Yes. I see them quite a bit in zone 6 in N. GA and TN and in the carolinas. Very popular. I thought the Edith Bogue extended the range into z5. In fact there is someone here or it might be the treehelp forum who has one in northern tenn somewhere.

Varies with the seedling. Named seedlings like 'Edith Bogue' and 'Bracken's Brown Beauty' are ones that have been noticed to be hardy. I would plant that latter as it is more ornamental than poorly indumented 'Edith Bogue' and may also be hardier as well.

BBB is planted extensively around the campus of the U of MO in Columbia, MO - z5, if I recall correctly. Some years, the leaves on some of the trees in exposed sites sustain substantial winter-burn, but the trees are otherwise pretty doggone healthy.

Thanks!

So why aren't they more common up here? Guess I have to find out!

What part of Detroit is zone 6???

Isn't that zone 5?
After looking at a zone map just now, I noticed I was a little off with what I thought was zone 6.
anyway I say give it a try. If you can't find one locally, maybe I can help you out. They are easy to come by here.

The greater Cincinnati area is likely the reliable northern limit of the southern magnolia even though you will find some north of us in protected areas. If you are in Michigan you will likely have to protect it from winter wind and plant near a brick wall . In our area in the winter of 76 -77 when temps got down to the -20 range and stayed cold for a while and the ground froze 2-3 ft down the majority of southern magnolias in the area died back to the ground. If your area is constantly that cold you may have trouble keeping it alive. Even here the hardiest selections planted in an exposed area can look bad and often do poorly. If you want to try it the selection that have been listed above are the hardiest with Brackens being the most dense. David

Magnolias don't like wind anyway, in a borderline area planting them in exposed positions is asking for trouble.

The 1990 USDA map is being tinkered with, you may end up in Zone 6 afterall. National Arbor Day Foundation has already come out with their own, new version.

My E.Bogue died last winter. Probable reason--too exposed. Lowest recorded temp here last winter approx -8 F. Same plant, same size/age, at Botanic Gardens 2 miles from here survived, leave looking a little ratty but generally OK. They planted theirs in lee of and about ten feet away from two medium-size dense-to-the-ground conifers.

Actually, we've been listed as zone 6 for a while--we're that little yellow patch on the map in a sea of zone 5. My site isn't too bad for wind exposure so I'm awfully tempted to try it. Thank you all for the information.

tree oracle has an excellent point.

Results with less hardy seedlings will not be the same as with hardier ones. What would be relevant would be results observed with 'Edith Bogue' and 'Bracken's Brown Beauty' specifically. There could be a similar area with one or both of these holding up, with many other clones not doing so well. You can see variable results in different postions here in Zone 8.

The only Southern Magnolias sold in my area are Edith Bogue and Bracken's Brown Beauty. My description earlier refers to these cultivars.

If you are going to try it I would get as large a tree as possible. Normally I think smaller trees establish faster but in this situation I think the larger tree may handle the cold a little better. I would also baby it for several years and make sure there is enough moisture in the winter. As the roots get down below the level that the ground freezes winter hardiness will likely increase somewhat. David

I planted an Edith Bogue in Grosse Pointe Farms, MI about 12 years ago. I bought it as a bareroot tree from nursery in OR, about 18". It took a while to establish and it used to lose nearly all its leaves every Winter. Now it is gorgeous, albeit not quite as full as a southern Southern Magnolia. It blooms several times each Summer, and it has filled out remarkably well for Michigan. It is planted in a corner of a yard, somewhat protected by a large hedge and conifers.

I recommend anyone try this gorgeous tree. Granted, Grosse Pointe Farms is more moderate than most of metro Detroit, and certainly more so than most of Michigan, as there is a little pocket around Lake St. Clair that is a half or full zone above the rest of southern Michigan.

I can't locate the photograph I took of this beauty last August. I'll try to find it and post it up here.

