I don't know about lousiana as that is a different climate than here but there's some rather mature colorado blue spruce in the northern atlanta suburbs and quite a few large norway spruces. They're not the easiest plants to find here either. You really have to hunt for them. I have a saying, you never know until you try it and don't take people's word for it that haven't tried it or nursery employees that don't have any in stock.

Is your purpose for the Spruce trees to be a specimen tree or trees (ie you have an open area and you just want to have a nice tree) or are you looking for a natural screen "living fence" to block a neighbor or busy road? What type of soil do you have? sandy, clay, swampy etc.? How much room do you have to work with? Do you want a fast growing tree or don't mind waiting a while (Or a generation)?

smallmouth1, The area for the spuce trees is pretty good soil,not swampy at all, however there is some clay. Would like to make a grove, like I had when I lived in Minnesota, I miss all the spruce trees and was just hoping that maybe some kind of spruce would grow here. I did try growing a Black Hills Spruce that I got a couple of years ago from a nursery in Minnesota, but it did not survive the summer, just too hot for it, I suppose. But if you know of any spruce trees that can handle the heat of the south, please let me know. Thanks

Try Picea torano (syn. P. polita) from southern Japan, Picea smithiana from the Himalaya, and Picea martinezii from northeast Mexico.

Resin

norway spruce do o.k. in east central alabama, zone 8.
my plant is about 15' tall from a 3' b&b christmas tree some years ago.
i doubt colorado blue spruce will like louisiana. they don't like it here.

It's not just a question of heat tolerance. For normal growth spruces need a considerable winter chilling -- otherwise they may not come out of dormancy well. Even the far-south Mexican spruces grow in montane situations where it snows. I doubt you can easily reconstruct Minnesota in Louisiana, but why not try?

Hi pinetree30 - not sure that's right. All spruces do OK in zone 9 Britain (same amount of winter chilling as LA), the difference is our cool summers which don't stress them in summer.

Picea torano actually does fairly poorly here (hardy, but very slow growth), most likely due to lack of summer heat.

Resin

I'm scratching my head over why someone would WANT to plant a Blue Spruce in that part of the country? Why not one of the conifers that will do fine?

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:346320}}

Resin

Ive just planted picea torano and it will thrive as the
summers are just warm enough here in Devon.

rhizo 1, I dont necessaily have to plant a blue spruce, like I said before I have never seen one around here, but saw on arborday.com that blue spruce were hardy to zone 8, however I am also learning that zone maps are not always correct. The tree that you sent in the picture I really liked, so will be looking into that as well, however I will try to grow some norway spruces just to see how they do here, if they make it fine, if not that is okay too, it is fun just trying to grow things in an area that would normally not grow these things

In retail nurseries of northeast OK it is easy to find Blue Spruce. and the USDA Zone there is 6b/7a. Personally though, I think the cedar and cedar cultivars do better in the 6b/7a zone of NE OK.

Have you considered Ponderosa pines. Even after first planted, they certainly do a good job thriving in dry conditons.

If you cannot find any Norway spruce cultivated in your area, then why not try to find a grower in Texas. If having any, Houston nurseries could reasonalbly be expected to have more salt tolerant cultivars. If none are grown in the Houston area, maybe nurseries in northeast Texas might grow some. When driving through the Northeast corner of Texas one can see some dramtically beautiful evergreen forests. It might even be worth your while to check some nurseries in the DFW area.

lsu 27.....
I finally figured it out, all of us tree nuts have the same problem. We want what we can't have. I did some research last night for you (yes, I am an absolute tree geek)trying to figure out if Spruces could grow in your locale etc...(arborday.org is a good general website and Norway Spruce is not listed for your zone). Then I thought of the names of the Spruces you want to grow... Serbian, Norway, and Colorado. Are any of these right for your location? Probably not, they thrive in cold climates, you can tell by the name. What I would give to have a giant Live Oak, Bald Cypress, Sothern Magnolia, or American Holly on our property like you could grow! When I travel down South, I am so envious! Bottom line, Northern trees wouldn't survive or be the trees you would want your grandchildren or great grandchildren to enjoy in your area. I took notice of your posting because we have a Norway Spruce plantation on our property. Probably 300 trees if not more. It is incredible. They are about 80' tall, planted in 1964. We have tons of owls and birds that roost in them and a fire pit with benches in the middle and my 2 year old stares up at them in awe. They are even more beautiful in the winter laden with snow. Truly wonderful. But they are designed to grow in areas like Michigan. If I had planted species that were not suited for here they would be scraggly at best and not what you truly want for future generations. As a tree nut, I have learned the hard way to plant a tree that is suitable for the conditions, rather than plant what tree you like the best. Think of all the wonderful trees that are designed for where you live! I am a huge fan of evergreens and you have a zillion that would thrive (and I emphasize thrive, not survive) in your area. Anyway, just a thought....

