Can you plant a bare-root rose too HIGH?

16 years ago

after reading the post about planting bare-roots too LOW (deep), I got a bit concerned about my bare-roots from Parks.

We've had really mild weather, and I soaked them in water for less than 2 weeks, changing the water daily. They were in a shady spot under a pine tree while they soaked. I finally got the chance to pot them up (hubby was nagging that they would die if left in the water so long) and I put them in with the bud-union just above the soil level. I used good potting soil (not potting mix) and they are in 18-quart pots (they are big).

I watered and pressed the potting soil down several times to make sure there aren't dry holes in the pots. Now the pots are sitting in a place that gets morning and some early afternoon sun, not the heat-of-the-day sun though. (I think its a good spot) I also pruned the canes about 1/4" down and they are alive, and look healthy. I'm making sure they stay moist but not soggy - the drainage from the pots goes out to the ground below.

How long till they put on leaves and start to grow? What should I expect? And is it ok that the bud-union is not underground? I thought it was bad to put the bud-union under the soil? I can still re-pot if I need to. I'd appreciate some advice, please... I can't let them die because my hubby will gloat.... :)

thanks!

Jeri in Texas

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Comments (9)

roseman
16 years ago
Generally speaking, the rule of thumb is if you live above the Mason-Dixon Line, plant with the graft one inch below the soil line, but below the M-D Line, and in warmer climes, plant with the graft one inch above the soil line. If you are planting roses on Fortuniana root stock, you will have to have your graft above the soil line anyway.
scoobagirl
Original Author
16 years ago
Thanks, roseman. I don't have a clue about what rootstock these are on. I guess I'll watch them for awhile and say prayers that they start putting on some new growth. If they last through the summer in the pots, I plan to put them in the yard... somewhere...

jeri in texas
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just stick them in the ground.. in the shade.. water.. and plant in a few days.. when its 60 ... heal them in as they say ... i wouldnt bother with potting for any more than a few days ... but you are absolutely right to avoid the high temp days .... but it is sept.. and tomorrow it might be 60 .. lol ... ken
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I think it's the wax on the canes, not the tiny buds you see there that caused the problem. The cheaper growers wax canes so that they stay green on store shelves. I've never had a waxed cane do well even where I am (and in Coastal Cal I'm in a much cooler zone than Arizona). The buds were fine -- leave them on. But ditch the waxed cane bareroots, unless you can imagine the plant without those particular waxed canes and still see a decent plant worth buying. Some bareroots are waxed only at the tops, and those ones are usually ok, because the bottom of the cane is all you need. And by the way, I've tried everything from fingernails to credit cards to hiar driers to get that wax off before hot weather burns the cambium layer of the canes -- nothing seems to help those canes to survive. They all die anyway.
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Quick answer, buy where you get value for your money. Know what value looks like. IF you decide to buy bare roots, there are three things I think you should look for. 1) are the canes green? It they are black or brown or green with black/brown splotches, KNOW that those canes are dead already and imagine the bush without them. If the canes are coated with a greenish wax, use your fingernail to flake off a bit of the wax and check the color of the canes. Greenish wax makes a lot of canes look ok. 2) have the canes already broken dormancy? Are there leaves at leaf nodes, even if they are dead? Can you see where the dead leaves from earlier this year are fingerpruned off? Are the canes starting to get wrinkled from lack of moisture IN the plant (that was lost when the earlier leaf break happened?) Each leaf axil on a healthy rose cane has three buds. Two are backups. But does the cane look as if either of the two backups will make it? 3) does the bagged up root mass that you can't see have enough roots to support the canes you can see? Two stories. I had Don Juans growing on my porch in Algiers Point, and I wanted to add a fourth one. I found one bagged with really good canes, and I got it home and found that there was a huge bright scar where half the roots had been pulled off in processing. I should have returned it. I didn't. With the same care that had supported the other three, #4 died. I remember that mistake. And how I confused densely packed sawdust for good roots. That lead to my not making a mistake several years later when I saw (insert music) from across a crowded room/nursery a mass of seven of the best looking canes I had ever seen on a body bag rose. Perfection. It was Purple something and it was a climber. And I grabbed the base of the bag, and there was close to nothing there. Not even much sawdust. Maybe one woody root. I knew that that root hadn't supported seven one inch canes in the growing fields. I put it back. And remember it to this day. Ann, putting off going out weeding.
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What I do is soak overnight in plain water. Then as I am finishing digging the hole and preparing my amendmnts, I soak with SuperThrive for 15-20 minutes, at the rate of 1.5 teaspoon per 5 gallons of water, which is recommended specifically for this purpose. Both of these soaks are up to the top of roots or bottom of cane material. One year I soaked overnight, then planted. The next year I soaked roughly 48 hours in a dark garage because the day after delivery was hot and sunny, so I wanted to delay planting to the following day which was cool and cloudy. This year I soaked roughly 48 hours (again in dark garage) because I had appointments the day after delivery. If I remember correctly, the first time I ordered bare-root, I posted questions similar to yours, and someone posted that he or she had soaked in water for almost a week due to scheduling issues. Do you use a soil mound to "sweat" the canes for a week or so after planting? Mine are in their soil mounds and starting to put out little leaves right now. [I have never bought bare-root grafted, so can't directly answer your question as to how own-root versus grafted compare or contrast.]
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diane_nj 6b/7a
16 years ago
Yes, you can plant too high. I'm telling folks to plant the graft union 1" below the soil line (we used to be told to plant with the top of the graft union level with the top of the soil), but I have a few that are above the soil line.

