Well yeah, in your environment. I'd have never suggested you try to plant Arkansas cultivars in Michigan, quite honestly. Just remember that a plant's phenotype (ie, physical qualities) is equally due to the environment as it is to the genotype. :)

I have seen first hand the vigorous and hardy nature of wild blackberries. In King's Canyon National park, I have seen wild blackberries thrive at elevations from 3,000 ft to 7,000 ft. They also are drought/heat tolerant and very productive (this climate has lots of extremes). The only downside is the huge razor thorns all over.

Fruitgirl == yeah, I knew it would be a gamble. Actually, they can survive my winters just fine UNDER COVER, wherein lies the problem - the cover that allows them to survive the cold is the perfect shelter for voles and mice, which just love the chew them to pieces.

I am just one of those guys who wants what he shouldn't have. I've got all kind of southern stuff growing here -- windmill, needle, and sabal palms, southern magnolia, hardy bananas, crape myrtles, crinums, agapanthus, alstroemeria, figs. The voles are a lot more of a challenge than the cold weather, frankly, but most of it generally does alright.

Some things work outside their native zone and some don't, I would say its hard to generalize and the only way to find out is to try. Many of the wild blackberries in Oregon today are the "himalaya" ones which I think are from Armenia originally. Not only did they do good they did too good and spread everywhere.

Scott

Most of the fruits we eat it seem to come from Afghanistan (grapes/apricots/pistachios), Kazakhstan (apples), China (peaches?/lots of other things)...

Looking at apples, the wild ones grow around the same latitude as WI, so its no surprise they do well here (although its a lot more humid here)... Not many wild fruits here in the US outside of pawpaws, plums and various berries...

I might need to go out and find a good wild berry, mark it somehow and dig it in late fall/early spring...the TC are a bear (they grow trunks!) and the tops die back so badly in winter (i don't protect), yet i still have a lot of fruit this year.

I wasn't speaking from a "they weren't developed in Michigan so they won't do well there standpoint." I was speaking from knowing just how cold sensitive these things are. I know where they've been trialed and didn't work due to lack of cold hardiness.

Frank; I could send you a few wild blackberries and blackcaps once they go dormantÂjust let me know in the fall. And if youÂre growing TC in WI, maybe there is hope for in my future. The ChesterÂs and Arapaho are a bust here in Michigan.

I'm in s.w. Ontario on shores of Lake Erie. My Chester and Navaho came through the winter fine. Navaho has grown the most this season (all in 2nd year since planting). Is the weather that much different in Michigan than it is here?

Frank,

The Americas have many great native fruit trees: plums, cherries, pawpaws, hawthorns, blueberries, avocados, prickly pear; and if we venture further into Central and South America, the list would grow exponentially.

I know that you're really referring to trees that produce fruit and nuts in the upper zones of North America. And yes there have been many fruits imported into NA, like cultivated apples, plums, pears, citrus, etc. But by the same token there are many Native American trees, fruits, and plants that are being commercially produced far outside of the plant's native American ranges: potatoes, any of the capsicum peppers, tomatoes, pawpaws, blueberries, cranberries, passion fruit, pecans, black walnuts, avocados, etc, etc....

I just glad that we live in an age that allows us to try growing the diversity of plants that nature has provided, regardless of where they originated on the globe.

TC will survive here unprotected (snowcover must be helping), but the tops die back. They still have fruited fine, but all the fruit is at crotch level and lower.

Completely the inverse here--all TC fruit is at crotch level and higher!

Luther Burbank and his "Himalayan" blackberries, that joke was on us out west. Still, people do enjoy wading into the brambles and getting free fruit in August. Many urban patches have the distinctive little "bays" where people can edge in and reach for berries. The ground and grasses in the bay become trampled.

Wow D, I got just the opposite results as you. Guess slight weather differences really count.

Any fellow that says North America doesn't have a plethora of wild fruits must have grown up in the city!!!

I do not know where to begin.... - all seasons from mulberry in spring to persimmon at Christmas time, and wild cherries and wild plums and a wealth of other fruits in between....

Grew up in Wisconsin. Whitetail deer is my fruit and is better tasting then anything grown on this forum!

Give me an Asian fruit any day (and an Asian woman!)

>Actually, they can survive my winters just fine UNDER COVER, wherein lies the
>problem - the cover that allows them to survive the cold is the perfect shelter
>for voles and mice, which just love the chew them to pieces.

I have heard from a fig growing friend that mothballs will keep the rodents away over the winter.

As a child I remember laying planks over Himalayan blackberry patches to be able to pick them, here on the farm, twenty miles from where Burbank let the blackberry loose in the early 1900's. Now 70 years later it is a constant battle to have a garden without blackberries. My advise is not to import them, if you do not have them. I spend a lot of money on brush killer spray as well as my labor to kill them every year. Al

Any fellow that says North America doesn't have a plethora of wild fruits must have grown up in the city!!!

I do not know where to begin.... - all seasons from mulberry in spring to persimmon at Christmas time, and wild cherries and wild plums and a wealth of other fruits in between....

Denninmi-
I'm sorry to hear (and a bit surprised) that your cultivated varieties aren't working out. Here in 6b, we got down to about -2 this year, and I only got just a tiny bit (6" at most) of dieback on my first year Triple Crowns and Doyle's. I've never had any dieback on my Chester's.

I actually just got back from vacation a few hours ago and tried my first two TC berries of the year. They weren't even fully black, and still had some red (nevermind waiting for "dull"), and they still tasted great. Chester, at this stage, would have been puckering-ly tart! I think I'm going to like 'em.

I'm afraid my thorny wild native ones are comparison for even my Chester's. The Chester's are much sweeter, 3x larger, thornless, and no where as seedy as the wild ones. I expect the same from TC and Doyle, except theyÂll be sweeter.

Have you at least tried Chester which is the hardiest one I know of? I wish I had some other suggestions for you. You have my sympathy my friend!
-Glenn

Thanks all, for the replies.

Last winter was exceptionally mild here. All of the canes would have survived the winter and I would have had an exceptionally large and nice crop.

Except for the voles that stripped the canes complete clear of bark from top to bottom. When I removed the protective shelter I had made, several of the little buggers ran. I put about 25 mouse bait blocks in there, which were all gone, but more voles came later, apparently.

So I'm done trying to shelter the less hardy cultivated kinds. The wild ones don't need shelter in my climate, so there isn't any cover for the voles.