and pay back for the kindness of you all. Gloria

Dave: What type of peat moss do you buy for potting cuttings? Is there a special kind to ask for? I've tried to use peat for my plants a long time ago but gave it up ... got it too wet or it dried and the plants died. Would like to try your formula for Brug cuttings. TIA Gloria

Me I use 50- 50 plain old mulch bark (cypress) and big granule vermiculite. They are thirsty all the time but love to root in it. The have double the roots compared to regular potting soil.

Gloria,

I use the sphagnum peat moss that you buy in the big bales. Not the sphagnum moss that is used to line baskets or for orchids.

Also, when I make up my potting mixture, NOT the rooting mixture, I use more peat moss. If I have it I will add well composted cow manure to my potting mix. The ratios of my POTTING recipe would be somewhat like this:

2 parts Peat Moss (If you don't have compost, 3 parts)
1 part Composted Cow Manure
1 part Perlite
1 part Vermiculite

Now, these portions are not fixed in stone. Add more or less of any of the ingredients until you get a mixture that seems right to you.

Something else that may interest you guys about Sphagnum Moss (Not Peat Moss). It is excellent for preventing damping off on seedlings. Just crush it up to a fine texture and sprinkle it on top of your seed starting mix before you plant your seeds.

Back to Peat Moss. When it is dry, it will repel water instead of absorbing it. But if you use very hot, even boiling water, the peat moss will absorb it.

Thank you DavidWV. Once my Brugs are ready to pot up I have no problem. I've been using a very rich soil mixture ... compost + worm castings+ pumice + vermiculite + osmocote 18-18-18. They also get "fed" every 2 weeks with liquid fert. And then once a month during growing season epsom salt and (ugh) fish fert.
I'm looking for a good medium for rooting the cuttings. Esp. the big woody ones, I find mush quickly in the BOB. so I like to pot them or root them horizontally. But I haven't found a mixture I really like yet for rooting. Gloria

hey Jim: Please tell me more (in detail) about your rooting mixture and how you handle rooting cuttings in it. Are you talking about those big bags of bark mulch I see at Walmart and Home Depot? (don't know if they're cypress). I also like to use vermiculite, but mine doesn't come in a choice of granular size. The stuff I can find is just "regular" vermiculite. Will that work, do you think? Expecting some cuttings this week and I'd like to try your method. TIA Gloria

The bark I guess does not matter much as long as it is not big chunks. Look for around 1/2 " size. Vermiculite any size will work. I accidentally ordered a 4 cubic foot bag of fine. It still works but just likes to drain out the holes unless you put a layer of bark on the bottom. You water them until it drains out the bottom every time. I put nothing on them until they go into the ground as far as fertilizer. I use it outside. If it rains for a week it is still ok. It will never get too wet. Check the bottom side holes in the pot and water them all when it feels dry. Do not water the other plants in regular soil at the same time it will mush them. Keep them together and water all of them. Spring rains here and slow draining potting soil is a disaster. We sometimes get 6+ inches and no heat to dry them out.

This works for regular and logs. It is nice to not worry about over watering. It will only hold so much and that is it. The extra just drains on out. Cheap and works for me.

It is a very light mix even when watered. So moving plants is easy. I move six 1 gallons at a time with no effort. I did use brug rolls this year just for fun. It works good also I have some in there about a month and a half but the mix grows roots 3-4 times faster for me. I was just trying to avoid pots if there was a freeze coming.

Jim: I'm going to try your way with the next bunch of cuttings. My problem here is once the rainy season is over (we get ALL our rain at one time!) our weather is hot and DRY!! It's good to know this mix will hold some moisture in for the cuttings. Will let you know how I do. Thanks for the info. Gloria

Gloria,

I assume that since you live in Zone 9 SoCali, that you do not get a whole lot of rain, even in the rainy season. And that you have your plants in ground year round.

If you have well draining soil, you should be able to use the water absorbing crystals to help keep the brugs root system moist in the dry season. I have to grow all of mine in pots and I still use the water absorbing crystals in my potting mix. A little hint that a brug grower from down south gave me about the crystals many years ago; mix up some liquid fertilizer at the regular rate and soak the crystals in that before mixing them into the soil around the roots of the plants.

