I agree. It's easy to panic when you hear "arsenic" (or whatever) that you know has bad things about it and not realize that it has to be of some level to cause harm. Modern analytical techs can find single atoms sometimes and fractions of a part per billion is not gonna kill me for many hundred years. Doubt if I live that long anyways. A single breath of city air, if it could be kept and analyzed, would probably scare me to death, lol. Few people realize that their gold or silver jewelry contains traces of poisonous heavy metals.....yes, ALL of it does. Not enough to worry with tho but given enough time and money a good lab can tell you.

The general public has been assured that so many chemicals were safe -- either out of scientific ignorance or willful lying and covering up -- that the credibility of the organizations who claim "things" are safe is utterly shot. Add on top of that the wanton greenwashing of corporations, overuse of nonsensical terms like "natural," the lack of education about basic scientific principles among even many college graduates plus awful media reporting on anything vaguely science related, and you get a population without either honest information or the ability to assess it when they do get it.

While I agree with your point in general, I don't find it hard to understand why people get paranoid. Most people are smart enough to smell a rat; how you deal with it depends a lot on your personality. Controlling something as simple as how the food you eat is grown and processed can be a big mental victory.

But it's not a collective here. I use non-organic methods when appropriate, and I don't think everything labeled organic is necessarily good, and I'm not the only one. But the folks here are a lot closer to my philosophy than the folks who advice you to "just put Sevin on it" or "kill it with Round-Up."

So while I, too, am bemused about some of the things you cited, I also organize my books by subject and alphabetized by author and publishing date. We all have our little harmless obsessions. :)

I have stated before and will repeat: I think "organic" is quasi-religious.

Compare "organic" to the dietary laws. Many Jews observe kashrut ... Some keep kosher at home but will eat in a non-kosher restaurant. Likewise with "organic", I would rather suspect. And furthermore, one does not need a reason. The Torah does not explicitly state the reason for most kashrut laws.

I have read that there are 27,000 words in the Code of Federal Regulations defining "organic" foods. The "organic" quasi-cult needs a quasi-rabbi to sort through this and determine if a few ashes and a soaker hose still allows the food to conform to the quasi-Kashrut or not.

I am a thus bemused by some of what almost has to be characterized as phobic preoccupation with at worst trace contaminants (in charcoal ashes, soaker hoses made from old tires, etc., etc., etc.) and additionally those that would be highly diluted, many types degraded, and in any case then would have to somehow make it into the food plant.

This is merely human nature and normal human behaviors that arise from ignorance and anxiety about the unknown. The set and spectrum of reactions arises from worldview. Nothing you can do about it. Frustration at this condition is perfectly natural too!

Dan

New American Standard Bible "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?

My problem with contamination is that it doesn't go away. Entire landscapes have been polluted, such as the area around Sudbury, Ontario. Sudbury has a nickel mine and the land around that mine has been contaminated to the point where vegetation won't grow. Lakes downwind are 'dead'. Completely clear water where nothing survives.

In Tacoma, Washington there was an copper smelter. Vashon Island, just to the north of Tacoma is contaminated with arsenic, cadmium and lead, as was the area local to the smelter.

The Housatonic River is a beautiful trout stream that runs from Vermont, through western Massachusetts and western Connecticut. General Electric contaminated it so badly (with PCBs) that there is a ban on eating the fish from any part of the 147 miles below the GE plant in Pittsfield, MA. Note that the use of PCBs was ended in 1977 and that river remains on the list of the 10 most heavily polluted.

Now that the air is cleaned up in places like New York City, people are starting to grow gardens in The City. BZZZT! Better check for lead in the soil from auto emissions in the days when lead was in gasoline.

I could go on about selenium in California, mercury in eastern Nevada from gold smelting, mercury from coal-fired power plants in the east coast, radioactive fallout in Utah, Idaho and other places from bomb testing, etc. etc., never mind the problems being caused by oil and gas drilling.

Yes, I am concerned about local (Boise, Idaho) levels of arsenic in the well water. But I had it tested, and I'm ok for now.

It would be easy to dismiss the fears about the steady accumulation of contamination, but I would rather stay informed. So, no Ironite fertilizer on my soil (banned in Canada for high levels of lead, arsenic, etc). Imagine, a fertilizer that contaminates. Is it any wonder people worry?

I've just sent off a soil sample to be tested for lead contamination. I'm keen to grow edibles down the side of my century-old house, but there are definitely particles of lead-based paint in the soil. A safe amount? I'll find out from the lab.
I'm perfectly happy to use old tires, shiny paper and what have you in my garden: as has been mentioned, I think walking down the street is infinitely more harmful.
As for some people sweating the small stuff; I imagine a lot of its to do with a feeling of helplessness and suspicion exacerbated by reliance on a mainstream media that swings wildly between sensationalist freak-outs and wilful blindness.
Whew. That came out sounding like I spend my days trawling the internet for conspiracies whilst wearing my tinfoil hat!
Most people can't think and act on a macro scale, and in order to feel some level of control, they focus on 'trivial and insignificant' things.

It is the dose of the contaminant that determines whether it is a poison or not, and some can be poisons in very minute quantities. Some also accumnulate in the soil so every time you add the material that contains that contaminent you increase the amount.
For example Selenium is an essential micro nutrient for humans and a lack of it can create in a human many problems, however a little too much creates even more problems. The same thing can be extended to your soil. If you know this product has anything that could become a ppoison in large enough quantities, lead for example, why put something with large amounts of lead into your soil so you potentially expose yourself, and yor family, to lead poisoning? Since one of the tenets of organic gardening is to make a good healthy soil that we can pass on to future generatioonms why add things that will accumulate in the soil and poison them today?