Check out Cunninghamia lanceolata "Glauca" (Blue China Fir), and Deodar Cedar, they do well in the deep south.

Picea pungens 'Iseli Foxtail' or just 'Foxtail' is the most heat tolerant Blue Spruce. I would also suggest Picea torano and Picea martinezii as well as Picea maximowiczii. Picea neoveitchii is probably impossible to find but is probably the most heat tolerant of the Chinese spruces since it grows at a low altitude in central China on southern slopes.

"Picea neoveitchii is probably impossible to find"

Yep - not in cultivation anywhere, as far as I know. When Wilson discovered it, he only found one tree, and didn't get any seeds (Masters, J. Bot. 41: 267-270, 1903). More recently, seed distributed by the Chinese in the 1970s under this name turned out to be P. wilsonii.

"it grows at a low altitude in central China on southern slopes"

Not from what I've read - Wilson's tree was at 1675m in western Hubei, and Farjon's Pinaceae book records it as "on medium high mountains, at elevations between 1300-2000m, often on north-facing, steep, rocky slopes". This compares with P. torano, which gets down as low as 400m in Japan.

Resin

FWIW, I have seen Picea glauca 'Conica' well established in a garden in Gainesville, FL - Zone 8b. I was looking for houses this summer and spotted two older specimens about 3' (1m) tall in a garden. They looked like they had been there for a while and looked no better or worse than they typically do up north. I am trying P. omorika in a partially shaded spot on the northeast side of my house. I will keep you updated...

Some other "exotic" conifers I am trying here include:
Araucaria angustifolia, araucana, cunninghamii
Austrocedrus chilensis
Cedrus deodara
Chamaecyparis formosensis
Cunninghamia konishii, unicanaliculata
Cupressus torulosa (grown from seeds)
Fitzroya cupressoides
Fokienia hodginsii
Keteleeria davidiana
Keteleeria evelyniana (lost almost all of the needles after 21 F in Feb. and is growing strongly now).
Pinus devoniana, massoniana, patula, pseudostrobus, yunnanensis and wallichiana (seeds from Bhutan)
Pseudolarix amabalis
Pseudotsuga gaussenii (grafts), sinensis (seedlings), wilsoniana (grafts)
Taxodium mucronatum x distichum
T. mucronatum

Pineresin
My information was straight from reading about it at conifers.org and the flora of China website but I guess I need a new reference source. Can you recommend any good books such as Krussman's conifer manual or anything else? I have been looking around lately for some better books about the subject and assumed I'd get the new book from Dendropress but can't find out when it will be released. You seem to quote Farjon quite frequently, can you please give me some advice about a good conifer reference book to get.

Pay attention to the sage advice smallmouth1 gave you....

"Think of all the wonderful trees that are designed for where you live!"

Salicaceae, Could you up-date us on how your list of trees did?

lsu:

Listen to smallmouth and gary. Sorry! I have been fighting with nursery men here in the Northern VA area for years about spruce and fir trees--they say they won't grow here, but I know they will. BUT, BUT, BUT, where you are? I would never even think of it. Yes, you may be able to get some spruce tree to grow and survive. Resin knows as much about what would be worth trying as anyone.

BUT, BUT, BUT, you say you loved the spruces you saw up north. Well, that is the key. You may get a spruce to survive and grow a bit, but you will never see anything like what you are dreaming of. In fact, I think what is the best that could happen is you could get some spruce to survive and grow a bit, but looking at them would make you more and more sad, and make you miss all the more your spruce trees from up north.

Look around and find some native (or well adapted to your area) trees you like and learn to love them. Don't plant something that will never be really pretty and which will make you more sad than happy.

--Spruce

I've seen several Colorado blue spruce trees around here zone 7a/7b where the average middle summer high is in the low 90s with high humidity. Some years it can reach 100F but not commonly. One colorado blue spruce was in full sun and was at medium to large size, I would say 30+ years old.

Listen to Spruce.

He loves Norway Spruce but he knows this beautiful tree won't thrive everywhere. I live in southeastern Virginia. I've discussed NS with him for nearly a year. Based on his advice, I talked to local growers - people who grow NS on their Christmas tree farms. They told me that the NS grows here but it grows slowly (for their needs).

I don't think NS grown in Louisiana will ever fill you with joy like the trees you loved in Minnesota. If you can open your mind and heart, you'll find equally wonderful trees that thrive in the South.

Here is a link to current thread that has information from people who know and love trees that grow and thrive in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama.

