Giving up a duraforce.....??

Absolutely. My 2-cycle phase is over. I have had one continuously since 1994 and am moving on. I hope somebody like one of you guys gets the 10550, as it is an outstanding example of the 'last Lawn-Boy'.

please post a review on it . many comm users are curious about them but never see one at our dealers. i would like to know what the ground speed is

They advertise 5MPH. It's 'Variable Speed' so you can go as slow as you want. I would speculate that the max speed is set a little higher for commercial purposes, and I'll compare it to the 10684 which is fast enough for me. I'm curious too, because so little can be found out about the mower or engine. Like weight, for example - not listed on the LB site. I did find out that the GSV 190 does have an iron cylinder sleeve but I don't know what it has for bearings. I think the wheels have sealed bearings because there is no reference in the manual (on-line) to greasing anything. The GSV also has a wet foam pre-filter which is held off the pleated paper air filter by a frame. That's about all I know for now.
I bought it because 1) I've always wanted a commercial. 2) I really liked the GCV 160 I had on a Honda. 3) I thought the OHC engine would be great on an aluminum deck, but I also wanted the 6.5HP 190 and ball-bearing wheels. 4) I like the Insight hi-dome deck and Atomic blade combination which I've been using for several years with the 10684.
I'm pretty sure it's going to be a little heavier than the 10684, so handling will be my first concern. Of course, the Honda was heavy too and that was no problem. I already ordered a GSV engine manual which will tell me everything I want to know about the engine, and more. The owner's manual states to use SAE 30 oil. I want to find out the temperature range for that - if it only goes down to 50 like the GCV, I want to use 10W30.
So, there are a lot of questions to be answered, not the least of which is the big one; 'Will I like it after writing that big check?' I think I will, and I'm getting excited.

Saxman1 -
I need to talk some sense into you. Why don't you get rid of your Tec powered mower? Then you have the best of both worlds. You have your duraforce with staggered deck to use when you get the bug, and the 22271, which has the deck you like and a great motor. The 10684 is the one to go.

You need to keep the duraforce to preserve it. Wouldn't you hate it if it fell into someone's hands that straight-gassed it.

I guess you have to look at the little guy on each shoulder - but would it be the guy dressed in white or red saying keep the duraforce?

because the tech is sadly more reliable than the duraforce

Probably the biggest reason is the offset wheel just doesn't work for me on my yard. I have gone back and forth on the 'Easy-Stride' (Personal Pace) over the years, but have been using the mower less and less because of it. My 10550 is one of the good ones that has never developed the 'surge', and I'll always miss it as the mower I could go to in cold weather (no oil viscosity concerns), but I can live with that. The 10684 with 30W oil is good down to 32F so it will fill that role. I doubt that anyone will go to the trouble of buying a used 10550 and then 'straight-gas' it, but if they do, it is what it is.

Hey Sax,

Is $799 about what you paid? Did you consider the Snapper Hi Vac P2160KWV with a Kawasaki? Those are only $649. I am considering both, which is why I am asking.

snapper =pos!

I didn't consider anything else - this is what I want. It's as if they read my mind when they came up with it. I was hung up on the 10795 until I found out about this one. The 10795 has the same deck, a 5.5HP GCV 160, regular wheels and Sensa Speed. As I said, I already liked the Honda OHC engine, having had a HRB216TDA for several years, and Variable Speed to me is the ultimate drive system for a mower. This is my shot at a legitimate commercial and I'm going for it.

I just picked one up yesterday, and couldn't wait to get home and cut with it. Will be nice to compare notes. Mostly happy, a few things to adjust and get used to the changes. I'm new to the forum, but started cutting on an 8310 and then a 10515.

Let us know what you think of it.