I avoid anything made of pvc/vinyl, whenever I can. Even if it doesn't leach much--I really don't know how toxic it is when it's in use, but I wouldn't want to be near a burning vinyl sided house--I think that manufacturing it creates lots of problems. So I don't want to add to the demand for it, hoping it will somehow contribute to less being created. I'm also concerned about lead in soaker hoses. I don't know how much will leach into my gardens, but I think there are reasonable alternatives, that are much less risky. Maybe I'm being paranoid on that one, but I can't afford to do my own lead testing. And who can you trust? The manufacturers? They have incentives to lie. The government agencies that are supposed to protect us? Even if we have good regulations, I think they're only selectively enforced at best. I know the world is full of toxic stuff, and I may only be worrying about the minor things. But I figure we have to start somewhere. I think there's some truth to the old saying: "Take care of the little things, and the big things will take care of themselves". Or is it "take care of the big things..."? I always get that one mixed up.

I have read that some people may have up to 40,000,000 atoms of mercury in each cell of their bodies...whew!! How many parts per million or billion that makes, I do not know....maybe not so many?

I just try to avoid chemicals that mimic estrogen...

Seems in this day and age little or nothing is truly organic.

Do you know of a lab that will test contaminant levels in soil?
Any suggestions on a winter cover for the garden that will introduce minimal contaminants?

I live in Brooklyn NY and last year put a raised bed garden in my concrete back yard. It is made of recycled plastic, lined with landscape fabric. I shopped for soil and filled it with a Monrovia Organic soil. This seemed as close as i was going to get to organic in Brooklyn.

Come winter i need to cover the bed to keep the feral cats out of it during the winter. I covered it with a couple of old hollow core doors, and worry about the stain from the doors leaching into the soil.

This garden season i will try out the "Scare Crow" motion sensor sprinkler.
Any input will be appreciated.
Thanks, Shawn

But we love to panic, why take that away from us? Also we have to remember that 20 years ago we were at the stage where we could detect parts per million at best and now we can detect parts per trillion. This adds to the confusion.

I'm in the science profession myself. I've done lots of toxicity work and know quite a bit about contaminates, exposure, risk factors, etc. I too wonder about the things people tend to panic about.

For some reason (maybe lack of a solid science education in our schools) our society seems programed to never actually look at the facts or ask critical questions about the issues. It's somehow easier to believe the media hype, panic, and then sue everyone in sight.

I think a lot of it is because most people just don't have enough understanding of the basic science and math needed to evaluate risks. So when they watch that news report the sensationalized the danger of lead from garden hoses, most people don't step back and think about it objectively. Rather they throw away their hose and run out and buy a new one that is 'drink-safe'. Never mind that they've likely just made the contamination load in their garden worse because of all the plasticizer that might come from a new hose.

Most people don't take the time to understand the issues. It never occurs to them to go look up the original study that says drinking hoses are unsafe. If they did they might find out that the vast majority of hoses, used in a normal manner did not leach any lead. They'd also discover that in order for any amount of lead to be detected the water had to be in contact with the hose for hours or days. And for the most part it lead was leached only from hoses that were full of standing water and were then heated (such as a hose filled with water laying in the hot sun all day). So if you're really worried roll your hose up after each use and store it in the shade. If you do leave it out in the sun, flush the hose by running the water for a few mins and all the lead will be gone.

You see news stories where some report went out and bought 10 hose, filled them with water, and then had the water tested. And 8-10 hoses can back with high levels of lead!!! It doesn't occur to most people to think about these studies in real world terms or ask critical questions. These studies never hold up to actual scientific scrutiny. Such as these tests were done on new hoses. A new hose is going to leach out most during it's first uses, so one that has been in use for years might not have any leaching lead. Did they test any hose that had 10g, 100g, 1000g, etc run through them? Also did they rinse the hose out before it was tested? The hose may be coated with some oil and dust left from the manufacturing process and maybe it's that dust the contains the lead. If so the 1st time you use it you'd be removing all the lead. Did they test the source water to determine what levels of lead were preset before the test? Was it tap water (most tap water contains some low levels of lead already)? Did it come from a faucet? What if the pipes and faucet were made out of old material with high levels of lead? Where did they get the hoses from, how many did they test? Is the sample size statistically significant? What about the lab? What type of test did they run (not all tests are the same)? Labs can make mistakes too so if one sample is particularly high or low did the person evaluating the data look for signs of lab error?

Even if all of this pans out and it turns out there actually is some lead in the water. What does this mean for your garden? If lead is only present in water that has sat in the hose and lets say the hose holds about 1/2 gallons of water. When you turn your hose on that 1st 1/2 gallon contains lead but then you keep running it and water on 20 gallons into your garden. That 1st sample is not representative of your entire 20 gallons. To test properly you'd need to fill a 20 gallon contain and mix well. Or take a small sample every 5 gallons and mix those. So if you have 1/2 gallon with lead 10 times the safe level and 20 gallons with no lead. Overall your 20.5 gallons is actually 10 time lower than the safe level (the math here is a little oversimplified but you get the idea).

So if you need to buy a new hose it makes sense to buy one that is 'drink-safe'. But should you chuck your old hose. Probably not. It really is safe to use. And if you want to be environmentally friendly it is always best to use what you have, buying new and throwing out the old is going to add to landfill space, use a bunch of gasoline to have it shipped to you, use up energy from the manufacture and potentially create more pollutants during manufacture, and so on.

That's just he 'lead in the hose' issue. Each new issue has it's own set of facts to consider. Even if there are some risk, what is the cost vs the benefit? What level of risk are you comfortable with? Mostly it's too much work to figure these things out for ourselves so we follow the "media-hype", what all my neighbors are doing, what my organic priestess tell me to, what everyone on that garden forum is saying, etc...

I use common sense and accept the fact that we live in contamination.