This is a very good question - the only way to get the correct answer is to find someone who actually grows these roses in your conditions. I would guess that the best bet would be the French ones, if they were bred in Southern France where the climate is warmer. You really can't rely on the opinion of the breeder, or anyone who grows them in a cooler climate.

Yes, Austin definitely started a breeding trend. However he, and most breeders, just pay attention to what their roses do right under their noses (p/o the human condition).

Jackie

There are few roses that stay short in California. 'Wife Of Bath' a very old Austin, one of his first, has always been petite in my garden. Sweet little rose, and great rebloom. 'Golden Buddha', a Barden rose, has remained petite for many years, again sweet plant with good rebloom. Gruss an Aachen/Pink Gruss (Irene Watts) is fairly contained.

Nearly everything else will get big, if I let it. The Kordes (German) roses will get enormous here, bereft of a German winter. Northern France gets a cold winter also--visit Paris in January.

So, I guess one thing to do would be to research exactly where in France the breeders of a rose you are interested in are, and figure out what climate zone they are in.

Here is a climate zone map for France - only the way Southern and Eastern area (red on the map) is a hot summer, mild wet winter "Mediterranean" climate. I would think that rose breeders in that area might produce some roses which would grow in a similar fashion to what they would do where you are. At least it would be somewhere to start.

Jackie

Ralph Moore introduced a line of short bracteata hybrids, which have manageable growth, repeat bloom and old fashioned form of flowers. The one I remember was named 'Lemon Pearl', or something like that. Maybe Burlington might still be growing them?

The romantica roses from Meilland proved to be a mixed bag. Touslouse Lautrec featured vegetative centers on every bloom. Weird. I remember there was one which was a very nice saturated pink color, which actually kept its color. The name began with R, and was named after a famous French artist or writer. Renoir, maybe?

Some of the newly introduced floribundas such as Julia Child and Bolero, seem to have more the old fashioned flower form, and are, by most accounts, exceptionally rapid blooming and healthy plants.

Thank you Jackie and Hoov. Drats. I guess those long winters give these hybridizers lots of time to dream up great crosses. Good map.

I'm all for letting plants display their natural growth pattern. But, after this flush on 'Heritage' it's out with the saw.

I'm not recommending this but due to a gopher invasion I put 'Colette' in a 5 gal. pot which was buried. After they wiped out every bulb except daffodils they moved elsewhere. Apparently rose roots were not tasty to these guys. The upshot is 'Colette' has stayed under 5 feet with minimal pruning. Wonder if this would work with tall Austins?

'Irene Watts' (pink Gruss) is on order for spring. Still lusting for 'A Shropshire Lad'. Thanks again for your input.

Our posts crossed Nastarana. I am looking at Moore's white 'Out of Yesteryear'.

I grow Out of Yesteryear and it is always in bloom. The disease resistance is very good. In my PNW garden this rose grows tall it is now 6 feet but makes a nice shaped bush.

However that is the good news about Out of Yesteryear. After 3 years it has slowly changed to a nice pink!!

Iris gal I placed my first order with them to be delivered this fall. Hope I didn't make a mistake by not waiting to get delivery next spring. They have some gorgeous roses on their website. I ordered several you mentioned. Anxious to hear what everyone says.

Gorgeous rose Lynnette! Love it in the peachy color the most. Think it will go back peach? Pink is quite beautiful too!! Judy

6 feet!?! And in the PNW. And I was thinking Moore's roses were all shorties. Beautiful pictures.

Prettypetals ~ you ordered from Filroses. How exciting. Do they ship from Belgium? Which ones did you choose?

Iris gal I came across Fil Roses while on HMF looking at roses. They have some gorgeous ones and when I saw ships to the United States goofy me jumped. Lol. The ones I ordered are Vichy, Voyage, Maria Theresia, Pastella, Aphrodite, and Charming Piano. I'm wanting lots more but going to see how these do and see what room I have left. Soooooo anxious to get these babies and see how they grow. Judy

Pretty petals,

What are you paying in shipping, please?

I am besotted again....

Here is a link that might be useful: Such beauty!

Nice choices Prettypetals! I am so excited for you.

Thank you John for supplying the names of some shorter growers for our zone. 'Savannah' has some gorgeous salmon pink colors at HMF. 'Star of the Nile' looks like a good deep rose pink (a couple of the pics portray it as a blue pink ?). I see 'The Yeoman' (Austin'69) is a parent. Interesting.

Thonotorose the shipping I think was 30 dollars. Seemed like for 1 it was 15 and then after that it stayed 30. Curious as to the size of the roses. I will post a pic when I receive them.

Whoa, I paid 32 for 4 roses from Texas! Fil, here I come.

Iris gal I looked into it and I think the cost is more but I'm not sure if the money is equal to ours. I'm sure someone on here might know. You can prob figure it all out but I just wanted to order once to try them out. Hoping they ship this week. They will send me an email when it ships.