From Parks, they would be grafted on Dr. Huey rootstock.

How long have you had these plants? It takes anywhere from 2 - 6 weeks for a bareroot to break dormancy, depends on the variety. You need to cover the canes though, they should stay moist until you see growth. Cover with mulch, soil, or a paper bag with one corner of the bottom torn out. Dehydration of the canes is the big killer of bareroots.
scoobagirl
Original Author
16 years ago
OMG. OK, I'll get those babies covered. It is really dry here (climate) and I had no idea they needed to be covered up.
alina_1
16 years ago
I am a newbie and I also bought 3 bareroot Roses from Park's sale, my first Roses... I carefully read everything I can find about planting bareroots, but I guess I missed something.

Do I need to prune the canes? I did not.

'Royal Bonica' broke dormancy almost immediately after planting, 'Carefree Wonder' and 'Marmalade Skies' are still dormant 2 weeks later. They are covered with perforated plastic bags. Other conditions are very similar to conditions Scoobagirl's Roses are in.
TIA,
Alina.
scoobagirl
Original Author
16 years ago
Alina, that makes me feel a little bit better - I had not heard of covering them after planting. I thought the ones that were covering with lawnchairs and laundry baskets were doing so to protect from sunburn. I missed the part about covering the canes to hold moisture... I'm going to move my pots to the shade when I go home at lunch break, and cover them with white garbage bags with holes poked in them. I hope that won't bake them.

Yes these are the Parks roses. I have one Iceberg with a sprig of new growth, and one Climbing Crimson Sky that is budding out. The others are still dormant. I've had them a couple of weeks. When I scratch at the bark on the canes, they are still green, so maybe I haven't killed them yet...

Jeri in Texas
alina_1
16 years ago
Hopefully, I have not killed mine either :-)
I think, you won't bake them covering with bags if you will have enough holes and the bag will not touch the canes. Paper bags work well for that since canes do not need light at this point. I read that it is recommended to remove bags when buds' size will be 1/2". I am using Lily bulbs' plastic bags because they keep their shapes well and already have holes in them.

Could someone answer my question please: is it necessary to prune canes on bareroot Roses?
palisade
16 years ago
Alina I would prune the damaged canes before I plant them.
I think if you plan bare root too high like above ground you end up with some sort of a tree rose.
Tracy
alina_1
16 years ago
Thanks Tracy,
I can not see any damage on these canes, they are just a little dry. When I scratch at the bark on the canes, they are green, so I hope they will break their dormancy...
Alina.

Can you plant a bare-root rose too HIGH?

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Can you plant a bare-root rose too HIGH?

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