I'm thinkin', she needs 24hp JD w/60" deck for encouragement. ... or to give the front a bit of color.

Yeah, because all that lawn needs is a little water and it will look like a nice, plush green carpet : )

Here in FL she'd get arrested FOR watering her lawn- go figure!

She might get arrested for watering her lawn her lawn here in Wisconsin also. Watering lawns is banned due to low water tables, but I don't know what the penalty is for turning the hose on. That lawn in the picture looks a lot like the greens on a local golf course.

She wasn't arrested for NOT WATERING HER LAWN!
She was arrested for not providing information! It's called obstruction of justice!

I would think if one played their cards right they could force the city to provide free water or forget about giving tickets.

I hope she is not watering her lawn because she is saving her money for some cosmetic surgury!
{{gwi:338176}}

Something looks a bit familiar here. Look at the link-

Here is a link that might be useful: Link

That's what she gets for moving into such a ritzy neighborhood.

Can't afford to water her lawn but she's got her tv antenna. Gotta have your priorities you know...

I think that BS, Poor old lady. What happen to respect for the old. How would you like you Mama or Grandma treated like that? Cops should be catching real criminals not inforcing some stupid yeppi ordiance and especically Not harrassing old ladies, but old ladies usually don't shoot or fight back. Easy prey for even the police!

That's a lady? Sounds like she was the one that was harassing. When a peace officer asks you what your name is, it is always a good idea to give him/her an answer. From the looks of her, he should have checked her house for a meth lab.

There seems to be a few things you guys are missing.

1) She's a widow at 70 years old. If and when you get to 70, will you want to take the few bucks you might have and spend it watering your lawn? So, she waters it, then she has to pay $3 + a gallon for gas to mow it, or hire some kid for $12 + an hour. Where's this going?

2) She probably wouldn't look so bad, if she hadn't fallen up the steps during this whole event. Will you look better at 70, provided you're still alive? Maybe, ... but if you don't, what are you going to do?

3) If the lawns are that dry, where is the water table? Or do you make the lawns look nice, at the cost of no drinking water and other necessities?

. Shame on some of you for bad mouthing the poor old lady! Does you grandma know your so cold hearted.

The Meth lab is a generation X product, along with Drain "O", Butane, sliver paint, and anything else the can be inhaled.

If you are detained by law enforcement -- whether or not you are actually under arrest -- you do not have to say anything at all to them. If they ask your name you do not owe them an answer. You have the right to remain silent and police cannot compel you to speak. It is not a crime to remain silent and police can't legally arrest a person for exercising the right to remaining silent. The woman is quoted in the article as saying she did not want to speak until she spoke to a lawyer first. On the other hand if the police say you are free to go, you don't have to say anything either. That is the law as it stands today. Maybe in some other countries, but not here in the United States.

Unless you are driving a car at the time, the only time a person is required to give the police your name and show ID is if you have been arrested and they are going to release you -- in that case you are required to identify yourself.

According to the article the police dropped all charges but they have opened themselves up to a civil rights action.

Your stories might change if he was your neighbor. I bet there is more to this story than is being told.

Here is the latest of the story, as of yesterday.

By the time the story is finished, she might have a lawn, new JD in the garage and a professional landscaper. Her house might be featured in Better Homes and Gardens!

If the neighbors or the city were so concerned, they could have helped out, just as most on this forum try to do.

Here is a link that might be useful: Latest on the story.

Clicked link & read story. Isn't it funny that the Orem mayor signed the apology as "Orem city mayor, city council" instead of signing his real name? This fiasco began when a citizen wouldn't give up her name to a "Barney Fife" "peace officer".

I thought for a minute that we might have a post with out JD being mentioned.....wishfull thinking I guess.

The least she could do is mow her crappy looking, overgrown dead weeds.

"If you are detained by law enforcement -- whether or not you are actually under arrest -- you do not have to say anything at all to them. The woman is quoted in the article as saying she did not want to speak until she spoke to a lawyer first.

Unless you are driving a car at the time, the only time a person is required to give the police your name and show ID is if you have been arrested and they are going to release you -- in that case you are required to identify yourself.

