I'm almost in the same position you are in. Can't get the OGR deep red that I really want. Ordered Munstead Wood this year and it is a beautiful workhorse. Will be getting Darcey Bussell this fall. Now if I could just find an OGR that is deep red to purple that makes a decent plant and has decent size blooms, I would be a happy camper. I could even live with a once bloomer and plant it between a couple of Munstead Wood's. I need to look into Wenlock.

Thanks Rick and Hoovb for the info. I don't get much fragrance out of William S. 2000 here. Gruss an Teplitz smells many times better .... I'm leaving toward OGRs for fragrance.

Like Hoovb, I was goingto mention 'Falstaff.' He does quite well in PDX and, unlike Hoovb's, is very fragrant. 'The Prince' is definitely more purple, but he is packed with petals and deliciously fragrant. Have you tried 'Tess'? 'Munstead Wood' is zooming to the top of my acquisition list. --Fellow big fluffy red/dark rose lover Carol

This post was edited by PortlandMysteryRose on Thu, Jun 20, 13 at 21:53

I am always disappointed in my photos of red roses, the camera never captures the true depth of the color. This photo of Falstaff is a bit more washed out and pink than the true color, but I thought it worthwhile for this post because it demonstrates the significant lightening of the rose as it ages. I do like my Falstaff very much. I agree that the blooms are a bit stingy but IMHO the form is perfection, and it's worth the wait. I'm growing Munstead Wood this year and can't wait to see it in bloom!

Ken,

If you would accept a once bloomer, would you consider Charles de Mills? I only grew it once, long ago, but the memory lingers.

Cath

You need to also consider Braveheart, a Clements shrub that has some of Austin's Dark Lady somewhere in its background.

Braveheart
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Braveheart is one of my absolute favorites in my garden--retains its red color well and consistently.

Kate

WS2000-- heavy bloom and good repeat for me, large well-formed flower with excellent fragrance, annoying growth habit (wants to be 7' wide and low arching), not the worst for blackspot. Keep this fuchsia hue away from other reds. It can be pruned to sort of stand up eventually. Maybe going easy on fertilizer would help with the growth habit, but I have a hard time restraining myself.

Prospero--great little rose with delightfully changeable, large, fragrant gallica-style flowers, good repeat, some blackspot resistance. As Jeri keeps saying, prune it as little as possible. It never gets big.

Munstead--new for me but everyone seems to like it, flowers are gorgeous.

Tess--semi-climber with some blackspot resistance, good repeat for a climber, handsome cerise flower with light fragrance, outstanding vase life. Cut flowers retain a dark raspberry color if cut early.

Sophy's--unusual semi-fluorescent cerise color like some chinas. Dense, shapely, short, twiggy bush. Brilliant repeater--it is setting up a heavy second flush as some roses are in the middle of their first flush. Not fragrant. Resists blackspot in some gardens, but I have a strain that infects it.

Othello--horrible thorny octopus with stingy bloom.

Fisherman's Friend--terrible blackspot, terrible thorns and vegetative centers. I hated it.

LD Braithwaite--mannerly shrub with bright modern-red flowers, not fragrant. An OK rose, but you might as well grow Olympiad.

Falstaff in a no-spray garden here got a lot of mildew, and mildew is usually not a problem here.

Rick

I neglected to add that your roses are stunning! As are yours Hoovb, Ratdogheads, and Kate. It is amazing what you're accomplishing with Austins up there in Ontario. Thank you for the dose of red. Love that color, especially when it arrives on full, quartered blooms. Do you grow any gallicas? Here are dark-flowered regions to explore in that class.

Ken

My 'The Prince' is 3 feet tall and 2.5 wide. Color and fragrance are 4.5-5 out of 5. 'Tradescant' has been very good to me. Gorgeous and great fragrance. Both would play nicely with the two roses you mentioned. Also, once-bloomer 'Tuscany Superb.' 'Frances D/Barcelona' makes a nice small shrub...a little sparce but color and fragrance are deep knock-your-socks off velvet red. It definitely looks hybrid tea to me, but I am charmed by the earlier HTs.

Rick and Ken
I agree with Michael regarding 'Othello.' Gave it away to a victim with a big space in the back of a bed. The 'LD' at my last garden was brighter red than the rest of the gang and only fragrant at one interval of the bloom stage, but it provided reliable rebloom following short periods of rest.

Carol

Kate, I have often looked at Braveheart and thought I would like to try him. Unfortunately, he is not available up here in the Great White North.

Carol, The Prince is still on my someday list. I grew him on the West Coast and liked him a lot. But his blooms tended to crisp in the heat and he was not all that vigorous. To grow here, he needs to take the summer heat and be able to put on growth after a zone 4 winter. Still, I loved the bloom and the colour and hmmmm... perhaps in a large pot that is wintered in doors.