Duuuuh me! It looks like I paid about $30 dollars a rose but it was roses I really really wanted. I searched to see if I could get them in the states but couldn't find anyone selling my choices. Anyways that lets ya know how much shipping is. Judy

So your place in Texas is muuuuuuch cheaper. I hope I caught you in time before you ordered iris gal! So sorry I was wrong the first time. :))

Thank you for sharing your information! Awfully good of you. I haven't ordered as I have the Austins to place plus 2 spring bands coming. I was planning for the next year.

Locally roses are $30 with poor choices.. Much rather order overseas and get something I'd really want. The Austins from TX came to about $22 each including shipping.

I ordered from FilRoses this year as well. I contacted them last spring and they went to the trouble of researching shipping to Canada and adding it to their list for fall. I also had a bit of an email chat with them about their rootstock (Laxa - similar requirements to multiflora, apparently). Each time I dealt with Philippe, one of the owners, and he was very friendly and helpful. I hope the roses live up to the customer service!

I ordered Chocolate Ripples, Pretty Sunrise, Cafe, New Imagine, Diamond Eyes and A Shropshire Lad.

The shipping/phytosanitary certificate was less than I would pay for roses from many American nurseries, but it's still not a "budget" option. The draw is that they have some really tempting roses that are hard/impossible to find this side of the pond!

Chocolate Ripples and Diamond Eyes sound soooo cool redwolfdoc. I so agree the customer service is superb as is lots of our American vendors.

I agree iris gal on usually poor choices but I do have one really good nursery that orders the new Austins and then lots of other beauties. I usually wait for their list in January to preorder from them if they have something I want.

Hi Prettypetals,
I'm wondering if you can give us an update on your purchases from Filroses. Did they make it through Customs and the ag inspection OK? Some of the roses you ordered I've been wanting for several years. I was told by the owners of Palatine several years ago that we couldn't get Tantau Roses (Evers) in the US or Canada because Tantau had no agent over here. I did manage to get Ascot from Palatine and Augusta Luise from Hortico, but Hortico no longer has any of the Evers roses. I have wanted Belverdere, Lavender Ice, and Mariatherisia so much. Ascot does get huge, and Augusta Luise gets very tall, but not too wide.
A note on Diamond Eyes--it's a Carruth rose and is widely available in the US. I purchased two here in Boise two years ago, and noted yesterday that my favorite nursery this year is carrying Diamond Eyes again. It's a mini, and I'm not really nuts about it. Mine don't bloom very much, but I do love the color.
Please keep us updated on your roses. I hope they have arrived in good shape.
Here's a photo of the Evers hybridized rose, Augusta Luise.
Diane

Iris, it is funny to me because I want the exact opposite. I want my roses to grow tall like a shrub but most don't where I live. I always admire other posters who live in warmer weather and their roses reaches a giant height covered with blooms.

I agree that the best way is to find other people in the same area as you who grow the roses you want. Hopefully there are other posters on this forum who live close to you.
Although the climate in France may be warmer than Austin's England for example, I still think there are variations between growing climate in France and California. I think Germany would be much colder than France or England. Therefore the growth and behaviour may not behave the same way in your environment.

Having said all that, I would probably pay attention what the plant type is. For example, if it is classified as a shrub then you know it will spread in width and height. Instead go for miniatures type which we know will be small. One of the best advice I've read from a book about roses is to find a rose that fits the space not the other way around.

Lynnette, your rose fascinates me. I have not grown a rose that changes its colour over the years. The only experience I had was Winchester cathedral. I bought it expecting it to be a white rose but end up a pink one. Either it is mislabelled or it is the Mary Rose, which I've read it happens when it reverts back to its parent plant. Either way, I really prefer the pink version of your rose. It has the fresher look compared to the apricot version. Thanks for sharing.

Hi Diane,

I had a long post typed out but my computer wouldn't ever preview so had to restyle. Lol. Anyways, I did get my roses on Christmas Eve after they sat in a New York airport for three weeks. Can't remember what the hold up was but probably holiday related. They were still green and not to dried out. I soaked them in my sink then potted them up. They are doing fine and I hope I can keep them living in my carport. I have another order with them for early March delivery. They have some beautiful roses and I'd so order away. They are really nice folks at Fil!! Take care, Judy

Hello!

Fil Roses is actually in Belgium, not France. They told me that they graft on Laxa, which as far as I can tell has similar requirements as Multiflora. BUT - I really only found vague information and I'm sure that there are plenty of folk on this forum who are FAR more knowledgeable about rootstock than I!

My roses came at the end of November and as I'm not sure when they were sent I don't know how long they were in transit. But they arrived well-packed and still damp and in good shape. I potted them and sunk the pots in the ground and mounded them up for the winter. I have high hopes for spring!
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On a side note, one of my roses was mislabelled. I emailed Fil pics of the tag and the rose and they were quick to respond, assuring me that it is indeed the rose I ordered (Pretty Sunrise) rather than the rose listed on the tag (Pretty Pink). I hope they're right - though Pretty Pink is nice too.