According to the article the police dropped all charges but they have opened themselves up to a civil rights action. "

According to the article the officer was attempting to write her a ticket. Thus requiring her name and signature! So yes, in refusing to give her name and sign the ticket, she could be arrested. Same way if you refuse to sign a speeding ticket.

And shame on you for the misleading title!

And as for the "poor old granny" and I quote:

Perry and her son have contacted LA attorney Gloria Allred, known for representing Amber Frey in the Scott Peterson murder trial and criticizing music star Michael Jackson.

If she's got the cash to hire Allred, she can water the freaking lawn!

It doesn't say they "hired" Allred. They contacted Allred and "She says at this point, she is supportive of the Perrys as a victim right's advocate."

How about afford a wig? Please say yes.....

Any cop who awants to write a ticket for not watering a lawn is a d!ck.

Did somebody (a neighbour) phone in a complaint? They are a d!ck too. What they should have done, is offered to water her 300 sq. foot lawn for her.

There are punks out there selling dope to kids, raping girls, and gang fighting, and the cops prefer to give tickets for a dry lawn?... which part of this instance falls under the mantra "to serve and protect"?.... what service and what protection did the cop provide?

what a d!ick

Looking at the nicely kept up house next door with the Ford truck parked in the drive, I can almost guarantee they turned the lady in. Most neighbors won't turn someone in that they like, so chances are they had some type of problems and this is just par for the course. I can guarantee the cop would rather be doing something else besides trying to get this lady to abide by the laws, but unfortunately her selfishness has pulled him away from more important things.

The cop is going to be doing more important things like preparing his legal defense, and looking for a new line of work.

I doubt he will be fired. Notice how the story only tells your Mom's side of the story?

'The cop is going to be doing more important things like preparing his legal defense, and looking for a new line of work.'

The cop is doing his JOB. City ordinance says you have to maintain your lawn, then you have to maintain your lawn!

Frankly I'm ashamed at the city for backing down. Get a backbone Mayor! She broke the law, she gets a ticket. You back down, you basically say she was right. (which she wasn't!)

I say she should be sued for slander for the following comment. Thats just inappropriate.

On Friday Betty Perry said, 'Don't ever say no when the police tell you do to something. You better do what they tell you no matter what, even if you don't have anybody to help you. You've got to do what they tell you or they will hurt you.'

Read the link its another less biased newspaper. The Salt Lake Tribune

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_6319911

Pay attention to the fact she is an avid cross country R-Ver and put $25,000 into renovations on her house.

Pay attention to where she was warned about this last year. (although I do fault the police for not following up)

Notice where she claims the officer hit her in the face with handcuffs. Sounds like she was trying to claim brutality on the officer to get out of it! (it happens more than you think)

She has bruises from the handcuffs. Because she was struggling!

No officer would assault a person over a dry lawn.

She was trying to go inside the house. If you were the officer, would you want someone going inside their house while you were attempting to write a ticket? For all he knew granny was going to get her gun. He wanted to stop that possibility. I'd rather have an arrested granny than another dead cop.

I do agree with the LT that there were other ways to handle it, but she was uncooperative. He was probably doing it as he was trained.

She says she hasn't been able to get help about weed removal or irrigation. Well sure. Its your lawn. Its your responsibility. Here's an idea. Get the son to do it!

http://www.telegram.com/article/20070708/NEWS/707080678/1052

Another news source. It claims she fell, rolled onto her stomach with her hands under her to prevent the officer from cuffing her. Thats resisting arrest.

She is one lucky lady. Here in California the cop would have claimed she was going for a gun, shot her 27 times and then called in for backup.

"retired military and U.S. government employee"

I doubt she can claim poverty.

You'd think she would know better AT HER AGE!

"...I can guarantee the cop would rather be doing something else..."
Metal: you are either naive, or a cop. The #1 thing "by far" for any ordnance cop is to make $$$ for the city. It has nothing to do with "more" or "less "important things to do. Now imagine an alternate situation. A goon from a local gang walks the street to collect "protection money". One of the terrorized citizens finally stands up and says "NO WAY". How do you think the goon will react?... say "that's OK then" or will he "rough up" that citizen?