I live in zone 5? St Louis, Missouri is considered zone 6. It is much more sheltered than here because it has the heat of the city for one thing. I live 2 hours east of there and 1 hour west of Vincennes, Indiana. Robert Simpson a renowned horticulturist who developed Winterking Hawthorne and several winterberry and decidua selections says we are Zone 5. During the most severe winters here many grandiflora died and many had minimal damage. Back then Brackens Brown Beauty was not around or commonly known.Years later there was an article by Michael Dirr in Horticulture magazine about this subject. He did extensive testing. I have been blessed to find a nursery that rooted 3 cuttings for me from trees selected from my county. They are among my most cherished earthly possessions and they are my passion. Joseph Hickman, a deceased attorney had such a passion as does McCracken Nursery. He is trying to develop those hardy in Zone 4. If you google search Brackens Brown beauty enough times you will find that many are growing it with some success in the Chicago area and they have a longer duration of cold there, but I don`t think it gets as cold here for as long. I would be honored to share cuttings of what I have but I can`t tell you how to propagate them. Evidently the selections I took root easily; some don`t and have to be grafted as I understand. I`m far from an expert. I have Victoria, Poconos, Twenty four below, Edith Bogue and Brackens Brown Beauty as well.I feel nothing ventured nothing gained.

Hi Jeff,

How large are the parent trees currently of the trees you have from your area and what is the coldest weather they have taken. The largest locally is 45'+/- by 25'+/- and full. It has taken -20 several times and made it through our record cold winters in 76-77. That said Brackens and Poconos are both more attractive plants when young. David

I don`t have a digital camera and I`m technologically impaired. Both were grown from trees at the campus of Southern Illinois University. I`ve called Brackens, called Michael Dirr and e-mailed McCracken Nursery. I sent Forestfarm cuttings once but they weren`t sent until December. Forestfarm Nursery has to be one of the nicest places I`ve ever done business with. He has reasonable prices, is open to new ideas, I`ve sent him information I`ve gained through experience and on this forum. Beaver Creek Nursery I have visited with and talked to personally. In the late 70`s we had temps -20 with a lot of sun and I live on top of a very windy hill. Often the case here is we have no snow fall. I`ve often asked my father just why did my ancestors ever settle here? I`m grateful that they did. We all want to make an impact on this world and our families. In this day and age we have to be careful who we meet on the internet and very careful of what information we list.

I seemed to forget that I got one for my wife at Christmas a few years back; now if I can figure out how to use it I will post pictures. When I was at SIU I made good grades but professors were intelligent but but knew little about design. Tech`s new even less so I need help with design for my church and a friend from there with landscape design. Any landscape design experts? Warning I`m opinionated. I hate ornamental pears, sheared evergreens,with lots of color many seasons, with some evergreens for winter.

OK. I can really "chime" in here. I am in extreme northeast Tennessee on the zone 6B-7A border. I have a Southern Magnolia that I have had planted here at my house since 1995. I have never had any winter damage. It was about 3ft. when I planted it and it is now about 25ft. tall. I will have to measure. Ironically, that next winter (Feb 96' I think ) we had smashed a record low and the temperatures dropped to -15° at the airport. I think it was about -9° here. I do not recall any damage, but that was years ago, so I cannot say for sure. I do know it was about 3 years after I planted before it bloomed in the spring. We have not been nowhere near that cold since.

Now, here is where it gets more interesting. In town, we have some very large Southern Magnolias growing that I know are at least 40-45 years old and have obviously survived our all-time record low of -21° on Jan. 21, 1985. I was only 9 years old at the time though, so I have no idea if they sustained any damage. As a kid, I knew nothing about trees, nor would I have cared. lol. It was not until I was about 18 or 19 that I started to get interested in trees. I wish I had of known if they sustained any damages during that nearly 50° BELOW average low on that frigid morning in 1985.

If its any gauge, we have some friends in southwestern Minnesota. I am thinking that is zone 3 or 4? Anyway, I was told by them that there are none of these trees up there. I think they said they knew of someone that tried to plant one, but it perished.

So, since these thrive in 6B, I am sure they should survive in a 6A, or protected 5B, but may look scraggly beyond that.

Here are some links to my Southern Magnolia that I took last year:
[IMG]http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/100_1536.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/100_1542.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/100_1541.jpg[/IMG]

I am known for growing "out of zone" trees. I have a Windmill Palm, and Southern Live Oaks planted here.... all doing well. So far that is.
I am right on the edge with my Longleaf pine. It is a zone 7a and I am on the border.... it has flourished however... here it is:
[IMG]http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/027f0462.jpg[/IMG]
More of these in town too that have been there for years... but only about 25 ft. tall.