So far so good - time will tell.
Karen

Here is a link that might be useful: Western Europe hardiness zones

Hi Karen,
Your roses looked pretty much like mine. Hope they do great for you!! Judy

Thanks, Judy! Me too!

Yeah, I couldn't pass up Chocolate Ripples, and Diamond Eyes is one that I keep coming back to in the catalogues. I know it's available all over the US, but as I'm in Canada, it was 6 of one, a half dozen of the other. :)

FilRoses has some really beautiful roses, don't they? I'm excited!

Karen

Thanks so much for the information prettypetals and Karen. I want very much to order, but am afraid the roses will never get to me out here. We are so off the beaten track. So there were no hassles with customs or inspections (sorry, I keep asking that)? I was under the impression that the buyer had to pay an inspector to look at the roses which then had to be in some kind of quarantine for a set time period. But it sounds as if that is not the case. I hope your roses do beautifully for you. Diane

Diane, usually the exporter is responsible for arranging inspection and obtaining a phytosanitary certificate. I actually asked them about it last spring because they had roses I wanted and didn't specifically offer shipping to the US or Canada. They spent a couple months looking into it and then got back to me to tell me that they'd added us to their shipping. There's probably a charge associated with it (I don't remember) but there was no holdup at customs, at least for me.

I also recently sent a bareroot rose from my garden to the US (from here in Canada). I had it inspected and got the certificate at a local Agricultural office. The certificate was all that was needed - there was no quarantine.

I hope that's helpful!

Thanks again so much, Karen. I'm inching toward an order. Must get my courage up. Diane

Hey Diane, I'm not sure if they were even told what the hold up was. I will email them again and see if they were even given an explanation. I have become very forgetful lately. Keeping my 2 1/2 yr old grandson scrambles my brain. At least that's my story and I'm sticking to it. Lol (plus I'm old). I would say go ahead and order bc they already sold out of several I wanted on my second order. Take care!!

Haha, prettypetals my granddaughters scramble my brains, too. They're teens, so that means I'm reeeally old. Thanks for the encouragement and all your efforts. Diane

Great looking bare roots Redwolfdoc. Thanks for showing us.

Nanadoll,

There is no quarantine period for roses imported from Europe to "Canada". I am certain there is post entry quarantine period and on site inspections for roses imported from Europe into the US. From the APHIS website:

Rosa spp. (rose) - Post entry quarantine required for all except Australia, Bulgaria, Canada, Italy, and New Zealand.

There is a requirement for an import permit for import into both the US and Canada as well as inspection on site in Europe and a phytosanitary certificate from the Department of Agriculture in the country of origin. Contact your state Department of Agriculture, or the US Animal and Plant Heath Inspection Service before you make any decision to order. Particularly if the nursery you are ordering from does not ordinarily ship to North America. Things might go horribly wrong when the plants arrive in the US otherwise.

Cheers, Rick

Here is a link that might be useful: USDA Plant Import Laws, APhis

Rick,
Pretty Petals doesn't live in Canada, and she didn't have to do anything special to get roses into the U.S. from Fils Roses. So something must have changed in the regulations.
Diane

post entry quarantine required for all EXCEPT Italy, Australia, Bulgaria Canada and New Zealand.

There might be a business opportunity here for well capitalized nurseries in those countries. You could set up a subsidiary in Bulgaria, where, I believe land and costs are still not prohibitive. I am so happy with my 'Titian'; I would like to have more from Mr. Reithmuller--hope I got the name right. I am sure CA and FLA gardeners would love some of those Australian teas and some of the Italian and Spanish HTs bred for warm climates and as for us in the colder zones--I pine for the European albas, both Karin Schade's found albas and the new hybrids as well.. I note that albas always sell out for those nurseries which still offer them in the USA.

Can anyone comment on how their roses from Fil Roses are doing? I am interested in ordering from them for arrival next Spring. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks!

Heather

Mine all came through winter successfully, potted and then sunk into the ground. They are all growing like gangbusters now and look healthy. Most have set buds though no blooms yet. That's not concerning - it's right on time for this climate/zone. Here's Pretty Sunrise.

Mine have done awesome also. Most of mine have bloomed a few blooms. They seem to be a great place to order from.

I have had 'Tamora 'for many years and its in the front of my rose garden. I concur that it does stay short. To the left next to it with the hint of yellow bud sticking out is my 'Julia Child' for comparison of size.

I can't say how Austins will grow in California, but here in the heartland, there are any number of shorter Austins to pick from. Just this morning I was admiring Munstead Wood and Molineux in the back garden--both about 3 ft tall, may grow another half-foot to foot at most by the end of summer. I was thinking how they were just the right size for my gardens.

Austin has several recent roses in the same range--Princess Alexandra of Kent and Boscobel and others, for instance.

Tamara (above) is looking good!

Kate