KCOOK said:
"...She broke the law, she gets a ticket...."
Who's Law?... what ever happend to "the land of the free, and the home of the brave..." Now tell me: which part of this "kind of law" has anything to do with freedom?... and tell me who exercised bravery: the cop, or the lady? If there was a law that said you can't leave your garage door open for more than 60 seconds (believe me - laws like that exist), is that another example of "tha land of the free"?

"...No officer would assault a person over a dry lawn...." Wake up. This post is about one.

Even if the lady "had an attitude"... is having an attitude illegal?... if the cop can't get her to sign the ticket, then perhaps "the law" should be changed that a signature is not required?... but oh - what a can of worms that would open... but who cares? the law makers?.... BWAAAAHAHAHA!!!!

This situation stinks. And the saddest part will be that the cop will be on the street tomorrow, doing the same thing again.... Kind of reminds me of weather guys... wrong so many times, and they still get to keep their jobs....

For a little humor, let's turn this story around a little bit. As was mentioned earlier, some places it's illegal to water your lawn during a dry spell.

Let's imagine she (or you) just bought a new $8,000 LT and after mowing once or twice, her/your lawn turned brown because of draught. So she/you sneak out at night to water, so she/you can have more fun with your new LT. She/You get caught by the local Federalis!

You can finish the story .....

"if the cop can't get her to sign the ticket, then perhaps "the law" should be changed that a signature is not required?"

So how's the cop supposed to prove the person was even present? Cops could just write tickets at their whim and claim you did something, without ever leaving the station, if a signature wasn't required.

If a person refuses to speak to the cop or sign the ticket, the cop can take that person "into custody". That's all he was trying to do. SHE is the one that escalated the situation!
All she had to do was sign the ticket and she could have had her day in court!
I hope they gave her a body cavity search!

"...So how's the cop supposed to prove the person was even present? Cops could just write tickets at their whim and claim you did something, without ever leaving the station, if a signature wasn't required...."

There are 2 answers to your question:

1. Why prove anything?... the cop gets his money in both instances - signature nor not. I see no difference in either outcome, except for 1 aspect - the woman does not get arrested in the case of "no signature required". Guilty until proven innocent (same as traffic laws).

2. Ask yourself this question: what happens when you get a parking ticket?..... hmmm.... guilty until proven innocent.... again....

The cop does have to leave the station, same as the case of parking tickets.... it's a lame way of excusing the cash-collection exercise...

I've said it before, and will say it again: it's all about cash!

Now don't get me wrong - there are lots of great cops out there... cops that actually have ethics and morals. But there is a handfull out there, that spoil it for everyone. And let's not forget the politicians. They make these insane laws!

She was probably reading this forum and was told she needed to spend over $3000 for a decent used lawn tractor. Attached of course would be a glowing picture of a that persons pride and joy- again. Therefore, throwing in the towel on the idea altogether :)

A law requiring a citizen to water or irrigate a lawn is stupid. I'll go along with the idea that the dead dry grass may constitute a fire hazard but to require a resident to water a lawn at their expense is ridiculous. Whether it rains or not depends entirely on circumstances beyond the control of mere mortals. Weather is a phenomenon of nature. Yes, I think the government and/or homeowners associations et al should have the right to force lazy residents to clean up debris, paper waste, etc. to abate fire hazards........those kinds of nuisances are man made. If the government thinks a lawn should be artificially watered in the absence of rain, it should be the responsibility of the government and the citizens at large to bear the costs and not focused on specific individuals. To mandate that a citizen should have to make up for nature's failure to provide precipitation is idiotic. If a person CHOOSES to water their lawn, so what? If a person CHOOSES not to water their lawn, so what? If it rains, it's nature's way. If it doesn't rain, it's nature's way.

Wally
"KCOOK said:
"...She broke the law, she gets a ticket...."
Who's Law?... what ever happend to "the land of the free, and the home of the brave..." Now tell me: which part of this "kind of law" has anything to do with freedom?... and tell me who exercised bravery: the cop, or the lady? If there was a law that said you can't leave your garage door open for more than 60 seconds (believe me - laws like that exist), is that another example of "tha land of the free"?"

