I am speechless. I was going to ask how often you clean out your freezer but that would sound rude. :)

You sure are thrifty.

Susan

Wow 39 cents for some seeds. Betcha gas prices weren't that cheap in '77.

I'm impressed!!!! Thirty-two year old seed still germinating - a seed savers dream : ) Thanks for sharing.

I clean it out about once every two years, but that doesn't mean I throw everything away. I have hundreds of lots of seed in there, all catalogued on my computer. A lot of the seeds I purchase are of rare plants, which are often not available at all. And I also sell seeds of rare plants. So I am not about to let that seed die at room temperature. Almost everything retains its viability perfectly at 0 degrees F. And freezer storage is so easy. With seed so expensive now, why would you just throw it in your closet, where it's going to be dead in a couple of years?

Some recent results:
Tomato, Marmande: from 1987; 100% germination
Tomato, Sungold: from 1993; 100% germination
Pepper, Pick-a-Peck: from 1976; 100% germination
Melon, Crenshaw: from 1981; 0% germ
Melon, Honey Rock: from 1980; 0% germ
Watermelon, Sugar Baby: from 1987; 0% germ

So the Tomato/Pepper clan does extremely well, but the melons don't make it in long-term storage. Freezing does keep melon seeds viable for about 15 years, but the storage times that we are talking about above are around 20-28 years, a long, long time.

WOW, I am impressed too. I never knew about freezing, I would have guessed it would kill the seeds. Who knew?

Does that mean that the armageddon seed bank in a remote Norwegian island (in a subterranean permafrost bunker) has no Sugar Baby? No Crenshaw? Bummer. Life will be tough after WWIII.

(More likely, they have Sugar Baby, but the many thawings and refreezing eventually ruined the seeds. In Norway, they freeze them once. I have always kept them in the freezer too, with great success, but I do know they thaw many times a year)

Wow! That's impressive. If you don't mind sharing your secrets, what's your technique for freezing them? What kind of container do you store them in?

I think those Armageddon seed banks are cryogenic, which is Seriously Cold. So seed metabolism slows to a stop. Also, they don't thaw the seed. My seed gets thawed a couple of times a year.

When thawing the seed, I keep the seed container sealed shut until it gets to room temperature (about 1 hour), then I open it. That way, moisture does not condense on the seeds.

If you are collecting your own seed, it's important to thoroughly dry the seed before you freeze it. I place the seed in a bowl and keep it at room temperature for two or three weeks, then place the seed in a labelled packet, and then in an airtight container. I do not use dessicant. I think my results demonstrate that fancy techniques such as dessicant are not necessary.

My freezer is not a defrosting type. In a self-defrosting freezer, you probably won't get results quite as good.

Not all seeds can be frozen. Some seeds die if they dry out, like chestnuts, maples, oaks, etc. Some tropical seeds can't stand to be frozen. Use Google to learn more. If I'm not sure about a certain type of seed, I keep most in the fridge, and place a few in the freezer. Make sure the seeds in the fridge don't freeze! A couple of days later, I take the frozen seeds out of the freezer and sow them, and see what happens. An easy way to test for germination is to place the seeds in a small bottle, and just cover the seed with water, and keep at room temperature. If they are dead, they will usually start rotting in a few days.

I'm glad you shared this with us. Your freezing test makes alot of sense, too. I think I'll try it. I use the refrigerator for storage alot and have had great success with tomatoes and some other, but I have not tried the freezer...yet. Your results are inspiring.

I was given alot of assorted veggie seed packets that ranged from 2 to 8 years old recently. They were stored at room temperature in a place that probably went from 50 F to 90+ F over the years. I've been surprised at how well some varieties sprouted when I ran some germination tests last month. Seeds truly are amazing packages of promise.

Years back I read that you should only take the seeds you need for planting out to the garden. Leave the rest of the packages inside. The writer felt most people set extra seed packets in places by the garden where they would absorb moisture from the humid air or ground and this reduces their viability. I try to follow that advice or at least keep the extras in a tightly sealed tin in a shaded spot.

I keep my seed in a rubbermaid container in the fridge with dessicant packets to keep everything dry. So far I still get 100% germination on 3 year old seed. I guess this year when seed saving time comes I aught to get several tubs for the freezer too. One for tomatoes, one for peppers....

Too cool, Lilydude. Too cool. Yep, that seed packet looks very familiar to me, only ours over here in Texas said "Lone Star Seed Company" instead of "Lilly's". I wonder if all the seed companies back then used the same stock drawings? Kind of like how poultry hatcheries still do it today?