I also see Victoria surviving around here.
I grow BBB since the late nineties. It was small enough to just stand up in the car. Now it is about 12 feet high and has a small tree shape.
My tree, in part shade, is open - I can still see the neighbor behind it - but filling in slowly, not loosing as many leaves as it use to. But that is what clematis is for. My mother bought one in the last couple of years and it is much denser, doing well on a more exposed site on top of a hill - much more wind. As a matter of fact, I see Southern Magnolias cropping up a lot around here and the trees are full enough.
It is worth a try. The leaves shine beautifully in winter like nothing else. Personally, I like the very noticeable brown indumentum of BBB and would be one reason you would use to choose it instead of the other hardy varieties.

This is a question for tennesseestorm or anyone who can answer it. I am curious if anyone who is growing Live Oaks outside
of their normal zones had any survivors out of the record breaking low temps. we had in early April? I am interested in trying a live oak or two here in Northern Middle TN.

Hey Nick... well its remains to be seen here at my house with my Southern Live Oaks. Back in December, we had record lows around 8° on the morning of the 9th if I recall. It did not damage them. However, one of them lost all of its leaves in early February... I thought it was dead, then the other started losing its leaves slowly, but then I recalled it was normal for them to lose their leaves in the late winter/early spring. BOTH of them started flourishing with new growth and was leafed out pretty good. Then that record low weather arrived on Saturday and Sunday night... one day only had highs in the mid 30s, which was extremely unusual for us that time of year. I think I damaged mine because I covered them with a paper bag on Sunday night and forgot to uncover on Monday... when I uncovered them on Monday, the leaves were black and crisp. I was devistated, as I was wanting these to grow well this year. Its been nearly 3 weeks and I have seen no sign of regrowth, but the one tree still has that ONE old leaf on it and the old crisp new ones that were destroyed.

Here was the sad sight after the recor lows in the lower 20s on Saturday night, on the 7th of April 07'.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/100_4675.jpg

Temps forecasted to be in the 70s and 80s all week... we will see if they recover.

Good luck!

Wow, that is a pretty diappointing sight. Looks better than our Crape Myrtles that were hit by the freeze. We went to 20 degrees as the coldest temp. out of that cold spell, if I remember correctly. One thing did survive that I wasn't expecting to. It was my Tillandsia Usneoides (Spanish Moss). I left some outside all winter, and it also survived the April 9th freeze. I thought that was cool. Well thanlks for the info., and if you want to check out some of the Spanish Moss forums I'll be there.

Thanks. I am hoping they recover as well. Our coldest temp here at my house hit 23° for two days in a row... it hit 21° at the airport, which tied the all-time monthly record low for April, which last occured in 1982, so I do not remember much about that, as I was just a little whippersnapper. :D Another thing I have never seen before is my Weeping willow tree being destroyed after being full of foliage. It was fully leafed out and now most all of the leaves are little brown crisps. Some of them in town was not damaged that bad though. My Peach and Apple trees were unscathed. It even wilted down the new growth on my Loblolly pines, but they have recovered. My Willow oak leaves were also ruined. I did have to take a trip however on Thursday to Maryville, TN, which is about 30 miles southwest of Knoxville and there was little tree foliage damage down there it seems.... much more green than we have here. Down there now, it looks like it did here before the freeze. There was still some damage though, but I drove by the McGee Tyson Airport (Knoxville apt) and there were several Willow oaks down there that looked unscathed as well. I am guessing that we were probably 5-6° colder here than they were during that unusually cold - cold spell. My Baldcypress for the most part was ruined as well. It has some green leaves but not much. I have noticed today that alot of trees are coming back out... with 70s and 80s this week, we may reach our normal stage for foliage- which is mostly all trees fully by May 1st. I still wonder about the damaged poplars though, as we have alot of those around here and as of today, I could see no signs of regrowth.

