Yeah, and I saw some beautiful Crypts!

Also a killer Alcantarea.

As far as the Neos, I wouldn't call them "culls". Some are better than others, and I bet they'd all look quite a bit better with a little more light.

I hope we're not going to start slamming other hybridizers' work when they register plants. That ain't nice.....

It was not a slam on someones work but its a slam on bad judgement. To register a few was one thing but page after page of that garbage..
So its ok to just register anything just so your name is on it? A few would be one thing but is that the new trend... register everything? That defeats the purpose of registering I think. Since the site is also used as an identifying guideline and also is to promote interest in bromeliads. Its time for a few guidlines in registering broms.

It's all really a matter of opinion, I just finished looking at I don't even know how many photos and there are a lot of plants I didn't care for, it doesn't mean they are no good. What your asking for is really impossible, first of all you really can't tell what a plant is like unless you grow it. How do you set standards, and how do you evaluate a plant that is 1000 miles (or more) away if you are the registrar. He can't keep anyone from registering anything any way, all he can do is make sure the procedure is followed properly, and that the name is either not already in use, not offensive and follows the guidelines that are set up for naming cultivars.

I think there are almost 60,000 registered daylilys, but the daylily has steadily improved or evolving. I asked a pretty popular hybridizer about some of my seedlings, they were first time bloomers, and needed a few more bloom seasons evaluation. He told me to consider any plant I wanted to introduce very carefully because he rushed to introduce some when he first started, and 5 years later found himself asking himself what he had been thinking. He admitted that he was quite emabarassed for having introduced a couple. I've been at it about 10 years, and have maybe 5 that are good enough, and thats MAYBE. 2 of the 5 are plants I didn't care for, but I have been convinced by others that maybe I should.

Thanks for making my point Bambi...evaluate and use good judgement dont register the first PUP of everything you cross

Unfortunately if you look at current events, good judgement is something that seems to be in short supply.

Ha! You got that right, Bambi!

I am 100% in favor of good judgement, but the hybridizer is the one that has to make the call, NOT the registrar. If the breeder doesn't excercise some restraint he or she will be the one who suffers, as it will be reflected in their reputation.

To the extent that the registrar encourages people to register everything but the kitchen sink, I agree with you, HDD, that we have a problem. I just don't think that singling out a hybridizer and calling their work "garbage" is the best way to address that. What if that person were a member of our forum (and how do you know they're not?)?

I would hope they would finally listen to the good advice previously given about these registrations from very knowledgable people about the damage it does to personal reputations and to the FCBS site as it is our only universal knowledge base...I was not knocking the registrar at all. He has no guidlines to stop such happenings

He doesn't need guidelines. The previous registrar encouraged people to be selective and only register the best. The current one actively encourages registering every plant being grown. It's a difference in personal philosophy and not anything in writing, but the results can be seen on FCBS.

If I submit a plant for registration and one of its parents is an unnamed cross, he asks that that one be named and registered too. I feel this is completely wrong-headed. I believe that many hybridizers, left to their own devices, would probably excersize a lot more restraint if they were not being actively urged NOT to. THAT is the problem, in my opinion.

Lisa, I agree with you on that point also. I have friends who gave up registering due to just such hassles. Hence I held back on some I have done in the past. The other reason was I had a lot of help with some I did, so I kinda felt like they werent mine even if the parents were my plants

Oh NO! you should be able to do seedling x seedling crosses, and neither parent needs to be registered, or released to the general public.

You can, Bambi. None of this is enforced. All I'm saying is that there has been a shift in direction with the registry.