Orem's city ordinance thats whose law. We live in a land of free speech but I dare you to shout fire in a crowded theater. Land of the free? Sure. You are free to practice any religion you wish. You can carry a weapon. (provided it legal for you to do so). But in Orem Utah, you better water your lawn.

Wally
" "...No officer would assault a person over a dry lawn...." Wake up. This post is about one."

That was aimed at the womans comment that the officer assaulted her with handcuffs. He claims she fell while trying to go back inside. No officer would attack a citizen over an ordinance violation. Wake up.

Wally
" Even if the lady "had an attitude"... is having an attitude illegal?... if the cop can't get her to sign the ticket, then perhaps "the law" should be changed that a signature is not required?... but oh - what a can of worms that would open... but who cares? the law makers?.... BWAAAAHAHAHA!!!!"

Ok. You were speeding. Oh, you never signed a paper that you were pulled over? Too bad. You need to pay a $500 fine.

No having an attitude is not illegal, but guess what? Its not going to win you any points with the officer. Had she just said "Ok, I'll take the ticket" she could contest it in court, and there would have been no problem. She could plead her case to a judge. But no. She gets an attitude and struggles.

Wally
" This situation stinks. And the saddest part will be that the cop will be on the street tomorrow, doing the same thing again.... Kind of reminds me of weather guys... wrong so many times, and they still get to keep their jobs...."

Yes he will be back on duty. Because he was doing his JOB. I'm sorry, are you some kind of super-human who has a 100% success rate at his job?

The officer is only human and they sometimes make mistakes. And guess how complex predicting the weather is?

Did she protest the ordinance? No. Did she attempt to get the ordinance changed? No.

She lives in an area that has basic laws about the appearance of property. She had to have known that when she purchased the property. She knew that because she had been warned before. Yet she didn't do anything!

Wally:
"1. Why prove anything?... the cop gets his money in both instances - signature nor not. I see no difference in either outcome, except for 1 aspect - the woman does not get arrested in the case of "no signature required". Guilty until proven innocent (same as traffic laws)."

Police get paid regardless of the number of arrests or citations. Quota's are illegal. So signature or not does not matter.

The reason the signature is required is to affirm that the person understands the charges against them and agrees to show up in court or pay the fine.

You seem to have a very mistake view of innocence until proven guilty.
" Innocent until proven guilty or Presumed Innocence:

Presumption of innocence is a legal right that the accused in criminal trials has in many modern nations. It states that no person shall be considered guilty until finally convicted by a court. The burden of proof is thus on the prosecution, which has to convince the court that the accused is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. In principle, the defense does not have to 'prove' anything. However, the defense may present evidence tending to show that there is a doubt as to the guilt of the accused. "

Wally:
"2. Ask yourself this question: what happens when you get a parking ticket?..... hmmm.... guilty until proven innocent.... again...."

Umm No. You may contest the ticket in court. This forces the police to PROVE you committed the violation. Burden of proof lies in the hands of the prosecution and the officer that wrote the citation.

What has any of this got to do with lawn tractors?

It is to remind everybody about the ordinance requiring owners of lawn and garden tractors to wax their machine twice per month. You haven't been waxing your tractor? Don't answer your doorbell without looking out the window first.

Strange how this world is these days?If she is paying her taxes and not hurting anyone.Why should she be harrased for that?Not a well kept place.But those places just make the people who keep there property looking good look even better.Ordinances?I can not see why anyone would want to live in town.Land of high taxes and snooty neighbors.Might as well rent then live in town.Your neighbor is your landlord telling you how to live.The high taxes is the same as paying rent.Atleast out here my crop pays the taxes.My farm was the same price as a $300.000 cooky cutter house that makes no money setting on 1/4 acre and I have 80 acres to pay me back every year.

Just throwing my two cents in, I firmly belive that people should have the right to what they want to their property, unless it is a hazard to others. The dead grass is not a fire hazard like the city would want you to believe. That said, the cop has to follow the rules set by the governing body, no matter how stupid they may be. Yes, the lady has to give her name for a cop when a ticket is being issued. But remember, a ticket is just a piece of paper telling you when your case is to be heard. Until a judgement is issued, nothing is certain. She should have gave her info, then presented her case to the judge.

