Berrytea, From what I understand it is a bourbon with noisette ancestry. Since HP is kind of a catch-all category of sorts, it seems a lot of roses kind of get lumped into that group as well as another. This seems to be especially true of roses classed as "hybrid bourbons," not so much of the plain "bourbons." I am a huge fan of bourbons and hybrid bourbons, so maybe I pay more attention to those groups, but I know this is true of damasks and portlands as well. When I think of HPs, I think of big blooms and relatively less plant vigor - none of which describes CdB. CdB's remontancy is MUCH better than most bourbons or HPs, and more on the order of a floribunda. Does any of this make sense? Recognizing them by sight is an imperfect thing. I feel like I kind of have a grip on what bourbons look like in a very general way, but explaining it would be full of qualifications since I am not schooled in this. My affinity for bourbons probably comes more from the fact that they do better for me than any other class. But, there is a lot of diversity there. In general, it seem to me the foliage of bourbons is distinct from that of other classes in that it's not gallica-like, not hybrid musk-like, not tea-like, etc. But I couldn't tell the foliage of certain HPs as being non-bourbon, like Souv. du Dr. Jamain, for example. Or certain Austins, like Gertrude Jekyll. In fact, everything about Gertrude Jekyll, (other than its vicious thorns), screams bourbon to me. I do know that OGRs with noisette ancestry tend to be lighter and looser in bloom form. That is true of CdB under the strongest heat of summer. On the other hand, it really resembles the gallica Duchesse de Montebello under opposite conditions. The fact that it blooms at all in 90 degree plus heat (and, boy does it ever) is probably due to its noisette heritage, because no other bourbon I know does that. On the other hand, mine had essentially no dieback during our unusually cold (for zone 6) winter. Did I mention I love this rose? I know nothing about its ploidy, but wish you good luck in all your rose pursuits. - robinia

These observations are made in coastal Camarillo -- where we have less fog than we used to. 1. Baronne Prevost has always grown vigorously and bloomed well (resting a little during the hottest weather). It has been disease-resistant, only rusting a little on old leaves in late Fall. 2. Reve d'Or -- A good grower, and great repeat bloomer, with NO disease issues here. In my garden, it has no flaws. 3. Mutabilis -- NO disease. Continuous-bloom. A beautiful, graceful, BIG rose. Give it space, and it will reward you well. 4. Mons. Tillier -- Disease-free. Almost continuous-blooming. A lovely big rose that needs little attention. Blooms are lovely, but will turn to potpourri in Santa Ana windstorms. 5. Mme. Berkeley -- This is a BIG Tea Rose, well-clothed in perfect foliage, and never completely out of bloom. A "Go-To" rose for Thanksgiving and Christmas Bouquets. Bloom color shifts with the weather, but at its best is French Vanilla and Strawberries. Bloom size shrinks noticeably in very hot weather, but it goes right on blooming. 6. Maman Cochet -- ALL of the Cochets are disease-free here. Great repeat bloomers. Blooms are badly affected by cold, dank weather, and might not open. But it is lovely most of the time. I actually like Niles Cochet best, but they're all good. 7. Mrs. Dudley Cross -- Mildewed continuously here, and is long gone. Marie van Houtte is better here, IMHO. 8. Golden Celebration -- In very rare hot-humid spells, it can blackspot. It is free of other diseases. Resented hard pruning here, and does best for us with only a complete winter deadheading, and foliage removed. Blooms are exquisite. This is a cropper. Big flush. Deadhead. Another big flush, all through the year. 9. Mary Rose -- Had good disease-resistance, but that's when we sprayed. Good bloomer. Eventually removed because it became boring. 10. Sharifa Asma -- Mildewed a little, most of the time. Blooms were lovely, fragrance delightful, but the constant low-level mildew was too annoying. Long gone. 11. Graham Thomas -- If you want it to bloom, plan to pull the canes out horizontally. It grew 12-14-ft. canes, and mildewed. Only bloomed at the top, hence the suggestion to train it horizontally. 12. Altissimo -- at a home in La Conchita, this bloomed like an explosion of color, and covered much of the two-story front. Good disease-resistance. Beautiful color. 13. Sally Holmes -- Disease-free. Best bloom in the spring, when it explodes with color. Want mine? It's huge, and probably Virus-free. I need the space! 14. Secret -- Compact, upright habit. Excellent repeat. Terrific disease-resistance. Good Fragrance. Every plant I ever saw (including my three, from three different growers) was virused to the max. Pity. 15. Cornelia -- wonderful as a shrub or low-climber. Disease free. Biggest bloom in the spring, but it will repeat respectably in Fall, scattering bloom through winter 16. Mrs. R.M. Finch -- Mildewed uncontrollably. Gone. 17. Leonie Lamesch -- A lovely bloom, doesn't make sprays. Gorgeous color, delightful fragrance. Completely disease-free here. A stingy bloomer for us. 18. Lamarque -- Not in my garden, but a virused plant blooms wonderfully at the Adolfo Camarillo Ranch. Disease free. In maturity, it repeats well. 19. Grandmother's Hat -- My number-one recommendation in consideration of disease-resistance, graceful habit, adaptability, and generosity of bloom. We must have a dozen of it here. DH keeps planting it. If I could have but one rose, it would be this one. Jeri Jennings Coastal Ventura County, Camarillo

Foodie -- There are quite a few roses that just don't open well as sprays. Usually many-petalled ones, of course. Another good example of it is "Garberville Hybrid Perpetual," a beautiful poiple HP-type. There are at least 7 buds in this spray, and all of them have rather short peduncles, so they are jammed close together. Too close to allow them to stretch out as open blooms. In this case, the terminal bud isn't EVER going to open further than it is here. It should be removed to allow the other buds to at least TRY to open. Under most circumstances, this rose opens best if all sidebuds are removed -- just as you would do with a Hybrid Tea Rose. Jeri

COQUETTE DES BLANCHES never bloomed for me in zone 6b. I moved it to my mother's zone 7b garden and it put out a lovely flush the first year in the ground. Flowers are exquisite - small, perfectly quartered with green button eyes, appearing in sprays all along the canes. Color is a very pale pink that verges on white. The shrub is big with long canes that gracefully arch in all directions. blooms. Soft pinkish white with green button eyes and pervasively fragrant. Since its spring planting it has put out three distinct flushes. Goes well on its own roots too. It amazes me how this rose could be such a dog in my garden and then turn out to be a stellar performer for my mother. The rose seems to love heat and humidity.