Lest this be taken as a personal attack, let me reiterate that I have no problem with the guy in other respects, and in fact have a great deal of respect for his knowledge, enthusiasm, and even his nitpicky tendencies when it comes to sorting out species. I even understand why he's doing this. Look at it his way-- how many times do we get asked to ID a plant, particularly a Neo? There are thousands of Neo hybrids already on FCBS, but contrary to what you might think, this is only the tip of the iceberg compared to what is actually in circulation. If Uncle D. had his way then every plant in everybody's collection would have a name and a picture on FCBS so that it could be identified. It would also help eliminate the problem of unnamed crosses on price lists. If you see a Neo. carolinae x concentrica listed, how do you know which of the hundreds (or even thousands) of clones you're getting? With his way they'd all have to be given names, so there'd be no confusion. Doesn't sound like such a bad thing in theory, does it? But in practice it would swamp the registry with crap (and use up all the good names in the process). You're looking at thousands of cvs now, you'd be looking at MILLIONS.

I get the reasoning behind it but I just don't think this is what the registry is for, and I get particularly upset when a true cull is registered-- one that the hybridizer him/herself chose not to name.

The solution, of course, is for every breeder to destroy all but their A game, and never let them get into circulation. Human nature being what it is, this is not likely to happen. I'm as guilty of selling off unnamed or unregistered crosses as anyone. When you've put so much time into creating them and they do have some redeeming qualities, you want to at least try to recoup a little for your efforts. Also, as Bambi points out, one person's "cull" may be another's treasure. The problem comes when it gets passed around and then somebody posts a picture of it on the GW and says "what is this?" and can't understand why you don't know. ;-)

You all keep talking about using up all the good names. With nearly 60,000 registered daylilys the hybridizers are still coming up with some new and original ones. Get creative!

Guilty, I've bought and sold seedlings that weren't fit to be registered, but were what we call "bridge plants". They might carry traits that just need to be expressed a little bit more. I have one that really isn't much to look at, but oh my does it help make some really nice seedlings. There others that give up thier color but have good form, and pass it on. Just because I'm using them, and they make good babies doesn't mean they need to be introduced, and they probably shouldn't be. BTW we tend to share these, I have quite a few that were given to me because someone thought it was something I needed.

There was a daylily hybridizer that produced a lot of really fine plants, but for one reason or another didn't register many. His plants were not only very nice, but are highly sought after, and were ahead of their time. They all carry the "garden names" he gave them with(unregistered) after them. I heard he once registered one just because it won a Junior Citation award and he couldn't collect it unless it was registered. He did grant permission to a number of people to register plants in his and their names, so more are being registered. BTW no one has tried to use any of the garden names he used, although they could.

I have not taken your comments as a personal attack on the registrar, and remember as far as species go there are "lumpers & splitters". He is probably doing what he thinks is the right thing to try and bring order to the confusion that I'm beginning to see. He has a very diffacult job. I can see why he wants as many of the plants circulating registered, if you have one being passed around as BIG BIRD, and someone registers one as BIG BIRD now you have 2, and if someone else decides they should call one of theirs BIG BIRD now you have a real problem, and it already exists.

I do get creative with the names, Bambi, and I also use a lot of Hawaiian names, not only because they're less likely to be used by anyone else, but also because they mean something to me and I want to help create a distinct identity for Hawaiian hybridizers. Of course nobody on the mainland can pronounce them, and the spelling often gets mangled, but that's another issue.

The BIG BIRD problem still exists though, and also the reverse problem of the same clone being given different names by different people. If you read all of the "Uncle Derek says" comments (and I have posted several of them here) you'll see that this is something he has been grappling with for a while, and that's probably why he does what he does.

I guess it all comes down to the question of "what is the registry for?" Is it to encourage excellence, or to be a catch-all for sorting out what's what? I vote for the first one, but I can see the rationale for the second one too. Maybe there could be two separate entities? Not sure how that would work.....

Well....I kow you are all probably getting tired if the Daylily comparisons, but the American Hemerocallis Society, has established not only standards for showing, and display gardens, but has established an award system for cultivars. There are different catagories so your not comparing apples and oranges. To win any of them your plants must be seen and evaluated in display gardens during AHS functions. Certified judges vote. There are National, and Regional events which really tests a plants quality when its being grown from Canada to Florida. There is a seedling category as well. That gives some people the incentive to introduce good plants. BTW the AHS handles the registrations world wide and has a registration COMMITTEE, there is a registrar, but not all the pressure is on her. She has help.