Blue conifers for wet spot?

16 years ago

I'm looking for ideas of blue-needled conifers that tolerate damp soil, can handle wet feet over winter.

Blue spruces survive but get budworm locally.

Junipers won't survive. The blue larch variety I have is so slow, as well as evergreen would be ideal.

thanks!

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Comments (11)

pineresin
16 years ago
Not really - the blue colour is an adaptation to the intense sunlight of dry climates, and dry climates and wet soil tend not to occur in the same places!

Resin
quirkyquercus
16 years ago
Cedrus atlantica ('glauca')

What do you all think?
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You didn't explain what your planting situation/purpose is--do you want to plant a grove of trees? Or do you want to plant one or two ornamental trees in your yard? The basic conifer for wet soils in your area I would think is loblolly pine. I think they are very beautiful trees when planted with, or thinned to, good spacing. They are planted in mass "plantation" plantings for timber and pulpwood, and these plantings are not always attractive, unless they have become more or less mature and have been thinned several times. But I have seen them in small groups or as individual specimens in all kinds of situations and I think they can be absolutely beautiful, especially as they become mature. They have tall straight trunks and have very picturesque crowns with good balance. And they have the advantage of growing very fast, often producing three flushes of growth every year. They do grow large, so you have to have room. Midweatjeff:--have you seen mature loblolly pines in the south? There are outstanding ones as far north as the southern and eastern half of virginia, but in places further south they can grow to 120 feet or more and have the most exceptional growth form. Years ago, maybe it was is Mississippi, I saw some old stands of loblolly, and they knocked my socks off! I have always had a special place in my heart for the best old white pine stands, but these loblollies deserve a place in the tree lover's hall of fame. --Spruce
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thanks for some suggestions-I like the eastern white cedars-that would keep the look I was kind of going for. I definitely don't want to turn it into a bog area if I can help it. I know some maples like the wet areas- but afraid they would get too big and produce more shade which would make it even more difficult to get sun in the area and prevent it from doing any drying out. Not sure if this area will dry out or if this is what I should expect from now on. I don't think bringing in more fill will solve anything too- and would just mess up the grade of the whole corner area. maybe some type of shrub or groundcover?
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Just coming across this thread as I research which conifers to add to my property... Here in Southern Ontario, Blue Spruce do not do well beyond 20 years, or so... some decline after a decade... Needle cast I suppose... my neighbour has 10 picea pugens... I am watching them decline every year... Don't know what it is but people in this part of the world love to plant these things and most look like crap within one human generation... I am going to give some concolors a chance as i love them and they seem to be doing ok albeit they've only been planted around here for the past 15 years or so... Our climate is virtually the same as all the other Great Lakes cities... Detroit, Buffalo, Cleveland, Chicago... Our specific area though has cooler nights than Toronto (we are just north of the city) as a result of being a more rural environment... 60s is the norm in typical summers nights, with some high 50s during cooler stretches.. we don't get huge amounts of rain... and it'll often fall in short bursts of thunderstorms.. Boston MA is definitely more wet as my sister lived there for years and they got a lot more snow in MA and rain...
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While this minutiae is still being discussed I might as well pick a bone with the opening statement: "I live in zone 9 in southern Brazil (equivalent to northern Florida or southern Georgia)" Generally not the case. If that were true, I would have moved to northern Florida a long time ago. If you go high enough to be USDA zone 9 in Brazil - because of the various factors I bring up repeatedly and will tediously rehash now, the cool ocean currents off the coast, the higher adiabatic lapse rate compared to the northern hemisphere, the prevailing high pressure patterns etc., summers in that zn 9 are NOTHING like those in north Florida. Here are Curitiba's stats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curitiba max 78F/61F in summer A measly 3000 ft. of elevation, and the summers are almost as cool as SE England's. And it is probably closer to zn 10 all the same. You would have be north of Boston to have summers like that on the US East coast. I don't think it would be Picea pungens, but I have NO doubt you could find a very similar looking blue Picea from high-elevation cloud forest areas of Mexico that would be happy as a clam in zn 9 Brazil. Even Sao Paolo is zn 11 (!), and has very mild summers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A3o_Paulo
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pineresin
16 years ago
That needs good drainage, too. Cedars can't cope with wet soil.

Resin
sam_md
16 years ago
I have a blue form of Atlantic White Cedar, Chamaecyparis thyoides. I got it from a collector who just called it Blue Form. I'm sure someone in the Conifer Society has a source of it. It has a "Rooster Tail" habit of growth especially when young, you have to keep the shears handy until it settles down.
Sam
conifers
16 years ago
Yeah, Chamaecyparis thyoides would be first on the list. You'll simply need to find a blue cultivar. You may also wish to ask if these were grafted or cutting-grown. Cutting Grown would be preferred only if the others were not grafted to thyoides as the root system will play a vital role in water resistance.

Chamaecyparis thyoides 'Glauca' 'Blue Sport' 'Glauca Pendula' are a few that are blue.

Same on the root systems of Picea mariana. I can't think of a blue cultivar first hand, but these Spruces are water-tolerant as well. Yet, I doubt highly that they will be intolerant of the budworms. I simply do not know.

Try Larix kaempferi 'Blue Rabbit' for rapid growth.

Dax
dirtslinger2
Original Author
16 years ago
Thanks for all the ideas. I didn't think of Chamaecyparis.
Do you have experience with Larix k. 'blue rabbit'? Haven't seen/heard of it but could probably find it.
pineresin
16 years ago
Atlantic White Cypress will do well in wet soil, but isn't very blue, more of a dark glaucous green (nothing like as bright as Blue Spruce).

Larix kaempferi won't like wet soil, it needs good drainage.

Resin
conifers
16 years ago
Hi dirtslinger,

Sorry about the 'Blue Rabbit' recommendation. I had saved years ago some information about trees that took to water well and the Genus - Larix was one mentioned and by a guy who owns an arboretum.

Regards,

Dax
pineresin
16 years ago
Hi Dax,

It isn't the whole genus, just two species in it that tolerate wet soil (Larix laricina, Larix gmelinii), and even then only in colder climates. The problem seems to be that some people (presumably including that arboretum guy!) see L. laricina growing in bogs in Canada and the far northern US, and assume that all other larches are equally adapted all of the time . . . not true, unfortunately!

Resin
cascadians
16 years ago
Aptos Blue coast redwood, will need to be watered in summertime and will get large.
pineresin
16 years ago
"Aptos Blue coast redwood"

Nice tree, but nowhere near hardy in zone 5 - needs zone 8/9.

Resin

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Blue conifers for wet spot?

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Blue conifers for wet spot?

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