First I'll answer some of your ?'s. No grease fittings on the wheels. The manual online is identical to the one that comes with it along with a parts catalog and a Honda engine manual that covers all versions of the GSV190. I noticed on mine that the foam element was dry thanks to reading your post. Don't know if that is the responsibility of the dealer or not. The L-B manual only says 30W oil, Honda manual has 50 degrees and above 30w but recommends 10W-30 for "general use" -5 to 100+. After 5 hours of running need to change oil for first time, once a year after that according to L-B, every 50 hrs or once a year, or every 25 hrs under heavy load or high ambient temps according to Honda. Honda also wants you to lower the throttle to slow before releasing the bale. BTW- 2 yr warranty for non-commercial use by L-B.
Alright so mower feels solid, no play in handle. Definitely heavier than 10515 getting in and out of pick-up but able to do by myself. It weighs 85lbs, with no catcher and 1/2 tank of gas. I paid $809.
Alright so I got to cut about 2 1/2 hrs on mostly rough terrain and hilly. Lawn not too thick yet so cut through it no sweat. Seemed to bounce around more than 10515 but I was having a tough time modulating the SP. I got better at feathering in with my right hand palm up holding handle. I was too fast or too slow. I think the belt stretched too because it started to need help and it would take a few paces to get up to speed and then I felt it was too fast and I'd back off and then repeat it again. The weld on the SP bale also was pretty sloppy and it rubs against the handle although it's already starting to wear in. So I'll adjust SP and try on smoother terrain too. I was racing the rain so...The bouncing could seem worse b/c no play what so ever in handle. Also a couple of times bouncing around with carb downhill on slope a few droplets of gas hit the deck, so I'll watch the paper filter. It also got me worried about oil starvation...The bag couldn't be easier to use just watch the bounce on uneven terrain when empty.
Once I have the SP dialed in I'll drag race the 10515 to compare speeds. It is a really beautiful machine and I love the wheels/ball bearings. So smooth. Everything seems solid and well built and bolts on/off to be replaced/repaired. I know there seems to be alot of negative but I'm really excited and am trying to deal with change-all 28 yrs I've been mowing w/2 stroke staggered L-B's. Sorry so long but I like to be thorough and I am excited!! I'll analyze and analyze...

the one speed sp system is this units short comming. for comm work you need real multi speeds- not slipping the belt to slow down. at least they didnt put the personal pace sys on it!

Thanks for the nice write-up. The only thing I'm concerned about is feathering the drive bail. It's very easy on the 10684 because of the curved handle/bail. I keep my hands on the handle palms down and do the bail with my thumbs. If the 22271 is awkward to modulate for varying speeds, I might not be satisfied with it - I guess we'll see in a few days. I had a 10323 that was not easy to use in that respect either. As far as the foam filter, definitely check your manuals before oiling it. I was speculating that it would be oiled because they went to such pains to separate it from the paper filter. I'm glad there's an engine manual with it, because the one I ordered wasn't available. The oil recommendation in the Honda book is the same as the other OHC engines, so I expect I will be starting out with 10W30. For true commercial use, obviously the 30W would be the choice. The sealed bearings in the wheels should be good for many years of residential use - I would avoid using high-pressure water and detergents on the wheels.

I'll keep you posted as I adjust and get used to it. The engine manual does say to soak the foam element in clean oil and squeeze out the excess. Thanks for the reminder on the wheels, I might have used my pressure washer to clean between wheels and deck at some point.

After further review, I've decided to keep all three mowers until I decide which two stay.

I agree...the single speed SP is a big shortcoming, and just a cost cutting measure in my opinion. My 10323 with the variable speed is just too slow. It is really one speed, slow and none. And if the new commercial has the same top speed, geesh, not good.

'Variable Speed' is my favorite drive, hands down. I got my 10323 running fast enough a few years ago, and the 10684 is about all the speed I want. I guess I've gotten pretty good modulating the bail for slower cutting where needed. I like it because it's based on Personal Pace, but with the bail, you instantly convert to a push-pull just by letting it go. They had to gear it lower because you can get max. speed with the bail. If you put a similar bail on a PP, you will have to run to keep up. Personally, I think they got it just about right. The 22217 should be faster, because like I posted they claim 5 MPH. If that's the case, I will be feathering the bail all the time. If working the drive bail is awkward on this mower, I will see if a 10684 upper handle assembly can be grafted to the 22271.