Spanish Moss... hmm, that is something I would like to try here, but never thought it would make it. I do have several "out of range" trees here- such as a Windmill palm, which has survived perfectly last winter and the 8° did not even touch it... also out of range trees I have are Longleaf pines and Slash pines... all have thrived. We also have some older Longleaf pines here that have thrived for over 30 years and they are zone 7a trees, but we are right on the 7a border, so not that out of range I suppose.

I would like to try Spanish moss now... did you just pull some off of some trees further south/southeast? Then, do you just drape it on the trees? I think I need to visit that moss forum.

Yes to the last 2 lines on your post. I don't know if you looked for the moss forum yet, but just search Spanish Moss in the search box on this site, and you should find it. That said I won't post anymore on this Magnolia forum, unless I have info. pertaining to magnolias.

I went to DC and stayed at a hotel in Tacoma Park, Maryland. I saw several large trees there. But there was noticeable cold/wind damage at the tops of the trees probably from the harsh winter this year.

I have never seen southern magnolia in full bloom. Do they get a full flush of blooms or are they sporadic. The times i have seen them in atlanta and charleston has been mid spring. I visit those areas on occasion and was wondering the peak time of magnolia bloom.

I'm finishing school at Cornell in Ithaca, NY (zone 5) and this spring the city planted 20 Edith Bogue magnolias (12-15ft tall) in tree lawns throughout the downtown. The City arborist tells me that it's a bit of an experiment, but I know there is an Edith Bogue doing very well in a courtyard on the Cornell campus with NO winter damage for the past few years (minimum lows have been -10 to -17F). In that same courtyard there are also albizia, crypotomeria, and lagerstroemia. Microclimate plays a serious role here, so I'd like to see how these trees handle not only the cold but also the snow and road salt factors.

Southern Magnolia is a gorgeous tree to be sure. But if you find they're not hardy up there in the Detroit area, you might consider trying a Magnolia virginiana. I believe they're quite a bit hardier. The subspecies 'australis' supposedly is more evergreen, but may still drop its leaves in the Northern reaches of its hardiness zone.

I have a seedling Southern Magnolia from Appalachian Gardens that was sent by mistake for Magnolia macrophylla. I grew it in a pot for a few years then three years ago, I planted it outside. It survives, grows well, even with burned leaves...
This year I am trialing Brackens Brown Beauty, Edith Bogue and Pocano. I planted them this week so they have a long establishment period before next winter...
I had a BBB from Carroll Gardens that grew good for a couple of years until the bottom graft died. I did not know it was grafted as I would not have bought it - I fell victim to their marketing...
I decided to try again after researching Gardenweb and rereading my copy of "Palms won't grow here & other myths by Dr. David A. Francko.

Well, in the year or so since I asked about this, I've relocated to the San Francisco Bay area and I have a nice fat M. grandiflora in my yard. They don't as nice here as they do in the south, but not too bad.

The most awesome southern magnolias I've ever seen are those growing wild at the Washington-on-the-Brazos State Park in Texas. Too big for the suburbs! :)

Just wanted to update on my April 21st post.... I thought I had updated....

ALL of our trees have fully recovered from that horrible freeze. It took some through mid May, but all recovered- even my Baldcypress, Willow Oaks and Camellias, which had major damage. Some of the Red Oaks in the area were slow to recover and it took to about mid May for them to fill out- normally, they are full by mid April- which they were, but all foliage had been ruined.

So, again, everything had fully recovered... no "ugly" summer like I though. In fact, some things are even more lush than usual. :) Hope everyone elses trees recovered as well... I am sure they did.

BTW - my Magnolia is thriving again, for the 14th year in a row.

"I have a seedling Southern Magnolia from Appalachian Gardens that was sent by mistake for Magnolia macrophylla. grew it in a pot for a few years then three years ago, I planted it outside. It survives, grows well, even with burned leaves... "

From my earlier post - update on this tree.
It is putting out new growth and looks very healthy. I was told by Appalachian Gardens, this tree was grown from seed from local mature trees in the Waynesboro, PA area.

Sounds great...