Hello David, Gloria Dave has much more experience than I do. His ideas we my next trials. I have a big bag of sphagnum, I bought 4 cubic feet. On the water gel I was going to try it. Brugs need so much more water than anything else once in the soil here. I was thinking of adding some clay. lol Not really laughing I am serious. Water gels, the fired clays like oil sorb at Walmart etc. Something to at least give one day in between watering in the summer. They are hit by the grass sprinklers and still have to be hand watered. So when I get lazy I double or triple the sprinkler time and then the grass suffers. I am trying to find a balance. In a pot it is easy make it drain real fast

Thanks, Gentlemen. Have used the water absorbing crystals when planting my Brugs inground in hopes it would increase moisture-holding capacity. Combining the crystals as well as the vermiculite in the planting hole works fine, BUT be aware that the crystals will be dissolved in a year and won't be there anymore. That's why I also throw in the vermiculite when planting. By the time the crystals disappear, I always hope the Brug's roots system is big enough to hold onto some of the moisture. But the dry heat and lack of moist soil is a BIG problem in my area for the Brugs!
The baked clay (kitty litter) turns to cement after being wet and then dry... even underground. I've had no luck with it. Vermiculite so far works best for me! G.

Not kitty litter. I have been down that road. The key is the temperature it was fired at. The oil sorb stuff from Walmart passed all the tests. It is labeled for plants. I was skeptical so I tried some and tested it out put some also in a jar half water half oil sorb. Left it in the sun for about a month and every once in a while agitated it. It is still in that jar almost a year later and has not turned to mush. Just one more tool and cheap. I am a Vermiculite person because it can get it real cheap by the cubic foot.

Jim: Will look for the oil-sorb at my local Walmart. Sounds like another alternative for when I can't get vermiculite (some places here in CA have banned it)Thanks. Gloria

Gloria - another tip Jim gave me? Once they're in the ground (I used this in a pot too), cover the ground around them with compost.

For some reason, that helped with the over all evaporation - and he said it would help me with slow release of fert. I was having such a problem with the MG tomato food (it was warping my leaves) - I had to slack back and he said to try that. I found it slowed the water loss also.

This year - I'm going to try to put them in the ground like you do. I'm trying to get them going now to get ready for spring planting.

Annette: Good advice about covering with compost. I will have to try a good mulch to cover for now, because I don't have a lot of compost. What I have I need for potting mix. Do you think the bark that Jim was referring to will work? Since I'll be buying a BIG bale of it I will have more than I need for the cuttings! BTW the Brown Turkey Fig? ... Delicious ... and that thing has the will to survive that you have to admire!!! Gloria

Yea - Jim told me to go get vermiculite and bark fines.

I couldn't find the bark fines. The vermiculite by itself, it didn't work as well as I had hoped. I'm using perlite now. But then again, I didn't have the bark fines I was told to get.

I used the compost on the top of the soil after I had flushed the soil repeatedly to remove the tomato mg food. Man that stuff was hard on those guys.

I use potting soil and almost 50% perlite. That is real lite and fluffy. I've had some good luck with this. I do think the gnats are taking a toll though. And the last time I blasted with neem oil (dripping into the soil to kill 'em) it was really, really hard on the poor little cuttings. I did see a fall off - but man - it really traumatized those poor guys.

So I'm gently feeding them with fish emulsion - and assuming the roots will out run the gnats - misting the room with RAID and using the sticky paper.

I think I've got a pretty good handle on the mites now also. Thanks to the FORBID! That area that was devastated and defoliated is now green and lush. Shocked me when I really noticed yesterday because I had to move everyone to water. Thought what the. . .then noticed. . .HEY! Everyone is GREEN! That's why I can't reach over and water anymore! (grin)

Can't wait for spring/summer when I can use a hose to keep them clean. And the Anti Stress for protection.

Annette: I've stopped all MG stuff. Remember earlier this year when I lost most of my Brugs and other plants after using MG fert.? A few brugs came back after constant flushing and about 8 months! Be careful with the MG. I know on the plumeria forum they warn against using it. Apparently it makes the plants so dependant that they can't function without it!!! Who'da thunk ... addicted Brugs ;0) Gloria

LOL Gloria.

Yea, I remember you used some old stuff and it burned some of your brugs to the point of killing them.

I'm trying to move away from MG - but everyone carries it. I have some schultz now. I can't find peters anywhere.

And good luck finding seaweed extract around here. I'm gonna try a large garden center 3 towns over - see if they have any.

I'm trying to make some compost tea that everyone raves about. But gotta get the seaweed stuff first, unless I can use Fish Emulsion instead.

This past season was my first with brugs and dats. I ordered plants and lost supernova and creamsickle. I don't know if I lost them because they were in MG, but the three brugs that lived and all the dats grew terrifically.

Of course, it was a miracle that any of the brugs lived. I bought them in 4 inch pots and didn't know that they would sprout roots up and down the cane (I know cane's not the right word) and planted only the root ball.

Jim

Jim - my supernova just bit the dust. Again! That's the SECOND one that croaked!

I'm going to purchase a full on plant this spring. I'm not having luck with super nova cuttings. It was doing well and then just bombed. So I'll get some plants. And go from there.