If it makes you feel better the seed is older than me LOL!!!!!!!!!

cassieinmass: haha -that's what I was thinking ('78)

I have a strange story to tell. My melon seeds would not germinate in 1/8 inch of water, as stated above, so I thought they were dead. I went ahead and planted them in potting mix anyway, and I got 50% germination. So, first, my melon seeds DID survive 20+ years in the freezer, and second, the germination test in water doesn't work for melon seeds. Don't ask me why. Temperature was 80F in both cases.

Sometimes seeds need more than water to trigger germination. Nitrogen can be very effective for reviving old beans, and in my experience, even good bean seed can germinate poorly without it. Perhaps that is true of cucurbits as well; I have a squash variety that always germinates poorly in soil-less seed starter, I'll have to try it with a little fertilizer this year.

>Wow 39 cents for some seeds. Betcha gas prices weren't that cheap in '77.

From the inflation calculator:
What cost $.39 in 1977 would cost $1.37 in 2008.

Also, if you were to buy exactly the same products in 2008 and 1977, they would cost you $.39 and $0.11 respectively.

Guess the real price of garden seed has been relatively flat then since 1.37 is about average.

I read this post awhile back and was very impressed, I had no idea some
seeds could last so long if you refrigerated or put them in freezer. I found
some older seed from 2006 and remembered this post. These seeds were
not properly stored, but I still had about 60% germination. So now I have
Machaiw eggplant, a few beefsteak tomatoes and Tasty Jade cucumber.
These are just extra's for me. .I didn't have room last year for corn called
Stowells Evergreen. I kept it in the hot garage all summer last year. I
thought it couldn't be any good, but it couldn't hurt to try. Every single
one sprouted. Hopefully I will have corn this summer..

lol you could have got a small fortune for those seeds unopened ...very nice looking package

I bought some Swallow Eggplant from Fedco late last summer, thinking I would try to grow indoors. I didn't get around to transplanting my seedlings to larger containers, and it was approaching Christmas, so I gave up.

I was frustrated this spring because none seemed to be sprouting, but maybe they needed more time, or the first batch of seedlings weren't watered right. So I've got 5 seedlings going. And only going to plant one. I'm trying a ton of different eggplant varieties.

Are there any types of seeds (like warm weather ones) that are inappropriate for storage in the fridge or freezer? Where can I get desiccant packets?

Alice

That's way cool.

Here is a link that might be useful: Start a growers diary here

So it is as simple as popping your seed packets into the freezer/fridge or are there more steps to it like putting it in a plastic bag or using desiccant?

Takadi, look at my two posts about halfway down the thread. I tell you all the steps. I don't use dessicant.

This is a good find, I'm using a bottom drawer in the fridge and the wife wants it back. I have a lb of sweet clover/red mammoth clover/and hairy vetch. I guess I need to try the germination test before I freeze the whole bags.

Why do you thaw your seeds a couple times a year?

rj, if your clover seeds are dry, you can safely freeze them. I've done it. I've never tried vetch, but I would bet it's OK.

I thaw the seeds so that I can take some out of the packets and grow them. There is no mysterious process going on.

lol lily, don't mind us if we treat you like the mystical guru of seed freezing. 30 years is quite an accomplishment though

Thanks Lilydude, have you tried alafalfa?

Are they stuck together? Is it necessary to thaw the whole packet or bunch of packets to plant a seeds? I'm just wondering about the thawing.

Since even fresh, lab-tested seed does not germinate at 100% how do you get 100% from 30+ year old seed?? I'm not saying you can't save seed much longer than many people think, but such claims as 100% germ. can be misleading. Of course, with a very small sample size you can get 100% but that doesn't tell the whole story.

Personally I use a packet of chard in less than 10 years... ;-)

Pepperdude, if I plant 5 seeds of something, and 5 plants come up, I call that 100% germination! With pepper and tomato seeds, I get 100% germination most of the time, whether they are fresh or frozen. Note that the melon seeds only gave 50% germination, once I figured out how to test them. However, you make a very important point: the seeds that you take out of the freezer can't be any better than the seeds that you put into the freezer.

Are you implying that anyone with "dude" in their username can't be trusted?

I froze some alfalfa and hairy vetch and now planted them in cups. I'll freeze the whole lb bags once I get germination. I bagged up the rest of the small packets and freed up a drawer in the fridge.

I left the Baby Pam Pumpkin in the fridge that I'll be planting later this season.