Pam

Here is a link that might be useful: Southeast MS Forestry 100 Years Ago

I know just how you feel about the spruces up north! I love them too. I was searching for info on serbian spruces and found your post from a while back. Did you ever try planting any? I live near Tupelo, Ms. I am about to plant a Serbian Spruce not knowing what will be the outcome. Our nurseries here will not sell spruce because they tell me that spruces wont survive in zone 8. Neither could they believe it when I told them I had a colorado spruce in my yard.

I have a colorado blue spruce planted in full sun. It has done well for over 3 years and is 2.5 tall. Two of my blue spruce died, but this healthy one I have kept watered every two days in the summer, and I keep miracle grow fertilizer stakes around it. I have also used cotton burr compost around it. I guess alot of it depends on how much attention they recieve. My mother has a blue spruce that is very tall and several years old. The thing is a site!

I have a friend in Augusta GA. who has two Serbian spruce that are very healthy. And you know how hot it gets there. So I think it COULD be possible but not likely that is will survive in the south.

If it doesnt survive, I have noticed that Canadian Hemlocks will survive in the south. They have a pretty spruce shape to them when young. I have read that they tend to get ugly and lose their lower branches when old, but I guess by then I could cut it down and plant a new one. haha

If you have any information or have tried anything I would be interested in, please let me know.

Try the Momi Fir.

The Momi Fir is pretty. I checked them out on the web. I didnt even know that existed! Thank goodness there is a pretty christmas tree that grows in hot humid climate. Thank you so much for the info. The only problem is now, where am I gonna find somebody who sells them. haha

I know this is a totally ancient thread but there are mature blue spruce specimens in zone 9b in Sacramento, CA where they see 105+ every year and even more in the cooler coastal climate in the bay area though its considerably less humid. My local nursery in southern California sells blue spruce trees which they do ok inland where there's enough summer heat and some winter chill. Probably your biggest issue where you are is wet soil or too much water logged clay. Plant on a well drained mound of loam or something relatively fast draining and be sure to water regularly in the summer during dry spells the blue spruce will consume a lot more water in humid hot places, that's why some spruces have unusual canopies the growth patterns may be altered some tips die off or don't grow due to environmental stress.

In general from what I've read and heard around from gardners that blue spruces tend to rot out and suffer from a myriad of fungal diseases in the deep south but I don't personally live there so I can't say for sure. Out west we can grow spruce into zone 9b but only in dry locations with limited summer rainfall. A better choice for super humid places might be a choice from lesser cold southern California mountains white fir sub species "iowana" on a root rot resistant Momi fir root stock or something like that for a fir. We have wild firs that grow wild into zone 9a on relatively low elevation mountain ranges that regularly experience fog and summer humidity (though nothing like the south) that looks similar to blue spruce. For a true spruce a Chihuahua spruce probably on Picea Glauca rootstock for root rot resistance would be something to look into. Picea chihuahua is similar to blue spruce but grows more vigorously in more humid rainy summer climates of southern mountainous Mexico and have been informed they have multiple annual flushes so they grow fast and may grow into zone 9/10 I found some mail order plants for sale at forest farm:

https://www.forestfarm.com/picea-chihuahuana-pich050.html

" We have wild firs that grow wild into zone 9a on relatively low elevation mountain ranges "

Yeah but the "9a" has nothing to do with why those firs aren't adopted to the southeast. It's still a totally different climate!

The picture that seems to be emerging is that grafting on firma doesn't make *every last* species of fir completely adopted to our [southeastern] climate. IIRC conifer50 or someone else in Georgia has reported losing western firs even if they were grafted on firma. I haven't lost any, but I've had them grow agonizingly slowly. Of all the world's firs, the western US ones seem most insistent on getting the "daily vernalization" of cool nights. By contrast A. squamata is from insanely high elevation in the subtropical highlands climate of SW China and Nepal and seems to have grown relatively normally here, grafted on firma...granted I've only had it for a year. A possible explanation for this is that although nights are plenty chilly in such places, it's definitely a summer wet aka "monsoon" climate, so the differential between day and night temps, in summer, is not going to be as high as it is in California.

It's funny to look through this old thread. I can't believe I had the self-control to not express my disdain for seeing "Colorado Blue Spruce" anywhere other than in the Rockies! But especially in more humid parts of the eastern US where they are so frequently hideous and diseased. Also was reminded of "Willows" posting some of the plants he was growing in FL. Wonder what will become of them now that he is known to have left the state.

I know this is old, but from what I’ve learned, spruce species that do well in the southeast are mostly east/central Asian species since the climate is so similar to that of the southeast

Another thing that I would try to find are the East Asian Douglas-fir species. Most of them grow in hot areas and are more warm climate conifers

Also, the only western fir I would even try to attempt is Abies concolor as it does quite well in the upper south and Midwest. They are adapted to heat, but more so desert heat. But it can handle eastern US humidity just fine