It has arrived and appears to be everything I want in a mower. Very solid although it handles 'lighter' than it weighs, which is a good thing. It had some shipping damage because it didn't have very good packing around the mower. The air cleaner cover got knocked off and broke one of the plastic loops on the housing on the way out, so I'm expecting the vendor to replace that. The handle was just lying in there and it scratched a small place on the deck which I already touched up with 'Grabber Green'. The big question was the ergonomics of the drive bail, and I can work that easily with hands on top of the bar, thumbs on the bail. The drive seems 'too tight' in that it was trying to crawl with the bail released, so I did a hasty adjustment to get more free play. It still tries to drag on the pull-back, and we'll see how that breaks in over a few hours of use. The engine is typical Honda, quiet and smooth - they always sound like they're going slower than they are. I'll check that with a tach before getting everything dirty - I have to put a reflective sticker on top of the blade so the tach can read it through the open discharge port. The manual choke gives a one-pull start as expected. The cutting-height numbers seem to be 1/2" high - I measured from the blade cutting edge to a flat reference surface (a typical concrete floor is adequately flat for this purpose) and it was showing 4" at the 3.5" setting. Checking the 10684, it was the same, so I don't know what this means, if anything. I never checked this on any other mower so I don't have anything to compare it to. Hopefully the two LBs will be approximately the same. Possibly the 10550 is more accurate because I noticed it cut a little shorter than the 10684 on the same height setting. My idea about putting the handle top from a 10684 on it not only is not needed, but it also wouldn't work. The handle is too wide and the tubes are bigger. The blade is a little different than expected, too. I thought the Toro 'Atomic' blade would be on it. It has one very similar one but without the 'chopping cuts' in the lift foils. So, unless something goes terribly wrong with with this mower over the next few days, this one looks like a keeper.

For that price??

shipping damage
big question was the ergonomics of the drive bail
didn't have very good packing
drive seems 'too tight'
drag on the pull-back
cutting-height numbers seem to be 1/2" high

I figured out the blade thing - it comes with a 'bagging blade' 108-3759-03, but the 'mulching blade' 108-0954-03 also fits. The mulching blade is the 'Atomic' blade furnished on other LBs and Toros.

Congratulations on the new mower. I had the opposite problem my adjustment was too loose. A few turns and I was back up to speed, and now can regulate it much better. Speaking of speed, I haven't had my drag race yet but I used the 10515 back to back with the 22271 and they are about equal or 22271 slighty quicker than the 10515 in 3rd. The 10515 seems to get a litter better jump getting to top speed though.

I'm pretty sure the 'drag' issue on mine will work out with some mowing time. In case it doesn't, I'll take it in for warranty work. On the blade choice, I note that reviews of the mower indicate mulching is the only weak function. I assume this is because it comes with the 'bagging' blade which is evidently the choice of most commercial services. Since the 'mulching' blade also bags well, that's what I'll use. This has worked great on the 10684 which is the same deck design but in steel. I picked up a 'screaming' deal on three brand-new LB 'Atomic' blades on ebay last year, long before I thought about getting this commercial. Now I wish I could find another deal like that although I still have two of them in the box. The blades sell for $18 at the dealer and I think I got three for $10 or so.

'The 10515 seems to get a litter better jump getting to top speed though'

That doesn't seem right. While 'Variable Speed' is by design a 'soft' starter, you should be able to spin the wheels by slamming the bail home. Full speed is nearly instantaneous. The mower should nearly jump away from you on a 'hard' start like that. I don't see how it could be delayed getting to top speed unless the tension adjustment is extremely loose or the wheels are spinning (not likely with the 22271's big, soft rubber tires).

Wow. I've found my ideal mower. Very quiet out on the lawn and very smooth. I put on the mulching blade first and that is a very good combination. So, I'm very glad I spent the money to get this incredible machine - sometimes you actually do get what you pay for. The only other change I'm likely to do for now is to change the starter pull handle to the big type on the 'Insight' mowers.

Did it stop being so tight on the pull back? I just got a PT21 22164 the other week and it was waaaaaay tight when I started out. Now after a couple hours use it is all good. From what I can see these mowers are probably the same transmission with bale control vs personal pace right? I really like the green/orange combo.