Around here, the Code Enforcement Department issues tickets all the time for lawns and vacant lots that need to be mowed. They don't knock on your door and hand you a ticket. How could they on a vacant lot? No, they use the tax records and other public information to look up the owner's name and address, and they send the ticket in the mail.

I've got mixed feelings about this case, but I'm very certain I wouldn't want this lady as my neighbor. I've had neighbors before that had the time and money for anything they wanted, but couldn't seem to find the time to maintain their yard or the money to pay someone else to do it.

I think it's obvious that she did not act in an appropraite manner. But the police officer's actions was way over the line and not justified. An onrey old lady can be agravating, but a police officer who abuses his power is dangerous. This country was founded with the understanding that government is a necessary evil and that people with power can be corrupt, so that's why we have a system of checks and balances. The constitution does not list the rights of people. It lists the rights that the people give the government, and some rights that we specifically do not give the government.
We don't get rights from the constitution, the government gets rights from us through the constitution.

As wrong as that lady was, the officer is the one to commited a serious offence.

Kcook,

I love a great debate.

"...Orem's city ordinance thats whose law...."
It's all about the "city" then.... Who cares about the citizens... Who made the laws?... the "city", or the "legislators"?.. the legislators are people... and any person who makes a law like that one, is an idiot.

"...We live in a land of free speech..."
I propse we change the words of the anthem then How does this sound: "...the land of free speech & religion (most of the time), and the home of the brave (but don't fight the law)..."

"...Ok. You were speeding. Oh, you never signed a paper that you were pulled over? Too bad. You need to pay a $500 fine...."
Yup - that's how it works.

"...Because he was doing his JOB. I'm sorry, are you some kind of super-human who has a 100% success rate at his job?..."
No I'm not perfect - but if I screw up bad enough to make the news, I get fired. I suppose I shouldn't blame the cop - but blame the laws instead. The cop after all is just a machine - he doesn't think, and doesn't consider the consequences of his actions.... so long as he does his job, he is OK.
I'd hate to be crossing the street when he decides to run through a red light - flip his cherries on for no good reason other than because he doesn't want to have to wait for a green, and floor it across the intersection. Oh wait - no cop has ever done that!

"...Police get paid regardless of the number of arrests or citations...."
Ever wonder why they tell you to make cheques you write for all your tickets, to the attention of "treasurer of [whatever political region]"?

"...The reason the signature is required is to affirm that the person understands the charges against them and agrees to show up in court or pay the fine...."
This doesn't seem to be the case when you get a parking ticket, now does it?

"...You may contest the ticket in court. This forces the police to PROVE you committed the violation. ..."
This one is just over the top!!!... You don't automatically go to court. You have to choose to go. If you DON'T go, you are "guilty as charged". The burden of proof is on you my friend. And guess what - 9 times out of 10, you will lose (you may have the fine reduced, but you are still found guilty). If you don't go to court and you don't pay your fine, you go to jail. Does that sound like "innocent until proven guilty" to you?

Anyway - let's stop this banter. The topic is worn out.

I always like it when someone puts in their 2 cents and then calls for an end of debate. If she lived here the city would give her a warning and if she ignored it they would come in and take care of her lawn and bill her for it (they actually subcontract it out). It wouldn't take long for her to realize she could take care of her lawn cheaper than paying the city to do it.

I wonder if there have been any precedent cases in Orem's past where the city has actually watered a citizen's lawn and subsequently billed the citizen for the the job?

Yea... the city does unsolicited work, and then sends you the bill. Hmmmm.... another model of "freedom"?

So when I cut the grass by the street-side, the 10 or so feet that actually belong to the city.... should I send them the bill?... I wonder if they'll pay it.... and I wonder if I could send a collection agency after them if they don't pay... and I wonder if I could then threaten them with jail, if they still don't pay....

hmmmmm

Reminds me of a old saying , Life is a bed of roses but watch out for the pricks.