Cath, I have often considered Charles de Milles, but as you say he is a once bloomer. I'm pretty certain he would be hardy here, but I have limited space and so have not planted once blooming OGRs since some Alba's I bought failed to survive winter.

Ken, if you can find the real thing, perhaps Souvenir d'Alphonse Lavallée might be the rose you are looking for, or one of the old purple once blooming Gallicas, Charles de Milles, or Orpheline de Juillet. If I had more garden space, I'd grow all three.

Cheers, Rick

Rick, are you saying U.S. roses can't be taken across the border into Canada? If so, I can't help you there, but if finding access to Braveheart is the problem, I think the only place you can buy him (other than as a teeny-weeny band from heirloom roses) is own-root but a nice blooming size from Roses Unlimited. Their roses are terrific,but maybe they sell only in the U.S.

Kate

I've had The Prince for five or six years, and found that after a slow start, it's really kicking in this year with more and larger blooms. The prince is about four feet tall. I am glad I planted him in a spot with afternoon shade. This has really helped with the frying problem in our dry heat. The much bigger blooms and the greater number of them I love, but some of the stems supporting these blooms are drooping, and I'm not happy with this. Munstead Wood is new for me and is performing like a winner, putting on growth and producing some gorgeous blooms, which do suffer in the heat, though. One of my favorite dark reds is still the Tantau rose Ascot which is in its third year, and just gets better and better. It's between six and weven feet tall and is covered in blooms. I'm showing a photo from last year, but hope to have this year's pics up before too long. Diane

Rick

'Braveheart' is an Heirloom Roses (Oregon) rose. Won't this company ship to Canada? If they don't currently list a rose, sometimes they've allowed me to special order one.

Carol

"Rick, are you saying U.S. roses can't be taken across the border into Canada?"

Kate and Carol; you can import roses from the U.S., but an international phytosanitary certificate is required for the shipment. Currently, only Rogue Valley Roses and David Austin Roses USA will ship to Canada.

I have contacted both Heirloom Roses and Roses Unlimited and neither are willing to ship roses to Canada. It is a lot of work and hassle and then shipments sometimes experience delays at the border that have cost me young plants in the past. I suspect that the extra work and effort required is prohibitively costly for small nurseries who may only get a few export orders a year.

I did import eight roses from RVR this spring, seven survived and are doing well in my nursery bed. But RVR doesn't carry Braveheart.

There are far more European nurseries that will ship to Canada, or the U.S. for that matter, than American nurseries who will export. The Europeans are more accustomed to shipping across borders in the E.U. But both an import permit and phyto are required for import of roses from the E.U. and it is costly and risky both.

Here is the much vaunted and much talked about Munstead Wood. The bloom just opened this morning and there are several others that will be open by this afternoon. This plant is grafted from Pickering Nursery and has been in the pot since mid april. She wants to grow and to bloom.

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On first impressions I suspect that this will be a worthy cultivar to be named for Gertrude Jeykll's garden.

The colour once again is just not quite right, much darker crimson purple in nature.

Cheers, RRL, aka Rick

Here is a link that might be useful: Munstead Wood, The Garden

Munstead is stunning! On my wish list. So sorry about the border hassles.

Carol

Have you looked at Ascot - Tantau not Austin, but worth a look if you like old fashioned reds. I grow Falstaff which is mean with its blooms - WS2000 which is OK once the growth settles - Heathcliff which is more of a deep magenta but has decent growth, not much fragrance though - Munstead wood is good but a bit informal - LD Braithwaite is a very clear red and is one of my favourite austin reds - Tradescant I shovel pruned, not a fan of long sparse stems with small flowers at the top - Darcey Bussell new for me this year, as is Thomas a Becket so will wait to see how they do. Although I like austins, maybe I prefer Ascot to his reds.

caldonbeck, I'm glad you also mentioned Ascot (its pic is above). I have two, and I keep singing its praises. Another Tantau rose I love, and only acquired this spring, is Augusta Luise. It's as vigorous as Ascot, and has the most unique, huge frilly blooms with an old fashioned look--but quite different at the same time. It's not dark red, however, but a sort of peachy apricot, that changes as the blooms age. Evers hybridized Ascot, Augusta Luise, and several other gorgeous, old fashioned type roses (see on HMF) that seem to be available only in Europe. I contacted Palatine (which carries Ascot) about those roses, but so far are not available in Canada, either. Hortico carries Augusta Luise. Another great Tantau is Bernstein-Rose, a small rose that has blooms in dark yellow. Diane

OOO h my---I love these lucious roses----Wish I had more sun and a better back----I want to try all of them

Florence

Haha nanadoll - that'll teach me to skim threads. I can't praise the the Nostalgic Tantau roses enough. They are great.

Falstaff in my garden is a very large shrub, wants to climb. I'll be getting a trellis when I've pruned it. Lots of gorgeous dark buds, good repeat and no disease at all. What a beauty.
Red roses are always hard to photograph, I found that the reds are lighter than in real life.