After some more adjusting before trying to cut with it I found that it was releasing with no input from me such as having to push forward another inch before pulling back as per the instructions. I think in a few weeks I'll be able to put some of the tension back on the drive cable. In reference to krc22's comment on the 'soft start', I think it's part of the design, with a spring at the cable end to make drive engagement slightly more gradual, perhaps to eliminate wheel-slip. The extended crankshaft on the Honda GSV is so big it has a diameter reduction to fit the standard Insight blade adapter/drive pulley. This thing is super-duty all the way through. I found your 22164 on the Toro site, a commercial with Kawasaki engine and Personal Pace. The deck does look similar, but that would be pretty much the only thing the same. 'Variable Speed' is very much like PP, with bail control instead of sliding handle. The gear ratios are different, with PP having a higher gear ratio for a potentially higher top speed - if a user can walk that fast and mowing results allow. Sounds like a great mower too. The drive belt in either case has to break in some before final adjustment.

What about the 10550...we are waiting for you to release it. You should have re-jetted, you would have released the beast.

interesting you like the atomic blade as its a direct copy of the gator blade

Whatever. It's a factory blade and works great. I haven't examined a Gator blade but blades of that type I have bought or looked at were extremely thick and heavy, the LB-branded blades are standard weight. I don't like using any more weight than necessary on the crankshaft. The effects of any imbalance are multiplied and wear is accelerated on the engine brake, for a couple of examples.

if you have never seen a gator blade -them dont dis them!

No dis - just engineering analysis. If a Gator blade is standard weight, I could see using one if I can't get the factory blades any more, particularly if its just like the Toro blade. Before I realized the disadvantages of heavy blades, I put a 'Viper' on a used mower I reconditioned for someone, and it worked very well - still in use several years later with the same blade. That thing was about 3/16". A heavy blade also has advantages, such as an increased 'flywheel effect' making the engine more resistant to slowing in thick cutting, but once it does slow it will be harder to accelerate back to speed. It also is obviously tougher and thereby more resistant to bending, but then again the force of an impact would be transferred entirely to the crankshaft, possibly causing significant engine damage. I just like to stick with OEM on the premium mowers I use. Sometimes the engineers really do know what they're doing. I cringe every time I hear of someone putting a heavy blade on a Lawn-Boy with the long crankshaft extension to clear the muffler or transfer tube box - that really creates quite a bending moment on that long crank. I also think about increased wear on the lower main bearing. Maybe this is all just speculation, but I stay away from them, particularly since the original blades work so well. Take the Honda 'Quadracut' system for example - two blades, but they're thinner, tougher steel than usual to keep the weight down. That's good engineering.

Oregon makes two Gator blades that fit my 21 inch LawnBoy.
There is the #92-601, which is 2 1/2 inches wide and
3/16 in. thick, and the center portion is flat.
Then there is the #92-901, which is 3 inches wide and
1/8 in. thick, but the center portion of the blade
is folded down on the edges for about 4 1/2 inches
each side of the bolt hole. The 92-901 is quite a bit
heavier, but the 92-601 seems to be about the same
weight as the OEM blade.

Hey, I just realized my 22271 is #100 off the assembly line - 270000100.

It would be interesting to check at the end of the year
and see how many were made, total.

That's interesting that it has a 2007 serial # considering it's the first one I've heard of anyone purchasing or being available for purchase and it's the middle of 2008...

They were first shipped for sale in late 2007. Obviously, with an expensive and largely unknown mower, I'm sure they didn't fly out the door. I haven't encountered any 'first year' problems on mine. Really, aside from possible assembly mistakes, there isn't much to mess up. With a Honda commercial engine on the aluminum Insight deck with steel ball-bearing wheels and Variable Speed, it was a no-brainer for me. I like it that the GSV 190 is not even available on Honda mowers. I just cut the yard with it and thought the engine sounded like it was grunting a little more than usual, but thought nothing of it. Then I realized I had set the height down to cut a certain area the other day and forgot to set it back. Turns out I was mulching about 2" of thick grass.