I wanted to post a photo I took of my tree tonight... it has more new growth this year than ever before- despite the super dry spring we had.
[IMG]http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e172/Tennesseestorm/Tree%20album/100_5408.jpg[/IMG]
yeah, thats a yucca stalk you see in the foreground there.. strange- all of our others have bloomed already.

you could get away with growing A southern magnolia (magnolia grandiflora) In detroit however it may or more than likely will not grow very large southern magnolia do well in the south mainly because of the longer growing season and it never drops below 0 degrees. The cold Hardiness for southern magnolia is right at about 0 degrees. We have Southern Magnolia's everywhere here In Tennessee very common tree here. I have studied up on these for years

DC is 6b and I saw 1 there. Pretty big tree too. In the 80's we hit -9 in Raleigh and our tree is still alive. Given how mild and not very snowy our winters have been lately I have noticed a lot of them popping up in woodland areas and ravines.

*update* just noticed I have already posted here, but might as well pop it up again.

Actually the hardiest cultivars of Southern Magnolia are hardy to temps between -20°F(-29°C) and -25°F(-31.7°C). But that's for relatively short periods of time (hours, not days). Protection from winter sun and wind are both important in preventing leaf burning. I think winter sun protection is a little more important with this though. Even though a tree might have lots of leaf burning, it often will not have any stem or wood damage. The ideal spot to plant one in a border line area would be against a NW facing wall, which would give plenty of heat during the summer (plus retain some heat longer into the night during winter) and also afford some winter sun protection since the sun sets in the SW during the winter(in the Northern hemisphere). Some people in zone 5 that try to grow Southern Magnolias many times report they act more like deciduous trees in having most all of their leaves burned off during the winter, but releaf out in the spring and bloom, so no wood damage is done.

I grow more than 1 dozen cultivars of Southern Magnolia here in zone 6 KS and none have been killed or had much of a problem with winter hardiness. Even the supposedly less winter hardy cultivar 'Little Gem' grows fine for me. I also know of many decent sized trees(30'-50'(9-15m) tall range) in the Kansas City metro area which have been through their all time record low temp of -22°F(-30°C) and the very tough, cold winters of the late 1970's and early 1980's. So, I think in general most Southern Magnolias are zone 6 hardy and a few can make it in protected spots in zone 5. Duration of cold is important as is summer heat. If you live in a colder area with abundant summer heat(temps mostly in the 80's(26°-31°C) or warmer for most of summer), you probably have a better chance at growing Southern Magnolia than an area with little or no summer heat and relatively mild winters.

Detroit, MI is zone 5 to 6. Thats Detroit, not Anchorage.
They have lake effect weather and also urban heat.
Hey tennessee, you should try Italian Cypress.
By the way, thats a nice palm tree there.
You are growing stuff like I intend to try to grow in a suburb of Dallas, TX.

This past spring we put in a small 'Bracken's brown Beauty'. It had a rough time adjusting to its new site, especially with the summer drought when it dropped all of its leaves. New leaves came forth since then and so far have survived a windy -11F. It is in a relatively sheltered spot, but I'm still impressed hat the leaves are completely undamaged. It dropped to -9F about a week later, but the leaves are still A-OK. I think this cultivar and a few others are a lot tougher than people generally give them credit for.

We hit all-time record lows in the 1980s, with lows nearing -20°. We have many Southern Magnolias here in northeast Tennessee, some very old and endured that bitter cold air. HOWEVER, this was a short lived cold snap and it has not been no where near that cold since. I personally do not think these could take much of that cold, so I question how well it would do in the far north. I was only 9 years old when we had that all-time record setting cold in 1985, so I cannot recall how the trees responded to that bitter cold air. They obviously survived in the long term. I planted my Southern Magnolia in 1995 if I recall and in 1996, we had a low around -5°, which we have actually not been below that since. It did well and it was only about 2 years old at the time. 13 years later, she is about 35 ft. tall and doing fine.

Southern Magnolia's are grown very commonly in Detroit Area. Mt. Clemens has some spectacular specimens near downtown. I know that near Lake St. Clair you are quite a bit warmer than the lakes area in Oakland co., but there are quite a bit that are over 40 ft. tall.

You can't miss them if you venture the East side. Lot's of Fig Trees too, all the Italians grow them and get bushels off of them.

Very impressive!